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AUTOSPORT.com's top 10s of the decade


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#1 AUTOSPORT.com

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Posted 26 December 2009 - 23:23

Starting today, we are publishing a series of features on the top 10 drivers from several categories of racing from the 2000-2009 decade.

NASCAR was first up this morning (you can find it here), but look out for more following each day until New Year's Eve.

We would like to open up the debate to the forum, so what do you make of our lists?

Who should be higher? Who should be lower? Who should have been included? Who shouldn't?

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#2 Atreiu

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 01:11

I think there are too many top-top lists going around these days, but at least they're insightful for the uneducated racing fans (like me with NASCAR).

#3 ApexTomi

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 18:24

I like how Nascar's top 10 has been formed, it's how it should be. Dale snr as #3 is perfect. :) I started following the series when Juan Pablo Montoya started the adventure from Homestead 2006 onwards. Since then I've catched up on the series' rich history. There's so much still to learn. It's history is so fascinating with all the characters etc.

Daytona 500 is just around the corner!

#4 AUTOSPORT.com

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 18:25

The IndyCar features have been added today (here), so we now have the following 2000-2009 lists.

NASCAR
10. Dale Jarrett
9. Bobby Labonte
8. Matt Kenseth
7. Dale Earnhardt Jr
6. Kurt Busch
5. Mark Martin
4. Jeff Gordon
3. Dale Earnhardt Sr
2. Tony Stewart
1. Jimmie Johnson

Indy/Champ Car
10. Justin Wilson
9. Dan Wheldon
8. Paul Tracy
7. Tony Kanaan
6. Helio Castroneves
5. Dario Franchitti
4. Sam Hornish Jr
3. Sebastien Bourdais
2. Gil de Ferran
1. Scott Dixon

Explanations and stats from the decade are in the full article, which you have to be a subscriber to read, but anyone can join the debate and put forward their own top 10s if they wish.

#5 jeze

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 21:14

Very good list, would swap Dario and Hornish, though. I agree that Dixon is the man of the decade, since whenever he's had a remotely competitive car, he's been in the championship hunt.

#6 Rob

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Posted 27 December 2009 - 23:45

Very good list, would swap Dario and Hornish, though. I agree that Dixon is the man of the decade, since whenever he's had a remotely competitive car, he's been in the championship hunt.


Agreed. I'd also swap around the last four and have

7. Wheldon
8. Wilson
9. Kanaan
10. Tracy

I don't think Kanaan and Tracy were good enough over the decade to merit 7th and 8th and I believe that what Wilson has done in underfunded teams eclipses even their title years.

#7 jeze

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 09:59

Agreed. I'd also swap around the last four and have

7. Wheldon
8. Wilson
9. Kanaan
10. Tracy

I don't think Kanaan and Tracy were good enough over the decade to merit 7th and 8th and I believe that what Wilson has done in underfunded teams eclipses even their title years.


I'd like to have Ryan Briscoe in there, since he's clearly done a greater impact on Indy racing this decade than what Wilson and Tracy have done. The lion's share of what those two achieved came during Champ Car's dark days 2003-2007, and I can't really rate those seasons, in fact I have no idea how good/bad the series was at that stage. It didn't appear to eclipse the opposition Briscoe faced en route to his nearly-won title this year.

#8 AUTOSPORT.com

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:26

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi

#9 gerry nassar

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:36

Love to see compiled lists!

But Im surprised Stoner is that low and below Hayden and Sete (both overrated). Stoner should be 2nd. Smells like a bit of a vendetta against him with this muddled MotoGP list.

#10 selespeed

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:40

stoner behind melandri...

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#11 undersquare

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:40

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi


What's Stoner doing down in 7th? He has more wins than anyone except Rossi.

Personally I'd fill the top of the list with the guys who had not been dominated by their teammates or a rival- Rossi, Stoner, Lorenzo. Then start the bottom with the guys who were badly beaten - Hayden, Melandri, Gibernau, Capirossi.

#12 SteF1an

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:41

stoner behind melandri...

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And Gibernau second :drunk:

#13 santori

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 13:43

And Lorenzo and Pedrosa! Interesting. I'm pleased that Biaggi is that high, although I'd probably put him ahead of Gibernau.

