39 replies to this topic

[Jose Mourinho is Special]

He's with Ferrari because its a last option. But what baffles me was why didn't Fernando see out his 3 year contract and a possible extension? McLaren was his childhood dream, Ok him and Ron Dennis took the p*ss out of each other, but could he have at least battled on, and just ignored Ron and concentrated on his own?

I'm 100% conviced he had no problems with Mr Hamilton, whilst the media exaggerated their relationship, but was Fernando sacked/forced out?

[RodrigoL]

Alonso's childhood dream was McLaren, not Ferrari

Of course. But in that dream, he was Senna ;)

[David M. Kane]

Point well taken, I think psychologically he felt he had been set-up to make Lewis look like the superior driver. He didn't trust Ron basically. I gather Ron's people skills fail him at time. For example, the Michael Andretti affair could and should have been avoided too.

[BMW_F1]

alonso is a world class driver, he does not need to put up with any BS.

[Buckethead]

I wonder where this topic is going...

[Atreiu]

I wonder where this topic is going...

The meaning of life, eventually.

[Anomnader]

Point well taken, I think psychologically he felt he had been set-up to make Lewis look like the superior driver. He didn't trust Ron basically. I gather Ron's people skills fail him at time. For example, the Michael Andretti affair could and should have been avoided too.

By not employing Andretti in the first place? Sacking him? Kicking him up the arse?

Like Andretti, its is as much the drivers fault, from the outside both Ron and Alonso are to blame don't think you can say either way who is more at fault without firsthand personal information.

Edited by Anomnader, 11 January 2010 - 19:04.

[Mandzipop]

I thought Alonso wasn't that bothered about F1 until he got older.

Anyway, according to DC although most drivers wont admit it (apart from Fisi, who stated it a number of times in his career that it was his dream, I think Vettel has admitted it too) their dreams tend to be winning a WDC and driving for Ferrari. I was quite suprised when he said that. Remember Senna wanted to drive for Ferrari. For all we know is that it could be Hamiltons dream, but do you think he'd admit it if it was?

Who knows what goes on in the mind of an F1 driver. They are an odd bunch.

[Mackey]

alonso is a world class driver, he does not need to put up with any BS.

[Clatter]

But what baffles me was why didn't Fernando see out his 3 year contract and a possible extension?

That has to be the best line I've seen in ages.

[Anomnader]

alonso is a world class driver, he does not need to put up with any BS.

But also Ron is the owner of one of the most succesful F1 teams ever, he does not need to put with any BS either.

[Mackey]

But also Ron is the owner of one of the most succesful F1 teams ever, he does not need to put with any BS either.

That´s why they parted ways in a "friendly" manner.

[fabr68]

Was is the correct tense for that verb.

It is not the first or last time that dreams turn into nightmares.

He is now moving on with his life at Ferrari. We can only hope the fans can do the same.

Edited by fabr68, 11 January 2010 - 19:13.

[undersquare]

Fernando didn't have a choice, he was sacked.

Times

[BMW_F1]

But also Ron is the owner of one of the most succesful F1 teams ever, he does not need to put with any BS either.

he actually did and that is why he lost the 2007 WDC..

[Mackey]

Fernando didn't have a choice, he was sacked.

Times

If that is true then Dennis is even stupider than i thought. Why sack Alonso and pay him the 2 remaining years when he was desperate to leave the team?

[Anomnader]

Why sack Alonso and pay him the 2 remaining years when he was desperate to leave the team?

Depends, if he was sacked due to misconduct then those remaining two years wouldn't have to be paid.

[undersquare]

If that is true then Dennis is even stupider than i thought. Why sack Alonso and pay him the 2 remaining years when he was desperate to leave the team?

Ron didn't pay the 2 remaining years, he tore up the contract

Fernando had 2 weeks to quit after the last race, but he didn't, so I suspect he was having second thoughts, given that Renault was the only alternative.

[Mackey]

Depends, if he was sacked due to misconduct then those remaining two years wouldn't have to be paid.

Ron didn't pay the 2 remaining years, he tore up the contract
Fernando had 2 weeks to quit after the last race, but he didn't, so I suspect he was having second thoughts, given that Renault was the only alternative.

Then, why didn´t Alonso sue McLaren?

[RodrigoL]

Then, why didn´t Alonso sue McLaren?

Because past history of industrial espionage and blackmail can be a hindrance when trying to present yourself as the moral party.

[r4mses]

I wonder where this topic is going...

At some point we will have passed the Hamilton vs. Alonso topic which will lead into Kubica vs. Heidfeld...

[JarnoA]

Because past history of industrial espionage and blackmail can be a hindrance when trying to present yourself as the moral party.

LOL. You do realise that industrial espionage came from McLaren, from the top down.

[BMW_F1]

the fact that PDLR, the team's lead test driver, was never sanctioned and continued his employment with the team demonstrates that espionage was a common practice and encouraged at mclaren.

Edited by BMW_F1, 11 January 2010 - 20:57.

[fabr68]

LOL. You do realise that industrial espionage came from McLaren, from the top down.

Have you forgotten that Alonso was the one and only person involved in the espionage case?

No bosses, engineers or anyone else at Mclaren knew about it. Alonso built the MP4-24 with the Ferrari data at his home garage.

Also, he did not bring 0.6 seconds to Mclaren. That is absurd. The engineers did. The Ferrari engineers that is...

[RodrigoL]

LOL. You do realise that industrial espionage came from McLaren, from the top down.

I honestly took very little interest in the whole saga, but IIRC it was never proven that anyone beyond 2/3 individuals had the info.

OTOH, there was concrete proof that Alonso actively participated in the information exchange, and later had the nerve to blackmail his own team with it.

The question was: Why did Alonso not sue McLaren?

My question is: Why not the opposite?

Edited by RodrigoL, 11 January 2010 - 21:02.

[olliek88]

Fernando didn't have a choice, he was sacked.

Times

interesting article, wierd looking back on that situation now, like the bit about pros and cons of alonso's replacement, kovalainens mostly thou, con - timid and likely to be overrawed by the hamilton bandwagon, how true that turned out to be.

[undersquare]

Then, why didn´t Alonso sue McLaren?

There must have been a clause in the contract: "If either Party shall have lunch with Max, this Agreement shall be null and void"

or maybe just something about "act in the interests of the Team".

[Bouncing Pink Ball]

Ron is a wee bit socially awkward and Alonso a wee bit paranoid. Combined, they didn't have chance; both good at what they do but not the right personalities to be employer and employee (or team owner and driver, if you prefer). It was never going to end well, but this sort of thing happens all the time professionally, it just isn't normally played out in the media the way the Alonso/McLaren fallout was.

[Anomnader]

the fact that PDLR, the team's lead test driver, was never sanctioned and continued his employment with the team demonstrates that espionage was a common practice and encouraged at mclaren.

Wow, quite a leap you made there.

[V8 Fireworks]

At some point we will have passed the Hamilton vs. Alonso topic which will lead into Kubica vs. Heidfeld...

[Scudetto]

Nobody handled that situation well. Alonso could have demonstrated a greater degree of testicular fortitude and less vindictiveness, while McLaren could have done a little better in meeting or managing his expectations for treatment commensurate with that of a 2x champion. A no-obligation divorce was best for everyone. Litigation would have unnecessarily protracted matters and may have ended up airing more laundry than either side was willing to stomach.

Edited by Scudetto, 11 January 2010 - 21:32.

[One]

Pointless attack, what does this thread bring to us?

[SAFC09]

Alonso's childhood dream was Mclaren, not Ferrari

And it quickly turned into a nightmare

[Clatter]

the fact that PDLR, the team's lead test driver, was never sanctioned and continued his employment with the team demonstrates that espionage was a common practice and encouraged at mclaren.

The fact that Alonso, who was in cahoots with PDLR, is now employed by Ferrari must mean that Ferrari have the same policy.

[Trust]

he actually did and that is why he lost the 2007 WDC..

Obviously you interpret badly Anomander post.

[noikeee]

Childhood dreams and adult reality are two very different things.

[as65p]

Ron is a wee bit socially awkward and Alonso a wee bit paranoid. Combined, they didn't have chance; both good at what they do but not the right personalities to be employer and employee (or team owner and driver, if you prefer). It was never going to end well, but this sort of thing happens all the time professionally, it just isn't normally played out in the media the way the Alonso/McLaren fallout was.

Well it's always the unique combination of things that can tip the whole matter off balance. While I agree with awkward vs. paranoid ;) it could still have worked without the ingredients of Hamiltons special relationship with the team plus his nationality plus his speed.

Take only one of those five factors out of it and the whole thing might have taken a completely different turn.

[MichaelPM]

http://forums.autosp...howtopic=121807
Forum hypocrisy.

[JarnoA]

http://forums.autosp...howtopic=121807
Forum hypocrisy.

Clearly, Kubica will take Nicole.

Nicole, Kubi ca......

Renault engineer these things, you know.

[ForeverF1]

Thread seems to be nothing other than flame baiting. - closed -