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The 2 Wheel Thread 2009 - MotoGP; WSBK; AMA; BSB


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#5601 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 23:24

Ummm That would be - let me guess here - ZERO?
Mate It's been going on since day dot.
Apparently there is only one rider in Motogp.
Glad others have noticed it finally.
This is the first time I've read his column in a while because of that very fact.
I guess some things never change.

To be fair, it´s not only Moody, even if he is one of the worst.
I see the cover of MCN had a full page pic of Valentino on the cover, even though a Brit was crowned WSS champion on the same weekend. Hell, I was at least expecting equal billing, even from MCN.
No wonder the lads from Blighty are having a hard time finding sponsors and decent rides.

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#5602 Chubby_Deuce

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 23:37

Sounds pretty reasonable to me. Why would a WSS title get the same level of coverage as a ninth World Championship?

#5603 woftam

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Posted 28 October 2009 - 23:58

To be fair, it´s not only Moody, even if he is one of the worst.
I see the cover of MCN had a full page pic of Valentino on the cover, even though a Brit was crowned WSS champion on the same weekend. Hell, I was at least expecting equal billing, even from MCN.
No wonder the lads from Blighty are having a hard time finding sponsors and decent rides.


I don't have a problem with Vale having top billing when he has just won his ninth title.
It's a friggin awesome achievement.
It's every other race weekend he goes way overboard on him whether he has won the race or not.


#5604 Kaiser

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 01:02

No wonder the lads from Blighty are having a hard time finding sponsors and decent rides.


I think that Brits have plenty of good rides. How many will be in WSB next year, 7? Even a rider like Sykes has a factory ride. Both riders on the factory Yamaha are Brits, Factory Honda has a Brit on board, looks like one of the Aprillias will be ridden by a Brit, factory Kawasaki, factory Suzuki. Is there a factory team, aside from Ducati, that doesn't have a Brit as one of the riders?

Meanwhile Josh Hayes is riding a Graves Yamaha next year.

#5605 Melbourne Park

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 01:46

Of course, there's absolutely no way that Melbourne Park and others' posts about Stoner could be considered fanboyism at all is there? :rolleyes:

Really, give it a break. We get it. We know some of you would let Casey bend you over and do you, but that doesn't mean Toby was wrong, or didn't research things. Given his position within the motorcycling circus(es), I'd place more credibility in his jottings than those of uninformed forum posters.

Oh and for what it's worth, I quite like Casey and absolutely adore Ducati so I really don't have any thing against him. I'd suggest many of those who are "slighting" Stoner feel the same. Despite your best attempts to impune otherwise, it is not that they are agin Casey, it is simply that Rossi is the bigger story at the moment. No doubt even suggesting that will bring the usual tirade of nonsense.

Neil


I'm not a journalist. And I admire Rossi. Although that's not exactly unique.

Here's part of what TM said. Rather than spin personal opinions and gossip, he should have done some research. Stoner's issues were NOT the result of f*cking mental fatigue, which was TM's false tenant. Stoner was physically sick. That TM just spun a shallow story was utterly disgraceful IMO, and he has my most sincere contempt. At the time I complained to Autosport. TM does not have an accessible email. And unless there is a retraction of some form, I'm not subscribing next year.

The illness that has been so hard to diagnose has finally caught up with Casey Stoner and the punishing schedule of a professional sportsman has seen him sit out Brno, Indy and Misano.

Much has been written about Stoner and his stunning natural ability, but is it sheer bloody mindedness that drives him too? Of course it is. Upon congratulating him after some of his ten victories in 2007, his face would light up in an instant, happy that someone was seeing through the whole 'the Ducati is the best bike' syndrome that surrounded the GP7.

But he could still bite journalists with a quip, the same journalists who had just dealt with the world's most polite world champion, Nicky Hayden.

The factory in Bologna even took issue with The Times, who wrote he was "an angry young man" while others were quoted as suggesting he was "tightly wound".

Of course motorcycle racers get wound up; by definition top level sportsman are scrutinised and subtly picked on by the press if they have a foible, but likewise smiled upon if they have a liking towards that sportsman. See Valentino Rossi and his favourable press the world over.

Ironically though, it may well have been Stoner's consummate drive and determination that has been a reason for this downfall.

Wanting to be the best and wanting to prove he is the best was rightly installed into him as a lad, winning all things he entered as a youngster. It is a major part of the Aussie sportsman's way to not concede or show weakness, but he is so driven and so determined that it has literally eaten him from the inside with this illness of late. Nervous energy is crippling.

He is no natural in front of the press and sponsors, he prefer to be with his closest friends away from the public eye. This I can utterly understand, but you can't not be in the public eye if you are a MotoGP world champion. It is in the script. Rumours of negotiating his contract so that he did less PR work can't have been too far from the
truth.

But all in all this has left Casey sick and drained.

There is no more mental energy to overcome the illness and physically fight his way through the field upon the GP9, to "stick it up 'em". Mental energy is a massively powerful and under-rated strength; overcoming weaknesses with adrenaline and sheer bloody mindedness.

Stoner started racing when he was four. He's now twenty three and never had a break nor a decent bit of time off. He didn't even take a honeymoon after marrying Adriana, instead jetting to the Wrooom Marlboro media event less than a week after taking his vows. That has not sat well with him to this day.


Casey Stoner © LAT
You can hardly blame him, but, cruel to be kind, it is still all part of the job. Take the money, win while you can and then relax later investing your bumper tax free winnings to make yet more, or just spending them to enjoy a happy life.

Or that's how it seems to us on the outside.


Edited by Melbourne Park, 29 October 2009 - 01:51.


#5606 beanoid

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 08:11

The truth is, none of us knows what was wrong with Stoner. The story has always been a bit vague. Not that it's any of our business--because it's not--but no one has ever really described (publicly) what was wrong with him.

And Toby Moody is one of the finest human beings I've ever had the pleasure to meet.

#5607 rally man

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 08:24

The truth is, none of us knows what was wrong with Stoner. The story has always been a bit vague. Not that it's any of our business--because it's not--but no one has ever really described (publicly) what was wrong with him.

And Toby Moody is one of the finest human beings I've ever had the pleasure to meet.


However it's reported that after they raised his blood-pressure by sodium diet it turned his physical condition.

This speculation he-got-sick-by-loosing to-valentino is example of standard fanboyish propaganda without actual merit or actual likelihood. When Cayse got visibly sick he was leading the championship with Lorenzo and Rossi. It's likely that Stoner's physical condition was unideal already from the start of the season. In Qatar he felt that he should train more because he was physically drained after the race.

Edited by rally man, 29 October 2009 - 08:24.


#5608 Arn

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 08:40

Final times, Portimao 2. testday.

Pos. Rider Manufacturer Time
1 Jonathan Rea Ten Kate Honda 1'41.878
2 Michel Fabrizio Xerox Ducati 1'41.992
3 Cal Crutchlow Sterilgarda Yamaha 1'42.115
4 Leon Haslam Alstare Suzuki 1'42.251
5 Max Biaggi Aprilia 1'42.71
6 Leon Camier Aprilia 1'42.79
7 Noriyuki Haga Xerox Ducati 1'43.098
8 James Toseland Sterilgarda Yamaha 1'43.147
9 Carlos Checa Althea Ducati 1'43.425
10 Max Neukirchner Ten Kate Honda 1'43.549
11 Sylvain Guintoli Alstare Suzuki 1'43.612
12 Joan Lascorz PBM Kawasaki 1'43.902
13 Javier Fores DFX Ducati 1'44.413
14 Tom Sykes PBM Kawasaki 1'44.9
15 Vittorio Ianuzzo Italia Squadra Corse Honda 1'44.908
16 Alex Hofmann Aprilia test rider 1'45.5
17 Regis Laconi DFX Ducati 1'46.458

After only two days of testing on the Yamaha, Cal Crutchlow is basically on the pace of the front runners. Makes you wonder what Sykes was doing all year on that bike. Also Leon Haslam looks impressive on the Suzuki. It is nice to see that the rider is so important in Motorcycle racing.

I know it is just testing but the times are very competitive so I expect most of them went balls out.


#5609 Rob

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 08:56

After only two days of testing on the Yamaha, Cal Crutchlow is basically on the pace of the front runners. Makes you wonder what Sykes was doing all year on


Sykes is a decent talent, one only needs to look at what he did on the BSB Suzuki to see that. It makes his year fairly surprising.

#5610 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 09:15

And Toby Moody is one of the finest human beings I've ever had the pleasure to meet.

Agreed. Toby is a lovely chappie. Salt of the earth actually, and a damn good rider in his own right.
But, with respect Beanie, we were discussing his journalism, not his personality.

#5611 woftam

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 10:41

Agreed. Toby is a lovely chappie. Salt of the earth actually, and a damn good rider in his own right.
But, with respect Beanie, we were discussing his journalism, not his personality.


Exactly. It's certainly not personal. It's just nearly all his articles have the same slant on them.
So I don't read them anymore. Problem solved.


#5612 woftam

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 10:43

Sykes is a decent talent, one only needs to look at what he did on the BSB Suzuki to see that. It makes his year fairly surprising.


He certainly had a shocking year compared to his team mate this year though.
Admittedly he had a pretty fair team mate to stack up against.


#5613 Melbourne Park

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 11:07

The truth is, none of us knows what was wrong with Stoner. The story has always been a bit vague. Not that it's any of our business--because it's not--but no one has ever really described (publicly) what was wrong with him.


The diagnosis for chronic fatigue is based on exclusion. Various checks are done, and if at the end of all of them, nothing is found, then it becomes labelled as chronic fatigue. Western medicine seeks a magic pill to fix the problem. So far there hasn't been one. There is a clinic in Melbourne which has an incredibly successful rate, with healing most people within only a matter of weeks (much more than a month though). Chinese medicine also has some successful treatments, but they do not provide an immediate cure, although they do provide a significant difference. Western medicine is investigating an area of the brain that tells the body that your sick (when your not). Essentially, your body feels as if its got the flu, all the time. sleep is effected, concentration, stamina, body pains, headaches, diet issues, there's a whole list.

Every person with chronic fatigue fails to have a specific cause - the only common factor, is that the patient started with a virus. Up to a couple of years ago, I never believed it really existed. Ignorance and journalism though are bad bedfellows IMO. And if a journalist is simply writing popularist drivel, then its hardly journalism IMO. Fact is that such sicknesses are mostly more of a handicap than broken bones, which are mostly specifically treatable. And when their bones are healing, journalists do not attack the injured person with claims of mental weakness.

Edited by Melbourne Park, 29 October 2009 - 11:14.


#5614 Atreiu

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 11:49

Is there any more WSBK testing this year?

#5615 Chubby_Deuce

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:07

chronic fatigue


Just let it go dude.

#5616 Option1

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:41

I still fail to see what's so shocking about Moody's statements. I don't read it that the illness was mental. I read it that he was so mentally drained that he was no longer able to fight the illness. Toby says that explicitly:

But all in all this has left Casey sick and drained.

There is no more mental energy to overcome the illness...


As is so often the case, I think some of you are seeing conspiracies where none exist.

Anyway, I'm sure you will all be thankful that that is the last I have to say on the subject. Really, this isn't a thread for fanboism MP.

Neil

#5617 Chubby_Deuce

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:43

Did you guys hear that Yamaha won three titles in one weekend? Couldn't find anything posted here about it but I did see a lot of stuff about Casey Stoner and chronic fatigue. Just thought it was an interesting news tidbit.

#5618 craftverk

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:43

I still fail to see what's so shocking about Moody's statements. I don't read it that the illness was mental. I read it that he was so mentally drained that he was no longer able to fight the illness. Toby says that explicitly:



As is so often the case, I think some of you are seeing conspiracies where none exist.

Anyway, I'm sure you will all be thankful that that is the last I have to say on the subject. Really, this isn't a thread for fanboism MP.

Neil

What are you talking about?

#5619 Option1

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:50

Oh do try and keep up, there's a good chap. :rolleyes:

Neil

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#5620 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:54

Oh do try and keep up, there's a good chap. :rolleyes:

Neil

You´ve forgotten your medication again, haven´t you Neil. :stoned: :kiss: :lol:

#5621 moto

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 13:59

Did you guys hear that Yamaha won three titles in one weekend? Couldn't find anything posted here about it but I did see a lot of stuff about Casey Stoner and chronic fatigue. Just thought it was an interesting news tidbit.


It is bit ironic that the Yam’s president made an announcement to step down a day after they won the championships by taking the responsibility for the worst financial performance in 26 years. They are losing big time, expecting net loss for 1.8B dollars this year. New president said they are facing the most difficult time since the inception of the company. :eek:

#5622 Lazy Prodigy

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 14:40

He certainly had a shocking year compared to his team mate this year though.
Admittedly he had a pretty fair team mate to stack up against.

He just couldnt ride the R1. He might be better than Ben if he was on the Ducati or Honda who knows. I honestly dont think there is anything else to it. Look at Toseland and Crutchlow in testing on the pace, Haga & Corser on 2008 R1 championship challengers. Ben could have had a Fabrizio if someone else was riding the bike.

#5623 saunarobot

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 15:31

Crutchlow is pretty impressive, right on the pace and much quicker than Toseland.

#5624 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 15:34

Crutchlow is pretty impressive, right on the pace and much quicker than Toseland.

And to think Toseland is an ex Superbake champion and (returning) from motogp, you would expect him to be comfortably fast on the superbike, looking at how Simoncelli did.

#5625 saunarobot

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 15:44

And to think Toseland is an ex Superbake champion and (returning) from motogp, you would expect him to be comfortably fast on the superbike, looking at how Simoncelli did.


Exactly, but I wonder if Toseland lost pace after his crashes in the winter testing?

#5626 giddyup409

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 19:14

I think that Brits have plenty of good rides. How many will be in WSB next year, 7? Even a rider like Sykes has a factory ride. Both riders on the factory Yamaha are Brits, Factory Honda has a Brit on board, looks like one of the Aprillias will be ridden by a Brit, factory Kawasaki, factory Suzuki. Is there a factory team, aside from Ducati, that doesn't have a Brit as one of the riders?

Meanwhile Josh Hayes is riding a Graves Yamaha next year.


pssst ... we don't wont another yank to destroy another brit career, do we?;)

#5627 Seanspeed

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 20:00

Exactly, but I wonder if Toseland lost pace after his crashes in the winter testing?

Plenty of other riders have recovered from similar circumstances just fine. I'm not saying something couldn't have happened during the period, but it does seem a little desperate to start going down that line of thinking. For me, I've just come to the conclusion that maybe he's just not capable of filling his potential like other riders can.

Give him time, though. Cal and him could have been running different programs, ya never know.

Looks like a good season next year, though. I'm glad we'll have more top riders on the Yamaha to keep the competition nice and tight. Will be cool to see Haslam on the Suzuki as well. And did I see Max N on a Honda? WTF? Is that for testing's sake or is that a confirmed move I never heard of? Not that I'm complaining......



#5628 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 20:43

And did I see Max N on a Honda? WTF? Is that for testing's sake or is that a confirmed move I never heard of? Not that I'm complaining......

Confirmed about 2 weeks ago. So chuffed for Max N. He needs a break after this year. :up:

#5629 Option1

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 21:01

Agreed! Max is one who really has had bad crash(es) at exactly the wrong time(s) in his career - not that there's ever really a right time of course.

Neil

#5630 smithy

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Posted 29 October 2009 - 21:50

And to think Toseland is an ex Superbake champion and (returning) from motogp, you would expect him to be comfortably fast on the superbike, looking at how Simoncelli did.

Toseland would have had to jump on a plane as soon as MotoGP Malaysia finished to get to Portugal in time for the WSBK test. The poor boy would have been shattered!


#5631 Chubby_Deuce

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 00:45

Nah, he looked to have been saving his energy all weekend.;)

#5632 Youichi

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 09:01

Nah, he looked to have been saving his energy all Season .;)


Fixed it for you :rotfl:

#5633 saunarobot

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 11:05

Some news/rumours from nelonen.fi . Ajo team will likely have Marquez and Cortese with Repsol and Red Bull following Marquez to them in 125's. Their Moto2 might have Pesek and Debon. Aspar will sign Terol and Smith for 125s. Pasini to Moto2 with JiR. It is going to be a cracking season next year in 125's!

#5634 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 11:53

Someone who has impressed me immensely in his first season is the young German, Jonas Folger.
Anyone have any idea where he´s going next year? I would love to see him picked up by Martinez who seems to run the top outfit in 125´s.
This kid could really develop into a top rider if he is not mismanaged and makes the right moves at the right time, something that is crucial for any young talent fulfilling to his true potential.

#5635 Atreiu

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 12:05

He was really on it at Jerez before he fell down.
How young is he?

#5636 ex Rhodie racer 2

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 12:29

He was really on it at Jerez before he fell down.
How young is he?

Born August 13, 1993, so he´s just turned 16.

#5637 Lazy Prodigy

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Posted 30 October 2009 - 18:45

Some news/rumours from nelonen.fi . Ajo team will likely have Marquez and Cortese with Repsol and Red Bull following Marquez to them in 125's. Their Moto2 might have Pesek and Debon. Aspar will sign Terol and Smith for 125s. Pasini to Moto2 with JiR. It is going to be a cracking season next year in 125's!

Good for Sandro. He was doing well early on. Anyways Ducati tried a new clutch on Haga and new forks with Fabrizio and Haga. And about Toseland's test, he was nearly a second faster than Bens race times at the end. No clue what Rea is doing he just said the bike has alot of potential.

Edited by Lazy Prodigy, 30 October 2009 - 18:48.


#5638 ehagar

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 02:04

Hmmm... I'm kinda embarrassed to ask this (because I feel like I should know the answer), but has there been any update on KTM's RC8 Superbike project. I haven't heard anything in ages. I thought they were planning a team for 2010 but have they shelved that till a later date. Last I saw they were running in the IDM championship.

Edited by ehagar, 01 November 2009 - 02:05.


#5639 Chubby_Deuce

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 05:53

Just getting back to how freaking good the new Yamahas are, they're practically impossible to buy. I was going to dump $9,200 a 2008 built to the old AMA SS specs but I didn't get to it in time... and this bike wasn't actually listed publicly. There's very few of the 2008/2009 race bikes for sale and the ones that are go fast. Meanwhile you can have a Suzuki/Honda/Kawi for cheap and there's a shitload of them. If Herrin and Aquino can find some consistency next year then they could very well walk the championship.

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#5640 Gilles4Ever

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 07:25

Hmmm... I'm kinda embarrassed to ask this (because I feel like I should know the answer), but has there been any update on KTM's RC8 Superbike project. I haven't heard anything in ages. I thought they were planning a team for 2010 but have they shelved that till a later date. Last I saw they were running in the IDM championship.

They raced the full season in Superstock 1000 as Go Eleven PMS. didn't score a point though. http://www.goeleven.it/

I see theyare2nd in the IDM (German Superbike Championship) to Jorg Teuchert (he must be 60) on a Yamaha.

Thinking aloud, with KTM out of 125 and 250, their original plan to run the RC8 in World Superbikes in 2010, with the bike doing pretty well in IDM, with the Red Bull rokkies cup being a success on MotoGP weekends, what are the chances that WorldSBK's secret new 1 make series being Red Bull KTMs?

#5641 ehagar

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 15:11

That random thought crossed my mind as well... I was wondering if the new "ParkinGO World Series" would essentially be a KTM RC8 cup such as what you see in BSB. Or Ducati 848s? I wonder...

Edited by ehagar, 01 November 2009 - 15:12.


#5642 Andy35

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 15:36

It always makes me laugh how Aussies complain about English whinging and yet all we ever get is Stoner or Mladin whinging and then people on here whinging about things also, you guys are worse than my mum who reads the Daily Mail and thinks the world is going to pot.

Lets face it. Cal Crutchlow and Stoner have got one championship to boot. Rossi has 9. Rossi cracked the records again, Stoner or Crutchlow didn't. Rossi is 10000x more known than Crutchlow and 100x more than Stoner in the big wide world and yet people complain about Moody and MCN doing the right thing for THEIR READERS.

Stoner fans who complain about Rossi will remain obsessed fanboys in my eyes until he can win a world championship without the best tyres and best engine. Be prepared for another season of sadness in 2010, at least you will be more used to it by then. :D

On a less jovial and joshing note, Tom Wheatcroft has died and for any British motorcycle enthusiast that is a sad blow :(

Regards
Andy



#5643 craftverk

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 15:41

It always makes me laugh how Aussies complain about English whinging and yet all we ever get is Stoner or Mladin whinging and then people on here whinging about things also, you guys are worse than my mum who reads the Daily Mail and thinks the world is going to pot.

Lets face it. Cal Crutchlow and Stoner have got one championship to boot. Rossi has 9. Rossi cracked the records again, Stoner or Crutchlow didn't. Rossi is 10000x more known than Crutchlow and 100x more than Stoner in the big wide world and yet people complain about Moody and MCN doing the right thing for THEIR READERS.

Stoner fans who complain about Rossi will remain obsessed fanboys in my eyes until he can win a world championship without the best tyres and best engine. Be prepared for another season of sadness in 2010, at least you will be more used to it by then. :D

So you think bias is good for readers? What the flip are you talking about?

It's not about whether one is a fanatic or not, it's about being balanced as far as coverage goes.

#5644 Kaiser

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 16:23

Just getting back to how freaking good the new Yamahas are, they're practically impossible to buy. I was going to dump $9,200 a 2008 built to the old AMA SS specs but I didn't get to it in time... and this bike wasn't actually listed publicly. There's very few of the 2008/2009 race bikes for sale and the ones that are go fast. Meanwhile you can have a Suzuki/Honda/Kawi for cheap and there's a shitload of them. If Herrin and Aquino can find some consistency next year then they could very well walk the championship.


Cardenas might be a factor next year.

#5645 ehagar

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 16:52

I hope Herrin, Aquino, and Cardenas are NOT in AMA next year. They need to be somewhere else.

#5646 Andy35

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 17:18

So you think bias is good for readers? What the flip are you talking about?

It's not about whether one is a fanatic or not, it's about being balanced as far as coverage goes.



The problem is that balanced coverage in one mans eyes is not in another depending on the blinkers or :love: that blinds the readers. You know it's true. It's only natural. Readers have always been more biased than the press in this respect and so are quick to forget or quick to remember what is written, depending on how it compares to their inbuilt bias.

Regards
Andy




#5647 ex Rhodie racer 2

ex Rhodie racer 2
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Posted 01 November 2009 - 17:39

you guys are worse than my mum who thinks the world is going to pot.

Your Mum is a smart lady. ;)


#5648 craftverk

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 17:49

The problem is that balanced coverage in one mans eyes is not in another depending on the blinkers

You can generally be balanced, though.

Edited by craftverk, 01 November 2009 - 17:50.


#5649 ehagar

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 17:53

Man, what's with all the hostility in this thread? Lighten up bra.

Edited by ehagar, 01 November 2009 - 18:00.


#5650 Kaiser

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Posted 01 November 2009 - 19:58

What's a ParkinGO?