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#801 robracer

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 10:14

Robracer

He's been racing for over 30 years with one eye and in that time he's only had one bad accident. He is allowed to race as he passes the required medical each year

Like other disabled racers you learn to adapt


Fair enough, I did ask. But to me a 72 year old who's blind in one eye competing in motorracing just sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. Just my opinion.

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#802 Sakae

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 12:17

A bit OT, but ability to drive/race/fly, whatever, say control a machinery is not rested on person's chronological age. It's just that age is associated with body deterioration, and we are not all in the same conditions, even if having the same birthday. I admit that it is remarkable that this man is ambitious enough to undertake such activity. Event organizers will take care of decision who should or shoudn't. Good luck to him. :)


________

Miki then at 41 has a chance then. !!

#803 Johny Bravo

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 12:58

But apart from that, notice how Schumacher has been getting magnificent starts this year? His reflexes are definitely not an issue.


Uhh, tssshh, don't say that!... He should be having problems without TC/LC. They said so...;)


#804 Disgrace

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 13:02

Oh and its important to remember that Alain Prost returned from a Sabbatical after 18 months off and destroyed Damon Hll in the first 4 races of 1993. 18 months is not 3 years and Hill was quite inexperienced - but time off should not be an excuse that stands for long.


He was basically a rookie. He qualified for only two races in 1992. There can be no comparison...

#805 jimm

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 03:28

A doctor who is personal trainer of Sebastien Vettel said that when driver is more than 30 he has lower level with some physical areas that are important to driver. He took an example from badmington and tennis in which all the very best players are younger than 32 year old. Nowadays you don't see 35+ guys winning grand slams. Vettel's personal trainer said that slight physical degradation strarts at the age of 30.



Feel like i have to answer this. First, it was always rare for men to win grandslams in thier 30s. Agassi did it fairly recently. Part of the issue with tennis is injuries that mount up over time. Some players last longer because thier style or thier conditioning or just luck allow them to last longer.

The physical decline that begins at 30 is questionable. It is true that if you compare the average 20 yr old to an average 30 yr old, they have more muscle and bone mass....but how active are most "average" 30 yr olds who have jobs, kids etc compared to 20 yr olds who go mountain biking or pickup games of basketball etc on the weekends or go to the gym so they look good for girls etc. Furthermore, most of the comparisons are against a golden standard of physiology established 50 yrs ago on studies done on medical students who averaged 5ft 9 in tall and ave wt ~150.

There is a center in florida that tests racing drivers...some more than once as they aged. Relfex response times do not signficantly decline over time. The fitness levels are the other physcial ability that could decline but I can tell you in practice (I am a resident in a well known hospital system) there are plenty of 40+ yr olds with resting heart rates in the 40s (a good indication of cardiovascular conditioning).

Really, for someone like MS who has kept his conditioning likely has no physical issues. I think the older drivers loose motivation that makes them push the limits.

Addiionally, they may start to have issues with refocusing speed. As we age the lens in your eyes becomes less elastic and harder to pull or relax into shape as you look from far and near objects. This could interfere with looking back and forth from the inside the cockpit and the out to the track.

Bottom line, MS's biggest issue is that he has not been around for the changes that have been made to the tires and cars, he has been out of the game so those little things that are worth a few hundreths here and there don't come second nature like they once did and he has new people to work with (not to mention a wife that from what has been said is pissed he is racing again)....he also has arguably stiffer competition than when he retired. These are probably bigger issues than his age.

#806 Galko877

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 06:28

I'd like to throw one more thing in the mix:

In the 2000 January issue of F1 Racing there was a very good interview that Damon Hill did with Schumacher.

And they talk about Hill's problems of adapting to the car in 1999 and then it's Schumacher who brings up the age factor and says: maybe the older you get, the harder it is to adapt to new things. And, he adds, that's why the time of young drivers always comes. And Hill agrees and says: yeah, the new drivers don't know what it was like before and they only care about what's ahead of them - and that's another factor why they adapt more quickly.

And I think they have a point. Age maybe doesn't necessarily affect physical condition and maybe not even reflexes in a very significant way (although there I think it does have an affect). But it does affect adaptibility. Adapting quicker than anyone else was always one of the big strenghts of Michael, so it's a bit surprising he is struggling exactly there now. Maybe that's what aging has brought with itself, maybe a 10 year younger Schumacher wouldn't find it so difficult to adapt to these cars.

Edited by Galko877, 09 April 2010 - 06:29.


#807 arknor

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 08:22

I'd like to throw one more thing in the mix:

In the 2000 January issue of F1 Racing there was a very good interview that Damon Hill did with Schumacher.

And they talk about Hill's problems of adapting to the car in 1999 and then it's Schumacher who brings up the age factor and says: maybe the older you get, the harder it is to adapt to new things. And, he adds, that's why the time of young drivers always comes. And Hill agrees and says: yeah, the new drivers don't know what it was like before and they only care about what's ahead of them - and that's another factor why they adapt more quickly.

And I think they have a point. Age maybe doesn't necessarily affect physical condition and maybe not even reflexes in a very significant way (although there I think it does have an affect). But it does affect adaptibility. Adapting quicker than anyone else was always one of the big strenghts of Michael, so it's a bit surprising he is struggling exactly there now. Maybe that's what aging has brought with itself, maybe a 10 year younger Schumacher wouldn't find it so difficult to adapt to these cars.

ofcourse adapting gets harder because you already have strong views and an understanding you didnt have when you were young which makes you less willing to try different things or to learn new ways not just in formula one but in every profession , even daily chores around the house you do them like you were taught when you were young regardless of wether its the best way or not.

which is why your wife my nag when you try to help her because something isnt "folded properly" , "the hoover isnt put away right", "you leave suds in the sink" the curtains arent how she likes them"

Edited by arknor, 09 April 2010 - 08:23.


#808 DaleCooper

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 08:37

I'd like to throw one more thing in the mix:

In the 2000 January issue of F1 Racing there was a very good interview that Damon Hill did with Schumacher.

And they talk about Hill's problems of adapting to the car in 1999 and then it's Schumacher who brings up the age factor and says: maybe the older you get, the harder it is to adapt to new things. And, he adds, that's why the time of young drivers always comes. And Hill agrees and says: yeah, the new drivers don't know what it was like before and they only care about what's ahead of them - and that's another factor why they adapt more quickly.

And I think they have a point. Age maybe doesn't necessarily affect physical condition and maybe not even reflexes in a very significant way (although there I think it does have an affect). But it does affect adaptibility. Adapting quicker than anyone else was always one of the big strenghts of Michael, so it's a bit surprising he is struggling exactly there now. Maybe that's what aging has brought with itself, maybe a 10 year younger Schumacher wouldn't find it so difficult to adapt to these cars.



He is struggling in as much as he starts the season on Rosberg's level. That is how his impressive adaptability has already helped him. It should only get better from there.


Cooper

#809 Chiara

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 11:30

http://www.f1sa.com/...c...&Itemid=157

F1 : Norbert Haug denies Michael Schumacher could end Formula 1 comeback
Source - GMM
Friday, 09 April 2010 08:04


Norbert Haug has played down suggestions that Michael Schumacher's return to Formula One might be short lived.

Prior to coming out of a three year retirement last month, the seven time World Champion inked a contract with Mercedes tying him to the German marque until the end of 2012.

But 41-year-old Schumacher has so far failed to outpace his younger team-mate Nico Rosberg, lags his German compatriot in the drivers' table by 26 points, and has yet to qualify higher than 7th or better his 6th place finish in Bahrain.

#810 Owen

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 11:34

The longer MS under performs, the more this kind of speculation will be fueled I guess.

#811 ivand911

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 11:40

It is really hard to perform if you are not in the race.

#812 kar

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 12:17

Source - GMM


End transmission.

#813 Massa_f1

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 13:02

http://www.f1sa.com/...c...&Itemid=157

F1 : Norbert Haug denies Michael Schumacher could end Formula 1 comeback
Source - GMM
Friday, 09 April 2010 08:04


"The true fans are experts and know exactly what has happened so far and why there is the points deficit."



Yes we do know what has happened so far and that is that Schumacher has not had a problem free race since Bahrain. Resulting in a loss of at least 10 points. Judge the guy on his finishes not his DNF's and broken front wings.

#814 J

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 19:22

Thank you for your very informative post.

-J

Feel like i have to answer this. First, it was always rare for men to win grandslams in thier 30s. Agassi did it fairly recently. Part of the issue with tennis is injuries that mount up over time. Some players last longer because thier style or thier conditioning or just luck allow them to last longer.

The physical decline that begins at 30 is questionable. It is true that if you compare the average 20 yr old to an average 30 yr old, they have more muscle and bone mass....but how active are most "average" 30 yr olds who have jobs, kids etc compared to 20 yr olds who go mountain biking or pickup games of basketball etc on the weekends or go to the gym so they look good for girls etc. Furthermore, most of the comparisons are against a golden standard of physiology established 50 yrs ago on studies done on medical students who averaged 5ft 9 in tall and ave wt ~150.

There is a center in florida that tests racing drivers...some more than once as they aged. Relfex response times do not signficantly decline over time. The fitness levels are the other physcial ability that could decline but I can tell you in practice (I am a resident in a well known hospital system) there are plenty of 40+ yr olds with resting heart rates in the 40s (a good indication of cardiovascular conditioning).

Really, for someone like MS who has kept his conditioning likely has no physical issues. I think the older drivers loose motivation that makes them push the limits.

Addiionally, they may start to have issues with refocusing speed. As we age the lens in your eyes becomes less elastic and harder to pull or relax into shape as you look from far and near objects. This could interfere with looking back and forth from the inside the cockpit and the out to the track.

Bottom line, MS's biggest issue is that he has not been around for the changes that have been made to the tires and cars, he has been out of the game so those little things that are worth a few hundreths here and there don't come second nature like they once did and he has new people to work with (not to mention a wife that from what has been said is pissed he is racing again)....he also has arguably stiffer competition than when he retired. These are probably bigger issues than his age.


Edited by J, 09 April 2010 - 19:22.


#815 Owen

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 19:31

At what point will he knock this comeback on the head and enjoy retirement?
Or will he stick with it for another 3 years?
I guess he decides.

#816 Les

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 19:34

ofcourse adapting gets harder because you already have strong views and an understanding you didnt have when you were young which makes you less willing to try different things or to learn new ways not just in formula one but in every profession , even daily chores around the house you do them like you were taught when you were young regardless of wether its the best way or not.

which is why your wife my nag when you try to help her because something isnt "folded properly" , "the hoover isnt put away right", "you leave suds in the sink" the curtains arent how she likes them"


Well I think that may be the case. Whatever the spin 'my comeback is going to plan' that is not the same Michael Schumacher that we seen in his heyday. The next couple of races will be crucial. If he is not up to speed (what we would expect from him) by Barcelona then I feel he is unlikely to ever be.


#817 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 19:44

At what point will he knock this comeback on the head and enjoy retirement?
Or will he stick with it for another 3 years?
I guess he decides.



Well I hope he lasts at least until Montreal so I can jeer at him in person.

And even better, maybe he could plant his car into Champions Wall and then decide to quit. That would be a fitting way to end it.

#818 2ms

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 19:46

Feel like i have to answer this. First, it was always rare for men to win grandslams in thier 30s. Agassi did it fairly recently. Part of the issue with tennis is injuries that mount up over time. Some players last longer because thier style or thier conditioning or just luck allow them to last longer.

The physical decline that begins at 30 is questionable. It is true that if you compare the average 20 yr old to an average 30 yr old, they have more muscle and bone mass....but how active are most "average" 30 yr olds who have jobs, kids etc compared to 20 yr olds who go mountain biking or pickup games of basketball etc on the weekends or go to the gym so they look good for girls etc. Furthermore, most of the comparisons are against a golden standard of physiology established 50 yrs ago on studies done on medical students who averaged 5ft 9 in tall and ave wt ~150.

There is a center in florida that tests racing drivers...some more than once as they aged. Relfex response times do not signficantly decline over time. The fitness levels are the other physcial ability that could decline but I can tell you in practice (I am a resident in a well known hospital system) there are plenty of 40+ yr olds with resting heart rates in the 40s (a good indication of cardiovascular conditioning).

Really, for someone like MS who has kept his conditioning likely has no physical issues. I think the older drivers loose motivation that makes them push the limits.

Addiionally, they may start to have issues with refocusing speed. As we age the lens in your eyes becomes less elastic and harder to pull or relax into shape as you look from far and near objects. This could interfere with looking back and forth from the inside the cockpit and the out to the track.

Bottom line, MS's biggest issue is that he has not been around for the changes that have been made to the tires and cars, he has been out of the game so those little things that are worth a few hundreths here and there don't come second nature like they once did and he has new people to work with (not to mention a wife that from what has been said is pissed he is racing again)....he also has arguably stiffer competition than when he retired. These are probably bigger issues than his age.


Things like sex hormone levels along with growth hormone levels etc are way lower in 30s vs 20s. Nothing like as much lower as they are by your 70s, of course, but enough different that very significant effects. When you read about guys in their 30s, 40s getting HRT they talk about things like getting their "edge" back and feeling incredibly revitalized. Recovery from everything, even things like hangovers, is apparently way higher when people bring their various hormone levels back up to normal for 20-something. Just thought I'd point out that there is mental component to effects of physiological changes that occur with age. Hell, I feel major differences myself from only a few years ago as far as various drives and types of quickness, sharpness, etc and I'm only starting my 30s. And I'm very active and health oriented.


#819 jimm

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Posted 10 April 2010 - 05:35

Things like sex hormone levels along with growth hormone levels etc are way lower in 30s vs 20s. Nothing like as much lower as they are by your 70s, of course, but enough different that very significant effects. When you read about guys in their 30s, 40s getting HRT they talk about things like getting their "edge" back and feeling incredibly revitalized. Recovery from everything, even things like hangovers, is apparently way higher when people bring their various hormone levels back up to normal for 20-something. Just thought I'd point out that there is mental component to effects of physiological changes that occur with age. Hell, I feel major differences myself from only a few years ago as far as various drives and types of quickness, sharpness, etc and I'm only starting my 30s. And I'm very active and health oriented.



What do you mean by "sex hormones"? Testosterone (male androgen)? There are two competeing studies. One shows it peaking between 35-45 and another around 30. In neither study is it significantly different (in other words, differences could be accounted for by chance and likely not physiologcially significant) until much older.

I know the new pop medical rage is to "replace" testosterone in men and even women. If you are considering it you should know it accelerates the curses of old age for men....balding, benign prostatic hypertrophy and atherosclerosis/heart disease. I feel the benefits for most people may out way the gain. Especially since most have crappy diets and get little real exercise....Those who actually eat a good balanced diet and get the right kind of exercise (heart rate 120-140 x 30 min at least 3 days/wk with 2-3 days of weight bearing exercise) typically have simlar energy levels as those who are younger.



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#820 VoRteX

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Posted 10 April 2010 - 12:53

Some are trying to make a controversy out of Schumacher being behind Nico in the standings.
Obviously Michael would rather be ahead himself, but is it such a big deal for him? i seriously doubt so.

Here's my view:
Schumacher debuted in '91 thanks to Mercedes management. (Nico was age 6 at that time lol)
It was then that all started. Schumacher is thankful about their vouching for him at the time and wants to finish his career with them(and develop a winning car with Ross Brawn AGAIN! this is most relevant).
Nobody can take his F1 megachampion leyend status off him. So i disagree about him having much to loose and little to win.

He seems to feel confortable and at home in the team.
Nico admires Michael and is very lucky. His is the best possible teammate to learn from.
Michael is probably proud of his talented countryman Nico in some unusual father-son way. But no doubt Michael has full authority over the situation.
Its only good vibes i get from this team.


