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Michael Schumacher (merged)


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#701 merschu

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 11:32

Here is what Michael has to say after the race:



"That's motor racing"
"A missing wheel nut stopped Michael in Malaysia

"It is a shame that I could not finish the race but unfortunately one of the wheel nuts in the left rear was lost. The car suddenly was becoming very instable in turn 6 and I could hardly steer and had not drive left. I initially thought it was something to do with the suspension but after I had stopped I was there was one wheel nut lost. It is something very unusual to happen, in testing we never had problems with it. I would have obviously wanted to finish the race, and I think it could have worked out quite reasonably because I was able to kind of safe tyres for later. But in the end that is motor racing, I remember that very well. It makes no sense to get angry about it, you have to accept it as part of the game and look ahead. At least Nico scored our first podium finish, and I am happy for him and the team."


http://michael-schum...m...043&lang=uk

Edited by merschu, 04 April 2010 - 11:37.


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#702 P123

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 11:34

Or lets remember 1996.


So, 10 years of no car failures?

#703 baddog

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 11:41

IMO he sounded very deflated today. I think he is realizing that even if he does get back up to speed then he still has no chance of making an impact driving for his current team.


Thats... well lets be nice and say thats a misinterpretation of the reailty of racing in the first few laps of a Grand Prix.

#704 Sakae

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 13:07

Michael had relatively good start, and rest is history. Good news is, He is not broken. :D

Now the China. :up:

#705 schumaster

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 13:21

Michael had relatively good start, and rest is history. Good news is, He is not broken. :D

Now the China. :up:


What happened was disappointing, but not his fault....

yet again he had a good start like in previous 2 races...his pace before the retirement was also matching Rosberg :)

I'm praying that Michael will finally have a good race very very soon and his bad luck will go away

#706 ZooL

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 13:37

Wow, did Brawn get the wrong car or something? :stoned:

#707 merschu

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 14:03

Ross Brawn & the Mercedes team sabotaged Schumi's car..!! :p

#708 glorius&victorius

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 14:07

Ross Brawn & the Mercedes team sabotaged Schumi's car..!! :p


in his previous life in F1 this would have never happened to Shummy....(only to his team mates)

#709 merschu

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 14:09

This what Norbert Haug has to say about the wheel nut faliure on Schumi's car:


Mercedes motorsport boss Norbert Haug felt to - and apologized after the race with Schumi:
"Sorry, something should not happen! We make from it. We will work hard and concentrate to make sure that our car in the future, reliable and simple step by step faster. "

Fair words for Schumi Malaysia helped. But for the future does he not gloomy: "In China (18 April) we wish to once again be a bit better there. There are as yet few good things for us. "
In any case, a new nut ...



http://translate.goo...y...=auto&tl=en

Edited by merschu, 04 April 2010 - 14:12.


#710 merschu

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 14:19

Work was going on that wheel before the start of the race, so some kind of mistake might have happened during that time!

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#711 F1 Tor.

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 14:50

Too bad for Michael. He could have scored decent points the last two races, but, that's racing. The only thing you can do is move on and hopefully Merc can improve the car fairly soon. Nico had a great race today, but it's getting really tough to watch these races. They really are quite boring

#712 grunge

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 15:03

insite of all the bashing,i think pacewise this weekend had many positives for schumi.on the racepace note,well he was stuck behind sutil before he stopped.rosberg was in clean air,ofcourse he wouldve been faster.

im positive he'll match rosberg consistently in 2,3 weekends time

#713 Paco

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 15:04

Hmmmm..... starting to wonder if Michael is a bit TOOOO relaxed and easy going. Seems to have lost that EDGE and FIRE..

A few more races will tell but on track, he seems to be ok with lapping away like everyone else then taking it to them like he used.

Looks as though he still has it but doesn't seem interested in fighting for it on track.. that extra 1/10 or 2/10ths that he used to fight and be sooooooo passionate about finding..

#714 BigWicks

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 15:07

i mean fundamentally the car isn't good enough so not much he can do, BUT... he is getting his bum spanked by rosberg at the moment and the amount of excuses being piled up in his defence is a bit humiliating for a man of his standing in the sport

#715 Paco

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 15:45

i mean fundamentally the car isn't good enough so not much he can do, BUT... he is getting his bum spanked by rosberg at the moment and the amount of excuses being piled up in his defence is a bit humiliating for a man of his standing in the sport


Agreed.. but I remember when he 1st got into Ferrari and some of Benetton days where he didn't have a top ride he still made the most of it and extracted every last bit out of his ride and literally put himself in a finishing place where he shouldn't have. Seems as though now he's driving at 98%.. leaving behind just that little bit that made him soooo special for sooo long.