I take it the list is just for Motogp/500s.

#14 FPV GTHO

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 14:33

Maybe Toby gave the 990cc years more importance over the 500cc and 800cc years.

#15 Mackey

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 14:36

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi


Hayden 5,Pedrosa 9??? LOL


#16 weiteck

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 14:45

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi


Wow. :well:

#17 Simon Says

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:31

Very good list, would swap Dario and Hornish, though. I agree that Dixon is the man of the decade, since whenever he's had a remotely competitive car, he's been in the championship hunt.


But wasn't Sebastian Bourdais the guy who was dominating Indycar? Imo he should be No.1?

#18 Simon Says

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:34

What's Stoner doing down in 7th? He has more wins than anyone except Rossi.

Personally I'd fill the top of the list with the guys who had not been dominated by their teammates or a rival- Rossi, Stoner, Lorenzo. Then start the bottom with the guys who were badly beaten - Hayden, Melandri, Gibernau, Capirossi.


But current bikes are more like 250 cc, hence why Pedrosa, Stoner and the rest were doing so well of a sudden. If you put those guys on the old bikes, watch how far ahead Rossi is then especially with the electronics these days :stoned:

#19 jeze

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:39

Stoner in seventh? WTF, fire Moody on the spot ):

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#20 KateLM

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:41

But wasn't Sebastian Bourdais the guy who was dominating Indycar? Imo he should be No.1?


Bourdais was in Champ Cars. As he isn't on the list, I think it must be IRL/Indycars-only.

Stoner 7th? :down:

Edited by KateLM, 28 December 2009 - 15:42.


#21 rolf123

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:44

Stoner so low, that is just ridiculous. He's one of less than a handful who have taken the challenge to Rossi.

If anything, Sete should be lower because Rossi "broke" him.


#22 weiteck

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 15:51

But current bikes are more like 250 cc, hence why Pedrosa, Stoner and the rest were doing so well of a sudden. If you put those guys on the old bikes, watch how far ahead Rossi is then especially with the electronics these days :stoned:


I seem to recall Stoner having quite a few impressive weekends in his first MotoGP season on the non-factory 990, as did Pedrosa who won two races.

You can't fail to see that there are four riders in a class of their own regardless of the machinery.

None of it should matter because a top 10 list should be formulated based upon the performances of riders in the top class of racing without regard for changes to the rules that govern the category, because it's the same for everyone. This is why it's baffling to see Stoner so low in this list.

#23 Lazy Prodigy

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 16:17

The only problem I have is where Stoner is. Id think Capirossi is a little to high though

#24 Atreiu

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 16:43

I'm surprised Toby mentioned Stoner at all. He barely gives the guy any credit and took all lenghts to not mention a single word on him after his crushing Sepang win. The list is still ridiculous anyhow. Stoner achieved more than anyone bar Rossi, but he stands in 7th. Sete had two good seasons and then broke down, yet he's 2nd. All Biaggi ever did was complain, and then he couldn't keep up with Sete in his Honda years... And Capirossi 4th? And how in hell can you explain Stoner behind Capirossi, Melandri and Hayden? How many times did they come within 20 seconds of Stoner when they were teammates?

I mean, Toby got the right guys, but they are all out of order.

#25 POLAR

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 16:43


10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri????????????????????????
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau ??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
1. Valentino Rossi

#26 BuonoBruttoCattivo

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 16:46

:lol:

#27 Dispenser89

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 22:54

Bourdais was in Champ Cars. As he isn't on the list, I think it must be IRL/Indycars-only.

Stoner 7th? :down:

erm, Bourdais is 3rd on the list and Tracy is 8th, another prominent Champ Car driver. Wilson is 10th too.

Edited by Dispenser89, 28 December 2009 - 22:55.


#28 DOF_power

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 23:48

But current bikes are more like 250 cc, hence why Pedrosa, Stoner and the rest were doing so well of a sudden. If you put those guys on the old bikes, watch how far ahead Rossi is then especially with the electronics these days :stoned:




How come Hayden and other Ducati boys did so badly with these cars then ?!


#29 DOF_power

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 23:52

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner

6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi

3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi




It B*.
Stoner destroyed both Melandri, Capirossi and Hayden.
And Rossi himself admitted that Lorenzo was the only team mate to pose a challenge.

