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#8201 Ramses1348

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 10:08

Examples please?


Hamilton canada 2008 (the red light was of course a brainfade, but how fortunate was it that he crashed into his title opponent instead of the bmw that was in front of him? :o )

:smoking:

Edited by Ramses1348, 23 December 2010 - 10:08.


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#8202 Jolkins

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 11:59

:wave:
Well it's almost a year now since I created my last video highlights that I posted here - Michael Schumacher - The Second Coming. Got great responses back then, so here's the newest one about Michael's 2010 season:


Enjoy!

Edited by Jolkins, 23 December 2010 - 12:00.


#8203 Frans

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 13:00

I would call Michael's performance of 2010 as short and simple as possible: "Being over taken is an Art."


:wave:

#8204 ivand911

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 13:14

:wave:
Well it's almost a year now since I created my last video highlights that I posted here - Michael Schumacher - The Second Coming. Got great responses back then, so here's the newest one about Michael's 2010 season:


Enjoy!

Thanks. I like it.
TopGear: Michael Schumacher Power Lap in Suzuki Liana
http://www.youtube.c...feature=related
:drunk: :eek: :lol:

Edited by ivand911, 23 December 2010 - 13:32.


#8205 cheapracer

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 17:24

You want to hear the whole list of Schumacher transgressions elaborated on one more time? How repetitive. Clearly you must take some (masochist? sadistic?) enjoyment in reading the actions of MS. Just glance through this thread and it´s in thousands of posts, there is enough mention of them.

I won´t take time to elaborate on them.


And once again my requests for the cheating and/or arrogant items goes unanswered.

What there is is mention a thousand times is "he's a cheat" and/or "he's arrogant".

I listed and must accept the official FIA moments of Jerez '97 and Monaco 2006 because they are recorded in history as official incidents but there must be many, many more because people keep saying it's so and again I say theres obviously so many it must be a breeze to list a bunch of them - so get to it.


#8206 cheapracer

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 18:03

Hardly ever means you accept that he has stepped over the mark then and on those occasions he has been let off very lightly. He is after all, the only driver on the grid to have deliberately crashed into an opponent.


The "only" driver besides Prost and Senna did you mean? The truth to DC's mid track antics in the wet at Spa knowing full well how fast MS was bearing down on him will only ever be known to DC. Hill in the Arrows pushing JV off the track at Hungary '97 wasn't pretty and theres a long list of drivers who didn't rightfully have to but knowingly should have conceded space to avoid accidents/incidents. Then theres all the incidents we don't see and the stupidity we do


If you drop the red mist and look at it openly theres more to the Jerez '97 incident than first meets the eye - had they not connected JV may have well ended off the track.

Amusing in a way, MS squeezed him hard enough into a mistake which may have been enough to wreck JV's race but then stupidly also turned into him and not only looked like a clown but helped push JV back onto the raceline! But be assured JV was traveling in a straight line in the wrong direction at impact and was heading offtrack. JV's tone at the podium interview was, not surprisingly, modest.

#8207 Clatter

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 20:14

The "only" driver besides Prost and Senna did you mean? The truth to DC's mid track antics in the wet at Spa knowing full well how fast MS was bearing down on him will only ever be known to DC. Hill in the Arrows pushing JV off the track at Hungary '97 wasn't pretty and theres a long list of drivers who didn't rightfully have to but knowingly should have conceded space to avoid accidents/incidents. Then theres all the incidents we don't see and the stupidity we do


If you drop the red mist and look at it openly theres more to the Jerez '97 incident than first meets the eye - had they not connected JV may have well ended off the track.

Amusing in a way, MS squeezed him hard enough into a mistake which may have been enough to wreck JV's race but then stupidly also turned into him and not only looked like a clown but helped push JV back onto the raceline! But be assured JV was traveling in a straight line in the wrong direction at impact and was heading offtrack. JV's tone at the podium interview was, not surprisingly, modest.


No that isn't what I meant. I didn't say Schumacher was the first or only, I said he was the only driver currently on the grid. And yes I agree there is more to Jerez97. Just like Oz94 his car was ailing and taking out his opponent the only way to retain his lead. The FIA let him get away with it in 94, and considering how light the punishment was in 97 I wonder what they would have done if JV had been unable to finish the race.