Interesting quotes:
http://www.guardian....macher-mercedes

..."Michael is, for me, quite remarkable," said Fry. "The level of feedback he gives is something that I have never seen before, and is just not in the debriefs. When you have the headphones on you hear amazing things. In qualifying he was driving around almost giving a commentary"....


i want so see those qual laps so much!! :eek:


#821 Szoelloe

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Posted 10 April 2010 - 14:42

Chris Dyer on MS some years ago:

"Working with Michael is easy. He is above all a nice guy and is always calm and level headed. He has a lot of experience and can remember any little problems that may have arisen at different circuits over the years. A sort of built-in data bank that he can draw upon and he knows the car's different systems so well that he can help analyze and solve any problems that might crop up during the weekends,"

"the pressure is enormous. It is not direct pressure from him, but because he works at such a high level, everyone who works with him is expected to work to that level too. We are used to winning and so is he, so that is our standard.' However, Dyer reckons that pressure is relieved by Schumacher’s command of every aspect of the sport. 'One of Michael’s strengths is that, apart from driving quickly, he has an understanding of the car and how all the systems work,' reveals the Australian. 'He can also analyse the cause of any problems, be it aerodynamics, set-up or traction control for example."

Dyer has also commented several times on MS's "live" feedback even during his fastest qualifiing laps.

"People always think that you've lost it when you don't have a good result"

Kimi Raikkonen

#822 hunnylander

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 16:58

I've made two digital paintings about Michael [and the Mercedes W01], you can grab them here.

#823 Dragonfly

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 18:03

I've made two digital paintings about Michael [and the Mercedes W01], you can grab them here.

Thanks, already on my desktop :)

#824 SeanValen

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 19:00

Chris Dyer on MS some years ago:

"Working with Michael is easy. He is above all a nice guy and is always calm and level headed. He has a lot of experience and can remember any little problems that may have arisen at different circuits over the years. A sort of built-in data bank that he can draw upon and he knows the car's different systems so well that he can help analyze and solve any problems that might crop up during the weekends,"

"the pressure is enormous. It is not direct pressure from him, but because he works at such a high level, everyone who works with him is expected to work to that level too. We are used to winning and so is he, so that is our standard.' However, Dyer reckons that pressure is relieved by Schumacher’s command of every aspect of the sport. 'One of Michael’s strengths is that, apart from driving quickly, he has an understanding of the car and how all the systems work,' reveals the Australian. 'He can also analyse the cause of any problems, be it aerodynamics, set-up or traction control for example."

Dyer has also commented several times on MS's "live" feedback even during his fastest qualifiing laps.

"People always think that you've lost it when you don't have a good result"

Kimi Raikkonen





I think the main problem for the returning Schumacher is the testing ban, it's never happened before in f1 in his career and I think if you need to prepare, then he's lost the ultimate preparation tool that was naturally there for him, think about the miles of testing he clocked up even prior to 2000 when ferrari didn't get extra test drivers they had after, MS usually spent nights at Enzo's house near the test track, he has anaylsed far less information one has needed too especially beeing away from the sport, so I don't think the old Schumacher would be enjoying the current rules, the current MS see's it as a challenge.


It would of been interesting to see what sort of laptimes MS could of done at Spain last year if he had come back to ferrari, with williams blocking his testing, so many things going against anyone returning to the sport, had the testing ban been delayed to say 2013/ he may have been alright, but this need to cost save has taken the whole of f1 into conversation and drive as less as possible please to save engines and moeny etc.. But on the plus side and it may be one of the reasons he's back, less testing means less jetting around and more time with his family, so maybe that's a incentive for him to his best catching up on gp weekends since there is no testing!

Edited by Buttoneer, 12 April 2010 - 13:54.


#825 ali.unal

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 19:19

I've made two digital paintings about Michael [and the Mercedes W01], you can grab them here.

Great job mate. Directly goes to my desktop :up:

#826 Muz Bee

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 21:21

I think the main problem for the returning Schumacher is the testing ban, it's never happened before in f1 in his career and I think if you need to prepare, then he's lost the ultimate preparation tool that was naturally there for him, think about the miles of testing he clocked up even prior to 2000 when ferrari didn't get extra test drivers they had after, MS usually spent nights at Enzo's house near the test track, he has anaylsed far less information one has needed too especially beeing away from the sport, so I don't think the old Schumacher would be enjoying the current rules, the current MS see's it as a challenge.


