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#11851 Tardis40

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 00:35

Out of ten races that Rosberg has finished this year, he's finished a lap down four times and two laps down once.

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#11852 Lelouch

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 00:42

I was absent this weekend and hardly managed to watch the race. So, didn't bother to go back through the thread.

My view is that considering the starting positions of both Mercedes drivers, their magnificent start and fall back, then MS DNF and NR behind Buemi (who started almost last) at the finish, we should simply stop throwing energy in vain as it's clear what a dog of a car they have and also that the team strategists lack something major.


Ofc i think everyone acknowledges that the W02 sucks. What i would like to see as an MS fan is more consistent race results, i think that he still has something to offer even if the peak of his career is long gone, so i would like to see something better in the races and a few more points. In the end it won't matter much to anyone whether MS finishes 8th in WDC or 10th it's just the impression at the end of the season and i would like to have a better one. I think the race pace is there but he needs better results, some 6ths or 7ths, i want to see some improvement from his part and from the car in Spa, Monza and Singapore, after that the car wil remain the same as it has already been mentioned in the W02 thread.

I don't expect miracles just a little bit of improvement. Still, at the end of the day i believe that the drivers are the minor of MGP's problems. When they deliver a good car and better strategic decisions we can talk about the drivers and whether they are underperforming.

Edited by Lelouch, 02 August 2011 - 00:43.


#11853 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 08:24

5-9th. Yes, history will drool over them.

And quali results are misleading. That's why race pace is relevant.


I get the impression it's made relevant because there are so many ways to twist all those numbers until they fit. :)

Meanwhile back in reality the things that count are still the same as they always where: points, podiums, wins.

#11854 arknor

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 09:49

I get the impression it's made relevant because there are so many ways to twist all those numbers until they fit. :)

Meanwhile back in reality the things that count are still the same as they always where: points, podiums, wins.

i get the impression teams rate drivers based on how fast they are which is why hamilton and alonso are so highly rated. and people who are reliable finishes arent wanted as much but we all know your motive for posting in here anyway

#11855 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 10:19

I get the impression it's made relevant because there are so many ways to twist all those numbers until they fit. :)

Meanwhile back in reality the things that count are still the same as they always where: points, podiums, wins.


Numbers are numbers.You don't need to fit anything to realize that the better pace in quali never translates in better race pace for Nico. And Ross explained why.

And with his drives this year Nico isn't impressing anyone. I said last year and i'll continue to say it : he focuses too much on just beating Michael and nothing else.Hence he focuses more on quali. It is Nico that needs to show drives like Michael in Canada and not Michael. He proved enough.

In the end, Michael needs just one good race to wipe out Nico's lead in points. And from i've seen this year Michael has more chances to get that good result, rather than Nico.

#11856 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 10:33

i get the impression teams rate drivers based on how fast they are which is why hamilton and alonso are so highly rated. and people who are reliable finishes arent wanted as much but we all know your motive for posting in here anyway


You mean just as we know your motives, and the one for your avatar too? :p

Anyway, you talk as if MS has a significant advantage in race pace, which is plain not true. He's just clöser than in qualifying, sometimes even ahead in carefully by his fans selected samples of laps, but even then only by small margins. Contrary to qualifying or number of driving mistakers, where frankly it has been a slaughtering this season, even more embarassing than last year.

Speaking of how teams rate driver, sure they rate speed, but that's by no means everything, obviously. De Cesaris was pretty fast too on his day...

#11857 ivand911

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 10:58

You mean just as we know your motives, and the one for your avatar too? :p

Anyway, you talk as if MS has a significant advantage in race pace, which is plain not true. He's just clöser than in qualifying, sometimes even ahead in carefully by his fans selected samples of laps, but even then only by small margins. Contrary to qualifying or number of driving mistakers, where frankly it has been a slaughtering this season, even more embarassing than last year.
Speaking of how teams rate driver, sure they rate speed, but that's by no means everything, obviously. De Cesaris was pretty fast too on his day...

Any prove or just empty words??


#11858 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 11:00

Any prove or just empty words??


Read the thread.

#11859 ivand911

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 11:12

Read the thread.

Empty words then! If there was mistakes(falsification) of any numbers, this could be easily proven. Didn't see that for now, and usually guys here use outside statistics.
Like this one:
http://en.mclarenf-1.....=Nico Rosberg

Edited by ivand911, 02 August 2011 - 11:13.


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#11860 Jejking

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 11:13

Funny you say that. If I read the thread and other forums I see pictures with full race laptimes analysis proving Schumacher is doing better on average racepace because he splits his race into different performance parts. He usually is (very) good off the line, making up spots and reasonable in the next laps, then dropping back a couple of seconds before getting back up to full speed and going faster. He's having to wait for the ideal stop strategy due to Rosberg being allowed to get the jump on that one because he is in front. With tyre wear being the same (I feel) on both cars he usually lags a lap behind Rosberg and loses out a bit when he's driving on the edge of the cliff.

And yes, when Schumacher was falling back those seconds after the first laps when being passed by Alonso, I was facepalming already but he came back very well. He's doing better, not perfect, but I think he'll get there if all pieces fall in their place. Named: car speed, reliability/driver errors (I'll put that one on having average equipment having to fend off equal or better cars, then it's easy to cross the limit. No excuse, going for it is good but agression is not the way to win WDC's these years), extra qualifying pace.

#11861 Afterburner

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 13:47

Meanwhile back in reality the things that count are still the same as they always where: points, podiums, wins.

Of which Schumacher has 1,473, 154, and 91, while Rosberg has 265.5, 5, and zero.

#11862 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 13:50

Of which Schumacher has 1,473, 154, and 91, while Rosberg has 265.5, 5, and zero.


Well, to be fair, Nico has 9 more races than Michael has wins.



:rotfl:

Edited by Diablobb81, 02 August 2011 - 13:57.


#11863 zelpre

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 13:58

Numbers are numbers.You don't need to fit anything to realize that the better pace in quali never translates in better race pace for Nico. And Ross explained why.

And with his drives this year Nico isn't impressing anyone. I said last year and i'll continue to say it : he focuses too much on just beating Michael and nothing else.Hence he focuses more on quali. It is Nico that needs to show drives like Michael in Canada and not Michael. He proved enough.

In the end, Michael needs just one good race to wipe out Nico's lead in points. And from i've seen this year Michael has more chances to get that good result, rather than Nico.


So true :up: :up:


BTW where did Ross explained that?

#11864 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 14:01

So true :up: :up:


BTW where did Ross explained that?


"The Briton also suggested the W03 would feature a longer wheelbase as the team has experienced difficulties with the current car to find a set-up that works as well on light fuel in qualifying and full tanks in the race.

“Probably yes,” he said when asked if the wheelbase would be lengthened on next year’s car.

“One of the main things [problems] is obviously when it’s full of fuel because the fuel tank’s shorter then it’s higher, so that doesn’t help. We’re finding that we’re having to balance between what we choose for qualifying and what we choose for the race, we’re having to find more of a compromise between the two.

“Obviously what you ideally want is a set-up that works in qualifying and you can just take straight into the race because these days there are very few changes you can make. But we don’t seem to have hit that sweet spot in terms of the position of the fuel when the car’s full [of fuel] and the height of the fuel when the car’s full.”

http://www.itv.com/f...-mercedes-4637/

#11865 zelpre

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 16:21

"The Briton also suggested the W03 would feature a longer wheelbase as the team has experienced difficulties with the current car to find a set-up that works as well on light fuel in qualifying and full tanks in the race.

“Probably yes,” he said when asked if the wheelbase would be lengthened on next year’s car.

“One of the main things [problems] is obviously when it’s full of fuel because the fuel tank’s shorter then it’s higher, so that doesn’t help. We’re finding that we’re having to balance between what we choose for qualifying and what we choose for the race, we’re having to find more of a compromise between the two.

“Obviously what you ideally want is a set-up that works in qualifying and you can just take straight into the race because these days there are very few changes you can make. But we don’t seem to have hit that sweet spot in terms of the position of the fuel when the car’s full [of fuel] and the height of the fuel when the car’s full.”

http://www.itv.com/f...-mercedes-4637/



Thanks. So this finally proves that they have different set-ups on Saturday. Michael's setup is more into a race, when Nico's is more into quali. That's why the big gap in the qualifications...They go on different way to score a good result by the end of the weekend. Michael realized that because of the new rules(tyres, KERS, DRS) qualifications aren't that important as they were before so he focus for the race.
I believe Nico wants to be better in qualifications just to beat his teammate and because he doesn't have good racecraft to climb up on the race.
If they will ever get a competitive car I believe the situation will not be different just on the race pace and those details, I believe the situation will change on the standings.

#11866 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 16:28

Well, to be fair, Nico has 9 more races than Michael has wins.



:rotfl:



Ouch.

Now that's a devastating statistic.

#11867 Augurk

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 17:34

Ouch.

Now that's a devastating statistic.

And after next year he has done as many seasons as.....

Who wants to finish this one? :smoking:

#11868 Prost1997T

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 17:40

Ouch.

Now that's a devastating statistic.


Rosberg's not the best of the crop obviously (a solid second tier driver, with the likes of Webber, Massa), but then he's only ever driven mediocre cars. He's been 'best of the rest' for 3 seasons running at Williams\Merc. He scored all of Williams points for 2009. Virtually zero retirements in the last 4 seasons (just two collisions, a few mechanical). Perhaps a handful of drivers (eg Hamilton, Alonso, Vettel) could have done notably better in those trucks, given the superiority of RBR\Ferrari\McLaren recently.

Consistency is something that Mercedes needs to stay ahead of Renault in the championship.

I don't see anyone calling Heidfeld a bad driver because he hasn't won yet..

#11869 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 17:47

Certainly Merc has to beat Renault. That's one reason why Michael's mistakes in races have to stop and he has to gain more points.

Two good race tracks are next. I hope we see some good results.

#11870 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 17:52

Of which Schumacher has 1,473, 154, and 91, while Rosberg has 265.5, 5, and zero.


Ah, the past... the golden country! Surely MS himself must be feeling a bit embarassed by those mega stats, I guess he has only come back to put a bit of perspective to it. Good man! :up:

Meanwhile, back from the nostalgia section... :drunk:

#11871 PoliFanAthic

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 17:53

I thought many people said Heidfeld epitomizes the unspectacular but fairly consistent F1 racing driver.

Then again, Heidfeld has not proven to be better than Petrov and Kubica managed to win a race using the same machinery while at BMW. Rosberg, on the other hand, has been faring well against his teammates and can't really be accused of not getting the most out of the car he is driving. But then again, he needs to get his hands on a car that can win to prove his worth.

Not much to do with Schumacher though.

#11872 Prost1997T

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 18:24

Rosberg, on the other hand, has been faring well against his teammates and can't really be accused of not getting the most out of the car he is driving. But then again, he needs to get his hands on a car that can win to prove his worth.

Not much to do with Schumacher though.


I was discussing Rosberg in the context of his performance v MSc. Michael's style might well be balls out but it's not getting the results lately. He seems to be fighting the car too much and making mistakes that are uncharacteristic of someone with his experience.

#11873 Afterburner

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 19:05

Ah, the past... the golden country! Surely MS himself must be feeling a bit embarassed by those mega stats, I guess he has only come back to put a bit of perspective to it. Good man! :up:

Meanwhile, back from the nostalgia section... :drunk:

Last time I checked, those stats were from the whole of his career, not just a part of it--I don't know how you come to the conclusion that my bringing up the stats from his full career is evidence of nostalgia. Sounds like a generalisation to me--and I could've sworn you were criticising someone else not too long ago for coming to a generalisation from a few laptimes, too... :drunk:

As long as he is racing, Schumacher has the potential to add to his stats. And as long as it's points, podiums, and wins that count, then--even assuming that a single driver wins every race over the next four years--Schumacher can race until he's 46 without scoring another point and still be the statistically greatest driver in the field, let alone F1 history.

Not to mention the fact that his record of sixty-eight poles isn't going to be topped for another three years, at the very minimum, either--but we must remember that points, podiums, and wins are what count. ;)

#11874 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 19:29

Last time I checked, those stats were from the whole of his career, not just a part of it--I don't know how you come to the conclusion that my bringing up the stats from his full career is evidence of nostalgia. Sounds like a generalisation to me--and I could've sworn you were criticising someone else not too long ago for coming to a generalisation from a few laptimes, too... :drunk:

As long as he is racing, Schumacher has the potential to add to his stats. And as long as it's points, podiums, and wins that count, then--even assuming that a single driver wins every race over the next four years--Schumacher can race until he's 46 without scoring another point and still be the statistically greatest driver in the field, let alone F1 history.

Not to mention the fact that his record of sixty-eight poles isn't going to be topped for another three years, at the very minimum, either--but we must remember that points, podiums, and wins are what count.;)


He didn't add to any of the latter two since his comeback, for 30-odd races now. All he achieved is lowering his percentages. So, what potential?

Yeah, I know, next answer is he's having fun. :p

#11875 halifaxf1fan

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 19:37

He didn't add to any of the latter two since his comeback, for 30-odd races now. All he achieved is lowering his percentages. So, what potential?

Yeah, I know, next answer is he's having fun. :p


I think he is making a shitload of money also.

#11876 Afterburner

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 19:45

He didn't add to any of the latter two since his comeback, for 30-odd races now. All he achieved is lowering his percentages. So, what potential?

Yeah, I know, next answer is he's having fun. :p

For all we know, Merc could develop a rocketship next year--one so far ahead of the field that even someone with no potential for victory (Schumacher, in this case ;)) could win in it. Anything can happen in Formula One, and it usually does. If you don't believe Merc is going to win--ever--there's nothing wrong with that, but you can't discount the possibility of Merc creating a car fast enough for Schumacher to win with next year.

#11877 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 20:01

For all we know, Merc could develop a rocketship next year--one so far ahead of the field that even someone with no potential for victory (Schumacher, in this case ;)) could win in it. Anything can happen in Formula One, and it usually does. If you don't believe Merc is going to win--ever--there's nothing wrong with that, but you can't discount the possibility of Merc creating a car fast enough for Schumacher to win with next year.


In this case, the former champion finishing the season way behind the new WDC Rosberg will be making the headlines more than anything else. :D

#11878 Afterburner

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 20:09

In this case, the former champion finishing the season way behind the new WDC Rosberg will be making the headlines more than anything else. :D

Haha, if that's your opinion, then I'm completely fine with that--we're all entitled to our own speculations. :) In any case, Schumacher's career isn't over yet--time will tell how we'll be talking about him after he runs his last race, though I get the impression our opinions probably won't be the same regardless of what happens. :p

#11879 black magic

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 21:58

It is interesting how perception has changed, our attempts to analyse supremacy not withstanding.

last yr some believed nico was potentiallay top tier based on his overall outshining michael.

this year the perception grows stronger regardless of what you think of michaels performance that nico is more journyman, based on his consistant slide form his starting position and reletive passivity with a faster package behind him eg the ease with which massa could get past him vs michael.

it also implies that most accept that michael has improved this yr - hence nico standing suffers.

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#11880 as65p

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:11

Haha, if that's your opinion, then I'm completely fine with that--we're all entitled to our own speculations. :) In any case, Schumacher's career isn't over yet--time will tell how we'll be talking about him after he runs his last race, though I get the impression our opinions probably won't be the same regardless of what happens. :p


Very likely. :)

But to end on a positive note, as sorry as his comeback looks to me, his first career will remain marvellous whatever happens. Frankly, I expect in 10, 20 years time the comeback will be reduced to a footnote to his former achievements, like Mansell@McLaren or the comebacks of Alan Jones.



#11881 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:13

journyman


Outdated, awful, terrible and even ludicrous term to use. Avoid.

Rosberg came into F1 on merit, like his fellow "journeyman" Webber (last driver I saw this term applied to). They were the new guard and the young chargers once as well.

Just because someone only achieves success later in their career, rather than the beginning, doesn't make them a "journeyman" or necessarily any worse than their contemporaries.

Edited by Disgrace, 02 August 2011 - 22:14.


#11882 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:20

when do you think he might achieve some succcess?

#11883 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:27

If Mercedes can build a car worthy of wins. Remember, this was supposed to be his big move to the big league. He was signed as a Brawn driver.

Rosberg has often done as well as he can only to come either undone by his team, like Malaysia 2009, his cars lack of pace, like China 2010, or himself like Singapore 2009 (and I suppose to an extent in aforementioned China).

The "problem" with Rosberg is that he is clinical and not in the least bit spectacular to watch which is totally contrary to his 2006/7 self. He's very boring but still he's quick. The other "problem" is that he hasn't had a proper team-mate to compare himself with since his somewhat erratic rookie season.

We don't know whether he is pushing beyond the limits, on the limit of, or below the limit of that Mercedes next to an aged Schumacher who seems to seldom bother with Q3 and makes errors on race day.

Edited by Disgrace, 02 August 2011 - 22:30.


#11884 SeanValen

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:32

Very likely. :)

But to end on a positive note, as sorry as his comeback looks to me, his first career will remain marvellous whatever happens. Frankly, I expect in 10, 20 years time the comeback will be reduced to a footnote to his former achievements, like Mansell@McLaren or the comebacks of Alan Jones.




But to end on a more positive note, prospects of winning with a 3rd team, who helped him into f1 is not closed, it just might take longer, and being the only driver at his time to leave and return to f1 with a 3 year gap, in his 3rd decade of racing, didn't give up despite huge expectations, enjoyed driving grand prix cars, despite having millions and done it all, this is about enjoying life, came back, took a shot at competiting, and gave racing fans someone to root for further down from pole. Mansell quit early at Mclaren, there is no comparison, yet Schumacher likes to build something, doesn't mind being written off, and has alot of belief in himself, you gotta admire someone who's stuck with improving himself, and he has improved from 2010, the rest is in the hands of mercedes, and timing/I'm sure everyone would like to see former champions in cars capable of fighting for podiums/wins consistently/not 6/7th place etc

Canada 2011 was more impressive then anything Mansell did in 1994 at Mclaren, the fact Michael was robbed of a 2nd place, because the FIA deemed wet tyres for wet races unsafe, lets wait for interes lol, there is no excuse for the FIA, they robbed drivers to race in the rain and get a upperhand on faster cars in the dry, that's what happened with Michael. A 2nd place, for a man who's been written off more times then countable, even in his first career, it seems that has followed him into this 2nd career. That's a better positive note I reckon.

#11885 ClockworkRacing

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:36

I have the impression that Schumy is just a little bit frustrated by being beaten by Nico,so he can´t get his head straight.
He had made some good races after his return such as Monaco,Turkey and Spain last year and Canada this year.
Brundle said something very interesting the other day:that Michael hasn´t got the same peripherical vision he once had and that´s why has damaged so many front wings,i don´t believe it,i think he´s still very fit and does that sometimes because as i said above he seems to be a bit desperate to show some results,to prove that his talent hasn´t gone.

Edited by ClockworkRacing, 02 August 2011 - 22:37.


#11886 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:42

Disgrace

The "problem" with Rosberg is that he is clinical and not in the least bit spectacular to watch which is totally contrary to his 2006/7 self. He's very boring


I agree with this

#11887 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:43

But I believe he is still quick.  ;)

#11888 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:48

I think he's very quick in qualy - but I don't think he's quick in the race.

He reminds me of Heikki when he was at McLarne - Mr Invisible - falls back in the race is unspectacular, is boring - very different from Keke!

Edited by Raelene, 02 August 2011 - 22:49.


#11889 jonnoj

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:51

Outdated, awful, terrible and even ludicrous term to use. Avoid.

Rosberg came into F1 on merit, like his fellow "journeyman" Webber (last driver I saw this term applied to). They were the new guard and the young chargers once as well.

Just because someone only achieves success later in their career, rather than the beginning, doesn't make them a "journeyman" or necessarily any worse than their contemporaries.


It doesn't make them a star either.



#11890 Sakae

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 22:52

when do you think he might achieve some succcess?



MGP will take at least two or or three years before they will be able competing for the front position, he is getting meanwhile old, and if he leaves, where he will go today? Next to Vettel? Replace Kubica? Nick might win some races, but he cannot emulate Schumacher, Vettel, or others in that class. Lack of opportunity is one, and we will never know what might have been because of his age. I am sorry to say that, but I think NR is finished at F1.

Edited by Sakae, 02 August 2011 - 22:55.


#11891 Bunchies

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 23:00

I think he's very quick in qualy - but I don't think he's quick in the race.

He reminds me of Heikki when he was at McLarne - Mr Invisible - falls back in the race is unspectacular, is boring - very different from Keke!


In regards to Keke, it looks like his spiritual successor is of Japanese ethnicity.

#11892 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 23:07

In regards to Keke, it looks like his spiritual successor is of Japanese ethnicity.

:lol: :lol: :lol:

#11893 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 23:11

It doesn't make them a star either.


Indeed not, but I see the term as derogatory as well as outdated. Only at a stretch can the term "journeyman" be used to describe the likes of Sakon Yamamoto.

I think he's very quick in qualy - but I don't think he's quick in the race.

He reminds me of Heikki when he was at McLarne - Mr Invisible - falls back in the race is unspectacular, is boring - very different from Keke!


But that's the thing, he's so unspectacular that you have failed to notice that he doesn't always fall back in the races, at least before 2011.

It has been a pattern this season due to the nature of the car. It is good in qualifying but has no race pace due to the fact it eats rear tyres. Rosberg always qualifies above where the car belongs in race pace terms, maximising the qualifying advantage (like Red Bull have to a greater extent) which is to his credit. Meanwhile, Schumacher simply can't get his act together in qualifying and qualifies well below the cars capacity. However, he's quick in the race (to his credit too) so the gap between Rosberg and Schumacher always decreases in the race towards where the car actually belongs: somewhere in the middle and then they tend to run in unison.

Edited by Disgrace, 02 August 2011 - 23:14.


#11894 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 23:38

but you get points for the race - no point setting up the car for qualy and then fall back in the race - and he does.

As I said hearlier - he needs to be a bit more aggressive and MSC needs to ease up a little on the agression.

All in all - I'd much prefer an MSC type racer than a Niko type driver

#11895 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2011 - 23:46

But qualifying is still important. The likes of Button and MSC give themselves too much work to do on Sunday to make the most of their race pace. Rosberg can go backwards, but if he's an acre ahead of MSC already, he hasn't all that much to worry about (which is why he's so hard to judge).

Most people do prefer "racers" which is the why the likes of Michael command a majority of the fans but I think it's evident that Schumacher is fairly past it. I think it's clear by how he's upped his pace this season, but at the cost of many mistakes. Speaking of rubbish qualifying, being outqualified by amounts resembling Piquet Jr and front wing loss each weekend used be unthinkable. Nonetheless, there were plenty of "racers" to take over after 2006 and there will be when Schumacher decides to call it a day for good.

Edited by Disgrace, 02 August 2011 - 23:49.


#11896 Raelene

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 00:37

I didn't say quaLy wasn't important. It appears to me that Rosberg sets the car up for the one lap glory run - I reckon if he hedges his bets a bit more, he may actually not go backwards so much in the race....

Imagine the drumming he'd be getting if MSC could get his qualies right and reign in his agression a little....not sure Michael has lost a front wing every weekend.

Edited by Raelene, 03 August 2011 - 00:37.


#11897 mrmusicman

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 06:26

Thanks. So this finally proves that they have different set-ups on Saturday. Michael's setup is more into a race, when Nico's is more into quali. That's why the big gap in the qualifications...


It does not prove anything. Nowhere does it say that the drivers are taking different setup approaches.

#11898 Diablobb81

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 06:34

It does not prove anything. Nowhere does it say that the drivers are taking different setup approaches.


The times say that.

#11899 mrmusicman

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 06:51

The times say that.



You seeing what you want to see. Michael might be a little closer in races but that could be a number of factors, mainly down to the fact the car handles better for him with heavy fuel, which does not mean his setups are more tailored to the race. F1 cars are easier to drive with fuel generally because the car is more settled, and the handling less critical than on low fuel. Either way he is happier with the handling in race trim, it seems he struggles to get the most out of the car on fresh tyres.

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#11900 Diablobb81

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Posted 03 August 2011 - 06:54

You seeing what you want to see.


Possibly. All i know is that after being equal in quali for a string of races in the next ones a gap appeared. At the same time he developed a better race pace.