#8208 aditya-now

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 21:45

I listed and must accept the official FIA moments of Jerez '97 and Monaco 2006 because they are recorded in history as official incidents but there must be many, many more because people keep saying it's so and again I say theres obviously so many it must be a breeze to list a bunch of them - so get to it.


You must accept the official FIA moments?

Like everyone here on the board you surely have not always "accepted" the official FIA decisions and versions, like Schumacher´s punishment in Monaco 2010. Or Hamilton´s treatment in Spa 2008. So I am surprised that you must accept the "official FIA moments" when they suit your agenda.

Probably everyone who has different ideas about Adelaide 1994, Jerez 1997, Montreal 1998, Monaco 2006 (to name just the most notorious events) than the "official FIA" version is probably just a crazy conspiracy nut.

Edited by aditya-now, 23 December 2010 - 22:00.


#8209 Raelene

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Posted 23 December 2010 - 23:45

I wonder if Aditya-Now will give it a rest over the holiday season ;););)

#8210 aditya-now

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 01:46

I wonder if Aditya-Now will give it a rest over the holiday season ;););)


Sure, Raelene. Just go to http://forums.autosp...howtopic=140401 and leave your good thoughts and wishes there! :kiss:

#8211 SlateGray

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 01:54

You can back that up with facts of course.
I'll even help get you started, official incidents 1997 and 2006, now help us out with the other 13 years, I'll even accept incidents of arrogance in lieu of cheats - otherwise I'm calling you out as a trolling liar ......

Yeah I'm still waiting for all those "things" to be eleborated on - should be easy as so many people keep mentioning them.


Like taking candy from a baby!

A a partial lit of Schumacher's dirty deeds....

Britain 1994:
Disqualified and banned for two races after failing to take his stop-go penalty for overtaking on the warm-up lap.

Australia 1994:
Crashed into Damon Hill to ensure victory in the 1994 WDC!
With the world championship at stake, Schumacher's Benetton slid wide and into the wall while trying to stay ahead of title rival Damon Hill's Williams.
Schumacher rejoined the track with a damaged car and Hill, who had not seen the German's error, attemped to pass him at the next corner.
Schumacher turned in on the Williams, putting both cars out of the race and sealing his first world title.
Hill wrote in a subsequent book: "There are two things that set Michael apart from the rest of the drivers in Formula One - his sheer talent and his attitude.
I am full of admiration for the former, but the latter leaves me cold."


1994 season:
Suspect software found on the Benetton that Schumacher drove
There were several instances of cheating in the 1994 Formula One season One of the main allegations surrounded the Benetton team.
The team were alleged to have been using illegal software to their advantage in races
Ayrton Senna suspicious that the Benetton car was illegal

1994 season:
Cheating allegations reignited in the summer of 1994, after a refueling fire on Jos Verstappen's Benetton car at the German Grand Prix.
After an investigation by Intertechnique at Benetton's team factory,
the FIA revealed that the team had been using an illegal fuel valve, without a fuel filter, that pumped fuel into the car 12.5% faster than a normal, legal fuel valve that had a filter.

Belgium 1995:
Blocking moves lead to the introduction of the ‘one move’ agreement where drivers can only move once to prevent being overtaken
Schumacher's performance did not impress Hill after his defensive moves forced Hill to either back off or go off the track.
Schumacher claimed that he had only blocked Hill at the low-speed corners, but video evidence suggested that Schumacher had blocked Hill on some of the high speed corners, such as the Radillion and Blanchimont.
Hill later commented that "We had some pretty hairy moments and I am not satisfied with being driven into; I don't think that was acceptable.
That is all well and good but if it was meant on purpose I would be very upset, F1 cars are not go-karts.
I think there are some things which are acceptable and some things which are not."

Schumacher defended himself by agreeing that touching wheels in high-speed corners is "not acceptable" but added that at the speed he and Hill were doing, he thought it was acceptable.
Schumacher was given a one-race suspended ban for driving aggressively in order to stop Hill from passing.

Europe 1997:
Drove into Jacques Villeneuve in an attempt to secure the Drivers’ Championship.
“You’ve hit the wrong part of him my friend!,” said commentator Martin Brundle.
Sir Frank Williams put Villeneuve’s car on display to show the mark left by Schumacher’s tyre.
The German newspapers were among the many from across Europe that attacked Schumacher.
Bild said "Schumacher was to blame for the crash." "He played for high stakes and lost everything - the World Championship and his reputation for fair play.
There is no doubt that he wanted to take out Villeneuve".

The Frankfurter Allgemeine called him "a kamikaze without honor" and commented that the "monument is starting to crack because the foundations are faulty."
A German TV station asked fans for their views and received the views of 63,081 votes. 28% said they could not support Schumacher any longer.
In Italy there was widespread condemnation of Schumacher.
The daily newspaper Unita called for him to be fired by Ferrari. "Schumacher ought to face charges in a Spanish court for the grave deed he committed" it reported. "The driver covered himself, Ferrari and Italian sport as a whole with shame. We are waiting for Ferrari to announce that it is throwing out Michael Schumacher and hiring a new driver who is more intelligent, has more wisdom and a real sense of morality."
La Repubblica reported that "seeing a world title vanish after waiting 18 years is sad enough. But to see it go up in smoke with the move from Michael Schumacher is unfortunately much worse. It's shameful."
Gazzetta dello Sport said that if Ferrari had won the title it would have been "a title to hide" and said that it preferred to go on waiting for the day when "our passion for Ferrari has a happy ending."
Even La Stampa, the newspaper owned by the Agnelli family, which also controlled Ferrari, said "His image as a champion was shattered, like a glass hit by a stone."
In the British newspapers, Schumacher's manoeuvre against Damon Hill at the 1994 Australian Grand Prix was used as a comparison in many of the reports.
The Daily Mail reported that Schumacher had now "lost the last vestige of his reputation of being a sportsman"
and The Times wrote that Schumacher had "sacrificed his reputation by an act of such cynicism that it lost him the right to any sympathy."
Ferrari hosted a press conference on the Tuesday after Jerez during which Schumacher admitted that he had made a mistake but said it was a misjudgment rather than a deliberate attempt to take out Villeneuve. "I am human like everyone else and unfortunately I made a mistake," he said. "I don't make many but I did this time."

Britain 1998:
Wins the race in the pit lane by taking his stop–go penalty after crossing the finish line.
May be tecnecially legal but as is typical with Schumacher he was happy to win outside the bounderies of fair play

Canada 1998:
Forces Frentzen to leave the track by abruptly joining the racing line after a pit stop,
leading to the introduction of the pit lane exit line that cannot be crossed

Austria 2000:
Following a shunt, manoeuvres his car into a dangerous position in an attempt to get the race red-flagged and re-started

EUROPEAN GRAND PRIX 2001:
Even Ralf felt the sheer force of his dirt
Michael Schumacher made a poor start to the 2001 European Grand Prix at Germany's Nurburgring, while brother Ralf was much faster away in his Williams.
To stop his brother passing, Michael veered across the track at him, leaving Ralf with the choice of backing off or risk being forced into the wall.
He backed off.

Austria 2001:
Team-mate Rubens Barrichello forced by Ferrari to pull over to let Schumacher through on the last corner

Germany 2001:
Once again moves his car into a dangerous position in an attempt to get the race red-flagged — this time successfully

Austria 2002:

Barrichello again forced to let Schumacher pass on the final corner — this time for the win.
The spectators were furious. This leads to the “ban” on team orders

USA 2002:
A failed attempt at a “manufactured dead heat”.
Some say it is payback for Austria. Once again, the fans are furious — and of all places, the USA is the one place this should not happen

Europe 2003:
Successfully encourages track marshals to push his beached car back on to the race track
recklessly endangering the lives of said marshals for his own personal gain.

BRITISH GRAND PRIX 2003:
Trying to defend his position from Renault driver Fernando Alonso on the opening lap, Schumacher moved across on the Spaniard at the fastest part of the track.
Although Alonso did not back off, Schumacher continued to move across, forcing half the Renault on to the grass at 190mph.
He escaped punishment.

Australia 2005:
Yet again helped out by marshals who choose to ignore Nick Heidfeld who is also beached.

Monaco 2006:
Rascassegate
Again blocking track in the Q to try to gain advantage for himself
Outrage abounds and Schumacher is put to the back for the race start

Hungary 2010:
Schumacher's aggressive driving in attempting to prevent Barrichello from overtaking drew strong criticism from commentators and former drivers, including triple World Champion Niki Lauda and former Schumacher team-mates Eddie Irvine and Martin Brundle.
Triple World Champion Jackie Stewart commented "We are never more than a millimetre away from something awful happening and for Schumacher to do what he did with Rubens Barrichello is just inviting disaster. ... It was one of the most blatant abuses of another driver that I have seen. It is a terrible example from a man who has seven world titles, bully-boy tactics."
Schumacher publicly defended his actions after the race and in the Stewards' hearing. Derek Warwick, one of the stewards for the race, commented that Schumacher could have been shown the black flag, resulting in an instant disqualification, had there been more time left in the race for the stewards to review the video evidence

2011:
To be continued.... lets hope everyone escapes Schumachers tactics in good health


http://en.wikipedia.org
http://autosport.com
http://forums.autosport.com
http://www.pitpass.com
http://www.grandprix.com/
http://doctorvee.co....hael-schumacher
http://news.bbc.co.u...one/5024532.stm

Edited by SlateGray, 24 December 2010 - 12:57.


#8212 SpeedyS

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 02:12

Clearly to much time on your hands...

#8213 arknor

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 02:19

Clearly to much time on your hands...

half of those are rediculous... such as 1998 which DC admited to beeing stupid for slpowing on the racing line...

for a schumacher basher it was obviously schumachers fault regardless of what dc has said

#8214 cheapracer

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 06:10

for a schumacher basher it was obviously schumachers fault regardless of what dc has said


Or what Damon Hill has said since. What I find the most amusing is that the bulk of these incidents involve Schumacher being where? Oh thats right, in front of the other guy :lol:

Now all together guy's, lets spell "A L L E G E D".

Speedy, in contrary to another's post you don't have enough time on your hands prefering to read sensational headlines rather than sorting the truth even just for yourself.
Britain 1994 is where you should start since thats where you started from anyway.

I allege you're from Mars, prove me wrong Martian.


#8215 Diablobb81

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 07:29

Lol at SlateGray's list. :rotfl:

#8216 iakhtar

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 10:56

lol how sad is that

#8217 merschu

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 12:09

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:



#8218 SlateGray

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 12:25

half of those are rediculous... such as 1998 which DC admited to beeing stupid for slpowing on the racing line...


OK arknor I will give you that one, actually it was just thrown in among the real transgressions as a kind of red herring, I will remove it from the list.
Now I ask you which nine of the remaining nineteen sportsmanship failures do you classify as " rediculous" which is spelled ridiculous btw. Please tell us which nine and why you think so.

#8219 r4mses

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 12:42

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:


Is the woman in this spot some (former) racing driver as well?

Nice spot imo. Looking forward to more.

/EDIT: LOL, just seen the German version featuring Franz Beckenbauer instead of the woman. Mercedes-Benz.tv: TV-Spot "Sonntagsfahrer" Haha, great stuff :D

Edited by r4mses, 24 December 2010 - 12:48.


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#8220 SlateGray

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 12:53

Clearly to much time on your hands...


Took less then twenty minutes, which I grant you may seem like an eternity to spend on any posting, judging from the quality of content of many of the postings here that is.
Funny to see the poster that repeatedly asked for this list is now unable or unwilling to engage it.
Be careful what you wish for.

#8221 Yorkie

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 12:56

Hamilton canada 2008 (the red light was of course a brainfade, but how fortunate was it that he crashed into his title opponent instead of the bmw that was in front of him? :o )

:smoking:

Try again :rolleyes:

#8222 cheapracer

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 14:24

Funny to see the poster that repeatedly asked for this list is now unable or unwilling to engage it.
Be careful what you wish for.


You must be kidding IT'S XMAS EVE!!

I have had dinner watched a funny movie with my wife ("As good as it gets" with Jack Nicholson, great movie folks) while having a wine and hot peanuts. Just checking my emails before a walk along the river, will stop and get some BBQ off one of the street carts and have a beer - I got a life too, will get back to you when I have time again but it won't be tomorrow thats for sure :lol:

Merry Xmas guys, just a forum and just a bit of fun, turn the system off and get to your friends and family :wave: :up:;)

Edited by cheapracer, 24 December 2010 - 14:25.


#8223 Callisto

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 14:30

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:

Funny advert :up:

#8224 Beamer

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 14:46

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:

Mika == :cool: miss him....
:up:

#8225 PoliFanAthic

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 15:36

There's also one in German with Beckenbauer at the end.

#8226 aditya-now

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 17:39

OK arknor I will give you that one, actually it was just thrown in among the real transgressions as a kind of red herring, I will remove it from the list.
Now I ask you which nine of the remaining nineteen sportsmanship failures do you classify as " rediculous" which is spelled ridiculous btw. Please tell us which nine and why you think so.


Thanks for producing the list, SlateGray. It provides some perspective on the dimension of Schumacher´s special style...

Ask Nigel Roebuck about him! ;)

Nonetheless, a very special Merry Christmas to the man himself, Michael Schumacher, and to all the Schumacher fans, wherever they may be. And may 2011 turn out to be more competitive for Michael!

Edited by aditya-now, 24 December 2010 - 17:42.


#8227 arknor

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Posted 24 December 2010 - 18:43

OK arknor I will give you that one, actually it was just thrown in among the real transgressions as a kind of red herring, I will remove it from the list.
Now I ask you which nine of the remaining nineteen sportsmanship failures do you classify as " rediculous" which is spelled ridiculous btw. Please tell us which nine and why you think so.

94 on hill watch the videos notice how wildly hes trying to move the wheel to even get to the corner its obvious the wheels movement is having little impact on how the car turns.

hill also later in life said if he knew MS had just hit the wall he wouldnt have taken the risk he did so hill new it was a do or dive move in desperation.

i dont expect you to take it from the list anyway, tbh i dont have the the patience to debate on these forums anymore its a useless task everyone is of there own opinion and the more vocal ones in here will never change there stance even if they know they are wrong

btw was 95 swerving mentioned? i reckon your on about this which in my opinion is just awesome driving on schumachers part it doesnt look risky for either of them at all it reminds me of the old classic duels people love to talk about

Edited by arknor, 24 December 2010 - 18:45.


#8228 Clatter

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 01:18

hill also later in life said if he knew MS had just hit the wall he wouldnt have taken the risk he did so hill new it was a do or dive move in desperation.


Not sure how that in anyway excuses what MS did, but hindsight is a marvelous thing.


#8229 arknor

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 01:47

Not sure how that in anyway excuses what MS did, but hindsight is a marvelous thing.

.... did you even read my post ?
the steering on the benneton seems broken before he is at the corner watch how he rapidly moves the steering wheel and the car barely turns... yet aparently the cars steering suddenly works fine and he rams hill? people only see the few seconds in the clip where schumachers moving the steering wheel full lock ands assume hes ramming when its obvious the steering is barely working if u take notice of the whole clip

#8230 SpeedyS

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 02:44

Took less then twenty minutes, which I grant you may seem like an eternity to spend on any posting, judging from the quality of content of many of the postings here that is.
Funny to see the poster that repeatedly asked for this list is now unable or unwilling to engage it.
Be careful what you wish for.


Fair play for taking the time and the research, I should'nt mock.

Personally I think its time take a break, all has been said, there will be nothing new until Feb 1st so lets see what 2011 brings. If there is one thig for sure MS brings news, chat and debate. Looking forward to it.

Merry Christmas

#8231 Tarzaan

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 16:41

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:



Fuunny':)


PS:

Merry Christmas!

#8232 DoodoolTalla

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 16:48

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:

hahaha, the look on Michael's face is priceless!

#8233 Clatter

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 19:49

.... did you even read my post ?
the steering on the benneton seems broken before he is at the corner watch how he rapidly moves the steering wheel and the car barely turns... yet aparently the cars steering suddenly works fine and he rams hill? people only see the few seconds in the clip where schumachers moving the steering wheel full lock ands assume hes ramming when its obvious the steering is barely working if u take notice of the whole clip


Doesn't tie in with Schumachers excuse that he was trying to defend the corner. He never mentioned the steering not working, so revisionist excuses won't work.


