Jump to content


Photo

Michael Schumacher (merged)


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
20770 replies to this topic

#14351 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 12 October 2011 - 17:15

Largely true. MS 2005 wasn't as outright fast as MS 2000, whether it be due to passing years or waning hunger.



put 2000 Schumacher vs the current drivers, I would and everyone else likely, would favor Schumacher to win.

Alonso just faced 2006 Schumacher and nearly lost the title.

Advertisement

#14352 zelpre

zelpre
  • Member

  • 275 posts
  • Joined: June 11

Posted 12 October 2011 - 17:20

So unfortunately no rain expected this weekend

#14353 carbonfibre

carbonfibre
  • Member

  • 6,328 posts
  • Joined: February 05

Posted 12 October 2011 - 18:24

Largely true. MS 2005 wasn't as outright fast as MS 2000, whether it be due to passing years or waning hunger.

In 2005 the combo of Ferrari + Bridgestone just didn't stand a chance against Alonso and Renault simple as that. In 2006 the story was a lot different and then the result was a lot more even as well even when Ferrari had a bad start with their V8 not being all to well.

#14354 Schumacher7

Schumacher7
  • Member

  • 738 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 12 October 2011 - 18:27

Formula one is physical but not in the same way as tennis or boxing.

I would have thought that formula 1 would be a lot more physically exerting than football, tennis or boxing. :/
I don't know but I can't imagine you do either, have you driven a formula 1 car or something similar? (Serious question not just being a bitch.)

#14355 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 12 October 2011 - 18:39

In 2005 the combo of Ferrari + Bridgestone just didn't stand a chance against Alonso and Renault simple as that. In 2006 the story was a lot different and then the result was a lot more even as well even when Ferrari had a bad start with their V8 not being all to well.



Ferrari made a good car; largely tire issue.



#14356 Jomyboy

Jomyboy
  • Member

  • 179 posts
  • Joined: May 02

Posted 12 October 2011 - 19:04

I know one can't be bothered to go through the 360 pages of Michael Schumacher - so to summarize, 2005 was in fact a no show for all Bridgestone runners except at the Indianapolis Circuit where the Michelin teams were a no show. I dont think Michael tried that hard nor did Ferrari, cuz there was no point. You can gain 10ths in aero development in all but its the tyre that can gain you a whole second. I think Ferrari and Michael got the hint that FIA and the public in general were tired of them winning all the time and most people started to call F1 boring becuz winning was so easy. I mean if bookies stop taking bets against you then that has got to be the day!!!!! Even during Nigel Mansel's record breaking championship year, bets were still open to be taken. So dont think either Ferrari or Michael cared much if 2005 was a lost cause.

They were pretty much focussed on 2006, and it must have been a rude shock to Ferrari and Bridgestone that Michelin had the better tyre in 2006. You know, for all who say that 2006 was Schumacher vs Alonso I say balls to that. In fact, it was Michael vs. the Michelin tyre runners. He wasn't only fighting Alonso but the Mclarens and the Honda's who were on Michelin's. It was like 2003 again. When the Bridgestone's were good, the rest of the grid had to contend only with the two Ferrari's. But when Michelin were better, running on bridgestones were a real disadvantage. I think 2003 was an incredible salvage job by Schumi and Ferrari. Unfortunately just as 2006 was turning out to be even mega, it just went away in engine fumes @Suzuka.


#14357 arknor

arknor
  • Member

  • 2,298 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 12 October 2011 - 19:29

i just pray schumacher gets car good enough to fight for podiums because im sick of hearing how f1 is morec ompetitive now and the drivers are better when im convinced its not true..

button almost got beat by schumachers lapdog FFS and theres more pay drivers on the grid than ever

#14358 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 12 October 2011 - 21:02

i just pray schumacher gets car good enough to fight for podiums because im sick of hearing how f1 is morec ompetitive now and the drivers are better when im convinced its not true..

button almost got beat by schumachers lapdog FFS and theres more pay drivers on the grid than ever



For that to occur, he might have to stay untl 2013.

#14359 SpeedyTimer

SpeedyTimer
  • Member

  • 88 posts
  • Joined: May 10

Posted 12 October 2011 - 22:03

What we are seeing now with MS is what he always had. Grim determination. It's a quality that a lot of fans didn't like about him (in addition to the fact that he was a bit naughty a couple of times in his career) but I am a huge fan because he is flawed. He doesn't know when to give up. This quality of him has taken him to great heights and also created some moments of madness. He was rightly criticized for some of those actions but who among us hasn't done something stupid. I am just glad to see him race. He is the last of the 'Old Guard'. As a fan, I will savor each race he competes in. Whether he wins again or not .. well .. that is yet to be seen.

Since his comeback, he has taken his time to understand where he needs to improve. He has taken in a loooooot of criticism. A lot of it was unfair apart from the Barrichello incident. But he has just worked hard and focused on getting to the front. Beating Rosberg has never been an objective for him. I am one of those fanatics who watches the live timing page while watching the race and I can confidently say that when it comes to race pace, MS has the edge over Nico this year. Nico should be worried. Should MS beat Nico this year, Nico's stock will fall.



I agree 100%. His will to win borders on pathological. Look at Quali Monoco '06. When he parked the car I nearly pissed myelf laughing and I couldn't wait to hear how he was going to explain himself out of that one (or not).

Some people would say we are flawed for admiring these qualities, but when the chips are down and something needs to be done I know whom I would rather associate myself with. Someone who will take the bull by the horns and shake the hell out of him instead of lying back and allowing his n*ts to be gouged out of him. No crying after the deserved penalty for those shenanigans but let his racecraft do his talking for him, last to 6th? place in Monaco... a man's man.

I do not know whether or not his skill has really diminished all that much in his later years. One only has to look at Monaco '06 and Brazil '06 to see how racey he was back then.. And this year we have seen the flashes of Brilliance again...Canada, Monza, and Japan.

As said by many others in this thread, the lack of testing has been the biggest detriment to his lack of form in 2010 and the first part of this year. I sincerely think that he has his MoJo back, and if MB can provide him with a competitive car in 2012 there will be alot of brown stained racing suits from the rest of the field and this Forum will go Loco. The LH-fest/LH-bash will Trulli be insignificant compared to the bashing/promotion of the "Flawed One". :p

Advertisement

#14360 Sakae

Sakae
  • Member

  • 19,256 posts
  • Joined: December 03

Posted 12 October 2011 - 22:25

F1 world will go nuts next year, should he make it onto podium. Vettel v. Schumacher is the ultimate showdown that I want to see, before I let out my last breath.

#14361 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

Ferrari_F1_fan_2001
  • Member

  • 3,420 posts
  • Joined: May 01

Posted 12 October 2011 - 23:54

F1 world will go nuts next year, should he make it onto podium. Vettel v. Schumacher is the ultimate showdown that I want to see, before I let out my last breath.


I think we may see it next year on a few occasions. We could have seen it in Canada 2011 had a dry line not emerged. Schumacher was in awesome form at that race.

I wonder how Sebastian would handle racing wheel to wheel with his idol and mentor.

#14362 cheapracer

cheapracer
  • Member

  • 10,388 posts
  • Joined: May 07

Posted 13 October 2011 - 01:51

I think he's doing just great remembering that F1 is now more competitive than ever and the drivers are also better than ever before.

#14363 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 13 October 2011 - 02:03

I think he's doing just great remembering that F1 is now more competitive than ever and the drivers are also better than ever before.



I don't agree.

1980s and early 1990s were more quality drivers; espeically 1991.

Senna, Prost, Mansell, Mika, Schumacher, Piquet were all on the grid in 1991.

Jean Alesi and Damon Hill were there also (Hill in '93).

I would, of course, take Senna over any driver today, except for Schu.

Edited by George Costanza, 13 October 2011 - 02:05.


#14364 merschu

merschu
  • Member

  • 520 posts
  • Joined: December 09

Posted 13 October 2011 - 11:21

Michael Schumacher: “I came here to succeed…”

Michael Schumacher is now only three points behind team mate Nico Rosberg, but the former World Champion says that finishing ahead of his countryman is not an extra spur as the end of the season approaches.

“To me that is not what matters,” said Schumacher in Korea today. “I think we have spoken about this some time before, whether I’m placed in front or behind him, that’s not what matters. To me it matters that as a team we go in the right direction, that we get the car that we need to really fight for a front position, and then it will matter where I am against him.”

Michael said there was no one reason for his recent improvement in form: “I guess in the end it’s a combination of many things, and the point is we are able to achieve more often to get 100% out of the car. That has not always been the case, but it’s very clear that since about three or four races we’ve been pretty consistent this way.”

Schumacher added that the recent arrival of Aldo Costa and Geoff Willis was a major boost for the team.

“I came here to succeed, together with Mercedes. On the way there obviously after the first two years, or first one and a half years, it was obvious that we needed to raise our game.

“And despite that we have fantastic engineers and great guys, we just need more capacity, and that’s what has arrived with two guys, one obviously Aldo that I know from the past, working together with in Ferrari days, and Geoff I’ve heard he’s been involved with the team in the past. So, two men with a wealth of experience that should help for the future.”


http://adamcooperf1....ere-to-succeed/



#14365 sharo

sharo
  • Member

  • 1,792 posts
  • Joined: April 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 11:25

“To me that is not what matters,” said Schumacher in Korea today. “I think we have spoken about this some time before, whether I’m placed in front or behind him, that’s not what matters. To me it matters that as a team we go in the right direction, that we get the car that we need to really fight for a front position, and then it will matter where I am against him.”


Well, that's what me and some others here have kept on saying since last year. Now you can read it in Michael's own words.

#14366 GoRacing

GoRacing
  • Member

  • 291 posts
  • Joined: May 10

Posted 13 October 2011 - 13:32

Well, that's what me and some others here have kept on saying since last year. Now you can read it in Michael's own words.


I agree. He's so confident that once he has a quick car that can fight at the front, he will beat Nico.

Edited by GoRacing, 13 October 2011 - 13:33.


#14367 schubacca

schubacca
  • Member

  • 800 posts
  • Joined: May 10

Posted 13 October 2011 - 13:42

Well, that's what me and some others here have kept on saying since last year. Now you can read it in Michael's own words.


That is what I always have thought also.

#14368 cheapracer

cheapracer
  • Member

  • 10,388 posts
  • Joined: May 07

Posted 13 October 2011 - 13:51

I don't agree.


The post wasn't meant for you :lol:


#14369 ali.unal

ali.unal
  • Member

  • 3,475 posts
  • Joined: June 09

Posted 13 October 2011 - 13:54

I think 2003 was an incredible salvage job by Schumi and Ferrari. Unfortunately just as 2006 was turning out to be even mega, it just went away in engine fumes @Suzuka.

That is they very moment still burning inside me. His hand shaking with his mechanics. Gosh. What a terrible day it was.

#14370 schubacca

schubacca
  • Member

  • 800 posts
  • Joined: May 10

Posted 13 October 2011 - 14:13

That is they very moment still burning inside me. His hand shaking with his mechanics. Gosh. What a terrible day it was.



For me, that day highlighted what a professional MS is.

The engine blows, but he does not get upset at Ferrari, understanding that it was the team that provided such good machinery for him all those years and championships.

Utter class...

#14371 Tardis40

Tardis40
  • Member

  • 759 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 14:29

For me, that day highlighted what a professional MS is.

The engine blows, but he does not get upset at Ferrari, understanding that it was the team that provided such good machinery for him all those years and championships.

Utter class...


Yes, there were storm clouds in his eyes as he climbed out of the stricken Ferrari but when he reached the garage his thoughts were for the teammates.


#14372 zelpre

zelpre
  • Member

  • 275 posts
  • Joined: June 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 15:34

Michael&Nico ratings from Japanese GP.

Posted Image

LOL

Did Michael ever got more than 8? How much did he got for Spa, going from last to fifth?

#14373 MightyMoose

MightyMoose
  • RC Forum Host

  • 1,141 posts
  • Joined: July 10

Posted 13 October 2011 - 15:41

Michael&Nico ratings from Japanese GP.

Posted Image

LOL

Did Michael ever got more than 8? How much did he got for Spa, going from last to fifth?

If that's Ed Straw writing those scores then we all know he's somewhat lacking in objectivity regarding MS (and probably SV as well). Ain't no way NR had as good a race as MS on Sunday, he did well, MS did better & the scores should reflect that (9 for MS, 8 for NR imo).

#14374 rm111

rm111
  • Member

  • 406 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 13 October 2011 - 17:12

Michael&Nico ratings from Japanese GP.

Posted Image

LOL

Did Michael ever got more than 8? How much did he got for Spa, going from last to fifth?

schumi was best of the rest outside the big four teams :confused:

Edited by rm111, 13 October 2011 - 17:13.


#14375 Ferrari_F1_fan_2001

Ferrari_F1_fan_2001
  • Member

  • 3,420 posts
  • Joined: May 01

Posted 13 October 2011 - 17:16

schumi was best of the rest outside the big four teams :confused:


Yup, Renault is among the top four teams, ya know :D

#14376 NateF

NateF
  • Member

  • 1,103 posts
  • Joined: April 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 17:25

Taking retirements out, Schumacher's last 4 results have been, 8th, 5th, 5th and 6th, I thought it might rain this weekend ( I predicted earlier that Korea might be his first podium if it rained) but it's actually looking like it will be a dry race so I'm thinking he might finish top six again and if there is some self destructive driving from someone maybe even higher

#14377 walkindude

walkindude
  • Member

  • 867 posts
  • Joined: March 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 17:30

Unfortunately just as 2006 was turning out to be even mega, it just went away in engine fumes @Suzuka.


Oh God.Did you have to remind me of that day again?Terrible terrible moment.Can never forget it.

#14378 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 13 October 2011 - 17:41

Oh God.Did you have to remind me of that day again?Terrible terrible moment.Can never forget it.


Yes... Schumacher would have won the title; had Alonso had trouble in Brazil. say Alonso DNF in Brazil, Schu wins, tie 126-126, Schumacher wins due to more wins. :stoned:

#14379 cheapracer

cheapracer
  • Member

  • 10,388 posts
  • Joined: May 07

Posted 13 October 2011 - 18:16

Michael&Nico ratings from Japanese GP.

Posted Image

LOL

Did Michael ever got more than 8? How much did he got for Spa, going from last to fifth?


Edd, even Damon has gotten over it :lol:


Advertisement

#14380 Fortymark

Fortymark
  • Member

  • 5,809 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 13 October 2011 - 18:21

Sigh, give it a rest please... The better (and fairer) driver won in 2006 despite having more mech failures, end of story.

#14381 Schumacher7

Schumacher7
  • Member

  • 738 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 18:50

Sigh, give it a rest please... The better (and fairer) driver won in 2006 despite having more mech failures, end of story.

Why should people give it a rest? If people want to talk about Michael Schumacher in a Michael Schumacher thread then why not?
It doesn't say "Michael Schumacher - 2010/11" does it? If people want to talk about Michael Schumacher in 2006 then why shouldn't they?

#14382 Kubiccia

Kubiccia
  • Member

  • 1,370 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 22:00

Ivan and some others, you guys were speculating that Schumacher was running less downforce because he was fast in S3 and slow in S1 in the race, but how can he be faster than Mclaren guys through Degner, in qualifying? :well:

Look this:
http://forums.autosp...howtopic=155676

#14383 Richardc

Richardc
  • Member

  • 235 posts
  • Joined: March 11

Posted 13 October 2011 - 22:30

He obviously wasn't tyre saving in the same way in qualifying. He was soooo very restrained through S1 in the race, i guess that's probably the reason.

#14384 arknor

arknor
  • Member

  • 2,298 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 13 October 2011 - 23:52

Sigh, give it a rest please... The better (and fairer) driver won in 2006 despite having more mech failures, end of story.

better driver while they had mass dampener you mean :wave:

alonso won both championships with a technology that was later declared illegal hmmm what does this mean

Edited by arknor, 13 October 2011 - 23:53.


#14385 BRK

BRK
  • Member

  • 3,653 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:08

Sigh, give it a rest please... The better (and fairer) driver won in 2006 despite having more mech failures, end of story.


Yup, the better car certainly won in 2006. Full credit to Renault's engineering team. And Bell is now at Mercedes, working with the man that nearly won 5 years ago, should be good. :up:

#14386 cheapracer

cheapracer
  • Member

  • 10,388 posts
  • Joined: May 07

Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:31

Sigh, give it a rest please... The better (and fairer) driver won in 2006 despite having more mech failures, end of story.


Factually incorrect, Schumacher failed to finish 3 races, Australia, Hungary and Japan while Alonso failed to finish 2 races, Hungary and Italy.

If you want to do your typically historic trolling in the Schumacher thread, then make some sort of effort to get your actual facts correct.



#14387 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:35

Yup, the better car certainly won in 2006. Full credit to Renault's engineering team. And Bell is now at Mercedes, working with the man that nearly won 5 years ago, should be good. :up:




Well, Ferrari was faster than the Renault from 2nd half onward. Not too sure if the better car was largely due to Alonso driving skill.

#14388 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:36

Yup, the better car certainly won in 2006. Full credit to Renault's engineering team. And Bell is now at Mercedes, working with the man that nearly won 5 years ago, should be good. :up:



Bob Bell did not exactly design the RS25 and RS26, Tim Densham did.

That said, Bob Bell is a good TD.

Edited by George Costanza, 14 October 2011 - 01:36.


#14389 BRK

BRK
  • Member

  • 3,653 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 14 October 2011 - 01:59

Well, Ferrari was faster than the Renault from 2nd half onward. Not too sure if the better car was largely due to Alonso driving skill.


Retrospective oversimplification? I can think of 3-4 races in the second half of the season where Ferrari had an advantage, Renault definitely did have a quicker car for at least half of the last nine races, off the top of my head, plus the Michelins had an enormous advantage in wet and damp conditions. Hungary and China in particular should have pathetic for the reds, Schumacher's win in China was spectacular as Ferrari didn't stand a chance at that race. At Hungary Michael retired but got bumped up into the points only because Kubica was DQ'ed later.

This talk of Ferrari having had an advantage for the entire second half is a myth.

Edited by BRK, 14 October 2011 - 01:59.


#14390 George Costanza

George Costanza
  • Member

  • 2,856 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:15

Retrospective oversimplification? I can think of 3-4 races in the second half of the season where Ferrari had an advantage, Renault definitely did have a quicker car for at least half of the last nine races, off the top of my head, plus the Michelins had an enormous advantage in wet and damp conditions. Hungary and China in particular should have pathetic for the reds, Schumacher's win in China was spectacular as Ferrari didn't stand a chance at that race. At Hungary Michael retired but got bumped up into the points only because Kubica was DQ'ed later.

This talk of Ferrari having had an advantage for the entire second half is a myth.




Ferrari was quicker in the second half of the season just after the mass damper was banned by the FIA to Renault. It became a bit more even after that. German GP 2006: Renault was nowhere near the Ferrari pace wise as an example.

As for as China, the Bridgestone tires were not as good as the Renault-shodded Michelins and Schu made all the difference.... Ironically, in prior years, Bridgestone used to be the better wet tire... But not the case in 2006.

Edited by George Costanza, 14 October 2011 - 02:17.


#14391 Sakae

Sakae
  • Member

  • 19,256 posts
  • Joined: December 03

Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:17

Bob Bell did not exactly design the RS25 and RS26, Tim Densham did.

That said, Bob Bell is a good TD.

...TD and bunch of other nameless engineers sweating like slaves 7/24.

Edited by Sakae, 14 October 2011 - 02:18.


#14392 BRK

BRK
  • Member

  • 3,653 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:34

Ferrari was quicker in the second half of the season just after the mass damper was banned by the FIA to Renault. It became a bit more even after that. German GP 2006: Renault was nowhere near the Ferrari pace wise as an example. As for as China, the Bridgestone tires were not as good as the Renault-shodded Michelins and Schu made all the difference.... Ironically, in prior years, Bridgestone used to be the better wet tire... But not the case in 2006.


Renault destroyed Ferrari at Hungary and China, that in itself should disprove the theory that Ferrari + Bridgestone had an advantage throughout the second half. It wasn't anywhere near as straightforward, anything but a perfect 50:50 season.




#14393 Sakae

Sakae
  • Member

  • 19,256 posts
  • Joined: December 03

Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:44

Jesus FP1 - Schumacher / Vettel - I need to change...

#14394 weston

weston
  • Member

  • 375 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 14 October 2011 - 02:58

Jesus FP1 - Schumacher / Vettel - I need to change...


It is raining very hard. Take an umbrella. :lol:

(Even Jos could not have done better in FP1. It looked like at tropical rain but Schumacher was on interns.)

Edited by weston, 14 October 2011 - 03:50.


#14395 Spa95

Spa95
  • Member

  • 861 posts
  • Joined: April 03

Posted 14 October 2011 - 05:01

Change of gearbox on Michaels car (according to Anthony Davidson) - is that a planned change?

*Edit: Now it's just a "gearbox issue". Hopefully they didn't need to replace it after all.

Edited by Spa95, 14 October 2011 - 05:13.


#14396 ivand911

ivand911
  • Member

  • 8,152 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 14 October 2011 - 05:38

Change of gearbox on Michaels car (according to Anthony Davidson) - is that a planned change?

*Edit: Now it's just a "gearbox issue". Hopefully they didn't need to replace it after all.

I also hear it. About the change I mean. Can they use older gearbox in FP?


#14397 Tardis40

Tardis40
  • Member

  • 759 posts
  • Joined: February 11

Posted 14 October 2011 - 05:53

Ferrari came on in 2006 after they got the V8 engine sorted. They were burning pistons at the start of the season and Renault jumped out to a sizable lead. Schumacher clawed it back and then another engine problem in Japan cost him the title.

Edited by Tardis40, 14 October 2011 - 05:54.


#14398 ivand911

ivand911
  • Member

  • 8,152 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:04

Very few laps for MS.

#14399 Tarzaan

Tarzaan
  • Member

  • 1,322 posts
  • Joined: April 06

Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:24

Michael Schumacher sets the fastest time in wet Korean GP practice

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/95325

:clap:

Advertisement

#14400 SparkPlug

SparkPlug
  • Member

  • 491 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 14 October 2011 - 06:42

Factually incorrect, Schumacher failed to finish 3 races, Australia, Hungary and Japan while Alonso failed to finish 2 races, Hungary and Italy.

If you want to do your typically historic trolling in the Schumacher thread, then make some sort of effort to get your actual facts correct.

Failing to finish is different from having mechanical failures.

Schumacher crashed out of Australia and Hungary due to his own errors.
Wheras Alonso had no role to play in the engine failure at Italy or the suspension collapse in Hungary.

You may argue that Brazil's qualifying should also be added to Schumacher's list of mech failures, but surely retiring from a race is far worse than having a mechanical failure in qualifying ? Maybe we should also add that ridiculous penalty that Alonso received at Monza to the list of issues he faced that were not his fault.

I think its fair to say that the better (or rather more consistent) driver won in 2006.