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Michael Schumacher (merged)


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#14601 Fortymark

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:16

It is official: MS is the best driver in the first lap and he is also the unluckiest driver in the field.
Michael said he was keeping his tyres.


It´s a little bit different fighting FI:s, STR´s and Renos than fighting Ferraris, Macs and Redbulls with topdrivers..

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#14602 Urawa

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:19

It´s a little bit different fighting FI:s, STR´s and Renos than fighting Ferraris, Macs and Redbulls with topdrivers..


True, chance of finishing the race is much higher while fighting with the latter group

#14603 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:20

It´s a little bit different fighting FI:s, STR´s and Renos than fighting Ferraris, Macs and Redbulls with topdrivers..

You mean Nico or MS. MS fight with Ferrari they were behind him. And who overtake Nico in the end? Nobody from them really fight RBR. MS could for sure finished this race better than Nico, no matter who fight who.

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 08:21.


#14604 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:20

It´s a little bit different fighting FI:s, STR´s and Renos than fighting Ferraris, Macs and Redbulls with topdrivers..


Indeed.

I am however of the (deluded?) belief that were Michael in a car comparable to the Mclaren, Red Bull and Ferrari's then he would be as strong as the number 1 driver in each of those teams.

:cool:

#14605 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:22

Without the accident I think MS would have been 5th/6th depending on how Alonso got on towards the end of the race.


Sure. And without qualifying problem Nico would have easily won the race in Suzuka...

Anyway, what happened to Alonso? Why was he anywhere near Schumi after the pitstop? Before the stop he was about 10 seconds in front.


#14606 Jejking

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:23

Schumacher, was as usual, saving his tyres until the moment when he needed to push hard. He would have been able stay on his second SS set, more than Rosberg and would have had better tyres towards the end.

I am not saying that he wasn't able to speed up, but not as much as Rosberg. If that's down to saving the car, compared to Rosberg who was at that time just a little down on the train behind the Ferraris and Button, I'm not sure. At the end of his stint his (MSC) times came down but overall Rosberg was faster in that stint. If Rosberg paid the price for it at the end of the race, I don't know because I haven't seen an onboard of him vs Buemi to know if he was able to get max revs.

It is official: MS is the best driver in the first lap and he is also the unluckiest driver in the field.
Michael said he was keeping his tyres.
"Slower" MS somehow overtake both Ferrari and Petrov in the box. So, he was quick enough. He save his tyres for this moment I guess. I doubt he would have used another SS set.

Yes, it was either that, or both FA and VP having a scruffy inlap, or a combo of both. Can someone check that out on LT?

By the way, MSC sprinting past Di Resta with DRS and instantly going purple in S1 by at least 0.6s from ANYONE, it was hilarious :D Very funny to see :)

Edited by Jejking, 16 October 2011 - 08:25.


#14607 Group B

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:31

It´s a little bit different fighting FI:s, STR´s and Renos than fighting Ferraris, Macs and Redbulls with topdrivers..

Well pointed out Forty; it's much tougher in the muddled, unpredictable midfield :up:

#14608 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:36

Alonso lost around 4 sec in the box and 5,5 in his outlap/pit exit. Massa was ahead of MS all the time.
http://www.fia.com/e...ace-history.pdf
MS was around 7 sec behind Nico and 6 sec behind Massa. Still he jump two places.

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 08:44.


#14609 D.M.N.

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:43

Unfortunate accident today. These things happen, sadly.

#14610 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:45

Schumacher, was as usual, saving his tyres until the moment when he needed to push hard. He would have been able stay on his second SS set, more than Rosberg and would have had better tyres towards the end.


Saving his tyres for what? He was clearly slower than Rosberg all the way til his pit stop.



#14611 GoRacing

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:50

Saving his tyres for what? He was clearly slower than Rosberg all the way til his pit stop.


I'm a die-hard MS fan, but if he had been saving tyres, you have to wonder why he did not go further on his 1st stint. He pitted the very next lap after Nico pitted. Maybe he was careful not to punish his tyres that he might have had to pit before everyone else??

Edited by GoRacing, 16 October 2011 - 08:50.


#14612 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:52

I'm a die-hard MS fan, but if he had been saving tyres, you have to wonder why he did not go further on his 1st stint. He pitted the very next lap after Nico pitted. Maybe he was careful not to punish his tyres that he might have had to pit before everyone else??

It is the way of driving that you learn with the new tyres. Maybe you can go faster but for how long? Driving behind McLaren and behind LRGP is different. Ncio somehow pay the price in the end. This wouldn't happen to MS. Maybe he see that Petrov is fast enough and he decided to pass him in the pit.

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 08:55.


#14613 Diablobb81

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 08:55

Not a great first stint by Michael. New options and neither great pace nor longer stint.

Next race.

#14614 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:01

He need to react to the guys around. He still have life in his SS tyres, Nico too I think. But, they pitted.

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 09:05.


#14615 GoRacing

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:06

He need to react to the guys around. He still have life in his SS tyres, Nico too I think. But, they pitted.


He definitely did have some more life I think, set his personal best laptime before he pitted. I think he should have gone a couple of laps further.

Edited by GoRacing, 16 October 2011 - 09:09.


#14616 merschu

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:09

Petrov handed grid-penalty for Indian GP
Sunday 16th October 2011, 10:05

Vitaly Petrov has been given a five-place grid drop for the inaugural Indian Grand Prix following his collision with Michael Schumacher in Korea.

The Renault driver had passed Fernando Alonso using DRS but failed to judge the braking into turn three which led to him hitting the rear of Schumacher's Mercedes, ending both their races.
After the race, Schumacher described the collision as a 'racing incident', though the FIA deemed Petrov fully at fault.

"I didn't see Vitaly coming; I was just suddenly spun into a direction I had not intended to go, and then I saw my rear wing hanging off," said Schumacher. "It was unfortunate but these things happen when you fight hard - that’s racing."
The Russian was also handed a reprimand for his actions.


http://thef1times.co...s/display/04750

#14617 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:10

He definitely did have lot of life I think, set his personal best laptime before he pitted. I think he should have gone a couple of laps further.

the problem is he don't know what lap time will other guys who pitted will do. With the hindsight is easy. :yawnface: Looking now maybe another 2 laps in 1:45 , without Petrov ahead of him could be better. Nico second lap after pitstop was 1:48.5.



#14618 arknor

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:10

Saving his tyres for what? He was clearly slower than Rosberg all the way til his pit stop.

i guess he was lieing after the race then , but im sure you know best...

Edited by arknor, 16 October 2011 - 09:11.


#14619 Diablobb81

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:11

He need to react to the guys around. He still have life in his SS tyres, Nico too I think. But, they pitted.


Michael's pace in the first stint is rarely great. He shines later on.

But with new tires he shouldn't have been 6 sec off. Maybe he was a little bit too conservative in saving tires.

Edited by Diablobb81, 16 October 2011 - 09:12.


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#14620 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:12

if e was so slow in the first stint how did he jump petrov and alonso?

#14621 sharo

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:12

See a lot of posts about the influence of bad starting position, which while true, is not the case today, because Michael had a good start, kept out of trouble and gained 2 places after the start.
When pit stops begin it's about where one would come out. And as long as this was the first stop and the gaps yet not so big, Michael and the Ferraris found themselves among slower cars.

#14622 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:13

Michael's pace in the first stint is rarely great. He shines later on.

But with new tires he shouldn't have been 6 sec off,

Overtaking some guys will do that to you. Also you finish your tyres quickly.
Petrov lost time in the tyre change.
http://www.fia.com/e...ace-summary.pdf

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 09:15.


#14623 GoRacing

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:14

the problem is he don't know what lap time will other guys who pitted will do. With the hindsight is easy. :yawnface: Looking now maybe another 2 laps in 1:45 , without Petrov ahead of him could be better. Nico second lap after pitstop was 1:48.5.


I think he might have also known that Nico and the rest would put on a set of softs, so he at least would have set similar times. It was worth the gamble.

Now on to the next race. I just cannot stand the fact that Nico is ahead in the points standings. :mad:

#14624 sharo

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:21

Now on to the next race. I just cannot stand the fact that Nico is ahead in the points standings. :mad:

That's the least which I can be bothered about. Let them youngsters think they all are incarnations of Senna. :)

#14625 zelpre

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:34

This season is so ****ing disappointing. Always when he has the pace, it's always a crash or a car error. Beh how many points had already been thrown away. He should be way ahead of Rosberg he could be fighting with Massa in the standings. Now massa isn't reachable anymore...


EDIT: Ross "As for Michael's incident, he was driving well, making up positions and minding his own business when somebody simply forgot to brake at turn three."

Edited by zelpre, 16 October 2011 - 09:44.


#14626 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:50

i guess he was lieing after the race then , but im sure you know best...


Well, maybe he had some use for those tyres at home and he was saving them for that... :p


#14627 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:52

This season is so ****ing disappointing. Always when he has the pace, it's always a crash or a car error.


Except that he didn't have any pace today.


#14628 Sakae

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:52

This season is so ****ing disappointing. Always when he has the pace, it's always a crash or a car error. Beh how many points had already been thrown away. He should be way ahead of Rosberg he could be fighting with Massa in the standings. Now massa isn't reachable anymore...


EDIT: Ross "As for Michael's incident, he was driving well, making up positions and minding his own business when somebody simply forgot to brake at turn three."

That's what you get when Russian's mindset was voiced by him "I don't brake for Schumacher" - couple of seasons back. Idi**.

#14629 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:54

Well, maybe he had some use for those tyres at home and he was saving them for that... :p

To explain to you because you don't get it apparently. SS tyres were suppose to last 10 laps, MS did 14, this is why he was keeping them. Maybe their plan was to go even further , 2-3 laps more, maybe, but he reacted to Petrov stop to overtake him for sure in the pit. LRGP are usually 2-3 sec slower in the pit change.

Except that he didn't have any pace today.

One stint don't make the whole race. Another explanation to you. You first F1 season was 2010 ,right?

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 09:57.


#14630 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:55

I think you're all over reacting
it was just a mistake, that's racing, accidents happen. it was not like petrov was trying to pass michael and made a stupid error, he was in another fight, playing chicken with alonso and didn't have the option of running wide (as fred had)

michael hit koba this year missjudging his breaking point. that makes neither of them idiot, just being on the edge

let's move on to the next race, no point in crying over spilled milk

#14631 zelpre

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 09:59

Except that he didn't have any pace today.


From my view I thought the same after some laps when he couldn't keep it up with Petrov. Then I realized he will got him in the last laps when tyres will start to degrade very much and Michael is always better at that point.
And I was right, if you didn't watch or heard the interview he did for RTL he said that he was saving the tyres at that stage of the race and in the last 2 laps of the stint he got closer( he was 1 second behind Petrov right before the pit) and after the pits he passed Petrov and Alonso.

Edited by zelpre, 16 October 2011 - 09:59.


#14632 sharo

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:00

Yep, we should take example from Michaels reaction and comments, despite the obvious disappointment.

#14633 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:01

MS was faster in FP3 on the long run with SS than Nico.
http://www.fia.com/e...sion3-times.pdf

#14634 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:05

MS was faster in FP3 on the long run with SS than Nico.
http://www.fia.com/e...sion3-times.pdf


Ok, now you are just being desperate. :rotfl:


#14635 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:09

Ok, now you are just being desperate. :rotfl:

It is just simple fact. What make me desperate? Nico pace was not great in the latter part in the race too.

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 10:21.


#14636 Wi000

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:11

Yep, we should take example from Michaels reaction and comments, despite the obvious disappointment.

Exactly shit happens but Michael takes it all in his stride. Classy guy. :up:

#14637 Urawa

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:12

MS is always cautious in the first stint, might be setup or fuel related

#14638 Sakae

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:16

I think you're all over reacting
it was just a mistake, that's racing, accidents happen. it was not like petrov was trying to pass michael and made a stupid error, he was in another fight, playing chicken with alonso and didn't have the option of running wide (as fred had)

michael hit koba this year missjudging his breaking point. that makes neither of them idiot, just being on the edge

let's move on to the next race, no point in crying over spilled milk


Petrov has done enough sniffing of Schumacher; check history. It might not been always his fault, but he has to get of his fat a** and start thinking like a F1 racer, not GP2 kamikaze torpedo before he gets too close to someone. He doesn't has in him to drive in proximity of 10 cm of anyone, and I doubt that he ever will.

Edited by Sakae, 16 October 2011 - 10:16.


#14639 FW09

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:25

MS is always cautious in the first stint, might be setup or fuel related


So he's slow in qualifying, slow in the first stint, and crashes a lot.

Seems like Nico's way of spending his tyres and fuel and only being a bit crap in the end of races works better.


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#14640 arknor

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:33

Well, maybe he had some use for those tyres at home and he was saving them for that... :p

or maybe they didnt expect the tyres to last for aslong as they did seeing as everyone was talking about 3-4 stops and schumacher was planning on doing 1 stop less than everyone else but that went out of the window

#14641 Urawa

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:39

So he's slow in qualifying, slow in the first stint, and crashes a lot.

Seems like Nico's way of spending his tyres and fuel and only being a bit crap in the end of races works better.


Dabatable when you get outscored since Barcelona, despite your teammate having 3 more dnf´s.


#14642 Diablobb81

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:46

Of course one explatanation could be that the tires had way more life than expected andd he also felt that he couldn't overtake Petrov on track and held back.

#14643 Diablobb81

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:50

So he's slow in qualifying, slow in the first stint, and crashes a lot.

Seems like Nico's way of spending his tyres and fuel and only being a bit crap in the end of races works better.

Yes, starting 7th and finishing 8th is amazing. With 2 more DNF's Michael is only 7 points behind and has better results.

#14644 Urawa

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 10:55

I think there was no need to bring him in and they were just purely reacting to what others did.
Michael´s times were just coming down niceley, posting his personal FL. I guess they wanted to cover the two Ferrari.

#14645 ivand911

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 11:29

So he's slow in qualifying, slow in the first stint, and crashes a lot.
Seems like Nico's way of spending his tyres and fuel and only being a bit crap in the end of races works better.

It is important where you finish the race, but you didn't know that? And what to explain to the guy who thinks MS was responsible for Petrov hitting him?

I think there was no need to bring him in and they were just purely reacting to what others did.
Michael´s times were just coming down niceley, posting his personal FL. I guess they wanted to cover the two Ferrari.

It really gives him two places with that pitstop. Alonso was somehow bonus. But, this was not the problem deciding MS race. :rolleyes:

Edited by ivand911, 16 October 2011 - 11:31.


#14646 zelpre

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:21

Schumacher shouldn't be kicked out of F1 for hitting Petrov in Turkey and Valencia, should he?


You serious? In turkey Petrov was doing the similar thing he did in Korea, he was breaking too late on the inside.

Oh yes and in both cases Turkey and Valencia Petrov retired right? This situation is so different, in Korea Petrov simply forgot to brake!

#14647 Augurk

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:32

Why all the hate towards Petrov? He was racing Fernando, who also missed his braking point by a mile. They pushed each other and unfortunately Michael was in the way before Petrov. Who cares. Possibly a 6th or 7th place lost. Big deal. We have been long shown that Michaels pace is back. I don't need him to be ahead of Nico at the end of the year to prove that.

Wish some of you could be as relaxed about it as the man himself. He doesn't seem to care about losing a 7th place. I (and him) was more sad when he got his best result of the year yet missed out on the podium due to a combination of idiotic FIA safety car deployment and DRS. Let's just hope for a fight for podiums and wins next year.

#14648 Sakae

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:40

There is no specific hate towards Petrov, but considering that he is not rookie yet the way he drives, questions is, whether he should be actually in F1 at all.

Edited by Sakae, 16 October 2011 - 12:41.


#14649 SeanValen

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:42

Why all the hate towards Petrov? He was racing Fernando, who also missed his braking point by a mile. They pushed each other and unfortunately Michael was in the way before Petrov. Who cares. Possibly a 6th or 7th place lost. Big deal. We have been long shown that Michaels pace is back. I don't need him to be ahead of Nico at the end of the year to prove that.

Wish some of you could be as relaxed about it as the man himself. He doesn't seem to care about losing a 7th place. I (and him) was more sad when he got his best result of the year yet missed out on the podium due to a combination of idiotic FIA safety car deployment and DRS. Let's just hope for a fight for podiums and wins next year.




Canada 2011 will do down as worst use of the safety car for as long as my memory remembers, they waited until the track was ready for intermediates, they waited so long, you wonder if realised wet tyres were brought in for a wet race,, then thinking they really safe, they let DRS be activated on a drying track, both situations easily robbed Michael of 2nd place finish, and who knows with Vettel tripping up near the end, had they let them race in the wet earlier, maybe just maybe, Michael would of contested a rain win, mark webber who's good in the wet himself, was easily beaten, only Vettel left to go. Gotta be a moment of the year there. MS has won Canada like 7-8 times, it showed in that performance.

Edited by SeanValen, 16 October 2011 - 12:44.


#14650 Urawa

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Posted 16 October 2011 - 12:46

Why all the hate towards Petrov? He was racing Fernando, who also missed his braking point by a mile. They pushed each other and unfortunately Michael was in the way before Petrov. Who cares. Possibly a 6th or 7th place lost. Big deal. We have been long shown that Michaels pace is back. I don't need him to be ahead of Nico at the end of the year to prove that.

Wish some of you could be as relaxed about it as the man himself. He doesn't seem to care about losing a 7th place. I (and him) was more sad when he got his best result of the year yet missed out on the podium due to a combination of idiotic FIA safety car deployment and DRS. Let's just hope for a fight for podiums and wins next year.



+1

he´s back and I wouldn´t rule out that he´ll make another step of improvement next season.
There´s nothing to worry about now except for the 2012 car...