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#7251 Boing 2

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 09:39

it was a good solid drive by schumacher but lets not forget that 3 cars were taken out ahead of him so on merit it would have been a 7th with the only wet set up on the grid.

Not spectacular but he kept it on the black stuff whilst others didn't so deserves some credit for that.

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#7252 SeanValen

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 09:51

I don't think MSC drove a great race at Korea. I think he drove a good race, or 'solid' as some others have described it.

I think he showed skill and bravery at the beginning but from then on he didn't really beat anyone on merit that he wouldn't be expected to in the MGP (with the exception of the clearly out of sorts McLaren of Button).

He did however keep it on the track and get to the end which deserves plaudits and is more than some of his peers managed. Webber is the only one among the 'top' drivers to self induce his own race end though.

For me there's nothing to suggest this is a turning point in performance or form, just a 'solid' race.




I like to add these wet tyres/intermediates have more sensitive zones and periods of freshness and don't like to be on the attack often, they liked to be drived a certain way, I don't think Michael was pushing once he got into 4th place, by keeping the position, now had these tyres neen the old sort Michael used to drive on, anyone remembers those great intermediates bridgstone used to do, even michelin's wet tyres in 2006 rocked, then I'm sure Michael could of took some risks if he wanted to in pushing, he tried that in malasyia qualifying, was 1st in the one of the sessions, then ruined his tyres in the last session by pushing too early. The limits of his mercedes and how they treat it's tyres is how Michael was driving his race, the only reference poiint was Nico and he was out. To be ahead of Kubica and finish ahead of Renault objective complete. Had Kubica been ahead of Michael by a bit, likely Michael would of pushed more towards the end, but driving fast every lap does not always win you points, races and championships, decisions on when to push is important, if we look at Vettel's engine, he was on the attack, he has no points. When you have a opportunity to preserve things, then do it, that's how these rules saves drivers, and the regulations make drivers attack less.

If we had pitstop 4 tyres, 1 race engines, all out attack in the old days, our old Schumacher would of been a bit more wild, even the rules seem to encourage more jenson button smooth driving to save the blasted tyres thing.

The car design of ferrari/redbull/mac is helping those drivers preserve their tyres more, nothing Schumacher can do there.

I don't expect Michael to solve his issues this year, he wasn't ready for these regulations, the team had no resources to fight for a title this year the way they would of wanted, testing is gone, all in all, I'm glad he's gotten some good races in for what was a far more difficult year for him to return in then expected.



#7253 wati

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 09:57

rosberg retired after only 1 lap and a half. how can anyone say he was "on fire", he was challenging for the win etc. he did the very same schumi did that lap, drive fast and overtake one driver. other speculations about what he could have done, based on vague hypotesis with no support, are pointless. both mercs did very good at the start and were clearly very fast in the early stages, then schumi lost ground with the track drying so i think similar would happen to rosberg. but at the time they were on track, a very short time anyway, they were both excellent, so saying that rosberg was on another level today and stuff like that, are not proved neither based on anything valueble


Yeah, well, that's right, but you seem to forget that Nico totaly owned MS during the SC period! :rotfl:


#7254 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 10:16

it was a good solid drive by schumacher but lets not forget that 3 cars were taken out ahead of him so on merit it would have been a 7th with the only wet set up on the grid.


That's assuming they'd all have kept it pointing the right way......

Which other 'rein meister' did well, Sutil? Glock? Button?

There's always a bitterness when it comes to discussing Schumacher.

#7255 Boing 2

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 11:57

That's assuming they'd all have kept it pointing the right way......

Which other 'rein meister' did well, Sutil? Glock? Button?

There's always a bitterness when it comes to discussing Schumacher.


vettel was doing rather well at the front, i thought hamilton did well but not astonishing but then neither of them had a dedicated wet set up.

I don't understand the bitterness comment, he would have finished 7th in the only team that went for a wet setting, he did well to keep it on the island but i don't see anything 'amazing' about his drive. The fact that it's a good result in comparison to the rest of his season says more about how bad his season has been.

#7256 Diablobb81

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 12:24

And i don't understand your comment about the wet setup. We have no idea on what setup each driver had. Even if merc was the only one witha more wet setup they compromised their dry pace. So why didn't kubica and Button overtake him back?

#7257 iakhtar

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 12:27

MB was mentioning during the race that there's not really much difference between wet/dry setups anymore

#7258 ivand911

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 12:38

I think all teams did same changes on the cars when race was stoped. But a lot of them can't change rear wing configuration because of F-duct. Recently front wing configurations are also not for quick changes, you just need new front wing. MGP team made some changes on the brakes and maybe something with car height or else(engine). But I don't think any team did big change in aero package. Modern wings just don't have anymore different positions that could be changed for more or less down-force.

Edited by ivand911, 25 October 2010 - 12:46.


#7259 slaveceru

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 12:46

vettel was doing rather well at the front, i thought hamilton did well but not astonishing but then neither of them had a dedicated wet set up.

I don't understand the bitterness comment, he would have finished 7th in the only team that went for a wet setting, he did well to keep it on the island but i don't see anything 'amazing' about his drive. The fact that it's a good result in comparison to the rest of his season says more about how bad his season has been.


Are you for sure that Mercedes was the only team that went for full wet setting? It would be strange if it was true because the rain did not stop till the end of race. After the race was interrupted there was enough time to set up the car for full wet condition even, if the cars at the beginning of the race were set up for intermediate condition. Also the stewards have stated that the race will continue on full wet. Thus I belive that all the teams set-up there cars to full wet settings. The difference between the speed of the cars that arise after the track begun to dry were probably due to differences in tire wear, position of the cars on the tracks, visibility and not to the differences in the settings for full wet per se.

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#7260 ivand911

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 12:55

We get it, that Michael is the only driver this year who pick up positions because other infront of him were having problems. And this is why everything he did don't count? All other drivers get their positions on merit. :rotfl: This is why his team were trying so hard to prevent him from doing this, like in Monaco,Valencia,Germany,Suzuka.

Edited by ivand911, 25 October 2010 - 13:00.


#7261 smitten

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 13:11

We get it, that Michael is the only driver this year who pick up positions because other infront of him were having problems. And this is why everything he did don't count? All other drivers get their positions on merit. :rotfl: This is why his team were trying so hard to prevent him from doing this, like in Monaco,Valencia,Germany,Suzuka.


He made up 5 places from his grid slot, three of those due to retirements. He did, however, overtake 2 cars on the track which is more than most of the front runners did. 4th is a very respectable finish, and his best result of the season. I think some people are prone to class it as superb as it was much better than his recent performances. Probably his best race of the season, but I'd class it as solid in the same way that I think the rest of the top 10 finishers had solid, but not outstanding, drives.

#7262 ivand911

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 13:43

He made up 5 places from his grid slot, three of those due to retirements. He did, however, overtake 2 cars on the track which is more than most of the front runners did. 4th is a very respectable finish, and his best result of the season. I think some people are prone to class it as superb as it was much better than his recent performances. Probably his best race of the season, but I'd class it as solid in the same way that I think the rest of the top 10 finishers had solid, but not outstanding, drives.

He have three times 4th place this year. Race was just normal , I hope for more races like this. Without hits/crashes and technical problems.


#7263 aditya-now

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 14:56

But they would have to buy new keyboards .... :lol:

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Funny one, cheapracer!

I will still have to catch up with the race on video, but congratulations to Michael, second race in a row with a strong showing. Luckily he did not throw his car entirely away....

And: Michael is in solid 9th position now for the championship!

#7264 ivand911

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 16:56

Korea Race blog(all weekend) parts 1 and 2 from "Cracker" ,rear end mechanic on Michael car is in MGP thread. A lot of interesting information about the race.
"Finally… to the few fans that scratch their heads and ask ‘has Michael still got it?’

In my opinion, working with him, there is absolutely no chance that he is doing this for fun as some people may think. I've worked with many drivers and teams over the years. The feedback from Michael is quite unbelievable. His memory about details of every corner, entry and exit, even on a long run, is quite amazing. If I was a betting man, then I wouldn't hesitate on backing this man next year. I get asked quite a lot ‘what's he like to work with?’ Just to round it off, he is so normal and down to earth it's untrue! Genuinely!"

Edited by ivand911, 25 October 2010 - 16:58.


#7265 BiH

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 17:19

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

that sounds really good but it will be very difficult for mercedes to catch the top 3 they still haven't determined why they are so slow compared to red bull, ferrari and mercedes

and the new tyre for next year it should be quite a challenge for mercedes to get back to the front of field.

also brawn never ran KERS so....

#7266 ivand911

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 17:26

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

that sounds really good but it will be very difficult for mercedes to catch the top 3 they still haven't determined why they are so slow compared to red bull, ferrari and mercedes

and the new tyre for next year it should be quite a challenge for mercedes to get back to the front of field.

also brawn never ran KERS so....

But, Mercedes company have best KERS(in 2009) , so MGP team will not have problem with it. KERS that McLaren use belong to Mercedes(engine supplier). Next year McLaren will use Mercedes KERS with the engines.

Edited by ivand911, 25 October 2010 - 17:28.


#7267 arknor

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Posted 25 October 2010 - 22:11

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

that sounds really good but it will be very difficult for mercedes to catch the top 3 they still haven't determined why they are so slow compared to red bull, ferrari and mercedes

and the new tyre for next year it should be quite a challenge for mercedes to get back to the front of field.

also brawn never ran KERS so....

there biggest problem was the wrong weight distribution on the chasis and your not allowed to change your chasis. next year all teams must use the same weight distribution

the centre of gravity is far to high aswell.

they didnt have enough resources to develop this years aswell as focus on winning the championship last year so this years car suffered.

if you didnt notice at the start of the season it pretty much looked like last years car , i think they were using the same aero package as the car that won the championship last year.


thats 3 thinks they will fix



#7268 cheapracer

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 14:58

Must have been his best race of the year by far because this thread I just found halfway down page 2 - whats wrong guys, nothing to criticize?

:lol:



thats 3 thinks they will fix


F1 cars are fickle things, a statement supported in it's history - it could also totally go against them and I fear that will end it for MS before the end of the year.

Edited by cheapracer, 26 October 2010 - 15:01.


#7269 britishtrident

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 18:16

It is like only Nico have bad luck this year????? And you still come here in Michael thread to tell us that he is better. I think there is thread for this(Nico Vs Michael) and I strongly advise Nico fans finally to start his thread. Not to come here to discuss Nico affairs.



MS manage not to get left behind too quickly by Massa ---- Massa may drive a very good car but he ain't no superstar he is a typical Ferrari down trodden number 2.

Not far behind him Robert K was just having a really bad week end and not very far behind Robert was Liuzzi

On the bright side Mercedes powered MS managed to stay ahead of Rubens with his third rate Cosworth power unit.

#7270 Mary Popsins

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 18:42

I'd like for the sake of the sport to see MS on a podium again. He would very likely be in good company.

Was reading in a journo blog: "the carnage helped Michael Schumacher on his way to his best showing of the year, which will no doubt be hailed by his fans as a sign that all is fine and dandy and his comeback was a really wizard idea". All I will say is that Schumacher is more professional than the person who wrote that.

Looking at the standings/results I have noticed that MS and NC have scored the same amount of points for the last six races.

#7271 salamin

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 18:57

overtake on kubica / button

#7272 ivand911

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 19:18

MS manage not to get left behind too quickly by Massa ---- Massa may drive a very good car but he ain't no superstar he is a typical Ferrari down trodden number 2.

Not far behind him Robert K was just having a really bad week end and not very far behind Robert was Liuzzi

On the bright side Mercedes powered MS managed to stay ahead of Rubens with his third rate Cosworth power unit.

Button was behind too. Kubica race improve a lot on last laps when Rubens and Hulk have problem with tyres. Michael from other side was just trying to conserve his inters since the moment he put them on. And he did good job with that. He didn't push it at any moment. This is F1 now, conserving tyres. But, still with full wet tyres he show something.

Edited by ivand911, 26 October 2010 - 19:21.


#7273 carbonfibre

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 19:36

MS manage not to get left behind too quickly by Massa ---- Massa may drive a very good car but he ain't no superstar he is a typical Ferrari down trodden number 2.

Not far behind him Robert K was just having a really bad week end and not very far behind Robert was Liuzzi

On the bright side Mercedes powered MS managed to stay ahead of Rubens with his third rate Cosworth power unit.

A yes you actually want to say he didn't do a good job but make a nice story around it. It's ok to give your opinion just say it as it is.

#7274 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 23:05

From what I understand MS had an average race but stayed on the track unlike some and inherited a reasonable position.Really nothing outstanding though a good honest job by the most experienced [but not fastest] guy on the grid.

#7275 arknor

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 23:09

From what I understand MS had an average race but stayed on the track unlike some and inherited a reasonable position.Really nothing outstanding though a good honest job by the most experienced [but not fastest] guy on the grid.

[sarcasm]yea average race [/sarcasm] ,dont think he made a single mistake the whole time and lapped pretty competively with those around him, pitty he wasnt in a faster car like the ferrari. . . he was only 9 seconds behind massa as it was

Edited by arknor, 26 October 2010 - 23:10.


#7276 Raelene

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Posted 26 October 2010 - 23:14

From what I understand MS had an average race but stayed on the track unlike some and inherited a reasonable position.Really nothing outstanding though a good honest job by the most experienced [but not fastest] guy on the grid.


from what you understand? Does that mean you didn't actually watch the race?

#7277 arknor

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 01:05

from what you understand? Does that mean you didn't actually watch the race?

he only overtook the HRT's of kubica and button and kept up with one of the ferrari's. pretty average :rolleyes:

#7278 1amiga

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 05:41


What you meant to say is he overtook last years world drivers champion, and till last week robert kubica rated by some on here till last week the best driver in F1. And kept up with the second fastest car on the grid.

:smoking:

#7279 cheapracer

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 11:36

Not far behind him Robert K was just having a really bad week end and not very far behind Robert was Liuzzi

On the bright side Mercedes powered MS managed to stay ahead of Rubens with his third rate Cosworth power unit.


At least you know how to spell "behind" though I bet you have a different definition of the word when it applies to Schumacher :lol:

Unless we have been watching different GP's in 2010, the Williams have had a pretty darn good run this year handily beating the Merc powered Force Indias on a regular basis and the "second rate" Renauts are actually the fastest cars this year so engine doesn't always maketh the car.


From what I understand MS had an average race but stayed on the track unlike some and inherited a reasonable position.Really nothing outstanding though a good honest job by the most experienced [but not fastest] guy on the grid.


He was honking at the start Lee and like the MS of old he was not following, he was looking for new lines and where to set up passes and poking his nose at every chance. Once he confirmed his position he knew he couldn't do much more and took what he could.



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#7280 arknor

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Posted 27 October 2010 - 13:03

He was honking at the start Lee and like the MS of old he was not following, he was looking for new lines and where to set up passes and poking his nose at every chance. Once he confirmed his position he knew he couldn't do much more and took what he could.

he got bashed a bit in this thread for going off the track behind the safety car when he was finding grip levels :wave:

martin brundle was smart enough to realise what was happening and pointed it out , he rehearsed the overtake on kubica behind the safety car :up:

#7281 cheapracer

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Posted 28 October 2010 - 04:21

he got bashed a bit in this thread for going off the track behind the safety car when he was finding grip levels :wave:

martin brundle was smart enough to realise what was happening and pointed it out , he rehearsed the overtake on kubica behind the safety car :up:


I wouldn't go calling MS smart for all of that, what I can't understand is why the other mega dollar drivers AREN'T doing it - if I was a manager and saw MS doing it and my driver wasn't I would be pissed.....

MS practices his starts, lays rubber for the start, practices hard at pit lane entry - again why aren't they all?

Also again this thread was on page 2, for sure this means his best performance of the year :lol:


#7282 cheapracer

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 13:23

OMG! 24 hours have passed and not a post, ok based on that I now have Korea as MS's race of the year! :lol:

I was watching MS today drive Monaco 1997 and he really was special that day

http://v.youku.com/v...I3MzMyNjg=.html



#7283 aditya-now

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:15

OMG! 24 hours have passed and not a post, ok based on that I now have Korea as MS's race of the year! :lol:

I was watching MS today drive Monaco 1997 and he really was special that day

http://v.youku.com/v...I3MzMyNjg=.html



You are waiting for people to dwell forever and celebrate Michael for his fourth place in Korea, which he gained thanks to the misfortunes of Rosberg and Vettel and the mistake of Webber?
Wow, in the old days Michael was winning one race after the other - if he were doing that we would see much more traffic in this thread.

An average showing like becoming 4th the third time this season (and this being his season´s best results) does not warrant commenting on it for five days in a row, it is too unspectacular.
Come on, cheapracer, get real!

Concerning Monaco 1997: yes, he was really special that day.

Edited by aditya-now, 29 October 2010 - 14:16.


#7284 arknor

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 14:52

You are waiting for people to dwell forever and celebrate Michael for his fourth place in Korea, which he gained thanks to the misfortunes of Rosberg and Vettel and the mistake of Webber?
Wow, in the old days Michael was winning one race after the other - if he were doing that we would see much more traffic in this thread.

An average showing like becoming 4th the third time this season (and this being his season´s best results) does not warrant commenting on it for five days in a row, it is too unspectacular.
Come on, cheapracer, get real!

Concerning Monaco 1997: yes, he was really special that day.

no we are celebrating him finishing 10seconds or so behind a much faster ferrari , overtaking kubica at the first corner of a restart and showing button whos boss

#7285 aditya-now

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 15:05

no we are celebrating him finishing 10seconds or so behind a much faster ferrari , overtaking kubica at the first corner of a restart and showing button whos boss


that is indeed worthwhile to celebrate, albeit there were numerous Safety Car periods and the "much faster" Ferrari was driven by Felipe Massa, who is a shadow of his former self.

Nonetheless, the celebrations seem a bit muted on this thread, don´t you think? :p


#7286 SchumiP1

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 15:14

To win, you first have to finish. Same goes for 4th place.
Anyway, nothing wrong with Schumacher making up a few places by others retiring from the race. Rosberg has "lucked" into quite a few podiums that way.

#7287 ivand911

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 15:54

Comparing Ferrari and MGP cars is not very useful occupation. I am sure Michael would prefer to drive red car this year. And I think his results could be better that Massa's. Because I think he can find red car easy to drive and better suited to his style.

Edited by ivand911, 29 October 2010 - 16:03.


#7288 cindy4ever33

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:06

Posted Image

Nice banner in Korea. Is it also from you, Ivan? :)

#7289 ivand911

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:09

It is from the same group Russian fans(Banner Maniacs). This was their banner for Korea. This banner have history. They found guy from city Khabarovsk who planned to visit Korean GP. They send him file(and money) and he made it in banner company there(they didn't have time to made the banner and send it in Khabarovsk). Then he visit GP and put banner there in good location. And this guy was McLaren fan. He is in the picture behind the banner in white. Ivanoff poster here have connection with the banner.

Edited by ivand911, 29 October 2010 - 16:43.


#7290 rog

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:10

To win, you first have to finish. Same goes for 4th place.
Anyway, nothing wrong with Schumacher making up a few places by others retiring from the race. Rosberg has "lucked" into quite a few podiums that way.


No not really. Rosbergs rain pace was just too good. Only Silverstone was a bit of luck. Same for MS in Korea.

#7291 arknor

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:17

No not really. Rosbergs rain pace was just too good. Only Silverstone was a bit of luck. Same for MS in Korea.

i like how people can tell rosbergs rain pace in korea from one flying lap where everyone was getting there brakes and tyres back up to temprature.

did you notice hamilton almost immediately shaved 2 seconds of his laptime following rosberg going out yet people use hamiltons slower lap as evidence rosberg would have pulled away from him

#7292 DarthRonzo

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:20

Comparing Ferrari and MGP cars is not very useful occupation. I am sure Michael would prefer to drive red car this year. And I think his results could be better that Massa's. Because I think he can find red car easy to drive and better suited to his style.

Yup... Red is the color.

When he was driving that silver Sauber Mercedes at LeMans, Schumy wasn't the fastest either.

Maybe MGP biggest upgrade for 2011 will be the red paint. :p

#7293 rog

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 16:23

i like how people can tell rosbergs rain pace in korea from one flying lap where everyone was getting there brakes and tyres back up to temprature.

did you notice hamilton almost immediately shaved 2 seconds of his laptime following rosberg going out yet people use hamiltons slower lap as evidence rosberg would have pulled away from him


You posting has nothing to do with my quote. Read properly.

#7294 man

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:22

Posted Image

Nice banner in Korea. Is it also from you, Ivan? :)



If I was M Schumacher, I would be a bit alarmed by this.

#7295 man

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:26

Comparing Ferrari and MGP cars is not very useful occupation. I am sure Michael would prefer to drive red car this year. And I think his results could be better that Massa's. Because I think he can find red car easy to drive and better suited to his style.


Perhaps. ;-) Though I dont think you or M Schumacher would take the roasting he would get from Alonso particularly well.

Still, who am I to step in the way of a good fantasy. ;-)


#7296 arknor

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:38

Perhaps. ;-) Though I dont think you or M Schumacher would take the roasting he would get from Alonso particularly well.

Still, who am I to step in the way of a good fantasy. ;-)

i seem to remember a thread about how much on avg schumacher beat massa in qualifying compared to alonso

#7297 man

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:42

i seem to remember a thread about how much on avg schumacher beat massa in qualifying compared to alonso


Hehe. Massa walking into a team that was moulded around M Schumacher for 10 years. Alonso walking into a team that Massa has been at since 2006. Apples...pears anybody? ;-)

#7298 arknor

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 17:47

Hehe. Massa walking into a team that was moulded around M Schumacher for 10 years. Alonso walking into a team that Massa has been at since 2006. Apples...pears anybody? ;-)

but alonso brought 3 tenths to the team :confused:

#7299 ivand911

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Posted 29 October 2010 - 19:09

Perhaps. ;-) Though I dont think you or M Schumacher would take the roasting he would get from Alonso particularly well.

Will be not worst situation than this year.


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#7300 aditya-now

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Posted 30 October 2010 - 00:40

Comparing Ferrari and MGP cars is not very useful occupation. I am sure Michael would prefer to drive red car this year. And I think his results could be better that Massa's. Because I think he can find red car easy to drive and better suited to his style.


Ah, crying after the red car?

Well, whose decision was it not to go to the Reds? Who wanted to join Mercedes and not Ferrari? Who did Michael disappoint so much by chosing "the enemy" that LdM called him "his own twin brother"?
So, maybe Schumi made the wrong decision joining the Greys?