45 replies to this topic

[cooper997]

Fifty years ago on Monday, February 1st, 1960 it was the Australia Day long weekend.(withheld from Jan 26th for overseas readers). But in the New South Wales township of Orange the ‘Australian Touring Car Championship’ was born. Their circuit being Gnoo Blas and it was chosen to begin what would become an annual, one race only championship for Touring Cars around various circuits of Australia. Well that’s how it would stay until 1969, when a 5 round series was created and in one form or other carries on to this day.

Looking back it may appear to be strange choice to pick Gnoo Blas for the first event. But it must be remembered that the Warwick Farm’s, Sandown’s, Oran Park’s, Lakeside’s and that ilk, were either in very early stages of being, or yet-to-be, built.

In 1960 most, if not all of the cars would have been driven to the circuit. Some were probably even tow vehicles in their own right (bringing along a race car for another category) and prepared by an enthusiastic owner. With minimal fuss and often minimal expense. Even though many would have been given a bit of a tickle in the mechanical department, they were all cars that mum & dad spectator could go and buy.

Fifty-one entrants stumped up their entry fee for this first ATCC event - a 20 lap, 75 mile battle of the marques. Of which 43 cars started the race. It was far from a Holden versus Ford battle. There were Ford’s entered but you had a better chance of a class win with an Austin A40 or a Simca. The main players were of course steering Jaguars, with a vast number of Holden there to pick up the pieces if the Jaguars over did it. But in the entry list there’s what would today be termed oddities - Abarth & 1100 Fiats, Lloyd, Peugeot, NSU, Riley, etc. It was an era of, "Run what ’ya brung" racing.

Looking back there are some great names amongst those entered, some already known or some still building a name for themselves. Kevin Bartlett - Morris Minor, Brian Foley - A40 Farina, Charlie Smith - Morris Major, Ian Geoghegan - Holden, Bruce McPhee - Holden, Ralph Sach - Holden, Max Volkers - Holden, Des West - Holden, David McKay - Jaguar, Bill Pitt - Jaguar, Ron Hodgson - Jaguar, etc.

Without getting too deep into the race and results (others will probably do this anyway), it was the beginning of the Jaguar domination of this Championship in it’s early years. There was spins, there was scrapes, there was a bit of argy-bargy (and that was mostly the Jaguars), but David McKay came home first. Having built up an extensive lead over his rivals. To have it quickly eroded away when a good meaning driver (possibly Telford or R Smith), blocked the track with his Zephyr. Having gone to help fellow competitor, Roy Sawyer after he had tripped his Holden over and comprehensively destroyed it. In the end McKay literally pushed the driver’s car out of the way with his Jaguar to complete the race. With the Pitt and Hodgson Jaguar’s taking second and third respectively. Then 3 Holden’s followed them home.

Class results saw Foley and the A40 take out the up to 1000cc class from Bartlett’s Minor. Jack Van Schaik’s Simca took the 1001cc - 1300cc class from Ken Brigden’s Peugeot, Gerry Trevor-Jones in a borrowed Austin Lancer took 1301cc - 2000cc from Charlie Van Shaik’s Morris Major. And finally Max Volker’s Holden won the 2001cc - 2600cc class from Jan Harris, also in a Holden.

In terms of press coverage of the event at the time, it didn’t rate that highly. Well why would it? They were only production cars, not proper racing cars. But I think I’ll try and finish off by quoting some prophetic words from Automobiles Australia, "As a race, this first Touring car classic was fine fun for drivers and spectators alike and a good indication of what may be expected from this third premier Australian event in future years." I bet those words rattled the likes of Lex Davison at the time.

Finally, for the other events of the 1960’s in it's one race format, the ATCC visited Lowood - 3/9/61, Longford - 3/3/62, Mallala - 15/4/63, Lakeside - 26/7/64, Sandown - 11/4/65, Bathurst - 11/4/66, Lakeside - 30/7/67, Warwick Farm - 8/9/68 and then it became the series as previously mentioned in 1969. With one driver from the inaugural Gnoo Blas event comprehensively stamping his name all over 4 of these Championships. With wins in 1964, 66, 67 & 68 for Ian Geoghegan. Then he went back and took out the first ATCC series in 1969.

