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#15251 schubacca

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 18:48

Hang on there a moment, Schumacher got comprehensively trashed by Rosberg last season, a total spanking, a complete schooling did Schumacher receive at the gifted hands of Mr. Rosberg, and this season sees Schumacher struggling mightily to get on even terms with the young talented Rosberg. So even if Schumacher does manage to eek out a higher points tally this season (with the aid of Ross and team orders it would now appear) it does not mean that Schumacher is better then the winless Mr. Rosberg. The combined points tallies for the past two seasons is Rosberg 217 Schumacher 142, Schumacher's total points deficit since he was teamed with young Mr. Rosberg is 75 points. If and when Schumacher manages to even up those numbers then we could say he has reached the same level as Rosberg. That leaves a long row to hoe for Schumacher, even with Ross in his corner screwing Rosberg at every turn it will still be a long time before Schumacher can manage to erase that enormous deficit. So at the moment Schumacher is not even a match for Rosberg and may never be.

Now consider this Schumacher has toiled two seasons as Rosberg's number two and in that time he has yet to manage a points total in either of those years that is greater then the total deficit for the two season period in question. Holy Crap!
Looking at the numbers this way it would seem obvious that Schumacher is currently a mid pack driver (flattered by teamorders) Combine that with all the ugly baggage that comes with Schumacher, punting, cheating, chopping, parking…. and it becomes very very clear that Schumacher is not and never will be among the great drivers of F1. Drivers like Senna Villeneuve, Clark, Alonso, Ascari, Rindt, Peterson, Stewart, Lauda! … Schumacher’s spotted record and his total sportsmanship fail over the years completely and entirely excludes him for consideration. That is not even mentioning the FACT that he can't best Rosberg without Ross hamstringing Nico. Schumacher among the greats ....pfffft not a chance.


That was a good laugh......

Using the performance of a 41 year old (in 2010) to characterize ALL of his career?

Misrepresenting the narrowing of that gap by a 42 year old, by your own flights of fancy (team orders?) in 2011?

Criticizing MS's ruthlessness ontrack, while simultaneously lauding Senna.....?

Man..... Like others have said....

You Know MS is Back When Utter BS Like This Emerges :)

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#15252 Group B

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 18:56

Hang on there a moment, Schumacher got comprehensively trashed by Rosberg last season, a total spanking, a complete schooling did Schumacher receive at the gifted hands of Mr. Rosberg, and this season sees Schumacher struggling mightily to get on even terms with the young talented Rosberg. So even if Schumacher does manage to eek out a higher points tally this season (with the aid of Ross and team orders it would now appear) it does not mean that Schumacher is better then the winless Mr. Rosberg. The combined points tallies for the past two seasons is Rosberg 217 Schumacher 142, Schumacher's total points deficit since he was teamed with young Mr. Rosberg is 75 points. If and when Schumacher manages to even up those numbers then we could say he has reached the same level as Rosberg. That leaves a long row to hoe for Schumacher, even with Ross in his corner screwing Rosberg at every turn it will still be a long time before Schumacher can manage to erase that enormous deficit. So at the moment Schumacher is not even a match for Rosberg and may never be.

Now consider this Schumacher has toiled two seasons as Rosberg's number two and in that time he has yet to manage a points total in either of those years that is greater then the total deficit for the two season period in question. Holy Crap!
Looking at the numbers this way it would seem obvious that Schumacher is currently a mid pack driver (flattered by teamorders) Combine that with all the ugly baggage that comes with Schumacher, punting, cheating, chopping, parking…. and it becomes very very clear that Schumacher is not and never will be among the great drivers of F1. Drivers like Senna Villeneuve, Clark, Alonso, Ascari, Rindt, Peterson, Stewart, Lauda! … Schumacher’s spotted record and his total sportsmanship fail over the years completely and entirely excludes him for consideration. That is not even mentioning the FACT that he can't best Rosberg without Ross hamstringing Nico. Schumacher among the greats ....pfffft not a chance.

:lol:
How's Jacques lately, Slate? Still a has-been, never-was, only won in a hyper car, made a clown of himself at BAR, long since forgotten turd? :eek: I can understand your wild-eyed rants to be fair, given that Michael looks FAR more competitive at 42 than your hero did at 32 :lol:

#15253 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 19:13

How's Jacques lately, Slate? Still a has-been, never-was, only won in a hyper car, made a clown of himself at BAR, long since forgotten turd? I can understand your wild-eyed rants to be fair, given that Michael looks FAR more competitive at 42 than your hero did at 32

I see you cannot refute any of the elements of my post so you attack wee Jacques. Here is a link to the Villeneuve thread. <a href="http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=107692" target="_blank">http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=107692</a>

Edited by SlateGray, 04 November 2011 - 00:45.


#15254 Group B

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 19:38

I see you cannot refute any of the elements of my post so you attack one of victims of Schumacher’s ugly sportsmanship failures instead, nice, classy …. childish. Here is a link to the current Villeneuve thread. <a href="http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=107692" target="_blank">http://forums.autosport.com/index.php?showtopic=107692</a>

Your 'arguments' can be refuted all day long Slate, but since you're long since proven to be wilfuly obtuse and not remotely interested in debate, only flaim bating, it would be a abject waste of 10 minutes typing. Far more fun to hold up a mirror reflecting your posting method :wave:

#15255 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 19:56

Your 'arguments' can be refuted all day long Slate, but since you're long since proven to be wilfuly obtuse and not remotely interested in debate, only flaim bating, it would be a abject waste of 10 minutes typing. Far more fun to hold up a mirror reflecting your posting method

So you say you can but you really cannot, leaving you with nothing.
Did I get the numbers wrong? Was difference greater or lesser then the numbers indicate? Perhaps there is an error, if so please accept my apologies did Schumacher not cheat and ram and chop and park ... did those things not happen?

Edited by SlateGray, 04 November 2011 - 00:47.


#15256 Diablobb81

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 19:58

Well, you do have a point: he isn't among the greatest.

He is the greatest.

#15257 Group B

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 20:54

So you say you can but you really cannot, leaving you with nothing.
Did I get the numbers wrong? Was the beating handed to Schumacher greater or lesser then the numbers indicate? Perhaps there is an error, if so please accept my apologies did Schumacher not cheat and ram and chop and park ... did those things not happen? Do you Schumacher supporters really want to consider him among the greats when he can't even beat a winless journeyman? Refute away …. Oh sorry forgot the truth cannot be refuted. Guess you will just have to live with Schumacher warts and all.

And there you go, proving my point perfectly. Spinning like Tony Blair on steroids you cutely imply MS at 42 is the MS that should be judged for 'greatness' and brush off his opponent as a winless jouneyman as if it's widely accepted he's useless. Part one of that claim is catestrophically flawed, part two is very highly debatable, and the whole is exactly the sort of myopic inflamatory idiocy that got you banned for trolling and is the reason you have absolutely no credibility. That's the truth, warts 'n all.

#15258 baddog

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 20:55

Slatey is no troll. One of the most consistently wrongheaded posters over a 10 year period I have ever seen, but a genuine guy nonetheless.

Oh and when Michael finishes ahead this year it will mean he is better than Rosberg right now. Significantly better in fact, given that the points-loss from fortune have been skewed against him not towards him. F1 works in seasons.. they even award a trophy for each one of those ;)

And lets face it Michael isnt going to get worse and Nico isnt going to get better. last year was as good as it gets for Nico in that partnership. No wonder he is flailing in the press.

#15259 Afterburner

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 21:02

I see you cannot refute any of the elements of my post so you attack one of victims of Schumacher’s ugly sportsmanship failures instead, nice, classy …. childish.

Let's see... because of that move, Schumacher gets DSQ'd, Villeneuve becomes WDC.

"Victim"? :rotfl:

Do you Schumacher supporters really want to consider him among the greats when he can't even beat a winless journeyman? Refute away …. Oh sorry forgot the truth cannot be refuted. Guess you will just have to live with Schumacher warts and all.

Right--and 'warts and all', including his arguably lousy comeback, Adelaide '94, Jerez '97, Monaco '06, Schumacher is still one of my favourite drivers, if not my favourite (hard choice between him and Vettel). :)

He set a new benchmark in terms of success throughout his career, due in part to the team he built at Ferrari. If you can't understand the magnitude of Schumacher's achievements and the impact they had on F1, then I'm sorry. After reading some of your posts from years ago, I know that you aren't completely incapable of objectivity--why is it then, that when it comes to the topic of MS, you choose to make posts like this rather than being balanced about it? You'll make far more friends than enemies that way, even among people who disagree with you. ;)

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#15260 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 21:51

Slatey is no troll. One of the most consistently wrongheaded posters over a 10 year period I have ever seen, but a genuine guy nonetheless.

Oh and when Michael finishes ahead this year it will mean he is better than Rosberg right now. Significantly better in fact, given that the points-loss from fortune have been skewed against him not towards him. F1 works in seasons.. they even award a trophy for each one of those ;)

And lets face it Michael isnt going to get worse and Nico isnt going to get better. last year was as good as it gets for Nico in that partnership. No wonder he is flailing in the press.


Thanks for the support baddog, I know you to be a lover of F1 and a fan of quality driving as am I.
I also know you are a supporter of Michael Schumacher which makes your support of "Slatey" all the more appreciated. I have noticed that you are one of the few posters that look at the facts square in the face even if you don't like the facts and base your judgements on rational thought. You take the time to understand others points of view and counter with your always well written and balanced opinions. Thank you for that.
I don't see that from any of the other Schumacher supporters, all we ever get from them is knee jerk attacks on posters who's message they cannot or will not engage. Simply attack the messenger, call names, or cry to the admins. While I admit my posting about Schumacher is very one sided it is only as a counter to those that think Schumacher is the best ever. When faced with points to the contrary do these Schumacher supporters try to refute, challenge, dispute or disprove? No they call names and throw sticks and stones. The surest sign of a failed position. Hats off to you baddog I just wish there where more rational supporters of Schumacher on this board, but there in lies the rub, being rational and a Schumacher supporter is a unnatural mix it would seem.

#15261 Group B

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:00

Thanks for the support baddog, I know you to be a lover of F1 and a fan of quality driving as am I.
I also know you are a supporter of Michael Schumacher which makes your support of "Slatey" all the more appreciated. I have noticed that you are one of the few posters that look at the facts square in the face even if you don't like the facts and base your judgements on rational thought. You take the time to understand others points of view and counter with your always well written and balanced opinions. Thank you for that.
I don't see that from any of the other Schumacher supporters, all we ever get from them is knee jerk attacks on posters who's message they cannot or will not engage. Simply attack the messenger, call names, or cry to the admins. While I admit my posting about Schumacher is very one sided it is only as a counter to those that think Schumacher is the best ever. When faced with points to the contrary do these Schumacher supporters try to refute, challenge, dispute or disprove? No they call names and throw sticks and stones. The surest sign of a failed position. Hats off to you baddog I just wish there where more rational supporters of Schumacher on this board, but there in lies the rub, being rational and a Schumacher supporter is a unnatural mix it would seem.

Why not stop the hypocrisy and address your critics then? For example, do you honestly think it a fair, sensible and objective argument to suggest that MS can't be considered among the greats because he (at 42) can't beat a winless jouneyman (Rosberg)?

#15262 Raelene

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:05

know you to be a lover of F1 and a fan of quality driving as am I.


that's an absolute load of crap - you are not a lover of F1 - you are just someone that likes to come in here and flame and stir. If you were a love rof F1, you would not do that

#15263 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:13

Why not stop the hypocrisy and address your critics then? For example, do you honestly think it a fair, sensible and objective argument to suggest that MS can't be considered among the greats because he (at 42) can't beat a winless jouneyman (Rosberg)?

Considering all the crowing his supporters do, "the greatest ever blah blah blah" the answer is yes I think it a fair, sensible and objective argument to suggest that Schumacher cannot be considered among the greats. He is just not that good. Can't even beat "barbie"

If you review my posting you will see that it is his dangerous and offside behaviour, that excludes him for me, not the fact that he is being slightly shaded by Rosberg.
To be a real champion you not only need to know how to win but you also need to know how to lose with dignity. Schumacher lacks that ability he is a classic example of a me generation poor sport. You can mention Senna all you like but it is just not the same Senna was not a consistent, serial offender the way Schumacher is (RB against the wall last year comes to mind as a fresh transgression) His flaws out weigh his accomplishments for me.

Edited by SlateGray, 04 November 2011 - 00:49.


#15264 Wi000

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:14

Thanks for the support........................
................it would seem.

Question Slatey,: when are you going to talk about Michael Schumacher instead of his supporters?
While I'm at it can you confirm that you're not Tony Dodgins like some idiot (pay attention Bieberventura) claimed?

#15265 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:16

Why not stop the hypocrisy and address your critics then? For example, do you honestly think it a fair, sensible and objective argument to suggest that MS can't be considered among the greats because he (at 42) can't beat a winless jouneyman (Rosberg)?

Sorry missed something in my first reply.
Would you be so kind as to point out an example of SlateGray's "hypocrisy"
You might want to look up the definition first however.

#15266 Raelene

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:19

I'm glad I support someone - warts and all and don't expect perfection.

I also like the fact that I can see recognise and appreciate talent - whether I like the person or not - Lewham perfect examples - don't like him at all, but he is super talented.


Edited by Raelene, 03 November 2011 - 22:21.


#15267 Schumacher7

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:34

This is one of the reasons why Michael Schumacher is and always will be my favourite driver, because he's so controversial and gets people so annoyed and so amazed that they hate and love him religiously, respectively.

#15268 Group B

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 22:41

Considering all the crowing his supporters do, "the greatest ever blah blah blah" the answer is yes I think it a fair, sensible and objective argument to suggest that Schumacher cannot be considered among the greats. He is just not that good. Can't even beat "barbie"

If you review my posting you will see that it is his dangerous and offside behaviour, cheating, chopping, punting, parking... that excludes him for me, not the fact that he is being schooled by Rosberg.
To be a real champion you not only need to know how to win but you also need to know how to lose with dignity. Schumacher lacks that ability he is a classic example of a me generation poor sport. You can mention Senna all you like but it is just not the same Senna was not a consistent, serial offender the way Schumacher is (RB against the wall last year comes to mind as a fresh transgression) His flaws out weigh his accomplishments for me.

There you go again; firstly to resort to your ceaselessly repeated punting, parking, piffle instead of answering the question, then you slip in another 'fact' that isn't one. I'll bet you any figure you'd like to name that if you asked 100 pit lane experts whether NR was currently 'schooling' MS the vast majority would say otherwise; to anyone remotely objective it's clearly very close between them and if anyone has had a slight edge as the season progressed it's MS.

Getting back to the original question, can you seriously not understand that a given sportsman's 'greatness' (performance wise) is judged by the level he produces in his peak years? You don't say that Sampras isn't great based on how he played in his last year, or Tiger Woods is a journeyman because he hasn't got close to winning a major lately. And who, apart from you, is convinced NR is so crap anyway? According to a current thread Ferrari are sniffing around him.


#15269 Sakae

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 23:02

Hang on there a moment, Schumacher got comprehensively trashed by Rosberg last season, a total spanking, a complete schooling did Schumacher receive at the gifted hands of Mr. Rosberg, and this season sees Schumacher struggling mightily to get on even terms with the young talented Rosberg. So even if Schumacher does manage to eek out a higher points tally this season (with the aid of Ross and team orders it would now appear) it does not mean that Schumacher is better then the winless Mr. Rosberg. The combined points tallies for the past two seasons is Rosberg 217 Schumacher 142, Schumacher's total points deficit since he was teamed with young Mr. Rosberg is 75 points. If and when Schumacher manages to even up those numbers then we could say he has reached the same level as Rosberg. That leaves a long row to hoe for Schumacher, even with Ross in his corner screwing Rosberg at every turn it will still be a long time before Schumacher can manage to erase that enormous deficit. So at the moment Schumacher is not even a match for Rosberg and may never be.

Now consider this Schumacher has toiled two seasons as Rosberg's number two and in that time he has yet to manage a points total in either of those years that is greater then the total deficit for the two season period in question. Holy Crap!
Looking at the numbers this way it would seem obvious that Schumacher is currently a mid pack driver (flattered by teamorders) Combine that with all the ugly baggage that comes with Schumacher, punting, cheating, chopping, parking…. and it becomes very very clear that Schumacher is not and never will be among the great drivers of F1. Drivers like Senna Villeneuve, Clark, Alonso, Ascari, Rindt, Peterson, Stewart, Lauda! … Schumacher’s spotted record and his total sportsmanship fail over the years completely and entirely excludes him for consideration. That is not even mentioning the FACT that he can't best Rosberg without Ross hamstringing Nico. Schumacher among the greats ....pfffft not a chance.

Have you been secretly in training at an other forum? Your conditioning is impecable, and your dislike of Schumacher has lost nothing of its edge.

#15270 SlateGray

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 23:15

There you go again; firstly to resort to your ceaselessly repeated punting, parking, piffle instead of answering the question, then you slip in another 'fact' that isn't one. I'll bet you any figure you'd like to name that if you asked 100 pit lane experts whether NR was currently 'schooling' MS the vast majority would say otherwise; to anyone remotely objective it's clearly very close between them and if anyone has had a slight edge as the season progressed it's MS.

Getting back to the original question, can you seriously not understand that a given sportsman's 'greatness' (performance wise) is judged by the level he produces in his peak years? You don't say that Sampras isn't great based on how he played in his last year, or Tiger Woods is a journeyman because he hasn't got close to winning a major lately. And who, apart from you, is convinced NR is so crap anyway? According to a current thread Ferrari are sniffing around him.


Sorry but the punting and parking and chopping and blocking and cheating are all things on Schumacher's record it all happened it was real. This is the primary reason I don't support Schumacher.

I never ever said I think Rosberg is crap I have only used Schumacher's supporters names for Rosberg (pre thrashing names that is) as a reminder of the level of disrespect they all showed Rosberg (pre thrashing that is) when Schumacher's attempted comeback was announced. I actually think Rosberg is underrated and very good and I do hope Ferrari go after him to replace the hapless Massa. Alonso / Rosberg would be a mighty team.
The problem is in Schumacher not living up to his fans hype, do you want me to post the pre comeback predictions of how Schumacher would trash Rosberg they are mighty funny now in light of how totally wrong they where. You see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate. A teammate that was ridiculed by the very people who now can't stand the fact that Schumacher is getting a education in F1 driving from Nico Rosberg.

If Schumacher was as good as he and his fans think he is. he would have shaded Rosberg from the first practice of 2010 and on from there, he did not because he is just a average driver. That is my view,



#15271 sharo

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Posted 03 November 2011 - 23:31

If Schumacher was as good as he and his fans think he is. he would have shaded Rosberg from the first practice of 2010 and on from there, he did not because he is just a average driver. That is my view,

That's pure trolling (I wouldn't like to think there's more than that) and I suggest we no more try to reason with such persons. Make them suffer.

#15272 Buttoneer

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 00:03

Posts deleted.

If you are not prepared to take issue with a posters argument, then I suggest that you put them on ignore. This thread is not reserved for unadulterated praise and you may not control who does or does not post here. This forum is not reserved for unadulterated praise either. I appreciate that many wish to post repeatedly that Schumacher is the best ever, but it is also acceptable to post that he is not. Attacking the poster, rather than their argument is not acceptable. All this discussion to berate 'fans' or accuse 'trolls' must stop. Address the points please, or leave well alone.

#15273 Juan Kerr

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 00:18

Schumacher is the best whether we all like it or not, it doesn't matter what era he was in how many races what the cars were like, he started with nothing...no reputation, he made it happen and engineered, drove, got-favoured-into-being, systematically, strategically, however you care to look at it won more world championships than anyone in the history of the sport. He didn't wreck it for himself with too many crashes and mistakes and he did not crack under the pressure, he delivered with whatever it took to gain those 7 championships.
Everyone can talk the talk but they never walked the walk and did not get close. We are active fans in the era of the best F1 driver in the history of the sport, ask all the drivers and they will say 'the championship', that's what they want and if not they want wins. Schumacher did it, did what mattered, built a team twice around him just as Senna always wanted because it is required, those who were not good enough got ignored in their own requests, Michael did not.

Let's embrace Michael Schumacher, still active and may well win another race before finishing his career in his mid-forties!

#15274 jj2728

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 00:24

Don't worry, if they have finished the same number races this year, MS would beat Nico for sure.
Who is Clark? Rindt? Ascari? Anyone see them driving? I personally didn't see Fangio, old Villenueve, Peterson, Stewart, Lauda driving? They are more like legends, but nobody know if they are good at all? Maybe they are good ,but don't have results to make them great.
Everybody knows MS is the best, because we saw him driving. I am watching F1 since around 1991/92(full season). First race that I remember was Hungary 1986. That times we were watching only Hungary races, and not every time. I don't feel robed because I didn't see Clark, Ascari, Rindt, Peterson, Stewart, Moss driving. Not at all. And in my list they don't exist. This guys in one team with MS will look like amateurs.


Yours is IMHO the most abusrd of the many absurd posts I see on this forum. Let me tell you something I've seen Clark, Villeneuve and everyone you've mentioned with the exception of Fangio and Ascari. If you don't feel robbed, well then, it is your loss because they were great drivers. I cannot, for the life of me, believe some folks complete lack of knowledge and no appreciation for the rich history of this sport. You'd think that everything started and ended with MS......... :rolleyes: Are you on his payroll per chance? I'd swear that at least 50% of the posters here are.....

#15275 jj2728

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 00:28

Schumacher is the best whether we all like it or not, it doesn't matter what era he was in how many races what the cars were like, he started with nothing...no reputation, he made it happen and engineered, drove, got-favoured-into-being, systematically, strategically, however you care to look at it won more world championships than anyone in the history of the sport. He didn't wreck it for himself with too many crashes and mistakes and he did not crack under the pressure, he delivered with whatever it took to gain those 7 championships.
Everyone can talk the talk but they never walked the walk and did not get close. We are active fans in the era of the best F1 driver in the history of the sport, ask all the drivers and they will say 'the championship', that's what they want and if not they want wins. Schumacher did it, did what mattered, built a team twice around him just as Senna always wanted because it is required, those who were not good enough got ignored in their own requests, Michael did not.

Let's embrace Michael Schumacher, still active and may well win another race before finishing his career in his mid-forties!


Why don't you give him a kiss while you're at it..... Are your seriously saying he is the ONLY driver to walk the walk of a champion? No one ever got close? I'd say take that opinion to TNF and see how far it gets you.....

#15276 Szoelloe

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 00:38

Sorry but the punting and parking and chopping and blocking and cheating are all things on Schumacher's record it all happened it was real. This is the primary reason I don't support Schumacher.

I never ever said I think Rosberg is crap I have only used Schumacher's supporters names for Rosberg (pre thrashing names that is) as a reminder of the level of disrespect they all showed Rosberg (pre thrashing that is) when Schumacher's attempted comeback was announced. I actually think Rosberg is underrated and very good and I do hope Ferrari go after him to replace the hapless Massa. Alonso / Rosberg would be a mighty team.
The problem is in Schumacher not living up to his fans hype, do you want me to post the pre comeback predictions of how Schumacher would trash Rosberg they are mighty funny now in light of how totally wrong they where. You see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate. A teammate that was ridiculed by the very people who now can't stand the fact that Schumacher is getting a education in F1 driving from Nico Rosberg.

If Schumacher was as good as he and his fans think he is. he would have shaded Rosberg from the first practice of 2010 and on from there, he did not because he is just a average driver. That is my view,


He cannot be an average driver with 7 WDC's to his name. That is about as foolish a remark as degrading NR. NR is NOT underestimated. Your choice of words are insulting to some. Every post of yours has a trolling edge to it. I couldn't care less who MS is getting an F1 driving education from, and I will sleep well if he retires mid-season without another win to his name. I will go on watching F1 and enjoying it. As I said you will have a feast next year if the W03 is competitive. AND I will too, because there will be a fierce competition between these two, if NR has the balls to stay on.

#15277 AndreasF1

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 01:05

Sorry but the punting and parking and chopping and blocking and cheating are all things on Schumacher's record it all happened it was real. This is the primary reason I don't support Schumacher.

I never ever said I think Rosberg is crap I have only used Schumacher's supporters names for Rosberg (pre thrashing names that is) as a reminder of the level of disrespect they all showed Rosberg (pre thrashing that is) when Schumacher's attempted comeback was announced. I actually think Rosberg is underrated and very good and I do hope Ferrari go after him to replace the hapless Massa. Alonso / Rosberg would be a mighty team.
The problem is in Schumacher not living up to his fans hype, do you want me to post the pre comeback predictions of how Schumacher would trash Rosberg they are mighty funny now in light of how totally wrong they where. You see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate. A teammate that was ridiculed by the very people who now can't stand the fact that Schumacher is getting a education in F1 driving from Nico Rosberg.

If Schumacher was as good as he and his fans think he is. he would have shaded Rosberg from the first practice of 2010 and on from there, he did not because he is just a average driver. That is my view,


Thats BS. Again, you answered only what is convenient but not the point that was addressed, that you can't judge a drivers accomplishments by only taking a snapshot of their career. If all you want to say that you don't like Schumacher because he was a cheat than it's hard to argue against it. But to say that his driving was crap during his peak years is just as biased and norrow minded as you accuse others with a different view.

It's just as ridiculous to sayt that Federer, Maradona, Klammer, or even Tiger Woods sucked in their respective careers because they finished in at a low or declined over the course of their careers. Take the example of Thomas Muster. Once a Number 1 tennis player in th world just made a comeback last year and has not won a single tournament. Nobody within reason would measure his accomplishments in the 90's against his comeback in 2010. Thats wrong and you know it. You always blame Schumacher for what his supporters claimed before his comback, that he would trounce Rosberg. Well I never once read an interview or heard Schumacher ever say once that he was going to beat Rosberg.

Edited by AndreasF1, 04 November 2011 - 01:07.


#15278 Raelene

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 01:16

SG

I'd like to read those posts from all those Schumacher supporters that said he would trounce Rosberg.

I'd also like to read the posts where people said: "see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate"

Only person I ever recall saying that was....Sir Frank Williams


#15279 SlateGray

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 03:32

SG

I'd like to read those posts from all those Schumacher supporters that said he would trounce Rosberg.


Always a pleasure to oblige! Just a small sampling.

Cheers


Uhmmm...
Don't know...
If Barbie wasn't capable of dealling with Webber, how could he possibly outpace Schumy :well:

The big question mark is... can we start calling him Nicochello :p


Rosberg fans must feel devasted by the news but the best thing for them to do is to admit defeat now and avoid much shame in the future.


Schumacher is utterly going to annihilate Rosberg. I'm not that happy Schumi is coming back to be honest, but watching him utterly obliterate Rosberg is going to be singularly joyous to watch. ESPECIALLY given Keke's dribbling in 2006 after Monaco. Michael isn't going to be charitable AT ALL.


Britney will get beaten senseless.


Rosberg may have had the upper hand against Nakajima, but against Schumacher, he may as well start over. Keke can't change any of that.


Cooper


I have watched hours of incar from 2008 of all the drivers and Rosberg just isn't there in fact besides Hamilton and Massa and depending on the car, this isn't a bad year at all for MS to come back.

If Rosberg is smart he will make this his learning year and profit his future from it.


It depends on how willing he is to learn and how his Father influences him on allowing that. Massa was happy to learn and be guided.


To my mind there is no doubt that Schumacher will beat Rosberg, in fact he will beat the whole field




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#15280 Raelene

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 03:55

wow - that's a lot of people isn't it..... :rolleyes: You've been on this forum almost as long as I - how many of the knowledgeable MSC supporters ever said he'd thrash Rosberg - can't remember too many of us can you.

and where's the quote

I'd also like to read the posts where people said: "see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate" - apart from Sir Frank Williams saying it (and he did) - I can't think many others saying it.

Edited by Raelene, 04 November 2011 - 03:58.


#15281 SlateGray

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 04:17

wow - that's a lot of people isn't it..... :rolleyes:


my bad I thought eight was enough...... as a sample

Here you go many more here

http://forums.autosp...p;#entry4050650

Cheers

#15282 Raelene

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 04:45

so again - you only chose to respond to part fo a post...I give up - keep up the good troll

#15283 pUs

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 07:25

He is just not that good. Can't even beat "barbie"


But he is actually beating Barbie quite a lot lately. And we both know you won't change your opinion one bit if Michael finishes the season in front of Nico in the standing. So why even bring it up?

Edited by pUs, 04 November 2011 - 07:26.


#15284 pUs

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 07:34

Sorry but the punting and parking and chopping and blocking and cheating are all things on Schumacher's record it all happened it was real. This is the primary reason I don't support Schumacher.


You religiously hate him, pretty obvious. Seems to be your only real passion.

I never ever said I think Rosberg is crap I have only used Schumacher's supporters names for Rosberg (pre thrashing names that is) as a reminder of the level of disrespect they all showed Rosberg (pre thrashing that is) when Schumacher's attempted comeback was announced.


Can't you start discussing F1 instead of discussing fans?

The problem is in Schumacher not living up to his fans hype


Problem for who? Not for you, I'm sure? :lol:

do you want me to post the pre comeback predictions of how Schumacher would trash Rosberg they are mighty funny now in light of how totally wrong they where


Speak for yourself, please. Or name all those people, or don't include them in your "argument"

. You see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans


Slategray, discussing fans instead of F1 like always

If Schumacher was as good as he and his fans think he is. he would have blah blah blah etc


Spare us this drivel. It's annoying having to read what I really think, written by some random idiot who has never met me, nor shows the slightest respect at all.

#15285 cheapracer

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 07:52

Did I get the numbers wrong? Was difference greater or lesser then the numbers indicate? Perhaps there is an error, if so please accept my apologies did Schumacher not cheat and ram and chop and park ... did those things not happen?


Slate Gray, since you seem to have a lot of time, how about showing with math the extent of Schumachers crimes against his 286 starts? Show us the percentages.

Thats official FIA reprimanded crimes against F1 and specific to dangerous driving, not your opinions.

While your at it define "cheat" before "did those things not happen" can be answered.


#15286 Group B

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 08:00

SG

I'd like to read those posts from all those Schumacher supporters that said he would trounce Rosberg.

I'd also like to read the posts where people said: "see Schumacher is supposed to be able to win from the back in a shopping cart according to his fans yet he cannot even equal his young teammate"

Only person I ever recall saying that was....Sir Frank Williams

:up:
Quite. Most of us never expected or predicted an uber return, Slate is cherry picking a couple of fanatics s in order to present everyone with a 'killer' argument.

#15287 ivand911

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 08:06

SlateGray, you show posts from the fans(and not fans I think) when W01 was not even born. Everyone expected W01 to be a good car(something close to BR001). Car good for a wins. But, the car was bad, 4th-5th best car for the whole season. W02 was even worse.
MS was away 3 years from F1, so in 2010 he have a lot to learn. Maybe Nico teach him something. Good for him. Tyres, how to drive them, and also different car rules. Nico have this knowledge and have this head start. But, in the end of 2010 MS was very close to him already. 2011 started different, MS without DNFs would be sure ahead of Nico by now. Only one less DNF(Singapore or Korea) would be enough for this. And MS to lead Nico now. We will see how Nico will handle the pressure. MS handle the pressure last year and beginning of this year very well.
Win from the back in a shopping cart , we saw it in Spa. He beat everyone except from the dream teams(best cars).

#15288 Math89

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 10:20

Who cares what the fans said when he came back? Not really shocking that fans have high expectations of someone who they are a fan of.
I've never heard Schumacher say anything about crushing Rosberg. He only said he would try to fight for the championship but I can point you to 23 other drivers who would also like to fight for the championship.

277 races. 3 controversial things... 1994,1997 and 2006.

The past...get over it.

#15289 outofbounds

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 10:33

I think there were also a lot of Schumacher fans who were concerned it wouldn't work out as well as they hoped. Maybe they just weren't so vocal.

#15290 Sakae

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 11:21

In 2010 I though he will need several races (6?) to get back into the grove, and he will be in top five. Then it hit me, that he has no car, and trouble is on.

In 2011 I thought it will be all corrected, only to realize, that we stilll have a problem, mostly related to car balance and tire characteristics he was not comfortable with. At least not initially.

In 2012 / 2013, if vehicle is competitive, I hope to see him in top five regularly, maybe even on the podium here and there.

I have never assumed he will automatically win another championship because of his career 1, nor I think that he is concerned about Rosberg. In fact I think Schumacher's focus is where he is compared to Vettel, and how to close that gap. As his long time fan, I have never doubted he will apply himself completely; how that effort will translate into results remains to be seen. For now I am optimistic.

Edited by Sakae, 04 November 2011 - 11:23.


#15291 Massa_f1

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 11:44

my bad I thought eight was enough...... as a sample

Here you go many more here

http://forums.autosp...p;#entry4050650

Cheers


wow big deal some people thought Schumacher was going to come back and win. Just becasue he has not does not make him rubbish. I think what he has done this year apart from a few stupid crashes has been the max you could ask of him and the car at this stage. I very much doubt any other driver could do any better in the Mercedes. Nico and Micheal are level in terms of race pace. To me this shows it is how far the car can go.

#15292 schubacca

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 14:11

MS is one of the greatest F1 drivers ever.

As a MS fan I can understand if people dont regard him the best...... Heck.... I cant even say that for certain.

However.....

When the anti-MS bridgade starts ranking MS as a mediocre driver who lucked his way in 7 WDCs, then I have no choice but to laugh.

MS is past his prime. Yet MS circa 2011 is not embarassing himself, his team, nor is he being embarassed by his teammate.

Next up, Slate will be saying that MS is lazy and would rather play golf than assist the team in car development....

Edited by schubacca, 04 November 2011 - 14:12.


#15293 Sakae

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 14:31

http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/95898

(Horner:)

Sometimes when we haven't had the quickest car on a Sunday we have still managed to win with it, and that demonstrates the strength of a team that is in total harmony and working in unison.


This is exactly why I have hope to see MS on the podium before he retires, as his working ethics are very similar.

Edited by Sakae, 04 November 2011 - 14:41.


#15294 arknor

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 14:57

MS is one of the greatest F1 drivers ever.

As a MS fan I can understand if people dont regard him the best...... Heck.... I cant even say that for certain.

However.....

When the anti-MS bridgade starts ranking MS as a mediocre driver who lucked his way in 7 WDCs, then I have no choice but to laugh.

MS is past his prime. Yet MS circa 2011 is not embarassing himself, his team, nor is he being embarassed by his teammate.

Next up, Slate will be saying that MS is lazy and would rather play golf than assist the team in car development....

luckiest man alive! what are the oods! i bet you have more odds of winning the euromillions for 7 weeks on the trot while winning your national lottery aswell for the same 7 weeks!

#15295 schubacca

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 16:54

luckiest man alive! what are the oods! i bet you have more odds of winning the euromillions for 7 weeks on the trot while winning your national lottery aswell for the same 7 weeks!



Championships

7 (1994, 1995, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004)

Wins

91

Podiums

154

Career points

1,511

Pole positions

68

Fastest laps

76

And all of it was luck....

#15296 Juan Kerr

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 20:12

Why don't you give him a kiss while you're at it..... Are your seriously saying he is the ONLY driver to walk the walk of a champion? No one ever got close? I'd say take that opinion to TNF and see how far it gets you.....

Ahhh yes there's Schumacher and his achievements and then there's jj2728 on an internet forum saying childish things from a school playground and also not reading properly, its shameful. They all talk the talk of a 7 time champion but non of them can walk the walk, I can see you're struggling to understand that bit there so I added to it.
Its embaressing to think sometimes that Schumacher is even the same species as some of these infantile individuals that post these comments.


#15297 CrucialXtreme

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 20:19

SlateGray, you show posts from the fans(and not fans I think) when W01 was not even born. Everyone expected W01 to be a good car(something close to BR001). Car good for a wins. But, the car was bad, 4th-5th best car for the whole season. W02 was even worse.
MS was away 3 years from F1, so in 2010 he have a lot to learn. Maybe Nico teach him something. Good for him. Tyres, how to drive them, and also different car rules. Nico have this knowledge and have this head start. But, in the end of 2010 MS was very close to him already. 2011 started different, MS without DNFs would be sure ahead of Nico by now. Only one less DNF(Singapore or Korea) would be enough for this. And MS to lead Nico now. We will see how Nico will handle the pressure. MS handle the pressure last year and beginning of this year very well.
Win from the back in a shopping cart , we saw it in Spa. He beat everyone except from the dream teams(best cars).


Very good post. Of which I agree 100% with. I think in 2012 SCHU will outperform Nico with relative ease. Relative I say. I'll be sure to post back here if I'm wrong but I think Michael is getting back to himself and after a full year on the new tyres, along with a better MGP car for next year, we'll see him place higher than this year.

#15298 Starish

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 21:04

Very good post. Of which I agree 100% with. I think in 2012 SCHU will outperform Nico with relative ease. Relative I say. I'll be sure to post back here if I'm wrong but I think Michael is getting back to himself and after a full year on the new tyres, along with a better MGP car for next year, we'll see him place higher than this year.

The ony thing we can't be sure of there.

#15299 CrucialXtreme

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 21:17

The ony thing we can't be sure of there.


I agree totally with that, we can't be sure. But I like the way Ross & Norbert carry themselves & the way the speak about the current situation and the future. It doesn't seem to me they set unrealistic goals or expectations and they're always brutally honest about the current performance. To me the fact that while they would love to be competing with the likes of RBR, MaCa & Ferrari they know they're behind and aren't forcing anything. They're somewhat content knowing it takes time to build one of the aforementioned teams and that's obviously what they're striving to become. I guess my main point is they're grounded & very focused on their goals. This bodes well for them & their fans. I fully expect MGP to be a top team consistently and for years to come. I just hope Michael is there when they're competitive with the better teams on the grid.

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#15300 jj2728

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Posted 04 November 2011 - 23:13

Ahhh yes there's Schumacher and his achievements and then there's jj2728 on an internet forum saying childish things from a school playground and also not reading properly, its shameful. They all talk the talk of a 7 time champion but non of them can walk the walk, I can see you're struggling to understand that bit there so I added to it.
Its embaressing to think sometimes that Schumacher is even the same species as some of these infantile individuals that post these comments.


Would you care to enlighten me as to who these THEY are that talk the talk of a 7 time champion then? Maybe that way I'll be able to wrap my childish, infantile head around it..... :rolleyes: