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Button's modesty - driving around an oversteer instability 'not my forte'...


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#1 pjabyrne

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:16

A comment by Button over the weekend really struck me:

...yesterday I was really struggling with the balance of the car. I had a lot of rear locking and instability and when I have that it is not my forte really. I find it difficult to drive round, so we changed the car overnight and it has improved it a lot and I feel very comfortable in the car...



I mean :eek: ???

A top F1 driver admitting to a weakness. I was really impressed by that. The total opposite of the 'that-was-the-best-race-of-my-life / I-was-really-on-it-today /I'm-great-aren't-I? BS you get from the other British driver.

Barrichello also made no excuses. I seen a quote somewhere where he admitted he'd been beaten 'fair and square'.

I just think such modesty is a really refreshing change...

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#2 Racing Dutchman

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:21

Originally posted by pjabyrne
A comment by Button over the weekend really struck me:



I mean :eek: ???

A top F1 driver admitting to a weakness. I was really impressed by that. The total opposite of the 'that-was-the-best-race-of-my-life / I-was-really-on-it-today /I'm-great-aren't-I? BS you get from the other British driver.

Barrichello also made no excuses. I seen a quote somewhere where he admitted he'd been beaten 'fair and square'.

I just think such modesty is a really refreshing change...

Refreshing modisty?
Check some of the press conferences of 2002 and 2004.

Every time after Michael Schumacher destroyed the competition 2 hand down he said: "It was tough, but the team did a superb job, so we managed a good result". I thought at the time that he had a bet with a Ferrari crew member regarding the amounts of times he could do this before he couldn't keep in control of his laughter and laughed his ass off right in the PC

#3 Scotracer

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:21

Button's an honest bloke. I used to feel he was over-rated but when you watch him drive, he really is quite something...and he's so happy this year that's hard to be mad at him.

#4 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:27

Originally posted by Scotracer
Button's an honest bloke. I used to feel he was over-rated but when you watch him drive, he really is quite something...and he's so happy this year that's hard to be mad at him.


Ugh - get a room and some kleenex! :rolleyes:

#5 Gareth

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:28

I really enjoyed Button's chat with Brundle on the grid walk. Because it was a chat. The man on pole usually shoos Brundle away. Even further down the grid, the most you'll usually get is monosylabic answers. But there's the pole sitter having a convivial chat with the media minutes before the start of the race. Fantastic. Button and the Brawn team have been a breath of fresh air this season.

#6 Silver999

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:33

I agree Button seems like an 'alright' bloke but he is an incredibly average driver. Can't defend his position to save his life and his overtaking abilities are virtually non existent, no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000.

#7 race addicted

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:38

...Err, he's only had a winning car for two races, and perhaps once or twice in 2004.
Btw, DC also held up his hand saying he didn't like oversteer and wasn't the best coping with that.

#8 Henrik B

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:42

Originally posted by Gareth
I really enjoyed Button's chat with Brundle on the grid walk. Because it was a chat. The man on pole usually shoos Brundle away. Even further down the grid, the most you'll usually get is monosylabic answers. But there's the pole sitter having a convivial chat with the media minutes before the start of the race. Fantastic. Button and the Brawn team have been a breath of fresh air this season.


Well, you have a native english speaker who have the best car and is winning in it. Not to take anything away from him, but it's a big difference giving interviews when you're comfortable.

#9 Gareth

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 18:57

Originally posted by Henrik Brodin


Well, you have a native english speaker who have the best car and is winning in it. Not to take anything away from him, but it's a big difference giving interviews when you're comfortable.

I'm sure a huge amount of it comes from the lack of expectation and pressure allowing him to be comfortable, along with the sheer joy of just being on the grid, let alone running at the front. I don't mention how good it is to criticise others, just to say it's been good. It'd be great if all drivers could be so relaxed and therefore comfortable, regardless of the circumstances, but it is understandable they aren't and I'm sure there's every chance that, given more trying times, Button wouldn't be too.

#10 PNSD

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 19:12

Originally posted by Silver999
I agree Button seems like an 'alright' bloke but he is an incredibly average driver. Can't defend his position to save his life and his overtaking abilities are virtually non existent, no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000.


Haha. A guy who has no idea..

http://www.f1technic...vertaking stats

http://www.f1technic... stats&start=75

Two threads only.

Ciro once posted a list of how many overtakes each driver had done, from a certain time period tio 2007 I think.

Supprise supprise, Button was ahead of if I remember right, most of the current grid. Shumacher, and I think someone else only surpassed him. He was ahead of Alonso, Kimi, Montoya.

no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000



You are not really that dumb are you. How many times during that period has he had a car to win.

2004? Only Germany and Brazil were Buttons chances to win on merit. We all know what happened in those races. Thanks Honda.

#11 Villes Gilleneuve

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 19:24

Originally posted by pjabyrne
I just think such modesty is a really refreshing change...


Really..he should take lessons from Alonso and blame a conspiracy, and then take all credit for himself with "no help from anyone."

I like the comments from his father when some ITV dork said, "it's only half points for this win" and he responded, "yes, five points..awful."

#12 engel

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 19:25

Aw bandwagons are so cute :rolleyes:

#13 Floyd

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 19:44

Originally posted by Silver999
I agree Button seems like an 'alright' bloke but he is an incredibly average driver. Can't defend his position to save his life and his overtaking abilities are virtually non existent, no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000.

Didn't do to bad on Alonso though did he not a sniff of a broken suspension. Not very often he got a chance to overtake in last few years.

#14 J2NH

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 19:52

Originally posted by Gareth
I really enjoyed Button's chat with Brundle on the grid walk. Because it was a chat. The man on pole usually shoos Brundle away. Even further down the grid, the most you'll usually get is monosylabic answers. But there's the pole sitter having a convivial chat with the media minutes before the start of the race. Fantastic. Button and the Brawn team have been a breath of fresh air this season.


Agreed. Really nice to have things mixed up this year, first time I can remember this happening ever.

#15 noikeee

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 20:33

That's just the underdog thing. By June, any single word he'll say will be seen as arrogant.

#16 mursuka80

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 20:49

Originally posted by paranoik0
That's just the underdog thing. By June, any single word he'll say will be seen as arrogant.



:rotfl: :rotfl: Its funny how this place has changed in one month.when season starts all logic goes out of the window here (not referring to your post) WE ARE ON A DIFFERENT PLANET!! :p

#17 Willy_Wonka

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 21:07

Originally posted by Silver999
I agree Button seems like an 'alright' bloke but he is an incredibly average driver. Can't defend his position to save his life and his overtaking abilities are virtually non existent, no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000.


:rotfl:
He is one of the best over takers out there, his weakness WAS defending, that was 2004, he is much improved since then and is no better or worse than any other driver now.
Everyone get overtaken, people like you are the ones that only remember one or two sterling efforts that stick in the mind, this then projects your opinion of said driver into hero proportions.
So please do come down to reality at some point ok ?

#18 Bob Nomates

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 21:28

He's a better driver than Hamilton thats for sure.
I made a really impressive impact in his first couple of yrs before the cars he drove went down hill. He's more than capable of winning the championship and with out falling out with everyone whilist doing it!

#19 Rob

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 21:48

Originally posted by paranoik0
That's just the underdog thing. By June, any single word he'll say will be seen as arrogant.


Sigh. So true. :(

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#20 bankoq

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 23:35

Originally posted by Silver999
I agree Button seems like an 'alright' bloke but he is an incredibly average driver. Can't defend his position to save his life and his overtaking abilities are virtually non existent, no wonder he's only won 3 races since 2000.


The problem is Button had winning car for 4 or 5 races in his career, while Hamilton for 36.

#21 karlth

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 23:45

Originally posted by pjabyrne
I mean :eek: ???

A top F1 driver admitting to a weakness.


Strangely enough Wurz said a similar thing after qualifying:

"A Brawn GP driver wouldn't be able to drive with a set-up like that at all. [like Hamilton's McLaren] "

Honest bunch at BGP nowadays.

#22 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 23:49

I remember Button stating that he would do what Schumacher had done at Jerez in '97 if necessary to win the championship.

#23 senna da silva

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Posted 06 April 2009 - 23:50

Originally posted by karlth
Honest bunch at BGP nowadays.


Ross Brawn honest! :rotfl:

#24 Seanspeed

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:01

Originally posted by Gareth
I really enjoyed Button's chat with Brundle on the grid walk. Because it was a chat. The man on pole usually shoos Brundle away. Even further down the grid, the most you'll usually get is monosylabic answers. But there's the pole sitter having a convivial chat with the media minutes before the start of the race. Fantastic. Button and the Brawn team have been a breath of fresh air this season.

Button's one of the few drivers left on the grid that are worth talking to, Webber and Barrichello being the others. I'm not looking forward to the day that these guys aren't there and all we're left with is Kimi's monosyllabic rambling, Lewis' PR-a$s kissing, and Alonso's whining. I'd almost be happier to just not hear what they have to say sometimes.

#25 Clatter

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:07

Originally posted by TheHumanPromise

Button's one of the few drivers left on the grid that are worth talking to, Webber and Barrichello being the others. I'm not looking forward to the day that these guys aren't there and all we're left with is Kimi's monosyllabic rambling, Lewis' PR-a$s kissing, and Alonso's whining. I'd almost be happier to just not hear what they have to say sometimes.


And you have spoken to all these guys?

#26 senna da silva

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:12

Originally posted by TheHumanPromise

Button's one of the few drivers left on the grid that are worth talking to, Webber and Barrichello being the others. I'm not looking forward to the day that these guys aren't there and all we're left with is Kimi's monosyllabic rambling, Lewis' PR-a$s kissing, and Alonso's whining. I'd almost be happier to just not hear what they have to say sometimes.


Except that I'd rather watch Lewis, Kimi and Fernando race than talk. Button, Webber and Barrichello on the other hand..............

#27 Seanspeed

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:21

Originally posted by Clatter


And you have spoken to all these guys?

:confused:

I dont get your point. I'm going by what I've seen over the years of them in interviews. Thought that would have been pretty obvious.....

#28 Seanspeed

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:24

Originally posted by senna da silva
Except that I'd rather watch Lewis, Kimi and Fernando race than talk. Button, Webber and Barrichello on the other hand..............

I think they're *all* very good race car drivers worth watching in a race.

But thats not what I'm talking about.

#29 Clatter

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:36

Originally posted by TheHumanPromise

:confused:

I dont get your point. I'm going by what I've seen over the years of them in interviews. Thought that would have been pretty obvious.....


You said "worth talking to", that to me implies actually talking to them, not listening to interviews. You would probably get a far different reaction from them chatting on an informal basis rather than when they have a microphone shoved in their face and being asked more or less the same questions numerous times, coupled with the fact that for the majority of drivers English is not their first language.

#30 senna da silva

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 00:52

Originally posted by TheHumanPromise

I think they're *all* very good race car drivers worth watching in a race.

But thats not what I'm talking about.


This is F1 RACING, not a chat show. I couldn't care less if they were all as vapid as Fisi!

#31 Dalton007

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 07:32

Originally posted by pjabyrne
A comment by Button over the weekend really struck me:



I mean :eek: ???

A top F1 driver admitting to a weakness. I was really impressed by that. The total opposite of the 'that-was-the-best-race-of-my-life / I-was-really-on-it-today /I'm-great-aren't-I? BS you get from the other British driver.

Barrichello also made no excuses. I seen a quote somewhere where he admitted he'd been beaten 'fair and square'.

I just think such modesty is a really refreshing change...


I suspect that every driver has a forte. Alonso likes an understeering car, for example. Michael likes a long gas pedal to help balance the car around corners. Lewis likes a twitchy back-end.

#32 bogi

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 07:37

''Im not good on the gravel'' - Mika driving old Mercedes 190 (Top Gear)

#33 Gareth

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 07:41

Originally posted by senna da silva


This is F1 RACING, not a chat show. I couldn't care less if they were all as vapid as Fisi!

But there is this thing called 'the build up' and this other thing called 'the after race show' that are a lot like chat shows at times. I like it when the chat is interesting.

Ultimately, I watch F1 for the racing and that will always be more important to me than the chat, so I do agree with your point to an extent. But it doesn't mean I can't enjoy some interesting conversation with the drivers and be pleased we're actually getting it at the minute.

#34 RoutariEnjinu

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 07:51

Check the comments on the Planet F1 article about Button saying they don't need Schumachers help.

A sign of things to come maybe?

The mob is fickle.

#35 RoutariEnjinu

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 08:08

Originally posted by pjabyrne

[...] The total opposite of the 'that-was-the-best-race-of-my-life / I-was-really-on-it-today /I'm-great-aren't-I? BS you get from the other British driver. [...]


"You would say we are going to be competitive, but it is a question of who else is going to be up there with us."

"Both Rubens [and I] are good in the wet"

"I know I am good and now I have a competitive car hopefully we can have a competitive season"

http://www.planetf1....53472_1,00.html

Don't for a minute think it wont be long until Button is the new witch to be hunted. The press will build it up as a fairytale, JUST like they did with Hamilton 2007, and then they will bring him down to size. All while selling papers, and getting the mouth breathing fickle mob viewing the adverts on their websites.

#36 Buttoneer

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 09:12

Originally posted by RoutariEnjinu


"You would say we are going to be competitive, but it is a question of who else is going to be up there with us."

Sounds confident.

Originally posted by RoutariEnjinu

"Both Rubens [and I] are good in the wet"

Wow that's a bit sure of himself.

Originally posted by RoutariEnjinu

"I know I am good and now I have a competitive car hopefully we can have a competitive season"

Listen to the sheer ARROGANCE of the man!

#37 Force Ten

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 09:19

Originally posted by RoutariEnjinu

http://www.planetf1....53472_1,00.html


Interesting link. I clicked on it and there was this rolling headline bar and the first three sentences started: Hamilton's career on knifes edge, Schumacher to blame for Kimi's..., Flav blames diffuser...

Somehow it made me lose interest at what that website has to say about anything pretty fast.

#38 The Ragged Edge

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 09:20

Originally posted by pjabyrne
A comment by Button over the weekend really struck me:



I mean :eek: ???

A top F1 driver admitting to a weakness. I was really impressed by that. The total opposite of the 'that-was-the-best-race-of-my-life / I-was-really-on-it-today /I'm-great-aren't-I? BS you get from the other British driver.

Barrichello also made no excuses. I seen a quote somewhere where he admitted he'd been beaten 'fair and square'.

I just think such modesty is a really refreshing change...


Thats why in bad cars Button looks distinctly average. He cant drive around the failings in a car like Hamilton & Alonso. Refreshing yes, but an admission he is not a top-class all round driver who can adapt well.

#39 chhatra

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 10:24

Originally posted by bankoq


The problem is Button had winning car for 4 or 5 races in his career, while Hamilton for 36.


Slighly unfair, Hamilton had a competitive car for 36 races and probably half he was able to win. I think it was clear that ferrari had the faster car for the last two years. McLaren were more consistent but ferrari were definately quicker.

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#40 RoutariEnjinu

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 11:08

Originally posted by Force Ten


Interesting link. I clicked on it and there was this rolling headline bar and the first three sentences started: Hamilton's career on knifes edge, Schumacher to blame for Kimi's..., Flav blames diffuser...

Somehow it made me lose interest at what that website has to say about anything pretty fast.


Yep, it's sensationalist pantomime tabloid bollocks... but just wait till the sentiments seep in to this forum regarding Button.

Every driver gives you ammo you can use to "prove" they are "arrogant", "prima donna" etc etc.
If you've got someone leading the interview wanting to reinforce a pantomime personality they've created that generates hits/sells paper, they'll be able to extract more nuggets.

Even if the press aren't able to extract any corkers, they'll throw in one picture out of the 20 they took that best fits the stereotype to go along with the article, and people that have already made up their minds will invent and assert reasons as to why the stereotype is to be reinforced.

If Button keeps winning, and the mob gets bored, and there's no more "fairy tale" story to sell, the press will turn, and he'll get it just as bad as Hamilton. He's British, and worst of all English. He hasn't got a chance! :p

It's easy for the paddock to like Button when he's driving a dog at the back.

#41 bankoq

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 15:44

Originally posted by chhatra


Slighly unfair, Hamilton had a competitive car for 36 races and probably half he was able to win. I think it was clear that ferrari had the faster car for the last two years. McLaren were more consistent but ferrari were definately quicker.


True, but 4 or 5 races isn't 18. And guy says no wonder Button isn't rated higly as he hasn't won many races in his career forgetting that the car is main factor in winning. How stupid is that?

#42 sreevishnu

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 19:06

Originally posted by Force Ten


Interesting link. I clicked on it and there was this rolling headline bar and the first three sentences started: Hamilton's career on knifes edge, Schumacher to blame for Kimi's..., Flav blames diffuser...

Somehow it made me lose interest at what that website has to say about anything pretty fast.

that site is full of cr@p
the site editors are pro british and there is no sensible news in that site

no need to ask about the forum....its full of BS with lots of fanboys and full of Bandwagon kids! :lol:

#43 sreevishnu

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 19:07

Originally posted by chhatra


Slighly unfair, Hamilton had a competitive car for 36 races and probably half he was able to win. I think it was clear that ferrari had the faster car for the last two years. McLaren were more consistent but ferrari were definately quicker.


Mclaren definetly had the fastest car in 2007!...it always seemed they are fastest straight out of the box.
In 2008 it was really equal!

#44 Madras

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 19:17

Originally posted by sreevishnu


Mclaren definetly had the fastest car in 2007!...it always seemed they are fastest straight out of the box.
In 2008 it was really equal!


No in 2008 Ferrari was the fastest car for sure, the only thing that hampered it was heating its tyres up for qualifying. Kimi got 10 fastest laps, Massa got 3, Hamilton got 1. 2007 McLaren had been developed by McLaren and Ferrari.

#45 raiseyourfistfor

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 20:44

Originally posted by Madras

2007 McLaren had been developed by McLaren and Ferrari.


Not really, and ontop of that in 2007 mclaren was close to .5s of the pace in race trim. Their car was only good in low df tracks.

#46 senna da silva

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Posted 07 April 2009 - 20:47

Lewis had a competitive car. Button has a dominant car. See the difference? :lol:

#47 giltkid

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Posted 08 April 2009 - 08:35

Originally posted by The Ragged Edge


Thats why in bad cars Button looks distinctly average. He cant drive around the failings in a car like Hamilton & Alonso. Refreshing yes, but an admission he is not a top-class all round driver who can adapt well.


Hamilton has had a bad car for only 2 races of his F1 career. If he's still got a bad car in 10 races and he's still got fight in him I'll be impressed, otherwise to me he's just an ok driver who lucked into by far the best car and threw away one championship and nearly threw the other one away.