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#9901 Augurk

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 06:53

My recollection is different. Seemed to me that most of his fans shouted anyone down who thought he was too old, or past it, or simply out of the game for too long. So far his come back has been more or less what I expected.

I think it was pretty balanced at the time. I was cautious, didn't expect too much yet on the other hand thought "well if he believes he can do it who am I to say otherwise?". I don't recall people "shouting down". The tendency was more cautious / "(hope) he's (not) destroying his legacy".

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#9902 Augurk

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 06:58

Because he's still living off those said glory days and they're now coming back to haunt him in a way. Let's face it, Rosberg is not getting beat often and if there are any excuses thrown around they're all on the part of Schumacher - his F-duct or now DRS has been stuck for over a year now. :rolleyes:

There have been quite some excuses for lack of Schumacher's performance. But many have been clear to see to the naked eye. The DRS issue in China for instance, the f-duct issues last year, the absolutely horrible strategy calls in the majority of races last year, his chassis issues were clearly gone when he got a new chassis last year. I wouldn't be surprised if the same happens when he gets a new chassis this year, after all, he was also crashed into in AUS, yet still driving around with the same chassis.

But please don't tell me Rosberg has never used any excuses when he got beat. Heck, he even uses excuses when he isn't visibly a lot faster than MSC yet finishes in front.

Try to open your eyes to get a more balanced view. :up:


#9903 britishtrident

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 07:05

One cannot help but wonder if Nico Rosberg would be even quicker if he had a a more competitive guy in the number 2 driver seat.

#9904 ivand911

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 07:07

One cannot help but wonder if Nico Rosberg would be even quicker if he had a a more competitive guy in the number 2 driver seat.

Don't you know he(Nico) have own thread???? Or you are what you are. :rotfl:


#9905 Group B

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 07:39

But what has it to do with "THE NOW"???

cilurnum's post could easily be interpreted as MS never having any raw talent, which I imagine was what spacekid was addressing. The fact that said talent has faded over the last 6 or 7 years seems pretty indisputable.

#9906 Group B

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 07:42

One cannot help but wonder if Nico Rosberg would be even quicker if he had a a more competitive guy in the number 2 driver seat.

:rolleyes:
Cheap shot. He clearly has enough youthful hunger and challenge from chasing RB/Mac/Ferrari that he doesn't need motivating by an inter-team battle.

#9907 spacekid

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 09:35

Right then fellow Schumi fans, Barcelona coming up next. Now I really do see this as make or break for Michael. He looked great in testing there, the car should have the tecnhical gremlins worked out, and he was decent there last year. If he can't produce the goods this weekend I really don't see where we go from here. I am almost not looking forward to the race weekend. Lets keep everything crossed that Michael can show us all that he still deserves his place on the grid on merit alone!!!

#9908 Augurk

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 09:42

Right then fellow Schumi fans, Barcelona coming up next. Now I really do see this as make or break for Michael. He looked great in testing there, the car should have the tecnhical gremlins worked out, and he was decent there last year. If he can't produce the goods this weekend I really don't see where we go from here. I am almost not looking forward to the race weekend. Lets keep everything crossed that Michael can show us all that he still deserves his place on the grid on merit alone!!!

Got to agree. If it doesn't work this way I won't stop supporting him, but my hopes for any improvement will be gone. I'm hoping two things: 1. everything works and he won't be hindered by technical issues, 2. he delivers.

That should help him not be in the middle pack where (semi-)rookies can crash into them with their do-or-die moves. :)

Fingers crossed, and what an exciting weekend it will be.

#9909 Clatter

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:24

One cannot help but wonder if Nico Rosberg would be even quicker if he had a a more competitive guy in the number 2 driver seat.


One cannot help wondering why anyone truly thinks a drivers speed depends on who he is partnered with. NR is trying to challange those who are currently ahead of him, how MS is performing is just a bench mark, and doesn't make him drive slower.

#9910 puxanando

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:32

That should help him not be in the middle pack where (semi-)rookies can crash into them with their do-or-die moves. :)

:well: Than is the danger that HE will crash the top drivers when he is more in the front......

#9911 Bonaventura

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:34

:well: Than is the danger that HE will crash the top drivers when he is more in the front......

You don't trust the top drivers much

#9912 puxanando

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:55

You don't trust the top drivers much


I don't trust Schumi! :stoned:
look here......

Edited by puxanando, 16 May 2011 - 10:56.


#9913 ivand911

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 10:57

With big updates they will bring I am not sure there won't be technical problems. But, maybe one time he will be lucky with that. Because for me after seventh title he run seriously out of any luck. I think car behaviour on the track will be very different if they put all this updates. So , a lot of testing will be involved. They can move forward there or go back, will see. If they have Turkey car there I would agree that all depend on him now. He better deliver this time, or we will have hard 3-4 hours after the race, in this forum. :rotfl: Guys, don't go down.
What his legacy means? He is not freedom fighter, he is F1 world champion, he will not resolve World hunger. He have one life and better spend it the way he want. Better leave legacy thing to Senna. Better go there and try challenge young boys(and some not so young) instead to sorry about never trying that. I don't care about his legacy, he have enough money to not think about that. If he was thinking about that he would be too scared to come back. And he is not coming last in the races. If he was so slow and Virgin and HRT beat him I agree ,he past it. But, it is not the case. He get last time in Q3, have some clash with Petrov get 12th behind Ferrari. So , not biggie. Yeah, for sure if you get into Q3 you need to retire. You are useless. I need to remember that.

#9914 spacekid

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:03

With big updates they will bring I am not sure there won't be technical problems. But, maybe one time he will be lucky with that. Because for me after seventh title he run seriously out of any luck. I think car behaviour on the track will be very different if they put all this updates. So , a lot of testing will be involved. They can move forward there or go back, will see. If they have Turkey car there I would agree that all depend on him now. He better deliver this time, or we will have hard 3-4 hours after the race, in this forum. :rotfl: Guys, don't go down.
What his legacy means? He is not freedom fighter, he is F1 world champion, he will not resolve World hunger. He have one life and better spend it the way he want. Better leave legacy thing to Senna. Better go there and try challenge young boys(and some not so young) instead to sorry about never trying that. I don't care about his legacy, he have enough money to not think about that. If he was thinking about that he would be too scared to come back. And he is not coming last in the races. If he was so slow and Virgin and HRT beat him I agree ,he past it. But, it is not the case. He get last time in Q3, have some clash with Petrov get 12th behind Ferrari. So , not biggie. Yeah, for sure if you get into Q3 you need to retire. You are useless. I need to remember that.


Hmmmm. Well as far as I know the updates will be aero bits. What I mean is hopefully the KERS and DRS activation bugs will be all ironed out. The team have certainly had enough time to get on top of it.

Its not a case of if Michael isn't on it he should retire. But at some point we have to accept he has lost his mojo forever, and for me I think this will be a huge weekend. I really did think after the Barcelona test session a corner had been turned and he was finding some of his old pace again. If it isnt there this weekend its never coming back, and I think he will have to fight harder to justify his place on the grid on merit. Being slower than Nico is no disgrace - Nico is a great driver - but is it really good enough for Michael?

#9915 ivand911

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:08

Hmmmm. Well as far as I know the updates will be aero bits. What I mean is hopefully the KERS and DRS activation bugs will be all ironed out. The team have certainly had enough time to get on top of it.

Its not a case of if Michael isn't on it he should retire. But at some point we have to accept he has lost his mojo forever, and for me I think this will be a huge weekend. I really did think after the Barcelona test session a corner had been turned and he was finding some of his old pace again. If it isnt there this weekend its never coming back, and I think he will have to fight harder to justify his place on the grid on merit. Being slower than Nico is no disgrace - Nico is a great driver - but is it really good enough for Michael?

I hear different things about updates ,we will see. But if this include Renault FEE, this is big update. Maybe new floor, sidepods, new cooling, new engine cover. They also said about suspension changes. Check MGP thread.

I don't trust Schumi! :stoned:
look here......

I need to see last year Abu Dhabi episode. If they have one.
Edit: I see it , it was great.

Edited by ivand911, 16 May 2011 - 11:14.


#9916 rommel

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:11

Right then fellow Schumi fans, Barcelona coming up next. Now I really do see this as make or break for Michael. He looked great in testing there, the car should have the tecnhical gremlins worked out, and he was decent there last year. If he can't produce the goods this weekend I really don't see where we go from here. I am almost not looking forward to the race weekend. Lets keep everything crossed that Michael can show us all that he still deserves his place on the grid on merit alone!!!


Bit late for all of this. We are well into the second season. Michael has shown what he has a long time ago and it aint much anymore.

#9917 spacekid

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:20

Bit late for all of this. We are well into the second season. Michael has shown what he has a long time ago and it aint much anymore.


I suppose I am still hanging on to the last scraps of hope he can get some strong performances together.

Those scraps are;

i) Strong pre season test pace in Barcelona
ii) Good all round performance Malaysia race weekend
iii) Good race in China
iv) Failiure to get into Q3 in Australia Malaysia and China can be explained by car glitches on critial laps
v) Strong practise form in Turkey ruined by costly mistake in Q3 by Michael. **** happens.
vi) Race pace hampered by iv and v.

My point being there have been rays of hope, and it has been possible to sort of convince myself that apart from that Q3 mistake in Turkey Michael has been unfortunate not to be able to show his true pace in competition. If I sort of close one eye and squint at it a bit funny. Sort of.

Like I said they have been scraps of hope that he could show a decent turn of speed this year in the right circumstances. I believe that Barcelona will be the right circumstances. I'll be honest - I'm not optimistic. I shall be watching quali from behind a cushion, and my soul is prepared for P11. But I really am hoping for more.

#9918 JustinCider

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 11:32

I suppose I am still hanging on to the last scraps of hope he can get some strong performances together.

Those scraps are;

i) Strong pre season test pace in Barcelona
ii) Good all round performance Malaysia race weekend
iii) Good race in China
iv) Failiure to get into Q3 in Australia Malaysia and China can be explained by car glitches on critial laps
v) Strong practise form in Turkey ruined by costly mistake in Q3 by Michael. **** happens.
vi) Race pace hampered by iv and v.

My point being there have been rays of hope, and it has been possible to sort of convince myself that apart from that Q3 mistake in Turkey Michael has been unfortunate not to be able to show his true pace in competition. If I sort of close one eye and squint at it a bit funny. Sort of.

Like I said they have been scraps of hope that he could show a decent turn of speed this year in the right circumstances. I believe that Barcelona will be the right circumstances. I'll be honest - I'm not optimistic. I shall be watching quali from behind a cushion, and my soul is prepared for P11. But I really am hoping for more.


Good luck to you for hanging in there, but how many more "one last chance"(s) can Schumacher be given ?

I wasn't a fan of Schumacher (to say the least) in his first career, and I'm indifferent to his comeback, but I couldn't help but feel a little sorry for him at Turkey. His performance was embarrasing to say the least.


#9919 cilurnum

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 12:13

And his 2 titles with Benetton were won because of....?? :stoned:

Same difference. Undisputed number 1 status and no competition, lots of testing, a certain amount of help from traction control and a bunch of competent engineers doing things for him which Mercedes seem to lack. Now that the playing field has been levelled again he's not looking particularly special.

Hell, the guy is a talented driver and he won his titles through a ton of hard work and bending things to his will that other drivers just weren't prepared to do. Fair play to him. However, he just wasn't realistic about why exactly he'd won before when he decided to make this comeback.

I felt sorry for him at Turkey as well. The Mercedes has started to look better but qualifying was a disaster (being a second off means he got trounced by Rosberg) and the race....... Those defensive moves were just absolutely terrible.

EDIT: Jock Clear had a point when he said that Schumacher has spent most of his career avoiding pressure wherever e could.

Edited by cilurnum, 16 May 2011 - 12:16.


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#9920 ivand911

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 12:24

EDIT: Jock Clear had a point when he said that Schumacher has spent most of his career avoiding pressure wherever e could.

Isn't it what every driver is striving for?
About lots of testing, can you give proofs? Because in this thread I personally found and put data/links that show how Badoer did the most of the testing, Barichello second and Michael was last. This was for 2001,2002 years if I remember correctly. So,there is data ,find it and prove you are right? And they all test a lot, other teams too.


#9921 sharo

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 13:12

This thread is just like
THIS
:)

#9922 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 14:14

One cannot help but wonder if Nico Rosberg would be even quicker if he had a a more competitive guy in the number 2 driver seat.


Nico has raised his game but be consistently ahead of Schumacher. Trust me, Daily Mirror reader, he wont get faster than this. He wont be able to magic the car from 4th best to 1 second clear of the Red Bulls.

#9923 spacekid

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 14:20

Same difference. Undisputed number 1 status and no competition, lots of testing, a certain amount of help from traction control and a bunch of competent engineers doing things for him which Mercedes seem to lack. Now that the playing field has been levelled again he's not looking particularly special.

Hell, the guy is a talented driver and he won his titles through a ton of hard work and bending things to his will that other drivers just weren't prepared to do. Fair play to him. However, he just wasn't realistic about why exactly he'd won before when he decided to make this comeback.

I felt sorry for him at Turkey as well. The Mercedes has started to look better but qualifying was a disaster (being a second off means he got trounced by Rosberg) and the race....... Those defensive moves were just absolutely terrible.

EDIT: Jock Clear had a point when he said that Schumacher has spent most of his career avoiding pressure wherever e could.


So how do you explain away Michaels great driving between '91 and the start of '94? Os some of his race wins in 96-97?

Also, which absolutely terrible defensive moves are you referring to? He made a mistake against Petrov, but you imply there were many cases of bad driving from him during the race in Turkey. Which examples are you referring to please?

#9924 George Costanza

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 14:35

Not to play a bit of tug or war; but regards to pressure: Ayrton Senna was better than Schumacher when it came to that. Jo Ramierz said that.

Edited by George Costanza, 16 May 2011 - 14:35.


#9925 Sakae

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 14:47

EDIT: Jock Clear had a point when he said that Schumacher has spent most of his career avoiding pressure wherever e could.

One of the reasons why either Mr. Clear or Mr. Schumacher should be working at MGP, but not both at the same time. That was clear (to this fan) from the outset.

Edited by Sakae, 16 May 2011 - 14:47.


#9926 Sakae

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 14:52

Not to play a bit of tug or war; but regards to pressure: Ayrton Senna was better than Schumacher when it came to that. Jo Ramierz said that.

Many people said many things about Schumacher and his career, and it's nothing new that we are not all on the same page. Senna managed to smack people in the paddock when he got mad. How is that about handling pressure? I think that like with many other topics, Senna's greatness grew in time with his passing. Hamilton' and Alonso' greatness is also related to the past, and some reconcilliation between myth and reality could be useful.

#9927 arknor

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 16:01

Not to play a bit of tug or war; but regards to pressure: Ayrton Senna was better than Schumacher when it came to that. Jo Ramierz said that.

yea thats why senna invented the ram your competitor off to win the championship

#9928 spacekid

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 18:34

yea thats why senna invented the ram your competitor off to win the championship


Oh lordy here we go!!!! :p

I actually have my own theory about that. I think that Senna punted his rivals (ok lets just say Prost) off the track very much on purpose because he felt he was justified in doing it. I think he knew exactly what he was doing and was too stubborn to accept he might be beaten on merit so justified it to himself that he had been hard done by, and did what he did.

Schumi on the other hand I don't feel handles pressure well at all (i don't much like Jock Clear but he's right on the money with that one), and when he has behaved badly I think he has just panicked. In many ways he's just a big kid, they do that sort of thing all the time :)

#9929 Buttoneer

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 19:28

Please avoid discussion of Schumi v Senna please.

#9930 sharo

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Posted 16 May 2011 - 21:21

This may seem a bit OT but this thread is more suitable IMO.
Contrary to some people here I think that Nico is lucky and having MS as a team mate is something very good for his career. First of all his success is underlined on the background of MS. Secondly, Nico enjoys (at least I think so) a very kind attitude from his older teammate. Maybe it's the age difference, but it seems to me Michael does not regard Nico as he would regard a potential rival in his younger years (or one of a similar age now, like Barichello f.e.).
And I would add that up to now it's mutual. At least nothing in the public domain.

#9931 black magic

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 00:08

can someone just demonstrate at what point clear feels capable of criticising schumacher. that would be the engineer involved winning what a single championship witha driver who struggled to win it despite being in clearly the best car on the grid, and inheeriting a number of wins when clearly uotpaced by either the ferrari or the mclaren only for superior reliabilty to hand him the victory

one has never been a fan and therefopre should have nothing to do with the team and one is a 7 wdc. I think the numbers speak for themselves.as I and others have pointed out that whilst schumacher made mistakes under pressure(and there is a driver who hasn't) he also has a number of wins when under pressure - in fact far more pressure than clear or villeneuve ever faced. try facing the pressure of not having the raw speed in your car vs your competitor but having to deliver the wins nonetheless, of having to push 110% to get a result.

well lets look at jocks and jacques results under that sort of pressure. oh thats right - zero wins over a number of seasons.

hmmm what happened guys? - could it be under pressure jacques gave up a little and jock produced zip?

#9932 Clatter

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 07:32

can someone just demonstrate at what point clear feels capable of criticising schumacher. that would be the engineer involved winning what a single championship witha driver who struggled to win it despite being in clearly the best car on the grid, and inheeriting a number of wins when clearly uotpaced by either the ferrari or the mclaren only for superior reliabilty to hand him the victory

one has never been a fan and therefopre should have nothing to do with the team and one is a 7 wdc. I think the numbers speak for themselves.as I and others have pointed out that whilst schumacher made mistakes under pressure(and there is a driver who hasn't) he also has a number of wins when under pressure - in fact far more pressure than clear or villeneuve ever faced. try facing the pressure of not having the raw speed in your car vs your competitor but having to deliver the wins nonetheless, of having to push 110% to get a result.

well lets look at jocks and jacques results under that sort of pressure. oh thats right - zero wins over a number of seasons.

hmmm what happened guys? - could it be under pressure jacques gave up a little and jock produced zip?


I'd say his experience in racing makes him more than qualified to pass comment. Just because you don't like the message doesn't make him wrong.

#9933 baddog

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 07:39

Clear was entitled to his views. of course if he said it now he would be fired... but he didnt.

He is also wrong, and its pretty much personal sniping.

#9934 Clatter

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 07:47

I don't think he was wrong.

#9935 Frans

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 09:03

So how do you explain away Michaels great driving between '91 and the start of '94? Os some of his race wins in 96-97?


91? Must have been lucky.

94: Illegal traction control, launch control, removing fuel safety ring, illegal fuel.

96-97: the Cheating team of 94 was back together at Ferrari. Yet he failed to win anything like title's.... ha-ha.

#9936 ivand911

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 09:15

91? Must have been lucky.

94: Illegal traction control, launch control, removing fuel safety ring, illegal fuel.

96-97: the Cheating team of 94 was back together at Ferrari. Yet he failed to win anything like title's.... ha-ha.

94-95: He won 2 titles in a row.
2000-2004: He won 5 titles in a row.
HA-HA :clap:
He failed to win another 3 titles. :rolleyes:

Edited by ivand911, 17 May 2011 - 09:17.


#9937 spacekid

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 11:48

91? Must have been lucky.

94: Illegal traction control, launch control, removing fuel safety ring, illegal fuel.

96-97: the Cheating team of 94 was back together at Ferrari. Yet he failed to win anything like title's.... ha-ha.


I know this is largely a waste of my time Frans, lucky for you I have some time to waste. I notice you carefully ignored the wording of my question as I was hoping to avoid the obvious 'oh in 1994 he was cheating, Fiarrari' and all of that nonsense. I specifically went for non championship winning seasons when Michael was driving on equal terms in lesser cars than his rivals and produced some stunning performances.

And the best you can come up with? He was 'lucky'. That certainly explains away a lot of great drives from those 5 years I chose. Plenty of other years to pick great drives from too. I presume you were watching back then and know what you're talking about?

#9938 spacekid

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 11:52

can someone just demonstrate at what point clear feels capable of criticising schumacher. that would be the engineer involved winning what a single championship witha driver who struggled to win it despite being in clearly the best car on the grid, and inheeriting a number of wins when clearly uotpaced by either the ferrari or the mclaren only for superior reliabilty to hand him the victory

one has never been a fan and therefopre should have nothing to do with the team and one is a 7 wdc. I think the numbers speak for themselves.as I and others have pointed out that whilst schumacher made mistakes under pressure(and there is a driver who hasn't) he also has a number of wins when under pressure - in fact far more pressure than clear or villeneuve ever faced. try facing the pressure of not having the raw speed in your car vs your competitor but having to deliver the wins nonetheless, of having to push 110% to get a result.

well lets look at jocks and jacques results under that sort of pressure. oh thats right - zero wins over a number of seasons.

hmmm what happened guys? - could it be under pressure jacques gave up a little and jock produced zip?


'm actually inclined to agree with Clear on this. Michael had many great qualities as a GP driver, but under pressure he clearly makes mistakes. Sometimes they are mistakes like stalling on the grid or coming off the circuit when under pressure from Damon in Adelaide '94, a rare driving error from Michael. Sometimes they are mistakes of judgement like Jerez. When Michael was at his best he rarely came under pressure because his driving kept him away from it, but as a long time fan I've seen him buckle under the pressure.

No ones perfect :p

#9939 sharo

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 12:21

Even machines fail under pressure so why demand superhuman features from MS?
He, and for that matter any prominent driver not only in F1, has done mistakes pressure or not. But also has had great performances even under pressure. Even with a peak form is impossible for a person to act absolutely at the same level every time.

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#9940 cilurnum

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 12:58

Isn't it what every driver is striving for?

Not really. If you keep hiding you just get found out later.

About lots of testing, can you give proofs? Because in this thread I personally found and put data/links that show how Badoer did the most of the testing, Barichello second and Michael was last. This was for 2001,2002 years if I remember correctly. So,there is data ,find it and prove you are right? And they all test a lot, other teams too.

Regardless, Michael has done God knows how many thousands of miles of testing, and the way the system worked was that Barrichello and especially Badoer would do test programs for Schumacher.

#9941 cilurnum

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 13:06

Clear was entitled to his views. of course if he said it now he would be fired... but he didnt.

He is also wrong, and its pretty much personal sniping.

Well, it doesn't look like he is wrong now and I'm sure he's having a bit of a chuckle to himself inside Mercedes because Schumacher has come back to prove him right. You look at what happens when Schumacher gets put under real pressure where he can't avoid it and the guy cracks.

1. Crashed into a wall when being chased by Damon Hill and was lucky to get away with it.

2. Crashes into Villeneuve and comes off worse when he came under pressure.

3. Got desperate at Monaco in 2006.

4. Petrov comes past in his Renault and he tries to stop him from getting past when the move was done. Loses his front wing.

The difference now is that the desperation is coming thick and fast, and the more desperate he becomes the further back he seems to go.

#9942 arknor

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 13:27

Well, it doesn't look like he is wrong now and I'm sure he's having a bit of a chuckle to himself inside Mercedes because Schumacher has come back to prove him right. You look at what happens when Schumacher gets put under real pressure where he can't avoid it and the guy cracks.

1. Crashed into a wall when being chased by Damon Hill and was lucky to get away with it.

2. Crashes into Villeneuve and comes off worse when he came under pressure.

3. Got desperate at Monaco in 2006.

4. Petrov comes past in his Renault and he tries to stop him from getting past when the move was done. Loses his front wing.

The difference now is that the desperation is coming thick and fast, and the more desperate he becomes the further back he seems to go.


1-2-3 can possibly be put down to pressure.

4, im not so sure about were constantly reminded how the driver cant even see where the front wing is and they basicly have to judge the distance to the car infront.

even so 3 moments out of a career that spans more than a decade isnt alot you would expect someone who cant handle pressure to do alot worse than schumacher managed in his career.

#9943 spacekid

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 13:33

Well, it doesn't look like he is wrong now and I'm sure he's having a bit of a chuckle to himself inside Mercedes because Schumacher has come back to prove him right. You look at what happens when Schumacher gets put under real pressure where he can't avoid it and the guy cracks.

1. Crashed into a wall when being chased by Damon Hill and was lucky to get away with it.

2. Crashes into Villeneuve and comes off worse when he came under pressure.

3. Got desperate at Monaco in 2006.

4. Petrov comes past in his Renault and he tries to stop him from getting past when the move was done. Loses his front wing.

The difference now is that the desperation is coming thick and fast, and the more desperate he becomes the further back he seems to go.


Now you see I tried to be reasonable about this because I thought you were having a sensible debate. I'm not a one-eyed fanboy, I agree that dealing with pressure is not Schumi's strong point, especially in tight championship situations, but throwing this in makes it look rather like you are bashing for the sake of it.


#9944 Sakae

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 14:08

Now you see I tried to be reasonable about this because I thought you were having a sensible debate. I'm not a one-eyed fanboy, I agree that dealing with pressure is not Schumi's strong point, especially in tight championship situations, but throwing this in makes it look rather like you are bashing for the sake of it.


Rubbish.

#9945 spacekid

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 14:30

Rubbish.


Care to expand on that?


#9946 Scotracer

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 14:55

Michael has been erratic in pressured circumstances before, but he's also shone: Suzuka 1998 he was having a brilliant race through the field only to be cruelly taken out by a spare piece of Tyrell bodywork. Or Brazil 2006 with a similar circumstance.

So, to pick a few and therefore state "Shumy sucks under pressure" is fallacious.

Edited by Scotracer, 17 May 2011 - 14:56.


#9947 Sakae

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 15:08

Precisely so; all drivers I know about (or care to remember since my begginings with F1) had a few bad days. Bad things happen to good people. Sweeping generalisation about Schumacher is not helpful and hard to swallow.

BTW - Hamilton is not immune - just recall him piling into Kimi at the pit exit. Is he also cracking under pressure?

#9948 arknor

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 15:11

Michael has been erratic in pressured circumstances before, but he's also shone: Suzuka 1998 he was having a brilliant race through the field only to be cruelly taken out by a spare piece of Tyrell bodywork. Or Brazil 2006 with a similar circumstance.

So, to pick a few and therefore state "Shumy sucks under pressure" is fallacious.

hungary 98 schumacher sucks under pressure :wave:

#9949 Scotracer

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 15:12

hungary 98 schumacher sucks under pressure :wave:


I had completely forgotten about that one. Add it to the list.



#9950 Afterburner

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Posted 17 May 2011 - 16:24

I had completely forgotten about that one. Add it to the list.

France 2004 and the four-stopper comes to mind as well. I still can't figure out how he managed that one.