159 replies to this topic

[Red Socks]

I'm a bit behind at the moment but I just got rouind to reading the July August issue.
Great read but both the Tipo 61 and the Lotus 19 have gearboxes fitted which are at least six years, and in reality light years-away from the orignals, Pick of the Liter on page 116 is a Turner 950S with the wrong engine and gearbox, the BMW prepshop seem deeply into the latest technology in 20 year old cars, the ''very rare DB4GT project car' on page 128 would be rare as its the only running replica and Fred and Barneys Fairlane replica has never really explained how a total perfect copy of a very sucessful Daytona Oval car without any modification turned into a Spa and Nordschleife winner.
But hey what do I know /

Edited by Red Socks, 24 August 2011 - 09:47.

[drsmith917]

Jennifer Revson's response.

First, I would like to thank Tom for expressing his interest, and initiating this topic, in the completely erroneous information regarding the Scott Hughes car, which appears in the current issue of Vintage Motorsport Magazine. And thanks also to the Friends and fans of my brother, Peter, who have so kindly spoken up and supported me about this most distressing distortion of my brother's Can-Am racing history. Scott Hughes has been told by me, three historians, that I know of, and numerous fellow vintage racers that he doesn't have my brother's 1971 championship winning M8F team car. In fact, what Hughes owns is a 1973 Commander Motors built car. Peter's "real" M8F team car is owned by Evert Louwman, and resides in the beautiful Dutch National Motor Museum in The Hague, and hasn't even been in the US since 1985. The fact that Hughes has been very ugly to me personally, when I've approached him about this matter, and willfully spews untruths to my brother's fans, who approach his car thinking they're touching a part of my brother's racing history, and then basks in the glory of it all, is despicable to me. He is the antithesis of everything my brother stood for in life, and I'm not going to sit back and allow him to blatantly disrespect Peter like this. I've written a very detailed letter to Randy Riggs, editor of Vintage Motorsport, asking for a correction in the next issue, and have received a reply that he would. This year marks the 40th anniversary that Peter won the Can-Am championship and sat on the pole at Indy. Naturally, I'm very proud of Peter, not only because of his racing ability, but as a man who possessed great character, and the best brother a sister could have ever hoped for. Thanks for all your support! Jennifer

Jennifer, Thank You for continuing to honor your brother's memory and holding the world of vintage racing accountable for accurate representation of the cars being driven and sold. I believe I read the controversy over Peter's real 1971 M8F has been settled. I was lucky enough to attend the 1972 Can Am at Laguna Seca. Not only did I get to watch my boyhood heroes - Peter and Francois Cevert, but I got to see Francois driver your brother's "real" M8F from 30th on the grid to a podium finish (3rd behind the two Porsche 917/10s of George Follmer and Mark Donahue). I wasn't a great race for either Peter or Denny, but for me it was such a thrill to stand close to the cars and of course my idols. It truly was the "Golden Age" of motorsport, when F1 drivers were hopping the Atlantic to drive in Indy cars, Can Am or endurance racing. I think the drivers of that era had to know so much more about setting a car up, high speed drifting and car control than the racers of today. They also had a camaraderie that I don't think we'll ever see again. Most importantly, drivers like your brother and Francois had a passion for life... a passion for their "art"... driving at the edge in those days was like dancing on tip toes. It was like watching a great artist performing a masterpiece. I was honored to have been witness to some of those performances and will be forever grateful. Dave Smith

[E1pix]

Jennifer, Thank You for continuing to honor your brother's memory and holding the world of vintage racing accountable for accurate representation of the cars being driven and sold. I believe I read the controversy over Peter's real 1971 M8F has been settled. I was lucky enough to attend the 1972 Can Am at Laguna Seca. Not only did I get to watch my boyhood heroes - Peter and Francois Cevert, but I got to see Francois driver your brother's "real" M8F from 30th on the grid to a podium finish (3rd behind the two Porsche 917/10s of George Follmer and Mark Donahue). I wasn't a great race for either Peter or Denny, but for me it was such a thrill to stand close to the cars and of course my idols. It truly was the "Golden Age" of motorsport, when F1 drivers were hopping the Atlantic to drive in Indy cars, Can Am or endurance racing. I think the drivers of that era had to know so much more about setting a car up, high speed drifting and car control than the racers of today. They also had a camaraderie that I don't think we'll ever see again. Most importantly, drivers like your brother and Francois had a passion for life... a passion for their "art"... driving at the edge in those days was like dancing on tip toes. It was like watching a great artist performing a masterpiece. I was honored to have been witness to some of those performances and will be forever grateful. Dave Smith

David, this is such an inspiring first post as to damned-near give me the Willies!

I watched Francois in two 1972 Can-Ams, taking a 2nd at Road America and his only win at Brainerd in what I recall was the following round. A fan forever, and for a guy "untrained" in giant V8 cars it was truly something to behold. I was 12 but already knew the grid by heart, and I'll never forget that flashy Frenchman.

The only thing better than this for me was watching Peter win at Road America the year before. I loved that guy, the epitome of speed and cool bundled up in one great American Legend. I cried when we lost them both.

That Francois was a concert pianist fits him to a tea. The music he made with that blue Young American Racing M8F will live in me forever. You're right, that was pure art.

[By the way, Dave, did you race Formula Vee in the '70s? EDIT: Nah, you're too young.... ]

Edited by E1pix, 27 August 2011 - 16:34.

[drsmith917]

David, this is such an inspiring first post as to damned-near give me the Willies!

I watched Francois in two 1972 Can-Ams, taking a 2nd at Road America and his only win at Brainerd in what I recall was the following round. A fan forever, and for a guy "untrained" in giant V8 cars it was truly something to behold. I was 12 but already knew the grid by heart, and I'll never forget that flashy Frenchman.

The only thing better than this for me was watching Peter win at Road America the year before. I loved that guy, the epitome of speed and cool bundled up in one great American Legend. I cried when we lost them both.

That Francois was a concert pianist fits him to a tea. The music he made with that blue Young American Racing M8F will live in me forever. You're right, that was pure art.

[By the way, Dave, did you race Formula Vee in the '70s? EDIT: Nah, you're too young....;) ]

Actually, I AM that old. No, I didn't drive Formula Vee though. I drove Formula Fords in Southern California - Ontario Motor Speedway. The British School of Motor Racing (BSMR) was the U.S. version of Jim Russell. I started in 1978 and sat in my last FF in 1982.
- Dave

[E1pix]

Actually, I AM that old. No, I didn't drive Formula Vee though. I drove Formula Fords in Southern California - Ontario Motor Speedway. The British School of Motor Racing (BSMR) was the U.S. version of Jim Russell. I started in 1978 and sat in my last FF in 1982.
- Dave

Thanks, Dave.... and Ah, Heck, you're young, just a few years older than I (unless I'm in denial! ). What I meant was that the Vee guy should be 60+ by now.

You Know, though, we got to see the good stuff in racing, and beyond. I'd trade that for youth any day.

I recall a bit about BSMR, followed FF very close in those days all the way to the Runoffs. Curious, what marque did you run?

Thanks.

[RA Historian]

In all fairness to Vintage Motorsport Magazine, this post and all posts concerning the Peter Revson McLaren M8F and the attempts by the Scott Hughes family to pawn off their Commander Motor Homes team built copy as the Revson car should be in a separate thread. But that it up to Stuart and just how much time he wants to invest in separating the items.

At any rate, they are back. Just like a bad penny. It seems that Tim Mayer, formerly of IMSA and the ALMS series is a son-in-law of Hughes and his wife. Mayer recently was in Holland for a race at Zandvoort, and while there he visited the Louwman Museum and viewed the real, genuine M8F of Peter Revson. He had his picture taken standing in front of the car and had the photo and this caption posted on the McLaren Group facebook page:

This is the M8F that is in the Louwman Museum near Zandvoort in Holland. It is puportedly Revvy's 1971 championship winning car, although the history of the M8F's is a bit murkey because of all the Trojans that were built, and because so much cross pollination of parts over the years as they have been actively raced since.

Now Mr. Mayer may be the son of Teddy Mayer, and may be an official with the FIA, etc., but apparently he is not at all familiar with the history of this car and the fact that the Louwman car has conclusively been proven to be the Revson car, and that the M8F owned by his in-laws is not. For Mr. Mayer's benefit, there are errors in his short post. To wit:

The car in the Louwman Museum is not "purportedly" the Revson car. It IS the Revson car!

The factory raced M8Fs were built by McLaren, NOT by Trojan. The Hughes car was a Trojan car.

While there may have been "cross pollination" of parts in a lot of Trojan M8Fs, the works M8Fs remained pure with no Trojan parts.

This matter has been debated at length, and the proof of the history and legitimacy of the Louwman Museum car is indisputable. Many experts have chimed in, from our own Doug Nye through acknowledged McLaren experts Bob Lee and Don Devine, and many others including fabricators who worked on these cars and have verified the identity and history of both cars. For something that has been proven, to have Mr. Mayer post such an ambiguous statement about the Louwman car is, well, make up your own mind.

The fact of the matter is that the Louwman car is the real Peter Revson M8F and the Hughes car is in reality the Commander/Trojan M8F and any wishful thinking and puzzling statements by the Hughes family will not change this.

I find it hard to believe that Mr. Mayer could have any doubt in his mind as to the identity of the M8Fs, given all the high visibility proof that exists. That makes his post very puzzling indeed. There is nothing "murky" about which car is the genuine Revson car.

Tom

[E1pix]

RA, I again commend you on your continued efforts in this outrageous, bold-faced lying mess.

The only way to put such matters to rest is to bury the instigator, and your shovel is doing a fine job.

[Rob Semmeling]

I am looking for anyone who has "Vintage Motorsport" 5/2009 (Sep/Oct) and would be willing to scan or photograph an article in this issue.

[bill p]

I am looking for anyone who has "Vintage Motorsport" 5/2009 (Sep/Oct) and would be willing to scan or photograph an article in this issue.

Rob - Yes, PM sent

Edited by bill p, 10 February 2012 - 14:36.

[Rob Semmeling]

PM and e-mails received, Bill! Thank you for your kind assistence, much appreciated!