Stephen

PS - I like many here on TNF have no interest in the ‘Supercar’ era . But please use this thread to share your anecdotes as competitors &/or spectators alike from the early days through to when they stopped using the ATCC moniker in the early 1990’s.

[woochoo]

The first ATCC race programme - from cooper997

[2Bob]

I think this is the year:

[wagons46]

To commemorate this event the Gnoo Blas Classic Car Club hold a car show within the old circuit and just opposite the start/finish each year. Hundreds of classic cars, former racing cars and bikes, sports cars and associated items of interest gather on the Saturday to display to large crowds what once was and has been preserved by enthusiasts.

Each year special guests are invited to speak at the Saturday evening dinner which is geatly supported and a terrific night for car buffs. Previous years have seen Bob Jane, Pete Geoghegan, Bruce Mcphee, and Des West to name a few. Des is earmarked to return again this year together with Sir Jack Brabham and Charlie Smith, Brian Foley, Max Volkers and compare Will Hagon.

Of course the track, being a public road, is open to drive on BUT there are the speed limits to be observed.

Held on the weekend of February 12th and 13th this year Sunday's activities include a drive to a local winery and lunch at Lake Canobolas, 10mins out of Orange.

It is a great weekend and possibly not too late to participate. Google the Gnoo Blas Classic Car Club for further info.

Edited by wagons46, 01 February 2010 - 02:34.

[Ray Bell]

Leo Geoghegan will be there too...

But I don't think it's true to say that the ATCC race is the reason for the annual picnic. Surely it's all about all of the racing that took place there?

[Terry Walker]

Were there any State Touring Championships before 1960?

I know the Western Australian Racing, Sports and Touring Car Championships began in 1955. "Championship" was used widely before then, but as far as I can tell was mostly used to distinguish scratch races from Handicap Races, handicaps being the dominant form until they faded in importance in the 1950s.

It's doubtful if the V8 Supercars Series could be considered to be the Australian Touring Car Championship any more, as the cars are technically "sports sedans", and the nearest we have to true touring cars are Group N (historic touring) and Improved Production.

[Ray Bell]

As far as I know, the V8 Stupidcars thing doesn't carry the ATCC name at all...

I recall when Bob Jane was taking over the AMRS he decided to name the tintop part of that the Australian Touring Car Championship because CAMS didn't then have the name in use.

[racer69]

I think it was to do with CAMS not being able to stop the wording "Australian Touring Car Championship" being used, as they called it the "AASA Australian Touring Car Championship"

As late as 2008 Jamie Whincup was presented with the "Australian Touring Car Championship Trophy" on the podium at Oran Park when he wrapped up the title, and i'd assume he was given the similiar award at the 2009 CAMS award??

Either way it is a pity the name is not in use these days, although the current breed of cars is quite removed from a 'touring car' (and the proposed 2012 rules will no doubt take them even further away), the whole V8Supercar circus does trade off our rich history of touring car racing in both the championship & Bathurst.

[cooper997]

I think this is the year:

2Bob,
Thanks for sharing your great photo. That is indeed the start line from Feb 1st, 1960 - McKay, Pitt and although hardly visible, Hodgson's Jaguars assembled on the front row. Brilliant stuff. If you've got more I and no doubt others would love to see them.

wagons46,
I wish I was closer for the event on Feb 12 & 13. If you can get some photos of the legends and cars in attendance for this thread that would be much appreciated.

woochoo,
Thanks for posting the programme for me.

I must have been bored at the time, but I too recall the ATCC trophy being handed to Whincup at the Oran Park meeting in 08.

Thanks again fellas.

Stephen

[David Shaw]

Were there any State Touring Championships before 1960?

Terry, from my database I have the following State Touring (or Sedan or Saloon) Championships prior to Appendix J:

Queensland Saloon Car Championship, Lowood - April 8, 1956
NSW Road Racing Championship, Bathurst - September 30, 1956 (don't know if this qualifies as a State Championship)
Queensland Saloon Car Championship, Lowood - March 23, 1958
Victorian Saloon Cars Championship, Fisherman's Bend - October 19, 1958
NSW Road Racing Championship, Bathurst - October 4, 1959 (as per the 1956 version)
Victorian Touring Car Championship, Fisherman's Bend - October 10, 1959

This list is not complete, but it gives an indication that from around 1956 State Championships for Touring Cars were starting to emerge.

[Terry Walker]

Thanks David

I assumed they all began around the roughly same time, for the same reasons.

[Lee Nicolle]

Were there any State Touring Championships before 1960?

I know the Western Australian Racing, Sports and Touring Car Championships began in 1955. "Championship" was used widely before then, but as far as I can tell was mostly used to distinguish scratch races from Handicap Races, handicaps being the dominant form until they faded in importance in the 1950s.

It's doubtful if the V8 Supercars Series could be considered to be the Australian Touring Car Championship any more, as the cars are technically "sports sedans", and the nearest we have to true touring cars are Group N (historic touring) and Improved Production.

Wash your mouth out Terry. Thupercars are so fat and heavy and BASIC as never to be a Sports Sedan.And the Commodores do not even have the right profile as they were shortened to be "parity'. Like Nascar it is amazing how much money you can spend on a big fat lump. Sure they are reasonably fast but that much money spent on a Sports Sedan it would be 10 sec a lap faster.
But they still compete for the Ausrtalian Touring Car Championship even if they are no relation to a Touring Car.

[Terry Walker]

There's half a dozen ex-V8 Supercars in Perth, racing at Barbagallo, and they run as Sports Sedans. There's no other category which they fit.

Of course you can build much faster sports sedans - the Ricciardello Alfetta GTV Chev for example - but they cost a lot more than a second-hand V8SC, which will probably do a WA club season cheaper too - which consists of typically of 10 meetings of 3 8-lap races.

I don't mind the V8SCs as such - they sound good, they look sort of like the originals, they put on a lively show - but they are not touring cars by any stretch of the imagination. As far as I can work out, the original parts in them are mostly the body panels. When the Falcons go front wheel drive in a few years, they won't even qualify as sports sedans!

There is apparently an Australian Production Touring Car Championship now, but I'm not sure it's an official CAMS Championship.

[2Bob]

If you've got more I and no doubt others would love to see them.

The only photo I can find right now is this:



I think that would have been the same meeting.

I passed all my negatives on to Autopics a couple of years ago figuring that the was more chance of them saving them for posterity (or whatever).

[Lee Nicolle]

There's half a dozen ex-V8 Supercars in Perth, racing at Barbagallo, and they run as Sports Sedans. There's no other category which they fit.

Of course you can build much faster sports sedans - the Ricciardello Alfetta GTV Chev for example - but they cost a lot more than a second-hand V8SC, which will probably do a WA club season cheaper too - which consists of typically of 10 meetings of 3 8-lap races.

I don't mind the V8SCs as such - they sound good, they look sort of like the originals, they put on a lively show - but they are not touring cars by any stretch of the imagination. As far as I can work out, the original parts in them are mostly the body panels. When the Falcons go front wheel drive in a few years, they won't even qualify as sports sedans!

There is apparently an Australian Production Touring Car Championship now, but I'm not sure it's an official CAMS Championship.

They may be racing as Sports sedans but they do not comply with the regs, and this is nothing new. It goes back to the 90s when they were knocked back at championship meetings. and that was VR VS which are a lot closer to the regs than now.
And the cost of a decent quick ex Thupercar is probably more than Basils Alfa and a lot slower. And probably dearer to run. I know it wa costing at least 15k a meeting to run VS VT Thupercars and that was over 10 years ago. And a strong guess the Alfa costs half that now.

[DJH]

Would that perhaps be Brian Muir's A 30? Note the taped door hinges.
My first car in 1965 was an A30, always loved the tea pots ever since.......John

Edited by DJH, 02 February 2010 - 10:58.

[cooper997]

The only photo I can find right now is this:

I think that would have been the same meeting.

I passed all my negatives on to Autopics a couple of years ago figuring that the was more chance of them saving them for posterity (or whatever).

2bob,

Thanks for posting the photo of the A30, it may well be the 1960 ATCC meeting. But it's not listed in the programme. The only Austin's listed is the Foley A40 and then 4 Austin Lancers. One for John Malcolm, E Pitsiladis, H Sketchley and the Dick Bland car for Gerry Trevor-Jones.

As DJH eludes it could possibly be the Brian Muir A30 or one of the car's previous drivers, Frank Dent or Brian Foley. There's a feature in the June 58 Sports Car World. It appears to have been racing for 4 years at the stage.

Stephen

[2Bob]

RE the A30.

Seeing that my filing system is a shoebox and I never labelled any of the pictures I really can't say at which meeting that photo was taken. The most likely reason for taking it was that my best friend's elder brother had an A30!

Somewhat off topic but .... I think that the first meeting I went to would have been in 1958 when my father took me (at 13) to watch from behind a railway level crossing fence (at Gnoo Blas). This was the closest free viewing area I think. Dad was a very keen photographer and his only interest was taking photos so that was just a try out for him and presumably the results not satisfactory as he never went again while I have hardly missed an event since! Dad bought me a second hand Puma camera for 10/- ($1 these days) so that I could take racing photos and the A30 and Jags (and all other early photos I have posted elsewhere) would have been taken with that. I got a bit keen on car racing as a result of the first few meetings attended and actually ended up racing in a couple of touring car rounds at Calder and Mallala in 69 or 70 (the filing system in my head isn't much better than the showbox) and after a couple of lapses of 10 years and then 19 years am back competing in an historic clubman now.

[wagons46]

To commemorate this event the Gnoo Blas Classic Car Club hold a car show within the old circuit and just opposite the start/finish each year. Hundreds of classic cars, former racing cars and bikes, sports cars and associated items of interest gather on the Saturday to display to large crowds what once was and has been preserved by enthusiasts.

Each year special guests are invited to speak at the Saturday evening dinner which is geatly supported and a terrific night for car buffs. Previous years have seen Bob Jane, Pete Geoghegan, Bruce Mcphee, and Des West to name a few. Des is earmarked to return again this year together with Sir Jack Brabham and Charlie Smith, Brian Foley, Max Volkers and compere Will Hagon.

Well what a great weekend it was. Although dampened a little by 3" of much needed rain we did get a few hours of Saturday afternoon fine weather. The rain only consolidated the true enthusiasts, and there were plenty of them, and some great cars on display including David McKay's Jaguar and Des West's red FX Holden from the 1960 race. The drivers have fared a little better with no fewer than 11 original drivers from the 1960 ATCC present at the display and dinner on Saturday. I hope someone who can, will post some photos of the display and the evening.

Effortlessly compered by Will Hagon, the night felt like an informal social gathering of a few die-hards rather than an audience of near 500. All the drivers spoke in turn with Will and related their piece of the jigsaw of the event that took place 50 years ago.

Sir Jack Brabham attended the display and of course was guest of honour at the dinner, happily signed countless autographs and mingled with all and sundry seemingly enjoying himself and coping quite well physically.

Will Hagon interviewed him at the dinner in front of a most respectful and awe inspired audience and most appreciative of the fact that Sir Jack had agreed to attend.

Edited by wagons46, 15 February 2010 - 05:10.

[cooper997]

Well what a great weekend it was. Although dampened a little by 3" of much needed rain we did get a few hours of Saturday afternoon fine weather. The rain only consolidated the true enthusiasts, and there were plenty of them, and some great cars on display including David McKay's Jaguar and Des West's red FX Holden from the 1960 race. The drivers have fared a little better with no fewer than 11 original drivers from the 1960 ATCC present at the display and dinner on Saturday. I hope someone who can, will post some photos of the display and the evening.

Effortlessly compered by Will Hagon, the night felt like an informal social gathering of a few die-hards rather than an audience of near 500. All the drivers spoke in turn with Will and related their piece of the jigsaw of the event that took place 50 years ago.

Sir Jack Brabham attended the display and of course was guest of honour at the dinner, happily signed countless autographs and mingled with all and sundry seemingly enjoying himself and coping quite well physically.

Will Hagon interviewed him at the dinner in front of a most respectful and awe inspired audience and most appreciative of the fact that Sir Jack had agreed to attend.

Wagons46,

Thanks for the update on the Gnoo Blas celebratory event. Can you please expand on who the 11 drivers that attended were?

I only wish I could have got there earlier. It was all a last minute decision after buying a car in Newcastle. I can now however tick Gnoo Blas off as an old motor racing circuit I've driven around. I commend the Orange district for their township and the fact that the circuit is well identified and pretty easy to find. Plus the park at Windsock corner is an honour to a great Aussie - 'Sir Jack Brabham Park'.

Heading back to Melbourne, I was the 'ring in' following a group of Canberra enthusiasts heading back towards Cowra - HT Monaro, works-style big Healey, Jaguar XK150S, RenaultSport Clio & Cobra Daytona replica. A great convoy at slightly increased pace, under very damp conditions. I suspect the classics will be drying their carpets for a while yet. Because there was flooded roads to go through on a few areas. But alas a great run for 70 or 80 kilometres of flowing NSW back roads. Brilliant Stuff.

Stephen

[Ray Bell]

Yeah, some good roads there for country touring...

Some of those ups and downs near Canobolas are fun while there's not much to fear in the run from Cowra through Boorowa.

But you didn't drive around the circuit, not the whole circuit, as there's a part that's been realigned, a new bridge from memory being included in this. It's at the opposite end of the circuit to the start/finish area.

[wagons46]

The V.I.P. guests that attended the dinner and actually drove in the 1960 ATCC were.....

Brian Foley
Ken Brigden
Max Volkers
Charlie Smith
Des West
Denis Gregory
Andy Selmes
Charlie Van Schaik
John Halcrow
And one of the Bailey/Bayley's

Bill Buckle was also there, as this was certainly his era, together with his recently acquired Buckle Sportscar, and related his history of car manufacturing from Goggomobil to Buckles. A courageous pioneer in this field.

[Ray Bell]

Leo Geoghegan was also on hand, was he not?

He told me a week or two back he was going...

[wagons46]

Leo Geoghegan was also on hand, was he not?

He told me a week or two back he was going...

I thought I saw him from a distance on Saturday afternoon at the Gnoo Blas Circuit, and then at the dinner Will Hagon said ambiguously Leo was unable to attend....the dinner or the day ????

Edited by wagons46, 15 February 2010 - 23:54.

[Paul Newby]

I was there during the day and at the dinner in attendance with freelance journo Luke West, who was there to do a feature article for Auto Action.

Luke and i managed to speak to about five of the drivers during the day (not a chance of approaching them during the dinner) and will chase up with a few of them post event (such as Chris Haigh, the owner of the "Grey Pussy.") He even spoke to a friend of mine who "was there" as in the crowd back in 1960 to get the the spectator's perspective. Look out for the article in Auto Action out on Wednesday week. There are a few other stories that Luke will chase up for future articles, but I won't spoil his thunder here.

It was great that us "young uns" were able to approach the likes of Des West and Max Volkers and strike up conversations about the old days. They had great stories to tell (witness their interviews with Will Hagon that night) but no one during the day's festivities knew who these guys were. A pity really, but not at all surprising.

A few of the display cars did a solitary "parade" lap but Des West managed to get in three in a red Humpy Holden that was on display (not the original Des West racing Humpy that stayed on the trailer.

All in all a great day and night. We didn't hang around for Sunday's wine tour as the Bathurst 12 Hour beckoned. But as they say, that is another story....

Oh, and to answer Ray's question. Leo Geoghegan wasn't there.

[cooper997]

Yeah, some good roads there for country touring...

Some of those ups and downs near Canobolas are fun while there's not much to fear in the run from Cowra through Boorowa.

But you didn't drive around the circuit, not the whole circuit, as there's a part that's been realigned, a new bridge from memory being included in this. It's at the opposite end of the circuit to the start/finish area.

I had worked out that there was a realignment of the main road at 'The Radius' - so I walked it instead. There's a footpath through the original section, but we're talking perhaps 120 metres taken out of the original circuit and minimal extra distance travelled on the realignment, if I've got it correct. So given how much time has elapsed since a proper race took place at Gnoo Blas, I reckon that it's a small price to pay and as good as a lap to me. Certainly more complete than Longford will ever be again.

Stephen

[cooper997]

I was there during the day and at the dinner in attendance with freelance journo Luke West, who was there to do a feature article for Auto Action.

Luke and i managed to speak to about five of the drivers during the day (not a chance of approaching them during the dinner) and will chase up with a few of them post event (such as Chris Haigh, the owner of the "Grey Pussy.") He even spoke to a friend of mine who "was there" as in the crowd back in 1960 to get the the spectator's perspective. Look out for the article in Auto Action out on Wednesday week. There are a few other stories that Luke will chase up for future articles, but I won't spoil his thunder here.

It was great that us "young uns" were able to approach the likes of Des West and Max Volkers and strike up conversations about the old days. They had great stories to tell (witness their interviews with Will Hagon that night) but no one during the day's festivities knew who these guys were. A pity really, but not at all surprising.

A few of the display cars did a solitary "parade" lap but Des West managed to get in three in a red Humpy Holden that was on display (not the original Des West racing Humpy that stayed on the trailer.

All in all a great day and night. We didn't hang around for Sunday's wine tour as the Bathurst 12 Hour beckoned. But as they say, that is another story....

Oh, and to answer Ray's question. Leo Geoghegan wasn't there.

Wagons46 & Paul,

Many thanks for your updates on who was in attendance and the general goings on. I'm with you Paul in that it was difficult to know who anybody was for us "young uns". From my point, there's only Brian Foley anf possibly Charlie Smith I would have recognised had I been there on Saturday. Even though many of the names are familiar. I did however chat with Denis Gregory (who should be congratulated for putting together a great event). I also spoke briefly with the chap in the Qld registered GT500 (he was originally from Orange but now Qld based). And walked off wondering whether I'd just been chatting with a legend.

Then it must have been Bill Buckle I passed, as he headed back towards Bathurst in the red Buckle 'BB 818' in the torrential rain.

Stephen

[wagons46]

[quote name='cooper997' date='Feb 16 2010, 18:15' post='4145578']
Wagons46 & Paul,

Many thanks for your updates on who was in attendance and the general goings on. I'm with you Paul in that it was difficult to know who anybody was for us "young uns". From my point, there's only Brian Foley anf possibly Charlie Smith I would have recognised had I been there on Saturday.




Well that's the penalty you pay for being a late arrival. Not only did you miss the best era of Australian motor racing BUT also missed The Beatles live at the Sydney Stadium !!

Edited by wagons46, 16 February 2010 - 08:42.

[David Shaw]

And it's all our fault

[customfc]

The highlight for me was to meet Sir Jack Brabham, a true gentleman.

Des West Holden






Sir Jack Brabham and Des West



Max Volkers signing Des' old racecar.

A few more pics in my album of some of the cars on display, here is a link.
Gnoo Blas 50th
Regards
Alex

Edited by customfc, 15 March 2010 - 04:30.

[Ellis French]

Custom fc

Great pics of Des West and his old Humpy
How about posting them in the Racing Humpy thread as well

Ellis

Edit...Its titled.......Early Holden Racing....... in the Nostalgia Section

Edited by Ellis French, 15 March 2010 - 20:09.

[JimBradshaw]

Custom fc

Great pics of Des West and his old Humpy
How about posting them in the Racing Humpy thread as well

Ellis

Edit...Its titled.......Early Holden Racing....... in the Nostalgia Section

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

[Catalina Park]

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

He must have been interested. He drove one in competition in the 1950s.
He raced Mustangs, Galaxies, Falcons, Toranas, etc. in the 60s and 70s. I guess he knows quality when he sees it.

Thanks Stan, I am off. If you are going to keep posting your meaningless anti touring car dribble I will not return.

Edited by Catalina Park, 16 March 2010 - 10:21.

[GeoffR]

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

So the real Stan, & whatever other aliases he may have used, reveals himself.
Have you ever stopped to consider that Sir Jack's gesture may just have been out of respect for another Australian RACING DRIVER (regardless of what he drove) from his era?
Get a life!!

Edited by GeoffR, 16 March 2010 - 10:32.

[Ray Bell]

Stan... are you aware that Jack's precious 'Ecurie Vitesse' entrant's licence was also used for an early Holden?

That's right. Brian Muir and, IIRC, Max Stahl raced under Jack's banner in old Holdens.

[Ellis French]

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

Now there is a balanced outlook if ever I seen one............
A chip on both shoulders.

If you find the pictures disgusting then dont look in a Touring Car thread.

[Lee Nicolle]

A few more pics in my album of some of the cars on display, here is a link.
Gnoo Blas 50th
Regards
Alex

Doed Des still own the car? While it looks like 40 years in the shed the motor doesnt. Nice clean carbs, booster etc and it seems to have some modern GpN tyres too so I guess it is getting some current use.

[Lee Nicolle]

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

Jack may be interested in a Vtwin speedway midget too, that is what he started racing in after all.

[cooper997]

Just got hold of the latest issue of 'Australian Muscle Car' magazine - #53. Cover & main feature on Des West's old 'humpy' 48/215 Holden from the 1960 ATCC and later owned/used by Kingsley Hibbard. Also a good rundown on Gnoo Blas circuit and that first ATCC.

Many photos have come from sources close to TNF.

Stephen

[Stinky]

Mr. Bradshaw;
You have obviosly been brought up and brainwashed in the "V8 Supercar era."
Very nice sports sedans BUT noway on earth a touring car!!
Touring cars have passenger and back seats and are (were) available from your friendly Jaguar,BMC etc dealer.
Go into a Ford or Holden dealer now and request the basic model to turn into a Supercar.
You would be laughed out of the showroom.
Back in that era the majority of drivers were gentlemen.
Of course Sir Jack would be interested in Des West.
They were of the same era!!
Also think back or do some research.
Sir Jack drove a Mustang and a Torana among other things.
Jim Clark was an ace in a Lotus Cortina.
Graham Hill drove a Jag and other touring cars.
Sir Stirling Moss was no slouch in anything with a roof as well.
From memory wasn't Stirling Moss Jacks co driver in the 2SM Torana at Bathurst when he (Jack) was shunted by a Dolomite??
It is a pity you did not share in the Golden Age of Motor Sport.
Roger.

[Stinky]

Mr. Bradshaw;
You have obviosly been brought up and brainwashed in the "V8 Supercar era."
Very nice sports sedans BUT noway on earth a touring car!!
Touring cars have passenger and back seats and are (were) available from your friendly Jaguar,BMC etc dealer.
Go into a Ford or Holden dealer now and request the basic model to turn into a Supercar.
You would be laughed out of the showroom.
Back in that era the majority of drivers were gentlemen.
Of course Sir Jack would be interested in Des West.
They were of the same era!!
Also think back or do some research.
Sir Jack drove a Mustang and a Torana among other things.
Jim Clark was an ace in a Lotus Cortina.
Graham Hill drove a Jag and other touring cars.
Sir Stirling Moss was no slouch in anything with a roof as well.
From memory wasn't Stirling Moss Jacks co driver in the 2SM Torana at Bathurst when he (Jack) was shunted by a Dolomite??
It is a pity you did not share in the Golden Age of Motor Sport.
Roger.

[Jesper O. Hansen]

Over at 10-tenths we're currently discussing the Group A era ATCC 1985-1992. Mostly results by now, but when I do get some proper time, I have my share of stories to tell and ask about. This is 1985: http://www.ten-tenth...d.php?p=2812231

Jesper

[gray chandler]

Does anybody really think that Sir Jack Brabham, a 3 times World Champion, a contempory of Moss, Brooks, Clark', Hill. Surtees ,Gurney, etal , the greatest manufacturer of customer open wheel cars,,F1 ,F2,, Tasman, F3 and a LIViNG LEGEND, would be remotely interested in a clapped out Holden sedan?

I find these pictures DISGUSTING

Wake up Australia...........we should cherish our heroes, not derade them in this way .

JB

Derade , second-person singular present active imperative of dērādō. Nuff said Dumbo!!!

[michael84]

Does anyone have entry lists for the early Australian Touring Car Championhip races from 1960-1968?

Thanks for your help

[Ray Bell]

Are they in the Chevron book about the ATCC?

Entry lists are generally the province of the race programme. Even then, a late entry might steal its way in and not be printed on the page.

RCN would turn up the grid of the races from '64 on, I should think. But that won't include non-starting entries.

[cooper997]

Does anyone have entry lists for the early Australian Touring Car Championhip races from 1960-1968?

Thanks for your help

Michael,

Drop me a pm with your email address and I should be able to dig out original entry lists for several of the annual ATCC events.

Stephen