#716 BigWicks

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 15:51

the thing i remember about his ferrari days is that when the car was bad, he would always destroy his teammate, when the car was good, things were always a lot closer. so i'm a bit concerned about his underperformance at the moment

#717 cheapracer

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:06

i mean fundamentally the car isn't good enough so not much he can do, BUT... he is getting his bum spanked by rosberg at the moment and the amount of excuses being piled up in his defence is a bit humiliating for a man of his standing in the sport


Know what you mean, I thought losing a wheel nut was a terrible excuse.


#718 BigWicks

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:10

Know what you mean, I thought losing a wheel nut was a terrible excuse.


well done on missing the point :smoking:

#719 cheapracer

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:23

well done on missing the point :smoking:


Your mouth is writing cheques that you can't cash.

What excuses? First race - 3 years out with little testing, Alonso spins him last race and his wheel falls off this one?

After these 3 races your statements have no substance - pointless.


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#720 Paco

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:30

well done on missing the point :smoking:


:rotfl: Exactly.

#721 carbonfibre

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:30

Really sorry this happened to him today, job well done by Nico simple as that.

So far you can't really tell what michael's performance is at, the first race he was behind but the last two races i got the feeling they were pretty much on par but with all the bad luck you can't tell.

#722 Paco

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:32

Your mouth is writing cheques that you can't cash.

What excuses? First race - 3 years out with little testing, Alonso spins him last race and his wheel falls off this one?

After these 3 races your statements have no substance - pointless.


No one is judging him on any one instance :wave:

It's a pattern that is developing over every weekend. Sure he's been hit by some bad luck.. no one is refuting that.

His time away is one reason and yes it will take him time ... but his swagger is very different. Michael 2.0 is definitely a different man... how much that will affect his results time will tell.

I for one hope Michael tosses away 2.0 and becomes the man of old on the track.

Edited by Paco, 04 April 2010 - 16:33.


#723 BRK

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:47

What's all this Michael part I/II stuff?! People don't lose talent,and F1 drivers most certainly do not turn into less talented clones just because they've been away a long time.

What you do lose a lot of are the devilish little details: keeping up those ridiculous corner entry speeds (people being awed at the Stowe corner being a prime example), the brake-bias dances, the on-the-edge late braking madness-that sort of stuff were what have always given him the edge but can only come of familiarity with and confidence in the machine you're driving. It's impossible to quantify and attest a deadline to this process. And you don't lose any of this with age either,but you definitely would need loads of time to get back in the groove.

As far as I know he is still driving the understeering W01 he had at Bahrain-the team have repeatedly said there will be no major changes in this area until Barcelona. I would say he's coping rather well with a car that doesn't suit his style at all and has adapted very well. Today was the second race running where he had issues that had absolutely nothing to do with his performance on-track,which is pretty annoying but I'm sure he's moved on.




#724 Sakae

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 16:54

As Michael is parking car, race TV shot shows how wobbly his rear wheel is. This was not a make-up excuse.



#725 rally man

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:00

What's all this Michael part I/II stuff?! People don't lose talent,and F1 drivers most certainly do not turn into less talented clones just because they've been away a long time.


In that case, bring then Häkkinen back and see what's result. According to your principle Mark Webber would be much better driver than Häkkinen at his peak. It would be absurd to rate for instance Häkkinen's, Fisichella's or Coulthard's abilities by their last races.

In fact it's quite visible that most of the drivers loose much of their speed between 30-35 - not to mention when they are 35-40.

#726 SeanValen

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:12

To Michael's advantage, there are 19 races this season, 2 more then the usual 17 he did and previously 16 race seasons he did. Alonso DNF'd and Massa is leading the championship, yet Massa isn't the one who's looked outstanding, it's been other drivers, weird, but it shows how many different ways this season can go. Michael could of done with a whole race distance, for him it's important because of limited testing, but the next race is interesting, China is the scene of his last GP win in f1 back in 2006, great drive, maybe it'll bring him some luck.

I think had we had a rain race, it would of worked out better for Mercedes overall and the race could of done with it, sepang being very wide, so many different lines to play with, the 2001 race was great.

Edited by SeanValen, 04 April 2010 - 17:15.


#727 Paco

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:13

In that case, bring then Häkkinen back and see what's result. According to your principle Mark Webber would be much better driver than Häkkinen at his peak. It would be absurd to rate for instance Häkkinen's, Fisichella's or Coulthard's abilities by their last races.

In fact it's quite visible that most of the drivers loose much of their speed between 30-35 - not to mention when they are 35-40.


think it's more that they've accomplished so much and that other priorities distract them from the internal motivation that drove them to be sooo successful. Be it family or $$$ that takes the edge off...

I wonder what incident or situation may arise that brings Michael back to his old self.. can't wait for it happen!

Edited by Paco, 04 April 2010 - 17:17.


#728 BRK

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:18

In that case, bring then Häkkinen back and see what's result. According to your principle Mark Webber would be much better driver than Häkkinen at his peak. It would be absurd to rate for instance Häkkinen's, Fisichella's or Coulthard's abilities by their last races.

In fact it's quite visible that most of the drivers loose much of their speed between 30-35 - not to mention when they are 35-40.


Did you read the rest of the post? You don't lose talent with age,you just go easy on the little risks you would've taken at a younger age. So while you may,for instance,still trail brake your way into corners,you wouldn't do this lap after lap and take it easy a bit. IMO there's also the psychological and fitness factors playing a part-Fisichella and DC were well settled into their respective repuations and were probably a bit sick with the whole thing by the time they retired. MS,on the other hand,is still in top shape at 41-as he was well into his thirties. And he's said time and again that his batteries are now recharged and that he's ready to take up the challenge ahead of him. Mentally ready? Check. Physically prepared? Check.

None of this is true for the above drivers. If you brought Mika back he'd trundle around seconds off the pace-I think it's basically a case of people severely underestimating the effect of the three year break. Not a case of losing talent,just one of getting back into his comfort zone.

#729 rog

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:20

As far as I know he is still driving the understeering W01 he had at Bahrain-the team have repeatedly said there will be no major changes in this area until Barcelona. I would say he's coping rather well with a car that doesn't suit his style at all and has adapted very well. Today was the second race running where he had issues that had absolutely nothing to do with his performance on-track,which is pretty annoying but I'm sure he's moved on.



Same for Rosberg, it does not suit his style.

#730 BRK

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:24

Same for Rosberg, it does not suit his style.


That's what he said after the stuff floating around on the internet about the car suiting his style better,but I think the understeery Williamses were said to suit his style perfectly? I remember people even remarking how different he was from his father,as far as driving style is concerned.

#731 rog

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:27

That's what he said after the stuff floating around on the internet about the car suiting his style better,but I think the understeery Williamses were said to suit his style perfectly? I remember people even remarking how different he was from his father,as far as driving style is concerned.



He never told the understeering williams suited him, who told this?

Edited by rog, 04 April 2010 - 17:27.


#732 BRK

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:39

He never told the understeering williams suited him, who told this?


The first time I paid any attention to this was when the tyres were changed in 2007,when Wurz was his teammate. I remember reading then that changing to Bridgestone's meant drivers that tended to attack a corner (rather than brake early and turn-in early) struggled,while those with a smoother style preferred the understeering tendency of the cars. Wurz said so himself in an interview that the understeering nature of the car+tyres suited NR's style better. I'm sure there's a quote to be found somewhere with a premium subscription to autosport.com (which I don't have)

#733 rog

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:49

The first time I paid any attention to this was when the tyres were changed in 2007,when Wurz was his teammate. I remember reading then that changing to Bridgestone's meant drivers that tended to attack a corner (rather than brake early and turn-in early) struggled,while those with a smoother style preferred the understeering tendency of the cars. Wurz said so himself in an interview that the understeering nature of the car+tyres suited NR's style better. I'm sure there's a quote to be found somewhere with a premium subscription to autosport.com (which I don't have)



Maybe he can cope with it better than some other drivers, why not. But it doesn't mean Rosberg prefer understeering. He clearly told twice that he would prefer a car that tend to be oversteering instead understeering. Of course best would be more a neutral car.

Edited by rog, 04 April 2010 - 17:49.


#734 Augurk

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:51

Maybe he can cope with it better than some other drivers, why not. But it doesn't mean Rosberg prefer understeering. He clearly told twice that he would prefer a car that tend to be oversteering instead understeering. Of course best would be more a neutral car.

It could however mean that once they get the weight distribution sorted (either with a neutral or tadly oversteering car) the results will turn around completely in MSC's favour.
We've seen the same in 2008 when Ferrari suddenly focused on developments for Massa for some reason. Kimi lost his advantage completely.

The style of the car is that important. Most people know Kimi was by far the better driver but the car was tailored to Massa, and he lost his edge. The Mercedes hasn't been tailored to either driver but it's likely it suits one better than the other.

#735 BRK

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 17:57

Maybe he can cope with it better than some other drivers, why not. But it doesn't mean Rosberg prefer understeering. He clearly told twice that he would prefer a car that tend to be oversteering instead understeering. Of course best would be more a neutral car.


No driver would want a car that tended to do lean too much in either direction,but the fact is that MS is having to adapt to the car unlike Rosberg,who has driven cars of a similar nature in the past. Basically a Schumacher that is having to cope with the car and is doing an excellent job of it,and as Augurk said above,something more neutral can only make MS quicker.

#736 rog

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 18:08

It could however mean that once they get the weight distribution sorted (either with a neutral or tadly oversteering car) the results will turn around completely in MSC's favour.
We've seen the same in 2008 when Ferrari suddenly focused on developments for Massa for some reason. Kimi lost his advantage completely.

The style of the car is that important. Most people know Kimi was by far the better driver but the car was tailored to Massa, and he lost his edge. The Mercedes hasn't been tailored to either driver but it's likely it suits one better than the other.



I doubt that, it's just assumption. Nico doesn't prefer understeering as well. Both can to benefit from a better weight distribution.

#737 Augurk

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 18:10

I doubt that, it's just assumption. Nico doesn't prefer understeering as well. Both can to benefit from a better weight distribution.

Exactly what it is, an assumption. That's why I said that it could mean that, as we have seen it before with other drivers.

#738 Dragonfly

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 18:27

Michael missed 3 years of car evolution, no to speak the the car he's driving now has zero of his input in its design. Techniques that worked great for him in the Ferrari might not work now. I think he's simply cautious. Not time to take larger risks and he's still not confident to the end in the car IMO.
But we've seen in the past that a row of mishaps does not make him give up.
I haven't heard much about the inner team atmosphere but besides Ross every one else might see in him the old rival.

Edited by Dragonfly, 04 April 2010 - 18:28.


#739 JimmyStew

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 18:44

Michael missed 3 years of car evolution, no to speak the the car he's driving now has zero of his input in its design. Techniques that worked great for him in the Ferrari might not work now. I think he's simply cautious. Not time to take larger risks and he's still not confident to the end in the car IMO.
But we've seen in the past that a row of mishaps does not make him give up.
I haven't heard much about the inner team atmosphere but besides Ross every one else might see in him the old rival.



Good points, Dragonfly. I hope that he does turn things around, as it is sad to see a driver of his legendary status struggling so badly. The lack of in-season testing won't help, either - so let's hope the Barcelona upgrades bring something good.

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#740 Kompressor

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 19:27

I'm surprised that none of the Schumacher fans have picked up on one of the few positives. It's two races in a row that Schumacher has picked up positions on the start while Rosberg has lost position due to excess wheel spin. If Schumacher can improve his qualifying, he might be close enough to Rosberg to pip him at the start.

Rosberg is whipping Schumacher 35 to 10 and is only four points from leading the championship. Schumacher just needs to get lucky.

#741 glorius&victorius

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 19:36

at Ferrari MS had everything going for him:
- car built for him (...not for his team mate)
- team mate driving for him (see austria debacle)
- team strategies for him (with his team mate being the guinea pig)
- team built around him (...not around the team mate)
- exclusive reliability (... consistent reliability glitches for his team mates)

Really a position of supreme luxury... that probably to this extend was never granted to any other driver in F1 history.
However, he was also worth every dollar... I think never has there been a race driver that drove so many KMs, stayed for days at Maranello.
Schumacher-Ferrari was the perfect symbiosis

So this whole Mercedes experience is quite a change for MS... and maybe we'll see the best of MS again when all these things are back in place.


* btw: I guess that that's why Montezemolo is so pissed.... thinking "we gave him everything...EVERYTHING!!! Things that other teams would never give him....and then he turns his back on us to start promoting Mercedes sports cars... Mammamia!". And to make it even more insulting the car is red.

Edited by glorius&victorius, 04 April 2010 - 19:49.


#742 1amiga

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 19:49

To me the dry FP3 gives the most telling indication of speed



1 M. Webber Red Bull 1:33.542 17

2 L. Hamilton McLaren 1:33.559 14

3 S. Vettel Red Bull 1:33.587 17

4 F. Alonso Ferrari 1:33.751 19

5 M. Schumacher Mercedes Grand Prix 1:33.992 15

6 N. Rosberg Mercedes Grand Prix 1:34.090 13

7 J. Button McLaren 1:34.113 16

8 F. Massa Ferrari 1:34.174 15



#743 1amiga

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 19:54

I'm surprised that none of the Schumacher fans have picked up on one of the few positives. It's two races in a row that Schumacher has picked up positions on the start while Rosberg has lost position due to excess wheel spin. If Schumacher can improve his qualifying, he might be close enough to Rosberg to pip him at the start.

Rosberg is whipping Schumacher 35 to 10 and is only four points from leading the championship. Schumacher just needs to get lucky.


No offence to Rosberg or Massa but its hard to believe with such underwhelming performances they have so many points !





#744 onemoresolo

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 19:55

To me the dry FP3 gives the most telling indication of speed



1 M. Webber Red Bull 1:33.542 17

2 L. Hamilton McLaren 1:33.559 14

3 S. Vettel Red Bull 1:33.587 17

4 F. Alonso Ferrari 1:33.751 19

5 M. Schumacher Mercedes Grand Prix 1:33.992 15

6 N. Rosberg Mercedes Grand Prix 1:34.090 13

7 J. Button McLaren 1:34.113 16

8 F. Massa Ferrari 1:34.174 15



Why? Because it's the one session so far that Rosberg wasn't faster in?

#745 arknor

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 20:01

Why? Because it's the one session so far that Rosberg wasn't faster in?

clearly, no real indication of speed can be known until schumacher and rosberg have clear air in race conditions something schumacher has failed to have in the last 2 races.

i expect in reality they are super close in pace and they would probably trade lap times in a duel with noone having a clear advantage.

towards the end of the season we will know FOR SURE who is the fastest of the two.

right now its to hard to judge but fanboys will try regardless

#746 1amiga

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 20:14


Because FP3 is when all the teams do there qualifying sims.

It just happened MS is marginally ahead - thats similar speed as its so close.



#747 Sakae

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 20:50

at Ferrari MS had everything going for him:
- car built for him (...not for his team mate)
- team mate driving for him (see austria debacle)
- team strategies for him (with his team mate being the guinea pig)
- team built around him (...not around the team mate)
- exclusive reliability (... consistent reliability glitches for his team mates)

Really a position of supreme luxury... that probably to this extend was never granted to any other driver in F1 history.
However, he was also worth every dollar... I think never has there been a race driver that drove so many KMs, stayed for days at Maranello.
Schumacher-Ferrari was the perfect symbiosis

So this whole Mercedes experience is quite a change for MS... and maybe we'll see the best of MS again when all these things are back in place.


* btw: I guess that that's why Montezemolo is so pissed.... thinking "we gave him everything...EVERYTHING!!! Things that other teams would never give him....and then he turns his back on us to start promoting Mercedes sports cars... Mammamia!". And to make it even more insulting the car is red.

Derision without cause. Seek help.

#748 weston

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 21:58

at Ferrari MS had everything going for him:
- car built for him (...not for his team mate)
- team mate driving for him (see austria debacle)
- team strategies for him (with his team mate being the guinea pig)
- team built around him (...not around the team mate)
- exclusive reliability (... consistent reliability glitches for his team mates)

Really a position of supreme luxury... that probably to this extend was never granted to any other driver in F1 history.
However, he was also worth every dollar... I think never has there been a race driver that drove so many KMs, stayed for days at Maranello.
Schumacher-Ferrari was the perfect symbiosis

So this whole Mercedes experience is quite a change for MS... and maybe we'll see the best of MS again when all these things are back in place.


* btw: I guess that that's why Montezemolo is so pissed.... thinking "we gave him everything...EVERYTHING!!! Things that other teams would never give him....and then he turns his back on us to start promoting Mercedes sports cars... Mammamia!". And to make it even more insulting the car is red.


Proper premissa propositio is missing.

#749 Massa_f1

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Posted 04 April 2010 - 21:59

The Guy is not slow he has just been unlucky. If his races had gone to plan he wold be around Hamilton in the champinship standing no doubt about it.

#750 SeanValen

SeanValen
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Posted 04 April 2010 - 22:08

The Guy is not slow he has just been unlucky. If his races had gone to plan he wold be around Hamilton in the champinship standing no doubt about it.




Do you remember Austria and Hockenheim back to back races in 2000, MS out at the first corner in both races, bascially allowed back in Mika and Mclaren.
Those sort of races can be spread out in a season, happen at the start, middle or end, with 19 races, lots of competition, unless he's more unlucky, I think he should be due some finishes in the coming races.


Massa is leading the championship, but it doesn't seem as if he's been the main guy in the first 3 races, but he's finished, and that's important with these cars and rules. I think in a 19 race season, it's gotta be something like 200 points whoever wins the title, and everyone may have to worry about Rebdull if their pace and reliability stays true.