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Kobayashi Thread


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#2051 billm99uk

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 17:32

True, Will Buxton tweeted that the amount yesterday, around €500,000, would buy Kobayashi a season in GP3. Says it all really :well:


Has he worked his way up to a season in GP2 yet?

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#2052 whitevisor

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 18:29

Stupid Japanese companies! Too damned frugal!

Where are the CASIO, the Mitsubisi, the sony, the panasonic, the Nintendo, IHI? Not even one?

#2053 BrokenBaculum

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 18:38

Stupid Japanese companies! Too damned frugal!

Where are the CASIO, the Mitsubisi, the sony, the panasonic, the Nintendo, IHI? Not even one?


They're at Red Bull and loving it.

#2054 g1n

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 18:45

Impressive. Hope it works out.


Less than 2 mil is not impressive at all, for his chances anyway. Few years ago some driver (can't remember who) was testing for Caterham/Lotus during the YNG driver test and he said you need a minimum of 5 mil, 8+ mil would secure the seat. This is what you needed back then just to drive for the bottom 3 teams.

#2055 XOR

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 19:08

They're at Red Bull

So he is going to RB? Hallelujah

#2056 race addicted

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 19:14

Kubota or Komatsu should sponsor Kobayashi. They're big, solid companies.

#2057 whitevisor

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 20:02

Less than 2 mil is not impressive at all, for his chances anyway. Few years ago some driver (can't remember who) was testing for Caterham/Lotus during the YNG driver test and he said you need a minimum of 5 mil, 8+ mil would secure the seat. This is what you needed back then just to drive for the bottom 3 teams.


Yeah.. a driver needs about 5 mill for a solid seat in a mid field team... For a year (Compare with Maldonado who got in on the 10 mill a year (30 mil over three years). He might get away with 3 mil for a Caterham/Marussia/HRT(cherry automobile?) seat.

#2058 whitevisor

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 20:04

One of my F1 dreams back in 2010 was for Toyota to buy into HRT and run the TF110 - Kobayashi and Nakajima as drivers.

#2059 Talisman

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 20:22

Less than 2 mil is not impressive at all, for his chances anyway. Few years ago some driver (can't remember who) was testing for Caterham/Lotus during the YNG driver test and he said you need a minimum of 5 mil, 8+ mil would secure the seat. This is what you needed back then just to drive for the bottom 3 teams.


Presumably the guy who said that had no f1 experience. For a team to take a chance on a complete rookie what you quoted is probably right. Kobayashi though has 3 seasons of experience and has proven pace, managing to hold a midfield seat without sponsorship backing. Therefore while more money would be good he can get away with less than a complete rookie because he's less of a risk. Also what he has is cash in the bank while the problem with sponsorship money is that there's a risk the sponsor doesn't pay up for whatever reason.

Looking at the force india seat most of the guys he'sfighting for the seat don't Bring money. Those that do like sutil have other issues. He's Not in a bad place really.

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#2060 KinoNoNo

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 21:20

Presumably the guy who said that had no f1 experience. For a team to take a chance on a complete rookie what you quoted is probably right. Kobayashi though has 3 seasons of experience and has proven pace, managing to hold a midfield seat without sponsorship backing. Therefore while more money would be good he can get away with less than a complete rookie because he's less of a risk. Also what he has is cash in the bank while the problem with sponsorship money is that there's a risk the sponsor doesn't pay up for whatever reason.

Looking at the force india seat most of the guys he's fighting for the seat don't Bring money. Those that do like sutil have other issues. He's Not in a bad place really.

I'm kind of hoping Lotus surprises us all and dumps Grosjean for Kamui.

I've just got no confidence in Force India at the moment, and Kimi and Koby could be a good combination together.


#2061 Showty

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 22:21

So if he gets a seat thanks to this money, what is he going to do for the people that helped him? Is he going to have all their names written in his driving suit or something like that?



#2062 qczhao

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Posted 04 December 2012 - 23:50

So if he gets a seat thanks to this money, what is he going to do for the people that helped him? Is he going to have all their names written in his driving suit or something like that?


He'd entertain them on 20 weekends over the course of a year.

#2063 SB

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 02:39

Stupid Japanese companies! Too damned frugal!

Where are the CASIO, the Mitsubisi, the sony, the panasonic, the Nintendo, IHI? Not even one?


Most of them are not making (good) profits like they were in 10-20 years ago. Therefore they don't have much spare money to spend.
The Korean companies are in much better shape financially nowadays.

#2064 Don_Humpador

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 08:59

He'd entertain them on 20 weekends over the course of a year.

This.

The Korean companies are in much better shape financially nowadays.

Yeah. I was thinking this the other day - it's a shame for Kamui's sake that he's not Korean :lol:

I bet a Korean driver would get a ton of backing.

#2065 Richard T

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 10:34

$1.9m

Not bad old Kamui :)

#2066 muramasa

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 15:58

So if he gets a seat thanks to this money, what is he going to do for the people that helped him? Is he going to have all their names written in his driving suit or something like that?

his on track performance/result.

plus those who donated 10,000JPY or more can claim kamui-support wrist band.
i donated few bucks last month (maybe will donate some again later.) and wont claim the wrist band coz I dont want it. Also, Kamui-support is set up and managed by his own brother and one or two other staff, so just sending wrist band to those who donated will be HUGE burden, so.

Edited by muramasa, 05 December 2012 - 15:58.


#2067 F1ultimate

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 16:53

$1.9m

Not bad old Kamui :)


Surely his popularity has got to attract a Japanese brands to throw some money in the pot. It's a shame Panasonic, Sharp and Sony are all in financial disarray.

#2068 One

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 17:28

$1.9m

Not bad old Kamui :)


Mighty Impresive. Kamui will beat Face Book sooner or later/ If so, Perhaps Bernie wants to sponsor him!

#2069 Talisman

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 19:35

Surely his popularity has got to attract a Japanese brands to throw some money in the pot. It's a shame Panasonic, Sharp and Sony are all in financial disarray.


I don't think the problem is that many Japanese companies are in trouble. Its that he's asking for a lot of money at very short notice. Companies, not just Japanese ones, simply don't work that way.

The whole process of allocating millions of dollars takes ages. First they have to decide the marketing budget, then they need to think of what markets to go for and how they go about it. Someone walking in off the street saying that they are a popular F1 driver, can I have a few million simply isn't going to work unless its a small company, then they're not likely to have the sum of money he needs.



#2070 Sakae

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 20:34

Presumably money was donated to buy him an F1 seat, which begs the question, what will happen to this fund, if he doesn’t get a ride?

Talisman is of course right that the allocation of marketing budget takes time, which also begs a next question, whether Kamu had any fall-back strategy planned already about a year ago, as he knew that contract needs to be reviewed, and there are no guarantees in this business. Maybe his manager failed to launch successful supporting campaign, who knows. If Kamui gets exceptionally lucky, and offer will be made to replace Gro, then for him it will be a better seat, I think. Unfortunately chances of that are probably not too great.


Edited by Sakae, 05 December 2012 - 20:35.


#2071 KinoNoNo

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 20:54

Something that's been bothering me.

Ok say Kamui is successful in getting a seat for '13, it begs the question is he going to have to go through all this again for '14?

I hope there's plans going forward onwards from here, otherwise all this effort would be for naught.

#2072 Wander

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 20:59

That presumably depends on how successful he is next year. If Force India, he would have to beat Paul, if Lotus, he'd have to be really close to Kimi.

#2073 TF110

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 07:58

I think he'll be at F-I next season. If Bruno doesn't get it. I really hope he goes to Lotus though, and can get a car that's capable of Podiums or top 5's regularly.

#2074 Don_Humpador

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:48

Something that's been bothering me.

Ok say Kamui is successful in getting a seat for '13, it begs the question is he going to have to go through all this again for '14?

I hope there's plans going forward onwards from here, otherwise all this effort would be for naught.

I think the plan is, if he's in F1, he will also have some commercial backing at that point as well. Then, it's just down to his performances, isn't it?

#2075 Richard T

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 17:13

Mighty Impresive. Kamui will beat Face Book sooner or later/ If so, Perhaps Bernie wants to sponsor him!


With the apparently huge popularity of Kamui in Japan, I think Bernie would put some money on him and still make a winning out of it.
France does not even have a GP.. so why would he want Grosjean to continue?

#2076 Viryfan

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 17:40

With the apparently huge popularity of Kamui in Japan, I think Bernie would put some money on him and still make a winning out of it.
France does not even have a GP.. so why would he want Grosjean to continue?



To get more money from TV rights in France?

#2077 Rurouni

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 07:11

To get more money from TV rights in France?

How's the enthusiasm for F1 with and without Gro? Is he really marketable?
Btw, are there ads involving Gro? There's a Clear ad with Lotus F1 and Kimi.

At least on a world scale, Kamui is probably more likeable than Gro thus should be more marketable. But if we're talking about tv rights, the Japanese certainly like F1 with or without Kamui, thus he probably wouldn't have any effect for broadening the market.

#2078 Levike

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 07:35

I find it quite weird that after all the years when finally a really great, capable japanese driver arrived, he found himself without a seat.
The guy is a top driver on his own right, and he should have been picked by the top teams by now.
He is entertraining, he has flair and a down to earth guy who is a hard worker. I don't know why he is not picked by a top team really.

#2079 quidam

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:14

I find it quite weird that after all the years when finally a really great, capable japanese driver arrived, he found himself without a seat.
The guy is a top driver on his own right, and he should have been picked by the top teams by now.
He is entertraining, he has flair and a down to earth guy who is a hard worker. I don't know why he is not picked by a top team really.


Because his own team and others don't think he is a top driver :p

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#2080 Desdirodeabike

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:19

Because his own team and others don't think he is a top driver :p

I hope you are joking.

The difference between him and Perez was 6 points. Oh - and Telmex and the richest guy in the world backing Perez. That will get you a top seat as long as you are half decent and show promise.

#2081 Masahiro

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 09:22

To get more money from TV rights in France?


I live in France and I never saw an ad with Grosjean. About the Tv rights, the first channel, which broadcasted the F1 for more than 20 years, doesn't want to put more money than it did in the last years (31 m€) because Frenchs don't really watch F1, even with 3 drivers. And these rights ended this year, it might be a paying channel which is going to own it. So less televiewers.

In more, most of Frenchs don't like Grosjean anymore. Even commentators looked put out about him in the last races, especially in Brazil, where Jacques Laffite said that all we can't do in f1, Grosjean did it.

So, don't worry about the fact that Grosjean is French to secure his seat at Lotus.



#2082 Anderis

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 10:08

I hope you are joking.

He isn't joking. If Kamui is considered as a top driver by his own team, he would have been kept over Hulkenberg surely. Plain and simple.

#2083 muramasa

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 12:23

He isn't joking. If Kamui is considered as a top driver by his own team, he would have been kept over Hulkenberg surely. Plain and simple.

ha, too bad Sutil wasnt kept by FI, Hulk by Williams, Buemi/Alg by Red Bull etc.

di Resta being kept by FI, Petrov kept for 2nd year by Lotus etc etc, coz of they are considered as top driver then.


#2084 Wander

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 16:25

He isn't joking. If Kamui is considered as a top driver by his own team, he would have been kept over Hulkenberg surely. Plain and simple.


If Räikkönen is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Alonso.

If Prost is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Senna.

If Schumacher is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Räikkönen.

If Hill is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Frentzen.

Edited by Wander, 07 December 2012 - 16:28.


#2085 TheUltimateWorrier

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 22:09

Found this article in the BBC archives after the 2010 Japanese Grand Prix, as Mark Hughes argued Kubica is 'the best driver in F1'.

Why Robert Kubica is arguably the best driver in F1

Although Robert Kubica's Japanese Grand Prix lasted only a couple of laps behind the safety car, his qualifying performance emphasised again the Renault driver's claim to being a future world champion.

On the Formula 1 calendar there are only three outstanding driver's tracks - where there is scope for a great driver to transcend the level of his car. They are Monaco, Spa and Suzuka.

The remainder are 'technical tracks', where the lap-time potential is defined almost totally by the car, the difference between a great and a good driver on the stopwatch relatively small.

At each of those three special tracks this year, Kubica has qualified what is otherwise a lower-top-10-level car on the front or second row.


It is confirmation of a very special talent but one that is still under-appreciated by the wider world.

It is the sort of anomaly that occurs only with very special prospects, such as: Michael Schumacher qualifying the Jordan seventh at Spa on his F1 debut in 1991; Mika Hakkinen out-qualifying Ayrton Senna the first time they were paired together at McLaren in Portugal in 1993; Senna terrorising the field at Monaco in 1984 with a car from the unfancied Toleman team; in 2001 Fernando Alonso qualifying the outclassed Minardi in places it had no right being in.

When taking into consideration the machinery at their disposal, how much they have squeezed from what they have, how few errors have been made, there is a very real case to be made for putting Kubica ahead of all the other drivers this year.


Perhaps he's going a little overboard saying Kubica was the best driver in 2010, but I do agree that great drivers tend to excel at Monaco, Spa and Suzuka. What's interesting though is Kamui has done similar this year, qualifying second at Spa, third (after Button's grid penalty) at Suzuka in what was the fifth/sixth best car and fifth (thought should've been fourth) at Monaco after starting near the back of the grid. Kamui may never be a WDC, but he's shown something special at those tracks and yet hasn't been in realistic contention for a better team for next year :well: .

#2086 One

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 10:57

If Räikkönen is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Alonso.

If Prost is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Senna.

If Schumacher is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Räikkönen.

If Hill is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Frentzen.

:up:

#2087 SRK

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 11:30

I hope you are joking.

The difference between him and Perez was 6 points. Oh - and Telmex and the richest guy in the world backing Perez. That will get you a top seat as long as you are half decent and show promise.

Six point behing Perez, who was equally bad driver... End of the season in their execution was awful. They gave Mercedes-Benz 5th place and a lot a lot of money. Fortunately Sauber waiting fantastic season without these veggies.

#2088 Anderis

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 12:07

If Räikkönen is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Alonso.

If Prost is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Senna.

If Schumacher is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Räikkönen.

If Hill is considered as a top driver, surely he would have been kept over Frentzen.

Don't you think it's a bit of a stretch to compare unproven Hulk with WDCs like Senna or Alonso who was even bringing Santander backing?

I also can't recall Schumacher being forced out of Ferrari.

#2089 One

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 13:24

Don't you think it's a bit of a stretch to compare unproven Hulk with WDCs like Senna or Alonso who was even bringing Santander backing?

I also can't recall Schumacher being forced out of Ferrari.


Check out Saward article of the time about Michael.

#2090 Shiroo

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 18:20

http://www.sportspro...utm_medium=feed

acording to this article, Lotus will get biggest titular sponsorship, and maybe then they will choose whoever they wish to (though every driver atm brings some cash). + Their 2nd driver will get max 50% of Raikkonen payment at best.

#2091 Sakae

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 21:05

So, any news about Kamu's future?

#2092 DutchQuicksilver

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 21:16

So, any news about Kamu's future?

Not much, but be prepared for the worse. Force India look set to confirm Sutil this week. And Lotus will most likely retain Grosjean now that they have a title sponsor.

#2093 midgrid

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 23:42

Not much, but be prepared for the worse. Force India look set to confirm Sutil this week. And Lotus will most likely retain Grosjean now that they have a title sponsor.


I would have thought that Grosjean would have been a more attractive option if Lotus did not have a title sponsor on board, considering his Total backing. Unless Boullier is factoring in the cost of repairing crash damage...


#2094 Diderlo

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 00:14

I would have thought that Grosjean would have been a more attractive option if Lotus did not have a title sponsor on board, considering his Total backing. Unless Boullier is factoring in the cost of repairing crash damage...


I agree. The more money Lotus is getting from own sponsors the more freedom it has choosing its drivers and driving capabilities matter more than the money the driver is bringing. Atleast I would think like that.

So I wouldn't rule Kobayashi out just yet (or Kova). Lotus should be in a very good position and most likely will get a bargain. 3+ good choices, 1 seat. Kovalainen and Kobayashi must make very competitive offers, "little" money and a seat is way better than sitting home and watching others race after all :p

#2095 Don_Humpador

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 10:40

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104801

Nice comments from Alan Jones.

Although it does sound like he was talking to Japanese media, sadly Autosport doesn't give the context.

#2096 UPRC

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 12:37

http://www.autosport...t.php/id/104801

Nice comments from Alan Jones.

Although it does sound like he was talking to Japanese media, sadly Autosport doesn't give the context.


Kudos to Alan. It's great to see a former driver endorsing Kamui so strongly. :up:

#2097 Les

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 13:20

Something of a tall claim from Alan Jones when you consider that Ukyo Katayama is 'undoubtedly the greatest formula one driver that Grand Prix racing has ever produced'.

http://www.f1rejects...yama/index.html



#2098 muramasa

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 13:49

Something of a tall claim from Alan Jones when you consider that Ukyo Katayama is 'undoubtedly the greatest formula one driver that Grand Prix racing has ever produced'.

http://www.f1rejects...yama/index.html

What Jones said is nothing new or special, he just said what many people think or already know.

Meanwhile Walker's comment on Katayama was just a slip of the tongue, again meant to say sth extremely ordinary.

I have no idea how a completely separate case of completely different nature about a completely different driver almost 2 decades ago can be relevant to Kamui of 2012 :rolleyes:


#2099 swerved

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 14:16

177,807,171 Yen, 1,340,990 Pounds 2,157,500 USD

Wonder if he'll hit the $3M mark.

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#2100 Don_Humpador

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 15:10

What Jones said is nothing new or special, he just said what many people think or already know.

Meanwhile Walker's comment on Katayama was just a slip of the tongue, again meant to say sth extremely ordinary.

I have no idea how a completely separate case of completely different nature about a completely different driver almost 2 decades ago can be relevant to Kamui of 2012 :rolleyes:

Lost in translation?

The website he linked to is jokey and then the comment from Murray Walker was a 'Murrayism', it's funny because it's a clearly ridiculous mistake. Nobody is seriously comparing, lol.

Edited by Don_Humpador, 12 December 2012 - 15:12.