#8234 FigJam

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Posted 26 December 2010 - 05:39

Michael Schumacher and Mika Häkkinen in a ad for Mercedes:


Nice :up:

Look forward to seeing how MS gets on in 2011. Will be a hot topic no doubt

#8235 cheapracer

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 04:46

Not sure how that in anyway excuses what MS did, but hindsight is a marvelous thing.


Doesn't tie in with Schumachers excuse that he was trying to defend the corner. rk.


A a partial lit of Schumacher's dirty deeds....

Britain 1994:

Australia 1994:
Crashed into Damon Hill to ensure victory in the 1994 WDC!
Schumacher turned in on the Williams, putting both cars out of the race and sealing his first world title.


Schumacher was in front and not only defended his line but was actually on his racing line, crashed into him or not isn't relevant, he was in front and is allowed to defend his position as hard as he wants too, the impetuous Hill took a chance and that chance failed when the door got (legally) closed on him. It was listed as a racing incident by the FIA luckily for Hill. (amusing that when Schumacher did the same thing to Senna that then it was clearly Schumacher's fault stated by the same people who say it wasn't Hill's fault).

If you believe that Schumacher doesn't have the right to defend his position and line while he is in front, please feel free to say so against the rules of motor racing and look like complete twits.

To quote that Schumacher did this to win the 1994 WDC is to be totally ignorant of the 1994 season in it's entirety (or convenience if you're anti MS) - I remind you that Hill had no chance at all of the WDC had it not been for very questionable and un-precedented 4 non-races for Schumacher, Hill had no hope (MS finished 2nd Britain and 1st in Spa on the road for example and it's reasonable to assume he would be top 3 in at least one of the other 2 races giving a reasonable guess'timate of some 20+points lost).


A a partial lit of Schumacher's dirty deeds....

Britain 1994:
Disqualified and banned for two races after failing to take his stop-go penalty for overtaking on the warm-up lap.


He did take his 'stop and go' you liar, possibly you didn't even watch the race and are trolling based on a bit of biased Googling? By the way, Wiki can be edited by anyone and often is to suit one's own agenda. Schumacher's page is edited and vandalisd so often it's not a good guide at all http://en.wikipedia....;action=history

The bottom line is that Hill in no way won the 1994 WDC, on track or morally and all this rubbish is about Hill fans desperately trying to dismiss Schumacher an everyway they can to justify Hill's shit 1994 performance (I actually like and respect Hill by the way). Schumacher/Benneton won 6 of 7 of races and then arrived at Britain..... here try some non pro Hill commentators for the race;
http://v.youku.com/v...MzMTg4MjM2.html
And don't forget to compare the Benneton's alleged LC quipped car to the Williams :rolleyes:
.

Edited by cheapracer, 27 December 2010 - 05:17.


#8236 aditya-now

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 23:36

hahaha, the look on Michael's face is priceless!


:up:

Indeed! Hopefully this does not foreshadow the 2011 season.... :lol:

At least it ties in with Ecclestones´ watch advertisement where Bernie is beaten black and blue. Didn´t know Michael was capable of the same self-irony...

Edited by aditya-now, 27 December 2010 - 23:37.


#8237 ivand911

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Posted 28 December 2010 - 08:15

hahaha, the look on Michael's face is priceless!

He deserve Oscar for his acting performance: "And the Oscar goes to Michael Schumacher for Sunday driver" :rotfl:


#8238 Clatter

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 00:19

Schumacher was in front and not only defended his line but was actually on his racing line, crashed into him or not isn't relevant, he was in front and is allowed to defend his position as hard as he wants too, the impetuous Hill took a chance and that chance failed when the door got (legally) closed on him. It was listed as a racing incident by the FIA luckily for Hill. (amusing that when Schumacher did the same thing to Senna that then it was clearly Schumacher's fault stated by the same people who say it wasn't Hill's fault).

If you believe that Schumacher doesn't have the right to defend his position and line while he is in front, please feel free to say so against the rules of motor racing and look like complete twits.

To quote that Schumacher did this to win the 1994 WDC is to be totally ignorant of the 1994 season in it's entirety (or convenience if you're anti MS) - I remind you that Hill had no chance at all of the WDC had it not been for very questionable and un-precedented 4 non-races for Schumacher, Hill had no hope (MS finished 2nd Britain and 1st in Spa on the road for example and it's reasonable to assume he would be top 3 in at least one of the other 2 races giving a reasonable guess'timate of some 20+points lost).




He did take his 'stop and go' you liar, possibly you didn't even watch the race and are trolling based on a bit of biased Googling? By the way, Wiki can be edited by anyone and often is to suit one's own agenda. Schumacher's page is edited and vandalisd so often it's not a good guide at all http://en.wikipedia....;action=history

The bottom line is that Hill in no way won the 1994 WDC, on track or morally and all this rubbish is about Hill fans desperately trying to dismiss Schumacher an everyway they can to justify Hill's shit 1994 performance (I actually like and respect Hill by the way). Schumacher/Benneton won 6 of 7 of races and then arrived at Britain..... here try some non pro Hill commentators for the race;
http://v.youku.com/v...MzMTg4MjM2.html
And don't forget to compare the Benneton's alleged LC quipped car to the Williams :rolleyes:
.


How Hill came to be in contention is totally and utterly irrelevant.

I'm quite happy for a driver to defend his line, but AFAIC that is not what happened. Schumacher had just crashed his car, it was crippled and he knew it. The only thing he could do to win the WDC was to take out his opponent and that's exactly what he did in a completely deliberate act. I thought that when watching it live, and I've seen nothing to change my mind from the numerous replays. The fact that the FIA failed to act was an utter disgrace, and was compounded by the non-punishment they issued in 97. I still believe they would have done nothing had JV not been able to finish the race.


#8239 ClubmanGT

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 00:43

How Hill came to be in contention is totally and utterly irrelevant.

I'm quite happy for a driver to defend his line, but AFAIC that is not what happened. Schumacher had just crashed his car, it was crippled and he knew it. The only thing he could do to win the WDC was to take out his opponent and that's exactly what he did in a completely deliberate act. I thought that when watching it live, and I've seen nothing to change my mind from the numerous replays. The fact that the FIA failed to act was an utter disgrace, and was compounded by the non-punishment they issued in 97. I still believe they would have done nothing had JV not been able to finish the race.


Perhaps you should take note of Hill's position when he attempts to dive inside Schumacher. He's got only one wheel on the track. There was never, ever a gap there and it's unfair to blame Michael for this, especially when he's already admitted he made a mistake in Jerez. Why keep Mum on Adelaide? The real disgrace was their conduct in previous races, and taking any further action against Schumacher would have exposed them to allegations of a witch hunt. Thus, when they should have taken action, they didn't, and when there was no action to take, they tried to ban him. Schumacher's pulled some silly stuff in his time, but when you look at Britain 1994 and Monaco 2010, he's also been on the receiving end of some incredibly shit officiating.

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#8240 Clatter

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 00:59

Perhaps you should take note of Hill's position when he attempts to dive inside Schumacher. He's got only one wheel on the track. There was never, ever a gap there and it's unfair to blame Michael for this, especially when he's already admitted he made a mistake in Jerez. Why keep Mum on Adelaide? The real disgrace was their conduct in previous races, and taking any further action against Schumacher would have exposed them to allegations of a witch hunt. Thus, when they should have taken action, they didn't, and when there was no action to take, they tried to ban him. Schumacher's pulled some silly stuff in his time, but when you look at Britain 1994 and Monaco 2010, he's also been on the receiving end of some incredibly shit officiating.


He only admitted Jerez because the attempt failed, and even then he initially denied it. It's pretty obvious why he would keep quite about Oz. Many drivers have been on the end of crap officiating, but that's a different argument and does not constitute a valid excuse for deliberately crashing into your opponent.


#8241 arknor

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 01:30

He only admitted Jerez because the attempt failed, and even then he initially denied it. It's pretty obvious why he would keep quite about Oz. Many drivers have been on the end of crap officiating, but that's a different argument and does not constitute a valid excuse for deliberately crashing into your opponent.

oz is not a ram attempt watch the video... you cant relate steering wheel movement to the cars turning something is broken after the wall look at the rapid wheel movement and barely anything is happening with the front wheels then when the car comes to the corner it doesnt even seem to try and go around the corner yet aparently it rammed into hill? seriously watch the video

Edited by arknor, 29 December 2010 - 01:31.


#8242 cheapracer

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 03:56

How Hill came to be in contention is totally and utterly irrelevant.

I'm quite happy for a driver to defend his line, but AFAIC that is not what happened. Schumacher had just crashed his car, it was crippled and he knew it. The only thing he could do to win the WDC was to take out his opponent and that's exactly what he did in a completely deliberate act. I thought that when watching it live, and I've seen nothing to change my mind from the numerous replays. The fact that the FIA failed to act was an utter disgrace, and was compounded by the non-punishment they issued in 97. I still believe they would have done nothing had JV not been able to finish the race.


No it's totally relevant to a driver's attitude to a situation, they are not robots and your sentence is far from any reality I know even as simple as someone pushes in front of me in a line - payback is a bitch.

You're quite happy for a driver to defend his line as long as it's not Michael Schumacher is what you mean and the fact that the FIA failed to act is only a disgrace because a/ it was Michael Schumacher and b/ it doesn't agree with your stance.

Compounded? The fact that you want to relate incidences AFTER what aggrieve's you is a sign of desperate clutching for straws, courts of laws only accept precedents, not something that hasn't happened yet and then only for the severity of the sentence.

The undisputable fact remains that MS was in front and on his line and the fact that he used that to his advantage was his right and prerogative as it is for any driver in front.

See this is why I win this argument everytime, I post the same factual stuff consistently and you guys post rants entirely based on your opinions.

I'll keep winning and you keep throwing the fingers, hmmm what does that remind me of

Posted Image

Edited by cheapracer, 29 December 2010 - 03:58.


#8243 404KF2

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 04:24

Too bad he's past it. I mean, really. Every sport needs a Darth Vader. It was definitely more interesting when Schumi was competitive.

#8244 ClubmanGT

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 04:39

Many drivers have been on the end of crap officiating, but that's a different argument and does not constitute a valid excuse for deliberately crashing into your opponent.


I was referring to why the FIA couldn't really do anything.

I also love how people fail to bring up the incidents where Hill punted off Schumacher in 1995.

#8245 cheapracer

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 05:31

I also love how people fail to bring up the incidents where Hill punted off Schumacher in 1995.


Oh I am coming to that and especially Spa 1995 ....


#8246 ivand911

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 07:57

In the end the best man won in 1994. Simple.

#8247 aditya-now

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 09:37

In the end the best man won in 1994. Simple.


In the end the best man died in 1994. Ask Michael.


#8248 ivand911

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 09:45

In the end the best man died in 1994. Ask Michael.

I mean, when was time for winning Championship he was the best in 1994. Or after Imola he was the best, not that he didn't won all races in 1994 before that. :) But,when it is for Senna , only good or nothing.


#8249 aditya-now

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 10:01

I mean, when was time for winning Championship he was the best in 1994. Or after Imola he was the best, not that he didn't won all races in 1994 before that. :) But,when it is for Senna , only good or nothing.


Remember how Michael started crying in the press conference when he had won 41 races like Ayrton.


#8250 Clatter

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Posted 29 December 2010 - 10:41

No it's totally relevant to a driver's attitude to a situation, they are not robots and your sentence is far from any reality I know even as simple as someone pushes in front of me in a line - payback is a bitch.

You're quite happy for a driver to defend his line as long as it's not Michael Schumacher is what you mean and the fact that the FIA failed to act is only a disgrace because a/ it was Michael Schumacher and b/ it doesn't agree with your stance.

Compounded? The fact that you want to relate incidences AFTER what aggrieve's you is a sign of desperate clutching for straws, courts of laws only accept precedents, not something that hasn't happened yet and then only for the severity of the sentence.

The undisputable fact remains that MS was in front and on his line and the fact that he used that to his advantage was his right and prerogative as it is for any driver in front.

See this is why I win this argument everytime, I post the same factual stuff consistently and you guys post rants entirely based on your opinions.

I'll keep winning and you keep throwing the fingers, hmmm what does that remind me of

Posted Image


If you think that you win the argument based on "it's all right to crash as he was in front" then there is no point in discussing it any further.