Hey autosport.com team, what were you guys smoking ?!

Edited by DOF_power, 28 December 2009 - 23:56.


#30 DOF_power

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Posted 28 December 2009 - 23:57

I seem to recall Stoner having quite a few impressive weekends in his first MotoGP season on the non-factory 990, as did Pedrosa who won two races.

You can't fail to see that there are four riders in a class of their own regardless of the machinery.

None of it should matter because a top 10 list should be formulated based upon the performances of riders in the top class of racing without regard for changes to the rules that govern the category, because it's the same for everyone. This is why it's baffling to see Stoner so low in this list.




They were smoking a big dose of B*.

#31 Redback

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 00:31

I'm surprised Toby mentioned Stoner at all. He barely gives the guy any credit and took all lenghts to not mention a single word on him after his crushing Sepang win. The list is still ridiculous anyhow. Stoner achieved more than anyone bar Rossi, but he stands in 7th. Sete had two good seasons and then broke down, yet he's 2nd. All Biaggi ever did was complain, and then he couldn't keep up with Sete in his Honda years... And Capirossi 4th? And how in hell can you explain Stoner behind Capirossi, Melandri and Hayden? How many times did they come within 20 seconds of Stoner when they were teammates?

I mean, Toby got the right guys, but they are all out of order.

Having read almost all of Toby's reports, I can only conclude (as have most fans) he's a champion w@nker.

The sequence of this list merely reinforces that assessment.

#32 juicy sushi

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 00:39

I have to agree with the trend, the MotoGP list is downright incompetent. Stoner and Lorenzo both accomplished far more than those ahead of them on the list (save Rossi), Biaggi does rate a mention for his performances over the first half of the decade, but I think he's not quite as good as either of them. Pederosa, as much as I dislike him, should be higher than Hayden, and Gibernau should be no higher than 9th, as a case cannot be made for him being the second best rider after Rossi this decade.

The only way the list makes sense to me is by being based on how well they might have done on 2-stroke 500s, but even then, I think Stoner and Lorenzo would have shone (far brighter than Gibernau or Capirossi), and Hayden would have been higher up the list (he really arrived in GP 10 years too late).

#33 Turbo4

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 09:26

But Im surprised Stoner is that low and below Hayden and Sete (both overrated). Stoner should be 2nd. Smells like a bit of a vendetta against him with this muddled MotoGP list.


same sentiments, he's waaay too low. ):

#34 lafitek

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 09:46

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi


from 2007 in moto 800cc

Stoner 20 wins 17 poles
Rossi 19 wins 13 poles

1.Stoner
2.Rossi
3.Lorenzo
4.Pedrosa
.
.
.
.


#35 AUTOSPORT.com

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 13:27

The sportscar review has been published today (here), with top 10s for both drivers and cars.

Drivers
10. Lucas Luhr
9. Pedro Lamy
8. Frank Biela
7. Jan Magnussen
6. Dindo Capello
5. Emmanuel Collard
4. Emanuele Pirro
3. David Brabham
2. Allan McNish
1. Tom Kristensen

Cars
10. Ferrari 550 Maranello
9. Maserati MC12
8. Ferrari 430 GT
7. Peugeot 908 HDi
6. Chevrolet Corvette C5-R
5. Porsche RS Spyder
4. Riley MkXI (/XX)
3. Porsche 911 GT3-R (996)
2. Audi R10 TDi
1. Audi R8

It covers quite a wide spectrum, but - as mentioned previously - only subscribers can read the full articles with the stats and explanations behind the choices.

Edited by AUTOSPORT.com, 29 December 2009 - 13:29.


#36 Seanspeed

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 13:40

2. Allan McNish
1. Tom Kristensen

Tom may have the stats, but McNish is the star driver, if you ask me. I'd also put the Corvette much higher in the car list.

Anyways, mainly wanted to comment on the MotoGP list. As everyone else is saying, its a bit ridiculous.

Hayden does not deserve to be above Pedrosa. Stoner is woefully misplaced, and aside from Lorenzo, could be poised to be the best rider in MotoGP after Rossi leaves(or maybe before!). Gibernau was good, but not *that* good. Biaggi is quite high for never having won a MotoGP(or 500cc) title when he was on a competitive-enough bike.

Edited by Seanspeed, 29 December 2009 - 13:44.


#37 Victor_RO

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 13:42

There's no doubting Tom's ability and record, but I might be tempted to rate McNish just above him on sheer pace and skill. Also, omitting the fastest man in the Peugeot team on every one of their Le Mans outings (Sarrazin) is surely a shame.

As for the top 10 cars, the R8 definitely deserves the accolades. 7 years of racing life, 80-odd races and 60-odd victories. 'Nuff said.

#38 jcbc3

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 14:13

As is already stated in the article, McNish may have surpassed Kristensen 'now'. But as driver of the decade it would be RIDICULOUS to place McNish above TomK. Both for achievement and results. Tom at his very best was beyond awesome.

IMHO.

#39 jcbc3

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 14:14

And the MotoGP drivers list is ridiculous.  ;)

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#40 F1Johnny

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 14:45

It B*.
Stoner destroyed both Melandri, Capirossi and Hayden.


Exactly. Yet they are all ahead of him in the list. IMO Stoner should be #2. He's seen off teammates with ease and taken the fight to VR. There is clearly some bias in Stoner's selection.

#41 slideways

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 14:52

Toby Moody's MotoGP top 10 has been added today, here

10. Kenny Roberts Jr
9. Dani Pedrosa
8. Jorge Lorenzo
7. Casey Stoner
6. Marco Melandri
5. Nicky Hayden
4. Loris Capirossi
3. Max Biaggi
2. Sete Gibernau
1. Valentino Rossi


Moody is a great journalist but this is ... wow. :down:

#42 Classic Ferrari

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 15:05

Judging by the list i take it that Autosport doesn't specialise in MotoGP...

#43 postajegenye

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 18:02

It'll be interesting to see the F1 list.

#44 carbonfibre

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 18:16

Moody is a great journalist but this is ... wow. :down:

Lol Melandri and Hayden above Stoner is absolute BS.

Also Gibernau over Biaggi, you can argue about that, especially if it's over the last decade, not only the 2003 and 2004 season....


#45 beanoid

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 19:35

from 2007 in moto 800cc

Stoner 20 wins 17 poles
Rossi 19 wins 13 poles

1.Stoner
2.Rossi
3.Lorenzo
4.Pedrosa
.
.
.
.


From 2007 in moto 800cc
Stoner 1 world championship
Rossi 2 world championships

1. Rossi
2. Stoner

Although I do think Stoner should be higher, I think some folks are forgetting this is a list for the last 10 years, not the last three or four. Or since 2007. ;)

Anyone (ahem) who thinks that Rossi has been the dominant rider for the past 10 years is seriously deluded.


#46 armchair expert

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 02:21

From 2007 in moto 800cc
Stoner 1 world championship
Rossi 2 world championships

1. Rossi
2. Stoner

Although I do think Stoner should be higher, I think some folks are forgetting this is a list for the last 10 years, not the last three or four. Or since 2007.;)

Anyone (ahem) who doesn't think that Rossi has been the dominant rider for the past 10 years is seriously deluded.


Fixed that for you! :)
Clearly Rossi is number one, of the last decade, maybe of all time.
I think the point about race wins in the current category simply reinforces how far out of place Stoner has been ranked. If nothing else, he must be ahead of his last three team-mates. Loris has been a great rider, but when given a championship winning bike, he didn't deliver. Same goes for Max and Sete.

#47 Hairpin

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 02:27

from 2007 in moto 800cc

Stoner 20 wins 17 poles
Rossi 19 wins 13 poles

1.Stoner
2.Rossi
3.Lorenzo
4.Pedrosa
.
.
.
.

Hehe, this is why I love stats, they prove everything








That you want them to.

#48 pingu666

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 02:49

stoner is really oddly placed. he did chase michlin out of the sport kinda too...

#49 FPV GTHO

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 03:31

he did chase michlin out of the sport kinda too...


I dont understand that conclusion. I wouldve thought Honda and Yamaha splitting their garages wouldve done that.

#50 beanoid

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 03:37

Fixed that for you! :)


:lol:

Sorry--I was at work and heard the boss coming down the hall. Thanks! :kiss: