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#11901 carbonfibre

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 07:25

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

Golden moments at Ferrari, 2000.

That was a real qualifying they should bring that back far far more exciting.

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#11902 baddog

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 07:41

The great days of the old qualifying format are a sad loss I think. The duelling nature of it building tension over the hour was great.

Didnt please the TV people when the first 20 minutes were quiet though, and back marker teams got ignored by the TV people. Seems like the TV people may be to blame for everything eh?

#11903 sharo

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 09:16

That was a real qualifying they should bring that back far far more exciting.

Not only that, but the on-screen info by Siemens was way more easily readable and informative. Both during qualy and race.

#11904 Hacklerf

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 10:00

Yea i used to enjoy the 12 laps immensely

#11905 Jejking

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 10:48

Yea i used to enjoy the 12 laps immensely

Too bad it went on to become too tactical with the Minardi trackcleaners out there only in dry sessions with the rest of the teams waiting. That was just plain wrong.

#11906 Johnrambo

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 12:34

Of course, he he stayed at Benetton: he would have won it from 1994 to 1997; they had Renault engines so it would have been a battle with Williams, but I think Schu would win four straight. Then who knows where he would have went (likely Ferrari, though), or less likely, McLaren Mercedes with Newey. Imagine that: Schu with Newey at McLaren? Oy.


If we start this if-game let's not forget that Mika had a contract with Williams for the 1993 season and only because Peter Collins was an a**hole he could not join them. If that had happened Schumacher would not be statistically the most successful F1 driver ever. Mika would have learned from Prost in 1993 and then romped to 1994-1997 titles and also would not have gotten injured at Adelaide..

#11907 EdwardCullen

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 15:28

If we start this if-game let's not forget that Mika had a contract with Williams for the 1993 season and only because Peter Collins was an a**hole he could not join them. If that had happened Schumacher would not be statistically the most successful F1 driver ever. Mika would have learned from Prost in 1993 and then romped to 1994-1997 titles and also would not have gotten injured at Adelaide..

If we start this if-game, if my grandmother had a gentleman's sausage she would be my grandfather! Blimey :rotfl:

Edited by EdwardCullen, 05 August 2011 - 15:35.


#11908 George Costanza

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 16:06

If we start this if-game let's not forget that Mika had a contract with Williams for the 1993 season and only because Peter Collins was an a**hole he could not join them. If that had happened Schumacher would not be statistically the most successful F1 driver ever. Mika would have learned from Prost in 1993 and then romped to 1994-1997 titles and also would not have gotten injured at Adelaide..


With Ayrton Senna at Williams? :lol:


The if is pretty fun to do sometimes. :lol:

#11909 Boing 2

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 17:12

Can you imagine Senna and Hakkinnen in Williams mid 90's? jesus, no one would have got a look in! :clap:

Edited by Boing 2, 05 August 2011 - 17:19.


#11910 merschu

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 18:28

Schumacher: My mindset isn't right for Mercedes

"I arrived at Mercedes with a specific task: not winning at all costs but to grow this team," he is quoted as saying by Corriere Dello Sport. "We are working very hard, the car is in its second year and still has many areas of uncertainty, but it will grow.

"If anything, I am the problem - it is a fact that I am a bit more relaxed than I was before. I have experience, I can estimate when it is necessary to concentrate. But I do not know if my mindset is right for the team."

He added that he will soon make a decision on whether to retire at the end of the current season or continue through 2012.

"Soon I will evaluate whether to continue [racing] or stop."


Meanwhile, Mercedes team principal Ross Brawn, says he and the whole team are happy with the seven-time world champion, but they wouldn't want to force him to race if he didn't feel it was the right decision.

"We called Schumacher in to our team with the task of developing the car, he has a three-year contract and we are very happy with him," said Brawn. "But if Schumacher does not feel more at ease, then we need to talk. You can not force someone to do something that they do not want to do. We believe in him, he is an important part of our team.

"I am convinced that eventually we can convince him to extend his contract ," he concluded.


Is this article true? Has Michael really said that? I mean during the last few weeks he was saying that he will definitely race next year! How all of a sudden is he saying that he will evaluate whether to continue?? :| :confused:

http://thef1times.co...s/display/04180

#11911 Mastah

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 18:42

Google doesn't bite :wave::

http://www.corriered...

#11912 Diablobb81

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 18:56

It's an "if" situation. The english translation is bad (and the italian title doesn't reflect the actual quote).

"If my mindset isn't right..."

Nothing new here. It was known that they will decide later this year about 2012.

Edited by Diablobb81, 05 August 2011 - 18:58.


#11913 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 19:14

Ross wouldnt call MS 'Schumacher...'.

Friends do not address each other by surnames....

Also, if Michael does not have the correct mindset anymore, why is he at the factory all the time pestering them for updates etc etc?

Then again, maybe he and Ross have realised that Honda/BAR are going nowhere fast......

#11914 Augurk

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 19:21

Ross wouldnt call MS 'Schumacher...'.

Friends do not address each other by surnames....

Also, if Michael does not have the correct mindset anymore, why is he at the factory all the time pestering them for updates etc etc?

Then again, maybe he and Ross have realised that Honda/BAR are going nowhere fast......

Good point. I've never heard Ross name him anything other than Michael.

And it's so much the opposite of for instance what we saw on the BBC with the factory tour.

#11915 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 19:54

Good point. I've never heard Ross name him anything other than Michael.

And it's so much the opposite of for instance what we saw on the BBC with the factory tour.


Indeed. I think Schumacher is committed to his 3 year contract. If the second half of 2012 begins to yield something productive then he may continue. However, if 2012 is much like 2011 (all empty promises), I don't think he will hesitate to walk away. Infact, I think Nico will have had enough too (assuming he doesn't leave at the end of 2011 that is.)

#11916 Math89

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 20:32

Well, normally when there is 'Schumacher will retire' news it gets picked up really fast by all the other websites. So far I have only seen one copy of this on the english website in the url a couple of posts above me and on a dutch website that has made mistakes before and got into trouble for those mistakes.

Think all the other websites are (for now) labeling it as bullshit.

I think it's a very late and poor version of the 'I am more relaxed' headline from Schumacher a couple of days ago.

He added that he will soon make a decision on whether to retire at the end of the current season or continue through 2012.

"Soon I will evaluate whether to continue [racing] or stop."


Come on... I can believe that he may be having some doubts from time to time but just like that, sharing that with a reporter? I don't buy it...

Edited by Math89, 05 August 2011 - 20:45.


#11917 Math89

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 21:42

Hmm, after thinking about it...

Anyone els worried this could truely be the beginning of his second retirement?

What if Mercedes has gotten tired of the results so far and want him gone, out of respect for Michael they want to make it look as if it will be Schumacher's choice and this is the first step. Openly saying that he is not to sure about 2012 and that he is perhaps not helping the team.

Could also explain why Brawn called him Schumacher instead of Michael. Can imagine this could have resulted in a clash and they are no longer friends.


Anyway, 'What if? What if?'

I still call bullshit on this news but i'm kinda afraid it's not. :(

#11918 puxanando

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 21:45

:cat: Perhaps Schumi know now that his time in F1 is OVER!?

#11919 Starish

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 23:02

Schumi is going home without a 10 place grid penalty, should be interesting if he keeps it clean.

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#11920 jannyg

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Posted 05 August 2011 - 23:15

Schumi has stated many times that this is a three year plan and that he will stay for the three.

I still believe in the Schumacher and Mercedes partnership and I am sure he is laying alot of foundations for a better 2012.

There is no denying that this hasnt gone to plan for MS, but he is the best guy to have in this situation because he understands the value of patience and continuity.

If there ever was a time to quit then it would have been last season because it didnt look like things could have got better for Schumi. But Canada '11 bought more satisfaction and recognition than anything he did in '10. What im trying to get at is that if Schumi didnt think big improvements could be made within the 3years then he probably would have left last season, he probably still believes he can meet some objectives by the end of 2012. He wont be leaving until he gets at least one podium IMO.




#11921 arknor

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 00:47

:cat: Perhaps Schumi know now that his time in F1 is OVER!?

maybe alonso thought the same when rookie hamilton kicked his ass ?

#11922 Disgrace

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 01:27

Yeah, because special talent rookies are the same as any old rookies. Good reasoning.

#11923 Sakae

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 02:07

Is this article true? Has Michael really said that? I mean during the last few weeks he was saying that he will definitely race next year! How all of a sudden is he saying that he will evaluate whether to continue?? :| :confused:

http://thef1times.co...s/display/04180


I have to admit, this interview is a shock to my body system. It's not normal, I am convinced, and something unexpected is on. I didn't think that Michael would pull the plug now, especially when just not too long ago there was noises from that camp that he might extend his contract.

#11924 intothepits

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 02:34

They probably want to keep him for his prestige and name, which brings money.

Performance wise, there's no reason they should keep him. The driver with the most titles can't beat WDCless, race winner-less Nico Rosberg... So definitely, Schumacher is not the driver he once was, but this is understandable considering the man is 42, and the current crop of drivers are at a different level than the drivers back in the 90s and early/mid 2000s.

So time for the team to maybe be honest, and stop worrying about 'denting' Michael's reputation, would they like a driver who can battle neck to neck with Rosberg? Most likely.... Yet having the guy that won most World Titles back in the day, also brings its positives aswell, and it seems they'd rather have that.... Good or bad decision do you think?

Edited by intothepits, 06 August 2011 - 02:36.


#11925 puxanando

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 07:19

maybe alonso thought the same when rookie hamilton kicked his ass ?

:p No...he thought in a red car........

#11926 zelpre

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 08:28

Translated - Schumacher: "I no longer have the mentality to F1»


I can't believe that...I hope this is fake really...

And look Brawn is bullshitting again, I can't believe it again:
http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/93641

#11927 Math89

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 08:34

Stil no other websites who have taken over this article... And it's not because it's weekend cause they have new topics but none of it is about Schumacher. If it was for real this news would have been taken over right away by most formula 1 websites.



#11928 glorius&victorius

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 08:41

someone wake up Frans! :lol:

If the guy retires, he is still a great driver to me! Maybe his second career contributed to me liking him more as a person/character. So it was not all lost. I enjoyed seeing Michael dueling it out with Jaime Alguesuari race in and out.

Edited by glorius&victorius, 06 August 2011 - 08:43.


#11929 Massa_f1

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 10:44

Is this article true? Has Michael really said that? I mean during the last few weeks he was saying that he will definitely race next year! How all of a sudden is he saying that he will evaluate whether to continue?? :| :confused:

http://thef1times.co...s/display/04180



Maybe he has woken up to reality that he will never win again. It is sad to say but it is true. His last few races have been a mess.

#11930 SeanValen

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 11:50

Translated - Schumacher: "I no longer have the mentality to F1»


I can't believe that...I hope this is fake really...

And look Brawn is bullshitting again, I can't believe it again:
http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/93641





, Ross hardly says Schumacher, and it's really taking the piss for Michael to keep coming out and saying he has a 3 year programme, he's already commented about next year, and with all these recent appointments at mercedes and things finally starting to move in a direction, it would be absolutely insane to leave on the eve of the car finally getting there, he knows it's going to take longer then expected and has commented so, but the press or a few bloggs :rolleyes: are going to hammer out retirement aritcles right up until the day he retires again whether that's next year or 2-3 years from now. Schumacher wins or Schumacher retires is news, anything in between is not press meterial.

Michael always said when he started, he could of signed a longer contract then 3 years, the most important thing is mercedes have a structure in place.



THIS IS BLOGGS!
Of cource it's coming from a writer who speculating hamilton at ferrari now, not redbulll,
http://blogs.bettor....1-season-a88962


I think Donald Hardly who writ that Schumacher article, is a Alonso+Hamilton fan, would like to see them in a team together, but he's writing on speculation and not on official comments, and dreams of seeing Alonso and Hamilton again at ferrari, which would be cool, but more of a fan blog post, and his writing of Schumacher reeks of someone who isn't a fan, and obviously not on board with the fact that Schumacher is actually enjoying f1 while working hard, I would rather believe actual official quotes from Michael then a blogg on better.


In the team's 3 week break, with Michael after hungary just expressing his desire to get back to racing and wish the break hasn't come at this time for SPA, really silly article, if anything, if this article was mentioned after the season was over, it would of been a bit more crediable, and that's giving it some credit lol



Anyway Ross Brawn is kinda right, ferrari have closed the gap to mac and redbull quicker then merc, Mercedes are 6 months behind, but have improved, but because we have merc/ferrari/redbull so strong and improved, it makes mercedes look stationery, but they are finally on their way, Schumacher would of expected more before signing, but once in, he knows it's about timing, and you either arrive at the right time in the team, or have to wait longer then expected, but if the structure is there, and the team is going places, then it is promising.

Michael and the team/ Nico, expected podiums and a odd win this year, after winter testing, instead they have to wait longer, and deal with the usual crap written as they try and get that car to the front, that's the nature of the game, either perform or spend extra time retracting other websites nonsense in the meantiime.




Edited by SeanValen, 06 August 2011 - 12:04.


#11931 Poep

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 14:06

Here are my 5 cents.

The only reason the MS-Merc partnership hasn't worked is Mercedes team itself.

This leads to a very urgent question/theory I have. Please discuss it with me, because I think this is the biggest reason MS looks somehow 'different' from vintage MS. It's all about driving style.

Compare MS driving style fom onboards 2006 vs 2011. I know they are different cars, but that doesn't mean that pusing the throttle together with the brakes is not possible anymore.

2006; MS paces the throttle at a fast pace (like Senna used to) during the corner while braking.

(from 0:15)

2011; MS brakes for the corner, waits untill he is out, and then hits the throttle. He isn't using his famous driving technique anymore.
http://www.youtube.c...feature=related
(from 1:08)


Could this be because of a lack of grip on the W02? Please discuss.

And how about this discussion with his egineer: Saying to much oversteer, while MS dissagreeing and saying he still has understeer. http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

Edited by Poep, 06 August 2011 - 14:06.


#11932 peroa

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 14:16

He can't blip the throttle because of the highly sophisticated EBD engine maps I would imagine.
It's not just him, we've heard quite a few RE telling their drivers to keep their foot off the throttle while braking.

#11933 Poep

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 15:25

He can't blip the throttle because of the highly sophisticated EBD engine maps I would imagine.
It's not just him, we've heard quite a few RE telling their drivers to keep their foot off the throttle while braking.

They didn't have engine maps in 2006?

#11934 arknor

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 15:43

They didn't have engine maps in 2006?

they didnt have off throttle exhaust blowing? it doesnt start blowing the exhaust if you press the throttle while breaking

#11935 Poep

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 15:45

they didnt have off throttle exhaust blowing? it doesnt start blowing the exhaust if you press the throttle while breaking

That will be banned next year right?

So, next year he can blip the throttle?

Edited by Poep, 06 August 2011 - 15:46.


#11936 Augurk

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 17:28

That will be banned next year right?

So, next year he can blip the throttle?

If so I wouldn't be surprised if he gets the better of Rosberg even in quali.

#11937 MightyMoose

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 17:53

Is it possible the engine maps are controlled by the standard spec ECU? Which of course is made by a branch of McLaren afaik. It could be that Ferrari had their own specification which suited the "blip" style employed by MS.

Just random musing there.......

#11938 Augurk

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 18:15

Is it possible the engine maps are controlled by the standard spec ECU? Which of course is made by a branch of McLaren afaik. It could be that Ferrari had their own specification which suited the "blip" style employed by MS.

Just random musing there.......

Can't be, then there wouldn't be a difference between teams. Right now some have it, some have it partially, some don't. If it was ECU controlled surely everyone would use it?

#11939 George Costanza

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 19:54

And here is the delightful pole of the 1998 Japanese GP, absolute vintage.....

I consider 1997-1998 seasons his best non title year. It's hard for me to choose which would be better, '97 or '98 in terms of driving skill and overall.



http://www.youtube.c...s...der&list=UL


Edited by George Costanza, 06 August 2011 - 20:03.


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#11940 zelpre

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 19:55

Here are my 5 cents.

The only reason the MS-Merc partnership hasn't worked is Mercedes team itself.

This leads to a very urgent question/theory I have. Please discuss it with me, because I think this is the biggest reason MS looks somehow 'different' from vintage MS. It's all about driving style.

Compare MS driving style fom onboards 2006 vs 2011. I know they are different cars, but that doesn't mean that pusing the throttle together with the brakes is not possible anymore.

2006; MS paces the throttle at a fast pace (like Senna used to) during the corner while braking.

(from 0:15)

2011; MS brakes for the corner, waits untill he is out, and then hits the throttle. He isn't using his famous driving technique anymore.
http://www.youtube.c...feature=related
(from 1:08)


Could this be because of a lack of grip on the W02? Please discuss.

And how about this discussion with his egineer: Saying to much oversteer, while MS dissagreeing and saying he still has understeer. http://www.youtube.c...feature=related


Well you can't really compare race (2006) and FP2 (2011) lol

Also about the oversteer...It seems that the car really isn't stable, the steering wheel seems to be so nervous, the handling is so bad...
And I noticed that it was pretty much ok with that in the first race 2010: - that driving is great compared to the last drives in this season...


Edited by zelpre, 06 August 2011 - 20:05.


#11941 Afterburner

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 20:02

I consider 1997-1998 seasons his best non title year. It's hard for me to choose which would be better, '97 or '98 in terms of driving skill and overall.

I probably wouldn't say 1997, for one very obvious reason. :p

2006 is up there for me, namely because of his drive in Brazil that year.

Edited by Afterburner, 06 August 2011 - 20:03.


#11942 Brandz07

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 20:59

Michael should announce his retirement at Monza and get on to Ferrari to let him drive at the last race as they aren't likely to be in the championship fight in my opinion, crazy idea!

#11943 as65p

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 22:12

Michael should announce his retirement at Monza and get on to Ferrari to let him drive at the last race as they aren't likely to be in the championship fight in my opinion, crazy idea!


With Badeor in the 2nd car! :up:

#11944 arknor

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Posted 06 August 2011 - 22:44

And here is the delightful pole of the 1998 Japanese GP, absolute vintage.....

I consider 1997-1998 seasons his best non title year. It's hard for me to choose which would be better, '97 or '98 in terms of driving skill and overall.



http://www.youtube.c...s...der&list=UL

i loved 1998 so many awesome races that year and quite alot of wet ones if i remember right :D

thats my favorite looking formula one car aswell

#11945 ClockworkRacing

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 00:12

1998 was the best non-title season for Schumy,just look at what he did at Hungary,Spa,the guy was doing just great!!

#11946 George Costanza

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 01:07

I think the rules (one can debate about this) are not exactly suting Schumacher's strong points, after all, he was a genius at reeling fastest laps when refueling was in....

But, again, its just a point that one can debate on.... But however, in 1991, Schu was quick automatically, so it might not have some merit to it.

#11947 mrmusicman

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 01:23

Here are my 5 cents.

The only reason the MS-Merc partnership hasn't worked is Mercedes team itself.

This leads to a very urgent question/theory I have. Please discuss it with me, because I think this is the biggest reason MS looks somehow 'different' from vintage MS. It's all about driving style.

Compare MS driving style fom onboards 2006 vs 2011. I know they are different cars, but that doesn't mean that pusing the throttle together with the brakes is not possible anymore.

2006; MS paces the throttle at a fast pace (like Senna used to) during the corner while braking.

(from 0:15)

2011; MS brakes for the corner, waits untill he is out, and then hits the throttle. He isn't using his famous driving technique anymore.
http://www.youtube.c...feature=related
(from 1:08)


Could this be because of a lack of grip on the W02? Please discuss.

And how about this discussion with his egineer: Saying to much oversteer, while MS dissagreeing and saying he still has understeer. http://www.youtube.c...feature=related



Give it a rest. In his prime Michael could drive anything to the limit no matter how bad it handled, and no matter the rules and regulations. Just like Hamilton and Alonso can these days. You can analyse all you want but it's time to accept that at 42 he has simple lost the talent, no need for excuses anymore. One of the best drivers of all time should be able to adapt to any car, that is precisely why they are one of the best drivers of all time, and Michael no longer is.

#11948 Sakae

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 02:34

Give it a rest. In his prime Michael could drive anything to the limit no matter how bad it handled, and no matter the rules and regulations. Just like Hamilton and Alonso can these days. You can analyse all you want but it's time to accept that at 42 he has simple lost the talent, no need for excuses anymore. One of the best drivers of all time should be able to adapt to any car, that is precisely why they are one of the best drivers of all time, and Michael no longer is.

Let me see what you are writing,

We have this group of drivers, who are best drivers of all times (they can handle anything on four wheels)
Michael had an aptitute to handle everything, thus he was in that group of best drivers of all times
Michael cannot handle everything (now), because he is 42
Michael therefore doesn't belong to the group of best drivers of all times

Question I have is therefore how many drivers in the exclusive club of best drivers of all time was tested at 42 under similar conditions, and pass the test?

#11949 iakhtar

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 03:04

Alot of people have lost perspective, 42 years old and a few tenths off the pace, it really isn't as bad as some people are making it out to be. He has achieved everything a driver can and will always be one of the F1 legends, nothing can change that.

#11950 EdwardCullen

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Posted 07 August 2011 - 06:58

Alot of people have lost perspective, 42 years old and a few tenths off the pace, it really isn't as bad as some people are making it out to be. He has achieved everything a driver can and will always be one of the F1 legends, nothing can change that.

:up: