To sign or not to sign, that is the question
#1
Posted 13 August 2009 - 12:44
"Anything which makes it to the book will be acknowledged and I will try to arrange a complimentary copy. If you are in luck, it will be one of the rare, unsigned, copies. It is a fact that a signed copy ot a book is reckoned to be spoiled. so cannot be returned to the wholesaler. I learned that from Doug Nye."
With all due respect to the Good and the Great, my question is, 'spoiled' in whose perception? I can see that a bookseller not wishing to commit to selling X copies might consider signed books would spoil the 'return' part of 'sale or return', and that a wholesaler's options might be compromised by returned copies which are signed.
But in the eyes of the enthusiast or the collector, signed is good, not spoiled. And for the author, hoping to earn a crust from all his effort, and his publisher, seeking a return on his risk, commitment from a bookseller is also good, not spoiled. So all hail to booksellers who do like to sell signed copies, and effectively show that commitment.
Am I right? Or talking b****cks? Mike? Doug?
Rgds
Paul
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#2
Posted 13 August 2009 - 13:17
#3
Posted 13 August 2009 - 13:37
#4
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:00
On the author side I have signed stacks of my books for various book sellers with a generic autograph. Hope that did not render the books unsaleable!
Tom
#5
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:08
On the author side I have signed stacks of my books for various book sellers with a generic autograph. Hope that did not render the books unsaleable!
No, but unreturnable...............
#6
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:09
Is that 'Leap Into Legend' you're referring to, Steve? If so, one of those 50 showed up at the Bonhams Festival of Speed auction. Can't recall what it fetched.My publisher asked me to do a "Limited Edition" run of my last one. The first fifty were signed by many of those. whose names appeared in the chapters within, plus we used Sir Malcolm Campbell's own library stamp. It was only fifty, and have only ever signed books, only ever putting a personal dedication in if asked, but surely these are already "brought" and of no consequence to the publisher??
Rgds
Paul
#7
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:17
I suppose a book with a known drivers signature, even with a personal inscription should not be decreased in value, on the contrary.
#8
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:31
Exactly. My bookselling days are long ago, but it was a rule of thumb that if you had a signing session you either politely declined the author's offer to "sign a few more for people who couldn't make it" or grudgingly allowed them to sign five or so copies ....I believe it to be a technical issue regarding returns to the publisher only. The publisher draws clear guidelines as to what is a "spoilt" book, and that involves copies marked in ink, for whatever reason. Seems reasonable enough to me.
The occasional signed copy would make its way back to the publisher - who would refuse credit on the grounds that it was damaged. But they wouldn't send it back to the bookseller to give him the chance to sell it either
It was a standing joke in the trade that unsigned copies of certain books - Ted Heath's "Sailing" for example - were substantially rarer than signed ones.
#9
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:38
Certainly, signing a stack of prints is a bigger pain than is appreciated, books can't be any easier, and you really need two helpers.
Edited by Tony Matthews, 13 August 2009 - 14:39.
#10
Posted 13 August 2009 - 14:54
Is that 'Leap Into Legend' you're referring to, Steve? If so, one of those 50 showed up at the Bonhams Festival of Speed auction. Can't recall what it fetched.
Rgds
Paul
Mike Fairholme told me about that, shade under £400, ridiculous!
I was asked to add a dedication to an already signed book the other day, didn't have the heart to tell the chap it was my name, but not my signature!
#11
Posted 13 August 2009 - 15:03
Mike Fairholme told me about that, shade under £400, ridiculous!
I was asked to add a dedication to an already signed book the other day, didn't have the heart to tell the chap it was my name, but not my signature!
ouchie... I'll send you over my copy if you can stamp that one too it would be great... or I could just make up a stamp, probably cheaper than the postage !!!!!!!!
#12
Posted 13 August 2009 - 15:32
#13
Posted 13 August 2009 - 16:40
I read somewhere that at least one author habitually popped into bookshops and signed his own books, so that they could not be remaindered.This comes from Mike Lawrence at the start of his thread on a Tony Brooks book, supported by an even higher authority:
"Anything which makes it to the book will be acknowledged and I will try to arrange a complimentary copy. If you are in luck, it will be one of the rare, unsigned, copies. It is a fact that a signed copy ot a book is reckoned to be spoiled. so cannot be returned to the wholesaler. I learned that from Doug Nye."
#14
Posted 13 August 2009 - 17:06
Is that 'Leap Into Legend' you're referring to, Steve? If so, one of those 50 showed up at the Bonhams Festival of Speed auction. Can't recall what it fetched.
Rgds
Paul
I trust you'll sign my copy of your much awaited book Paul!?
#15
Posted 13 August 2009 - 18:21
It will be my very great pleasure, I look forward to putting a face to a name.I trust you'll sign my copy of your much awaited book Paul!?
#16
Posted 13 August 2009 - 19:14
"heh, heh, heh, heh," the author chuckled evilly.........No, but unreturnable...............
Tom
#17
Posted 13 August 2009 - 20:38
As an author, editor, bookseller, and book collector, I love signed copies! Authors, drivers, photographers, and editors are welcome to sign my books. And in over 30 years of selling books, I've never returned any to the distributor or publisher. A signed copy of an out-of-print title always has a higher value--and a more personal feel--than an unsigned one.
Frank
#18
Posted 13 August 2009 - 20:38
#19
Posted 13 August 2009 - 22:02
Sellers promptly took a publicity photo, scrawled his name on it, and carefully applied a lit match to the edges before blowing the resulting flame out and sending the photo on.
Two weeks later he got a reply. "Dear Mr Sellers, thank you very much for the singed photograph. Unfortunately, I need another one, as someone has signed it all around."
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#20
Posted 14 August 2009 - 07:14
#21
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:00
Good for you, my feeling pricisely.Friends:
As an author, editor, bookseller, and book collector, I love signed copies! Authors, drivers, photographers, and editors are welcome to sign my books. And in over 30 years of selling books, I've never returned any to the distributor or publisher. A signed copy of an out-of-print title always has a higher value--and a more personal feel--than an unsigned one.
Frank
#22
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:17
On the other hand my cloth copy is in is original cardboard box and never even opened. I suspect that one would show a better return.
#23
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:25
There's no arguement about that, but you can't return them to the publisher as it contravenes basic ground rules. There is no difference in law between someone scribbling in a book in order to deface it, and signing their autograph in it; it's just the direction of the ink, and it's in order to provide the publisher with some legal protection for this.Good for you, my feeling pricisely.
I own many autographed books in many different categories in addition to motorsport and the added value in monetary terms is irrelevant to me as I own them for the pure personal enjoyment of doing so.
#24
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:26
Now I wonder: which would be more valuable: a Kirk Douglas autograph by Kirk Douglas, or a Kirk Douglas autograph by Burt Lancaster??
Edited by Terry Walker, 14 August 2009 - 11:27.
#25
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:39
Reminds me of an anecdote from the movie world. In the 1950s Burt Lancaster and Kirk Douglas were so often confused with each other by the autograph hounds that they happily signed each others names.
Now I wonder: which would be more valuable: a Kirk Douglas autograph by Kirk Douglas, or a Kirk Douglas autograph by Burt Lancaster??
The Beatles were notorious for signing each other's names! I don't have a huge collection of autographs, but I've stuck to the rule of always collecting them myself personally in the presence of whoever's signing for me, as it's the easiest thing in the world to forge them as is currently happening with the craze for signed memorabilia.
(Similarily with model cars, I only collect those that I have either owned, driven, or seen race in period; that way my collection remains personal, manageable and meaningful).
#26
Posted 14 August 2009 - 15:25
So I have the woosnam book signed to me by Mcenroe
I only collect autographs (as Giraffe states above) only if I collect them myself, normally start with a request to personalise them and by stating it ruins the e bay value.
#27
Posted 14 August 2009 - 16:15
#28
Posted 14 August 2009 - 16:31
However when it came to selling it, just couldnt do it, just added to the pipe of other collectables (that my daughter look on as their inhertitance.
#29
Posted 14 August 2009 - 18:16
As publishers we have never pursued the 'signed copy' path. Today it seems to be done to death and its popularity is due either to the vanity of the author or the reflected glory of the buyer in having a 'signed copy'. There was one author who would sign everything out of site so much so that we would promote his titles at events as a genuine unsigned copies.
Taking this to further extremes there are also the limited edition signed copies complete with numbered certificates and/or leather bound covers etc etc. All this leaves me cold - it is the content what matters.
www.nynehead-books.co.uk
#30
Posted 14 August 2009 - 20:49
All this leaves me cold - it is the content what matters.
www.nynehead-books.co.uk
Well that is highly commendable, but as a businessman you should always be looking at opportunities to add value to your product and thus increase your profitability, surely?
I have purchased signed copies of books in the past, but only to use as gifts with a mildly personal touch for those with a particular interest in the subject. My personal collection of autographed books usually contain comments or a story relative to the circumstances of our meeting, and my most treasured being from Wilbur Smith, Brian Redman (Chevron book, keep chasing him for his!), George Best (I decked him by mistake in 1971! ) and would you believe Eamonn Andrews whom I met on New Years Eve, 1963/4 at my Uncle's house!
Edited by Giraffe, 14 August 2009 - 20:56.
#31
Posted 14 August 2009 - 22:56
I agree wholeheartedly with that!I own many autographed books in many different categories in addition to motorsport and the added value in monetary terms is irrelevant to me as I own them for the pure personal enjoyment of doing so.
Tom
#32
Posted 14 August 2009 - 23:34
Well that is highly commendable, but as a businessman you should always be looking at opportunities to add value to your product and thus increase your profitability, surely?
It is such a hollow gesture to be promoting every book one produces with the opportunity to buy a 'signed copy'. It's a form of exploitation and honestly we are not into that. Our books stand and sell by their reputation - signing adds no value whatsoever - financial or otherwise. It is fad that has got completely out of hand, just like all those personalised number plates that you now see everywhere. People who have got that sort of money to waste on such self indulgent trivia should look inwards and think about investing in others - charities, supporting child projects in Africa - rather than feed their own vanity. Sorry, rambling on again!
www.nynehead-books.co.uk
#33
Posted 15 August 2009 - 07:43
- signing adds no value whatsoever - financial or otherwise.
Yes it does: it creates additional demand which equates to incremental sales. If this was not the case, why would the publisher/bookseller bother with what is essentially a nuisance to all concerned?
Edited by Giraffe, 15 August 2009 - 07:44.
#34
Posted 15 August 2009 - 15:29
#35
Posted 15 August 2009 - 17:54
On the other hand to have a book or artefact signed by someone with whom one had forged a genuine connection is very satisfactory. I have some first editions (sadly, they never ran to second editions ) of one or two sailing books what I wrote signed by the people what I wrote about - and they are very special. But also very personal. I also have an unsigned copy of the aforementioned book by Ted Heath: when, long after the book was published, remaindered and out of print I got to make his acquaintence he confirmed its value.
I have two models of 722: one 'mint', as they say, and one signed by Jenk's chaufeur: which is the more valuable? And a (well-thumbed) copy of My Cars My Career signed not only by that Stirling Moss fellah but also by the great Doug Nye himself, personally and in person.
But listen while I tell you: I also have an LP of The Spinners Around the World, the sleeve of which is signed by every one of the eponymous ensemble. AND a penny whistle given to me personally by Tony Davis. Can anyone beat that?
... did I say something about sad?
#36
Posted 16 August 2009 - 07:21
AND a penny whistle given to me personally by Tony Davis. Can anyone beat that?
With relative ease, Mal; I've an autographed (genuine) tickling stick from Ken Dodd.................
#37
Posted 16 August 2009 - 13:14
With relative ease, Mal; I've an autographed (genuine) tickling stick from Ken Dodd.................
Wow!
(edit after more careful thought): ... but did he give you the music for it?
Edited by Mal9444, 16 August 2009 - 17:26.
#38
Posted 16 August 2009 - 14:34
#39
Posted 16 August 2009 - 18:04
With relative ease, Mal; I've an autographed (genuine) tickling stick from Ken Dodd.................
I suspect it was tax deductable ;)
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#40
Posted 16 August 2009 - 19:06
Ken told me he stuffed all of his cash into a violin; it was a tax fiddle...........I suspect it was tax deductable ;)
#41
Posted 16 August 2009 - 19:15
Ken told me he stuffed all of his cash into a violin; it was a tax fiddle...........
Giraffe 1 Me O