It would of been interesting to see what sort of laptimes MS could of done at Spain last year if he had come back to ferrari, with williams blocking his testing, so many things going against anyone returning to the sport, had the testing ban been delayed to say 2013/ he may have been alright, but this need to cost save has taken the whole of f1 into conversation and drive as less as possible please to save engines and moeny etc.. But on the plus side and it may be one of the reasons he's back, less testing means less jetting around and more time with his family, so maybe that's a incentive for him to his best catching up on gp weekends since there is no testing!

:up: One of the first reasons which doesn't come across like a desperate excuse. It is a different game with the lack of testing where improvements have to be achieved on race weekends. The quantity of work which Michael used to bring to Ferrari isn't possible and he will only be able to make tiny incremental improvements of his own input, the main part will be the engineering development "steps".


#827 RSNS

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 22:30


RE: Lack of testing
As Schumacher is providing a lot of input for the team, it is possible that he manages to develop the car to suit him (recall that he complained of not being able to drive the car on the throttle). When or if that happens he will probably be competitive again (he is competitive right now, but not on the level we were expecting).

#828 One

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 09:11

Lack of testing.

Besides Michael made a good start to the race for the last two. He was unfortunate to hit by other racing incidents. I am curious how he race without it.

For those who blames his age. Is the accident is partly due to his age and speed of reflections? No...

...



#829 soca

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 09:16

"It's very clear that Michael has not lost any of his skills," Stewart told the newspaper. "You don't just check out from the experience and knowledge that made him champion seven times.


http://en.espnf1.com...tory/14152.html

#830 One

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 09:28

Well I do not know, yet. I have to see it happening...

#831 Hacklerf

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 10:12

I feel, as the seasons moves forward we will see The Real Michael Schumacher, i am confident at the end of the year, he will have more points than Nico, he is learning again how to drive F1 again, the game has changed since he has been gone, but to show the speed he is showing already, is remarkable in my book

#832 whatto999

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 11:39

I've made two digital paintings about Michael [and the Mercedes W01], you can grab them here.


Thank you very much :up:

#833 Umpire

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 13:41

MS rejoins the GPDA. Link.

#834 Massa_f1

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 13:48

I have a feeling it dosent matter how he does this year he may well at least do 2 of his 3 years.

#835 cheapracer

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 14:14

I have a feeling it dosent matter how he does this year he may well at least do 2 of his 3 years.


I don't think so, did you see the jubilation of every one of his GP victories - I believe every lap/every race is important to him and he will be hard on himself until he gets to the best he can be again.


#836 SeanValen

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Posted 12 April 2010 - 23:30

I have a feeling it dosent matter how he does this year he may well at least do 2 of his 3 years.




I don't think so, did you see the jubilation of every one of his GP victories - I believe every lap/every race is important to him and he will be hard on himself until he gets to the best he can be again.




I remember forums before Japan 2000, especially around Austria/Hockenheim, when he went out at the first corner in both weekends, and what seemed like a sure thing to slip away come Hungary/September, back then especially with his broken leg in 1999, and 1998 Spa denting his points, the jerez 97 ending, ferrari in 1996 starting out, all these things meant pleging his life to ferrari until he won the title, if you remember the pressure on him at Monza in 2000, talking to his car morning of Japan 2000, that was his dream to win that title after many set backs, it kept getting longer, but so far he hasn't given up on his goals. There is something similar in terms of ambition with Mercedes to win with them, anything less then a title would mean unfinished business, in his mind he's already won it or it's waiting for him, 20 years or 3 years or 2 years or 1 year, to quote himself "I have alot of trust in myself."

With ferrari it was misson complete, but I think he's understated his will to win with mercedes, some people think he's a ferrari man forever still, but it's like a different life for him, it's in the past, and as he has said, mercedes he started off with, and it's like completing the circle to finish with them, and the fact Brawn is there, cements how important this extra unseen chapter, a unpredictable chapter is to MS, and unpredicable is the key word, no one saw him coming back almost to ferrari last year, no one saw mercedes coming, hell I even remembering the extreme doubts over the winter of his coming back, the pattern for MS usually is, if you doubt him, he'll surprise.

So many of those fools in 2005 thought he was too old suddenly because the tyre rules and ferrari got it wrong one year, he'll never challenge for the title again, some grey hair pops up in a f1 mag, fast forward in 2006, and he's winning races and going for the title and goes out with a bang in brazil 2006 leaving the audience hungary for more, putting on a show. MS is llike summer blockbuster action film fan fare and spring indie drama low key budget merry go around, some rain, win a race, superstar, a broken wing, more pitstops overtake slower cars but with bad aero, 1 point and suddenly it's a indie spring film low key event, it's the perception, Alonso thinks his malaysia drive this year was his best race but will be forgotten because of the result, maybe's he's right, the perception is too hard for the larger audience, but Schumacehr carries alot of belief, 3 decades of expectations, he's earned the privilage to have belivers in his prospects, infact no other driver has proved more then he has, yet after all those wins and achievements, it's still enough to create some believers, but that's the perception of f1, most drivers will lose patience from fans, but MS though has earned it more then others not to be written off as a major player in any f1 race, even after 3 years away, nothing short of brillance is demanded, then at any second, he'll perhaps find extra time on track and do something others can't. That's who he is, and like the post above, he won't stop punishing himself until he's back where he thinks he should be, it's been his life so far. Senna once said he expresses his character through racing, Schumacher is the same, his 1 point and overtaking in albert park was a petty battle considering where Michael has been and what he's achieved, but that was the challenge he had in albert park, not just the drivers, but the bad aero, the damaged car, the fact he's willing to fight for points and have satisfaction in achieving small victories like that is what makes him a force still, I still remember Monaco 2005, getting Ralf and Rubens at the end, or his drive in Monaco 2006 from the pitlane, maybe the penality was too severe to start from the pitlane, but his drive was full of venom. He does have a flack of getting stuck in and being persistent, he knows the true f1 fans are keeping eye on his drives even for small points.

Edited by SeanValen, 13 April 2010 - 00:01.


#837 ViMaMo

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 03:16

As the guy who wrote the lines above, let me put some things straight. I'm a big Schumacher fan and it wasn't by any means my intent to bash him. On the contrary - for being absent three years I think he has done an excellent job.

But fact is he was slower than his teammate and I tried to figure out why that was. Having no telemetry data available I could only do it by comparing the onboard videos of him and other drivers so I know the result can only be a guess. I never claimed it to be the absolute truth (and having seen some of the preposterous tinfoil-hat theories on this board I like to think it was at least a pretty straightforward guess).

And I'm sure MS will analyse things for himself and he doesn't need my help with it.


Id rather read your efforts than read 100 posts of rubbish one line squabbles.
Dont let the detractors distract you. :)

#838 aditya-now

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 03:39

But on the plus side and it may be one of the reasons he's back, less testing means less jetting around and more time with his family, so maybe that's a incentive for him to his best catching up on gp weekends since there is no testing!


That´s the consolation for die hard Schumacher fans, that Michael has more time now to spend with his family and less time jetting around. If he would have stayed in retirement right away he would have also had time to spend with this family....

It pains me, I have to say, although I never liked Michael. It is unbefitting of a great champion.

Especially what Nigel Roebuck et al are discussing ( http://www.motorspor...-audio-podcast/ ) is definitely true: that he has lost his aura, his invincibility. The one thing that made Schumacher a Schumacher. Now he appears to be a mere mortal. In hindsight the death of Senna has some grace, as Ayrton will remain in our memories with his aura intact, even if we remember the painful last pictures before the start in Imola...

Let´s hope Michael does come back!


anything less then a title would mean unfinished business, in his mind he's already won it or it's waiting for him, 20 years or 3 years or 2 years or 1 year, to quote himself "I have alot of trust in myself."


Well, in 20 years Michael will be 61...
He does not have the time anymore he had at Ferrari in 1996.
If you could compare it would mean he would win the title in 2014 at the mature age of 45...

Edited by aditya-now, 13 April 2010 - 03:48.


#839 Craven Morehead

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 05:42

I've made two digital paintings about Michael [and the Mercedes W01], you can grab them here.


super. I have my copies. :up:

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#840 1amiga

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 06:08


Not bad for an old timer

Out qualified Hamilton (2x) and Button (2x) , Alonso, Weber and Massa once. Considering they are in faster cars...

He hasn't spun in qualifying - always made the top ten - hasn't crashed into anyone during the race or weaved all over the track



#841 cheapracer

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 08:02

that he has lost his aura, his invincibility. The one thing that made Schumacher a Schumacher. Now he appears to be a mere mortal.


I'll keep repeating it, 2 and a bit races after a 3 year layoff at 41 years old and with no testing time available yet look at all the judgement calls.

I'll wait a few more races before passing judgment but I think what he has shown already isn't too shabby.

China has been good to him and I hope this weekend he will be closer yet, maybe very close to Rosberg - personally I still don't expect him to be faster or even "as fast" as Rosberg for the next couple.

I think the world will take notice though when/if he finds the 'sweet spot'.

Edited by cheapracer, 13 April 2010 - 08:32.


#842 BRK

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 08:17

This thread's stuck in a loop,same old criticism posted by the usual suspects-week after week,irrespective of whether anything's actually changed in the meantime. At least wait until a race weekend's here so you'd have some excuse to continue with the obsessive crap,goddamnit.

#843 ViMaMo

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 08:56

Give the champ atleast couple of races, why so eager to pound his status to ground?
Its a disease this instant glorification and impatient criticism.

#844 Juan Kerr

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 08:59

Its only the people that are failures themselves that would ever question people like Schumacher, hoping for failure to ease their own pain.

#845 rog

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 10:36

Not bad for an old timer

Out qualified Hamilton (2x) and Button (2x) , Alonso, Weber and Massa once. Considering they are in faster cars...

He hasn't spun in qualifying - always made the top ten - hasn't crashed into anyone during the race or weaved all over the track



I wouldn't call it out qualified when we consider the circumstances in the last Qualifying, it was more a mistake of their teams to not let them drive earlier with lighter rain. Same goes to Rosberg, his P3 was a bit lucky, their own pace isn't fast enough.

#846 merschu

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 11:05

I wouldn't call it out qualified when we consider the circumstances in the last Qualifying, it was more a mistake of their teams to not let them drive earlier with lighter rain. Same goes to Rosberg, his P3 was a bit lucky, their own pace isn't fast enough.


In the same way you have consider the circumstances in which Schumi was out-qualified by his teammate.

1) In Australia his quick qualifying lap in q3 was hampered unknowingly by Alonso.

2) In Malaysia his tires were not working when he tried to push on his last q3 lap.


I did this only to point out that anti-schumi people can and will look into circumstances when he out qualifies his competitors but won't look into the circumstance when he gets out-qualified..! Give that guy one good trouble free race weekend and then comment whether he has totally lost it or not.

Edited by merschu, 13 April 2010 - 11:07.


#847 Dragonfly

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 11:08

Its only the people that are failures themselves that would ever question people like Schumacher, hoping for failure to ease their own pain.

:up:
Short and clear.

#848 rog

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 11:10

In the same way you have consider the circumstances in which Schumi was out-qualified by his teammate.

1) In Australia his quick qualifying lap in q3 was hampered unknowingly by Alonso.

2) In Malaysia his tires were not working when he tried to push on his last q3 lap.



Sure, but you should know Rosberg was just faster in Melbourne and Malaysia by some tenths.


#849 CSquared

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 17:01

This thread's stuck in a loop,same old criticism posted by the usual suspects-week after week,irrespective of whether anything's actually changed in the meantime. At least wait until a race weekend's here so you'd have some excuse to continue with the obsessive crap,goddamnit.

What I find even more hilarious than the judgments that three races have shown he's lost it, are the constant predictions that he'll be quitting soon. Some people apparently don't know the first thing about Michael Schumacher or his history and yet, simultaneously, are so intimate with him so as to know his thoughts about the near future even before he's given any outward indication of them whatsoever.

#850 1amiga

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Posted 13 April 2010 - 19:39

I wouldn't call it out qualified when we consider the circumstances in the last Qualifying, it was more a mistake of their teams to not let them drive earlier with lighter rain. Same goes to Rosberg, his P3 was a bit lucky, their own pace isn't fast enough.


Weber and Rosberg exited the pits after - Hamilton, Button, Alonso, Massa - and they made it thru.