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'Motor Sport' magazine


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#1401 Vitesse2

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Posted 08 July 2006 - 21:27

They're trying to move publication forward in the month. When it was "purely" Haymarket, it was published in the third week of the month, while C&SC came out in the first week. My copies for retail sale arrived today, just two days after C&SC. Octane also usually publishes in the first week of the month, as do Practical Classics and Classics Magazine. C&SC is the market leader, so the others try to be on the shelf when the C&SC buyers mosey in to the shop .... it's a standard marketing tool in magazine publishing.

It would also be important to have the latest issue out in time for Goodwood, which has to be a major marketing opportunity.

Equally, whoever handles their subscriptions would have to totally rejig their schedules: if it's still being done by the same people as do C&SC then that would be a bit of a logistical headache.

ps That Galpin bloke from Bristol has had another letter published! :p

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#1402 Paul Taylor

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Posted 08 July 2006 - 22:37

Originally posted by ensign14
That's a bit unfair - the mid-90s mags were horrible.


Maybe...When did they make the best magazines then?

#1403 kayemod

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Posted 08 July 2006 - 22:43

Originally posted by Gary C
how comes my local Tesco has the new MotorSport on its' shelves, and I, as a subscriber haven't received it yet?? ?


As an occasional MotorSport reader I'm appalled to see that, but as a Tesco shareholder, I'm quite pleased.

#1404 Rob29

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 07:35

Mine arrived yesterday-seems to get earlier each month-next is scheduled for 4 Aug.

#1405 Allen Brown

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 10:28

Originally posted by Paul Taylor


Maybe...When did they make the best magazines then?

For me, it was from 1969 to 1979, when Jenks was at his peak. His interest waned into the 1980s and my choice of reading transferred to GPI.

I just checked my MS collection and it's nicely bound up to 1991, suggesting I still cared about it at that point, but it seems I stopped buying it after August 1992. I believe it actually disappeared for a while around the end of 1996, reappearing with completely different editorial values in 1997. I've rarely bought it since then. Should I?

Allen

#1406 David Beard

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 11:10

Originally posted by Allen Brown
I believe it actually disappeared for a while around the end of 1996, reappearing with completely different editorial values in 1997. Allen


I don't remember there being any gap in Motor Sport's history... :confused:

#1407 Vitesse2

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 11:16

Originally posted by David Beard


I don't remember there being any gap in Motor Sport's history... :confused:

Your memory's better than Allen's is, David.;) April 97 (IIRC) was when it went "historic", but there was no gap. They even managed to publish every month during WW2.

#1408 Allen Brown

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 11:34

Really? I was sure (well, fairly sure) that it went missing for a few months before that April 97 edition. Maybe it had just sunk so low on my radar that it might as well have gone missing.

Allen

#1409 green-blood

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Posted 09 July 2006 - 14:03

well no sign of the July copy yet, not holding out hope for augusts. If nothing arrives by teh end of next week we shall be having an arguement

I paid a 2 year up front Sub in January, this is NOT acceptable

anyone got the latest contact details

edit - dont bother teh rest of the planet doesn't bloody count apparently

Subscriptions Department

UK Subscriptions: 08456 777819

US Subscriptions: 1 800 272 2670


#1410 Darren Galpin

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 07:15

Originally posted by Vitesse2
ps That Galpin bloke from Bristol has had another letter published! :p


Well knock me down with a feather...... You've spoilt the surprise now though, as mine hasn't yet arrived in the post!

#1411 Rob29

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 07:21

Originally posted by Darren Galpin


Well knock me down with a feather...... You've spoilt the surprise now though, as mine hasn't yet arrived in the post!

Maybe its the local postman that you and others complaining here need to sort out? Mine seems to have always arrived before it was discussed here.

#1412 David Lawson

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 08:42

I subscribe to F1 Racing, MotorSport and Autosport and have never had a single problem with delivery for any of the titles. I have just renewed with the new leasee of MotorSport and guess what the very first issue hasn't arrived yet.

David

#1413 Cirrus

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 17:37

Well, I'm a subscriber, and I've just got home from work to find mine.

I have to say that I'm pretty impressed, after an initial flick-through. The articles seem longer, and appear to have a good words/pictures balance. The pictures themselves are interesting and relevant. I like the design and layout, and the whole thing has a true quality feel about it - it looks like a fivers worth.

#1414 Alan Cox

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 18:42

Mine arrived on Friday the 7th.

Indeed, some articles appear to have been given more space - thought the Ford GT piece by Gordon had been well researched and appeared to have input from virtually all the survivors of Le Mans '66.

Also the Moss piece by ST was given three pages of text. Although there was nothing new, it was well composed. Nice photo of the Greatest Living Englishman queueing at his local sandwich bar.

Pleased to see that there are no more of those tiny photos that spoiled the first issue with the revived green mast-head.

#1415 David Beard

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 18:54

The Font Fest seems to have subsided a little. :)

But Mr Pye, the Historic Lotus Register's Lotus 12 man is MIKE Bennett, not John!

#1416 Barry Boor

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 19:03

Mine arrived on Friday the 7th.



Mine too!

#1417 Gary C

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 19:23

Mine arrived this morning!

#1418 Maldwyn

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 20:15

Originally posted by Gary C
Mine arrived this morning!

Mine too!

#1419 David McKinney

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 20:37

and mine

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#1420 D-Type

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Posted 10 July 2006 - 22:11

And mine

#1421 Lemans

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 03:16

got mine on the 5th. much better. Bruce McLearn article was informative to me.

#1422 Eric McLoughlin

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 07:37

And I received mine.

The mag seems to be settling down nicely now.

#1423 KJJ

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 07:53

Am I the only reader who actually prefers black and white photography? Nowadays there seems to be such an obsession with colour that they even printed the Chiron pictures in sepia. Another moan, half the Chiron story was about Alice Hoffman, so why no picture of Baby?

#1424 David Lawson

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 08:13

My concern about receiving my August copy proved unfounded as I received it this morning. This month's nicely laid out magazine is a vast improvement on July's messy affair. The 1966 Le Mans feature is excellent.

David

#1425 bradbury west

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 14:13

Mine also came last Friday. I endorse the positive comments above, especially the extra wordage afforded to Simon Taylor and the GC GT40 piece. Perhaps we can look forward to a further report on the Moseley and Brooks interviews. It bodes well for the future. Still not happy about the mechanism for hiking the subs up. It is the principle, plus the sub is the same as C&SC retail price. Mr Frankel seems to be allotted a small slot.

I found WB's profile of Hans Ruesch a delight. Now there is a story and interview which need doing well by a suitably informed writer. (Send Mr McKinney over to Paris?) Imagine the scrap book or photo album HR might have, plus the first hand reports of a young racer pre-war, aide-memoire-d by notes and results from the TNF files.

Roger Lund.

#1426 Keir

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 15:10

Now that 1966 LeMans story has been told endlessly, but from reports, MotorSport did a good job on it.

So, it is true that one can still tell an old story and put some life into it .

#1427 petefenelon

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Posted 11 July 2006 - 15:35

Mine turned up yesterday, though how long it spent languishing in the postroom at work is unknown. I think the magazine is settling down, the design seems to be getting less bitty and fussy, but although most of the writing's good, the overall level of the articles isn't as high as I'd like - I don't feel MS leads me very often into uncharted waters these days, although that may be because I'm spoilt by TNF.

A good read, and nice to look at, but I don't feel the magazine is really stretching its readers.

#1428 Mallory Dan

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 09:35

Mine came last Friday the 7th, so very prompt. However, I'd agree with Pete, I think we've been spoilt by the level of knowledge on here and the other place, when it comes to history.

There must be masses of material that could be put together by informed writers that would be 'new' to most of us, and hence interesting, albeit perhaps to a smaller audience than articles on Moss, GT40s, Ferrari restorers, Andretti at Indy etc etc.

What about, for example, something on Lola sportscars (non T70s), the Aus/NZ F Pacific series, crumby F3 cars of the 70s, Jo Marquart, the SCCA runoffs, Group C2 privateers.

This could be a thread in its own right- "Ideas for MS articles" !!!

#1429 bradbury west

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 09:57

Originally posted by Mallory Dan
I think we've been spoilt by the level of knowledge on here and the other place, when it comes to history.

There must be masses of material that could be put together by informed writers that would be 'new' to most of us, and hence interesting, albeit perhaps to a smaller audience


.................... but also offers an ideal, deeper intro to this sport of ours for newcomers or those wanting to learn more, who may want more than /be put off by, shallow repetitive stuff, often inaccurate too. They are MS's future.

Haymarket/LAT's archives must be a goldmine. Perhaps the journos are not too keen to settle for rewriting, re-editing, drawing from proven knowledgeable articles by past experts, boosted now by more pictures, thanks to modern technology

OTOH broad glossy superficial sells copies. It is a policy decision for them.

RL

#1430 johnwilliamdavies

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 20:51

When I spoke to Martin Nott at Goodwood I told him that I preferred the articles on the more obscure drivers and cars, rather than the more obvious stuff. His response was that he only wanted coverage of the drivers and cars who were successful.
I think I'll probably cancel my subscription, there's not enough of interest to me in the magazine anymore.



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Welsh Motor Sport History

#1431 Barry Boor

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 21:38

I am afraid I am tending towards the same action as Mr. Davies.

#1432 Twin Window

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 21:42

Originally posted by johnwilliamdavies

His response was that he only wanted coverage of the drivers and cars who were successful.

He said that?!

Jeez... I'm at a loss for words. That's suicide.

#1433 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 21:49

:confused: What? If that turns out to be true then they have lost a new subscriber : ME!

#1434 Gary C

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Posted 12 July 2006 - 21:58

cor blimey. :|

#1435 David McKinney

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 05:00

Very strange
They'll cover topics everyone knows about, but won't give readers the opportunity to learn anything new.
I'll give the next issue a chance before deciding whether to join the defectors

#1436 Rob29

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 07:19

Originally posted by Bjørn Kjer
:confused: What? If that turns out to be true then they have lost a new subscriber : ME!

Me :cry: too.Its the obscure and unusual that I am looking for.

#1437 ian senior

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 07:26

Originally posted by johnwilliamdavies
When I spoke to Martin Nott at Goodwood I told him that I preferred the articles on the more obscure drivers and cars, rather than the more obvious stuff. His response was that he only wanted coverage of the drivers and cars who were successful.

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Welsh Motor Sport History


Unbelievable. Still, it must make it easier for them - all they have to do is re-hash existing material rather than carry out any new research.

#1438 Stephen W

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 10:00

Had a peek at the latest issue. Put it back on the shelf as it didn't look like good value for money.

When I read the post that implied they only want to cover successful drivers and cars I knew instinctively that Motor Sport was dead. If that is their attitude then I suspect a vast number of existing subscribers will not renew. I for one will be very sad to see The Green One finally disappear from the news stands but better that than becoming a coffee table glossy of no substance. DSJ must be spinning!

:eek:

#1439 petefenelon

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 10:11

What I like about the current incarnation of MS:
Photography, style of writing, nice thick glossy paper, improving design.
No more Fearnley track tests of no-hoper dull Cosworth-Hewland kit cars that "had potential".

What I don't like about the current incarnation of MS:
Too much coverage of contemporary historic racing.
Too many thinly-disguised advertorials for either cars that are on sale, or the people that are selling them.
Same ground being rehashed over and over again.
Failing to take advantage of classic material by DSJ, WB, GC, etc.
Failure to sub WB's pieces which contain a lot of facts but to minimal effect.

Too much concentration on stories that we know already.

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#1440 bradbury west

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 11:27

I would ask you all to bear with them for the next few issues at least, to see if their word is good, in whatever guise it appears.

I saw fit to ring the Editor yesterday, to pass on positive views about the apparent potential of the latest re-vamp. He takes on board everything that appears on TNF and certainly gave me the impression that he understood where we all come from in our wishes and hopes for MS. I just hope he was not spinning me a line............

The Editor comes from a sound background elsewhere in Haymarket, (I asked him how he came to be Editor as an "unknown") important as he needs to have the commercial nous to make it work, mindful of their readership, especially if they are brokering in contributors.

However, if Martin Nott, and it is his money after all, chooses to call the shots a different way, it is his prerogative.

If you have concerns, ring them up or e mail direct. It should be about content, not fonts.IMHO

But I ask that we give them a chance to show their colours, one swallow and a summer etc.

Roger Lund.

#1441 ian senior

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 11:33

Originally posted by bradbury west
IBut I ask that we give them a chance to show their colours, one swallow and a summer etc.

Roger Lund.


I think it's only fair to do that, but I am still a bit worried. I hope I'm wrong.

#1442 Paul Taylor

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 14:03

I'm surprised WB still writes for them...In the issues I bought 2 years ago (the last time I bought the magazine), WB's articles seemed to be limited to a single column somewhere near the back of the magazine, in most issues. In the old days, he used to get several pages. MotorSport could always go back to being a magazine about modern racing, but I'd certainly have no interest in that as I only have a limited interest of modern racing these days.

I think it'd be great to see articles on people who aren't obscure, but who aren't well known by only casual racing fans. Gijs van Lennep, Harald Ertl, Philippe Etancelin, Eugenio Castellotti, Nino Vaccarella...people who's names you don't hear that much these days. F1rejects.com has articles on people like Frank J. Dochnal, Mikko Kozarowitzky, Roelof Wunderink, Gaetano Starrabba...Names you may have heard once in an F1 statistics book, but that's it.

#1443 petefenelon

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 15:43

Originally posted by Paul Taylor
I'm surprised WB still writes for them...In the issues I bought 2 years ago (the last time I bought the magazine), WB's articles seemed to be limited to a single column somewhere near the back of the magazine, in most issues. In the old days, he used to get several pages. MotorSport could always go back to being a magazine about modern racing, but I'd certainly have no interest in that as I only have a limited interest of modern racing these days.

I think it'd be great to see articles on people who aren't obscure, but who aren't well known by only casual racing fans. Gijs van Lennep, Harald Ertl, Philippe Etancelin, Eugenio Castellotti, Nino Vaccarella...people who's names you don't hear that much these days. F1rejects.com has articles on people like Frank J. Dochnal, Mikko Kozarowitzky, Roelof Wunderink, Gaetano Starrabba...Names you may have heard once in an F1 statistics book, but that's it.


The Ruesch article was exactly the sort of level I think MS should be aiming at - he's a name i've heard, and someone whose career I'm vaguely familiar with, but that article turned him into a "real person".

#1444 john aston

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 17:52

I have now read the latest edition.And it is...well, ok. But I feel as if I have been to an expensive restaraunt, eaten a beautiful looking meal but am still hungry and can't really remember any flavour which stood out.In short , it's anodyne and too compromised- especially , I think , for the market it needs to corner.

What could be better?

1.Trash the lifestyle advertorial stuff. I am not interested in champagne coolers or silly watches .

2.Concentrate on races, racers and racing cars.

3.Less pictures , more text.I want 3-4000 word pieces which probe and explore the subject matter.Simon Taylor's piece are a start but the Ford GT stuff ruined by wasted space- a whole page devoted to a few lines of text.

4.No more bite size reviews of books or race reports.Especially the latter. If I want to know who won an HSCC race at Croft I would have found out from weeklies or web.Or actually attended in my case.

5 More personal pieces with strong opinons not just facts.

6 And spare me some of the contrived writing - if I want silly puns I will get them in Q thanks.

But I love it anyway- I find CSC near unreadable and only buy it for the ads now, if at all.

#1445 Paul Taylor

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 18:05

Originally posted by petefenelon


The Ruesch article was exactly the sort of level I think MS should be aiming at - he's a name i've heard, and someone whose career I'm vaguely familiar with, but that article turned him into a "real person".


If that's in a recent edition, then I haven't read it...The thing is 95% of the members here have an incredible amount of knoweldge of motorsports and - no disrespect to you guys - if MS wrote everything at the level that you guys would find interesting, then they'd be really closing themselves up to a very specialised audience. People like myself would find the magazine almost impossible to read.

They just need to find the right balance because at the moment, the articles aren't really interesting anyone, it seems. They could at least write some very specialist material and some not so specialist material so both of us are happy.

#1446 David McKinney

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 18:18

Originally posted by Paul Taylor
if MS wrote everything at the level that you guys would find interesting, then they'd be really closing themselves up to a very specialised audience.

I don't think anyone's suggesting that. I'm sure we all recognise that in order to survive the mag has to appeal to a broad base
But one topic of more obscure interest, covered in depth, would be nice. The newbies don't have to read it if it's too esoteric for them
(Which, I know, is more or less what you concluded)

#1447 Paul Taylor

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Posted 13 July 2006 - 23:41

Didn't I read that someone from MS magazine has seen this thread?

#1448 Allen Brown

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Posted 14 July 2006 - 07:31

Did I read that they've pushed the price up to £5? If they have, they're clearly not expecting a mass-market readership, they must be expecting a smaller more specialist readership. In which case they need articles beyond the McLaren M23/Lotus 72/Maserati 250F rehashes or it will fall between two stools and fail.

Allen

#1449 petefenelon

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Posted 14 July 2006 - 09:11

Originally posted by Paul Taylor


If that's in a recent edition, then I haven't read it...The thing is 95% of the members here have an incredible amount of knoweldge of motorsports and - no disrespect to you guys - if MS wrote everything at the level that you guys would find interesting, then they'd be really closing themselves up to a very specialised audience. People like myself would find the magazine almost impossible to read.

They just need to find the right balance because at the moment, the articles aren't really interesting anyone, it seems. They could at least write some very specialist material and some not so specialist material so both of us are happy.


The Ruesch article was this month, and was probably the best thing in the magazine since the relaunch.

I don't think it'd be "impossible to read"; consider MS as being something like picking up a biography of someone you've never heard of on the shelves of a bookshop because the cover/blurb/pictures/few paragraphs you flick through in there look interesting. It doesn't matter who or what you're reading about as long as it's presented in a compelling way.

Yet more "top 10s", hagiography of the "usual suspects", contemporary historic reports, thinly-veiled Goodwood plugs will probably bore the reader after six months to a year. When all's said and done, there isn't much more that you can say about Clark, Senna, Fangio, Moss, Stewart, Hill, or Brabham; Ferrari, Jaguar, BRM, Alfa, Lotus, Bentley, Mercedes or Auto Union; Monaco, Brooklands, Spa, Indy, the Ring or Monza in the space of a few pages.

I'd guess that the Motor Sport audience falls into four categories:
(1) Collectors and dealers - people who mainly buy it for the ads and the advertorial from dealers - as long as there's something to drool over in the back of the mag, they're not going to go away in a hurry.
(2) Historic racers who like seeing their cars reported
(3) "Lifestyle" readers who pick it up because it's nice and glossy and has a glamorous old racing car on the cover
(4) Enthusiasts.

Re: 3, as long as the magazine's full of good stories and pictures, with the odd famous face and some nice watch and road car ads, they'll continue to buy on the newsstands.

Re: 4, the more articles about the Stebros, Realphas, and so on the better ;)

#1450 Bjorn Kjer

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Posted 14 July 2006 - 11:21

:( I am afraid it does not look good with M S !?

PS Go to Volonterio thread and read one of the last posts (Graham) Perhaps its price, what do I know , but if they wont bring an article on Teodoro Zeccoli ?

PS I know he doesnt say yhat.....