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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#5901 Flamini

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:14

Formula1.com says this:

* Alonso and Hamilton both set five fastest laps. Alonso takes the Award by virtue of setting more second-fastest laps.




Hamilton fans celebrated this and they said this is very important award.

Of course now it will change, this award just doesn't matter when Alonso win it. :lol:

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#5902 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:16

Hamilton fans celebrated this and they said this is very important award.

Of course now it will change, this award just doesn't matter when Alonso win it. :lol:

Who has said that?

#5903 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:16

There was also alot of talking about Hamilton "choking" in Brazil this year when he made a mistake and let Alonso through. I didn't agree with that at all, but maybe now the boot is on the other foot and theres a chance to say the same about Fernando its just not appreciated. Its all school yard stuff at the end of the day and comes down to people taking petty digs at each other and not being able to take it when its returned. Whats good for the goose is good for the gander and all that. :)


I understand the urge to get back with the "choking", but simply being given a crap strategy and being too slow to recover doesn't fit the description at all, not by any stretch.

Repeated driving errors always in the last 4th of a WDC campaign OTOH... that sounds almost like a definition of choking, doesn't it?

#5904 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:19

Repeated driving errors always in the last 4th of a WDC campaign OTOH... that sounds almost like a definition of choking, doesn't it?

I think its pathetic for either set of fans to rubbish each drivers mistakes and refer to it as 'choking'.
Apologies but I don't understand what you are trying to say with the above quote. What is it in reference to?

Edited by tifosiMac, 15 November 2010 - 12:19.


#5905 rhukkas

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:26

I understand the urge to get back with the "choking", but simply being given a crap strategy and being too slow to recover doesn't fit the description at all, not by any stretch.

Repeated driving errors always in the last 4th of a WDC campaign OTOH... that sounds almost like a definition of choking, doesn't it?


Yh, like when Alonso crashed at Fuji in 2007 while his calm and collected ROOKIE team-mate romped to victory in appalling conditions. TWICE now Alonso has choked when it mattered!

Edited by rhukkas, 15 November 2010 - 12:27.


#5906 Lokt

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:34

I think its pathetic for either set of fans to rubbish each drivers mistakes and refer to it as 'choking'.
Apologies but I don't understand what you are trying to say with the above quote. What is it in reference to?


I think he's refering to Hamilton. Don't take it to seriously, he usally just tries to wind up Hamilton fans. Anyway Alonso didn't choke, Ferrari put him on the wrong stratergy. The same way Mclaren left Hamilton out to long in china 2007. Teams makes mistakes sometimes, sh*t happens u know. Anyway Alonso will challange for more WDC in the coming years with Ferrari.

Captain hindsight saves the day!

#5907 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:35

Yh, like when Alonso crashed at Fuji in 2007 while his calm and collected ROOKIE team-mate romped to victory in appalling conditions. TWICE now Alonso has choked when it mattered!


Everybody here seems to make up his own definition of choking as they go along. Whatever... :rotfl:

#5908 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:40

Everybody here seems to make up his own definition of choking as they go along. Whatever... :rotfl:

Would you like to answer my question too? See below.

I think its pathetic for either set of fans to rubbish each drivers mistakes and refer to it as 'choking'.
Apologies but I don't understand what you are trying to say with the above quote. What is it in reference to?



#5909 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 12:56

Would you like to answer my question too? See below.


Would you rephase it? What do you not understand, precisely?

#5910 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:01

Would you rephase it? What do you not understand, precisely?

I suggested that it wasn't long ago we had Lewis Hamilton being discussed in the same sentence as 'choking'. I suggested maybe some people were using this situation with Alonso in the same way, although I thought both stances were rather pathetic. Your response was the one below:

Repeated driving errors always in the last 4th of a WDC campaign OTOH... that sounds almost like a definition of choking, doesn't it?

Is the above sentence relative to a specific driver, or is it just an example?

Edited by tifosiMac, 15 November 2010 - 13:01.


#5911 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:21

I suggested that it wasn't long ago we had Lewis Hamilton being discussed in the same sentence as 'choking'. I suggested maybe some people were using this situation with Alonso in the same way, although I thought both stances were rather pathetic. Your response was the one below:

Is the above sentence relative to a specific driver, or is it just an example?


No, obviously I refered to Hamilton. From my POV it's obvious that every time he's in a WDC fight towards the end of a season, his driving error rate goes up. That's what I call choking, yet I'm not insisting on that specific word (only on my definition, underlined above).

He's not the only one, though. You could say the same for Webber this season. Others OTOH, among them Räkönnen, Alonso, Vettel, have not shown the same tendencies.



#5912 rhukkas

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:27

No, obviously I refered to Hamilton. From my POV it's obvious that every time he's in a WDC fight towards the end of a season, his driving error rate goes up. That's what I call choking, yet I'm not insisting on that specific word (only on my definition, underlined above).

He's not the only one, though. You could say the same for Webber this season. Others OTOH, among them Räkönnen, Alonso, Vettel, have not shown the same tendencies.


Alonso feels the nerves like everyone - - He bottled it yesterday, like he did in 2007 against Hamilton and Kimi.


#5913 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:33

Alonso feels the nerves like everyone - - He bottled it yesterday, like he did in 2007 against Hamilton and Kimi.


Alonso didn't lose anything by trying too hard, at that stage he had in fact nothing to lose anyway.

EDIT: talking about yesterday. ^^ Fuji is your one and only valid example of Alonso throwing points away in a WDC fight (and let's not forget that in that race his car was damaged by Vettel previously). In any case, one driver related error / DNF isn't a trend, it's coincidence.

Hamilton OTOH did [many mistakes that cost him points], many times in every of his WDC fights 2007, 2008, 2010.

What you try is paint every failure to win the crown with the same brush. But that's BS, and I think you know that.

Edited by as65p, 15 November 2010 - 13:46.


#5914 Gareth

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:57

I am simply stunned that anyone can describe Alonso's WDC run in, including Singapore, the overtakes at Brazil and Abu Dhabi qualy, as choking.

#5915 robefc

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:57

Alonso didn't lose anything by trying too hard, at that stage he had in fact nothing to lose anyway.

EDIT: talking about yesterday. ^^ Fuji is your one and only valid example of Alonso throwing points away in a WDC fight (and let's not forget that in that race his car was damaged by Vettel previously). In any case, one driver related error / DNF isn't a trend, it's coincidence.

Hamilton OTOH did [many mistakes that cost him points], many times in every of his WDC fights 2007, 2008, 2010.

What you try is paint every failure to win the crown with the same brush. But that's BS, and I think you know that.


I'm not sure how hamilton's error rate went up in 2008, there was only Fuji, he was flawless in China and drove well in difficult circumstances and with very poorly set up car in Brazil. Compare that to Bahrain and Canada...

2007 the one where he felt the pressure was the start in Brazil, pressure that was experly applied and affected a rookie driver. China was down to the team leaving him out on canvas, a ferrari ended up in the same gravel trap this year on tyres that were fine.

2010 - I don't think his error in monza was down to WDC pressure, singapore was a racing incident and both times he made errors to let alonso through in korea and brazil he was struggling with the car, button was letting people through at virtually exactly the same times in both races and the cars he let by weren't alonso in a ferrari.

In summary, there might be something in it but I think his reputation as a choker is exaggerated.

Alonso, however, seems to improve when the WDC pressure is on and didn't do much wrong yesterday except lose a place at the start, he's done that a lot this year I think.


#5916 robefc

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 13:58

Pretty fair assessment of fernando's geture to petrov and the team orders controversy from a british journo's pov -

3. Was Alonso being a bad sport at the end with his hand gesture to Petrov? I think yes, but remember he had just seen his championship hopes go up in smoke. It was heat of the moment stuff. Later on he acknowledged how well the Russian had driven. I liked Petrov standing up for himself though.

4. Was Vettel’s win karma? Was it a victory for clean racing? After all the talk of team orders and Alonso potentially winning a ‘tainted’ world championship if he had triumphed by seven points or fewer, perhaps Vettel’s win was a victory for sport? That is certainly the way it has been pitched in some newspapers this morning. My own view is that Alonso drove brilliantly in the second half of the year and was relentless in cranking up the pressure. He would have been deserving in my eyes. It’s a tricky one as I also felt the FIA should have docked points at the time. But they didn’t and every team knew what they had to do with half the season still to go.

5. Thank God it didn’t come down to those seven points or it would have overshadowed a magnificent season. But that should not let the FIA off the hook. The team orders rule needs to be tightened up or scrapped altogether. There is too much ambiguity. Because of the way it panned out in the end, with Webber so far back, everyone conveniently seems to have forgotten that Red Bull would also have manipulated the race result yesterday had they needed to. If it had been Vettel-Webber-Alonso going into final lap, the German would have pulled aside. I’m not saying he shouldn’t have – and clearly there is a distinction between doing it of your own volition when your title chances are over – I’m just saying that the whole team orders issue is a muddle. What is morally acceptable to one fan is anathema to another.

6. Max Mosley likes to use an analogy that to excuse team orders by saying “everyone does it” does not wash. I agree. Mosley adds that to scrap the ban would be like scrapping the law against stealing – just because the law isn’t 100 per cent fail-proof doesn’t mean you should scrap it altogether. Here I disagree. There is no other alternative with regard to the law against stealing. Clearly you can’t legalise it so you must have an imperfect situation whereby people break the law and you enforce it when you can. With the team orders ban you can scrap it – indeed most of the paddock would like to – and then we wouldn’t have hypocrisy and ambiguity. It would involve re-educating the watching public however.

7. A somewhat agitated Domenicali said on Sunday night that the controversy over team orders is a peculiarly British obsession. “Everywhere else it was forgotten two days after Germany,” he said. He is right in some respects. We do go harder at it than anyone else. But it wasn’t forgotten by the Brazilians when we were out there two weeks ago. It wasn’t forgotten by the Germans. And whether or not he feels there is a vendetta against Ferrari/Alonso, the fact is the FIA’s own laws prohibit team orders. There is a ban, which was not adequately upheld. The debate is a valid one.


http://blogs.telegra...fter-the-event/


#5917 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:04

No, obviously I refered to Hamilton. From my POV it's obvious that every time he's in a WDC fight towards the end of a season, his driving error rate goes up. That's what I call choking, yet I'm not insisting on that specific word (only on my definition, underlined above).

He's not the only one, though. You could say the same for Webber this season. Others OTOH, among them Räkönnen, Alonso, Vettel, have not shown the same tendencies.

Its always going to be obvious from ones POV the traits of a rival driver.
Alonso has shown instances where the pressure has got to him and this is natural in fierce competition. During 2007 he made mistakes whilst trying to compete against his teammate, for example the first corner at Canada where he out breaked himself and proceeded to make the same mistake another twice. Fuiji he pushed too hard to catch Lewis and made an unforced error which put him into the barriers. Lewis had similar instances that year where he tried too hard. We saw Fernando make an unforced error in Hungary '10 where he went wide on an exit and crashed into the barriers. Fernando went wide yesterday through frustration with Petrov on several occassions so the two drivers (Lewis and Fernando) are very similar in terms of being unable to handle the pressure in certain situations. Vettel due to the dominance of the RB6 has not really been in a position where he's had to fight his way through the field and has started the majority of races from the front. Over the next few years I'd like to see a platform where he can show his racecraft through taking risks, as he might not be in a position where his car can deliver pole position every race. He's a stunning driver and its going to be a very exciting season next year IMO.

Back to my original point, I do think its double standards to laugh at others for doing something which you happily do against other drivers. None of the top four drivers this year have got to the end of the season without making mistakes. Every one of them have crashed in vital races due to unforced errors but thats racing. Its not 'choking', its getting it wrong and they all do it. Its easy for us to sit in our armchairs taking the moral high ground and pretending we have the superior knowledge and mental strength to criticize these guys for making mistakes in an arena where we'll never experience that level of pressure. Its just not that easy my friend. :)

Edited by tifosiMac, 15 November 2010 - 14:07.


#5918 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:12

....
In summary, there might be something in it but I think his reputation as a choker is exaggerated.

Alonso, however, seems to improve when the WDC pressure is on and didn't do much wrong yesterday except lose a place at the start, he's done that a lot this year I think.


Well, that's all fair enough, especially as you recognize there is a difference between drivers in those pressure cooker scenarios. :up:

As to the start, especially yesterday it's clear to see that Alonsos reaction time was perfectly fine, only in the 2nd phase he lost out to Button, which indeed happened many times this season. The most obvious reason being that Ferrari isn't up with the best at the start.

#5919 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:17

Its always going to be obvious from ones POV the traits of a rival driver.
Alonso has shown instances where the pressure has got to him and this is natural in fierce competition. During 2007 he made mistakes whilst trying to compete against his teammate, for example the first corner at Canada where he out breaked himself and proceeded to make the same mistake another twice. Fuiji he pushed too hard to catch Lewis and made an unforced error which put him into the barriers. Lewis had similar instances that year where he tried too hard. We saw Fernando make an unforced error in Hungary '10 where he went wide on an exit and crashed into the barriers. Fernando went wide yesterday through frustration with Petrov on several occassions so the two drivers (Lewis and Fernando) are very similar in terms of being unable to handle the pressure in certain situations. Vettel due to the dominance of the RB6 has not really been in a position where he's had to fight his way through the field and has started the majority of races from the front. Over the next few years I'd like to see a platform where he can show his racecraft through taking risks, as he might not be in a position where his car can deliver pole position every race. He's a stunning driver and its going to be a very exciting season next year IMO.

Back to my original point, I do think its double standards to laugh at others for doing something which you happily do against other drivers. None of the top four drivers this year have got to the end of the season without making mistakes. Every one of them have crashed in vital races due to unforced errors but thats racing. Its not 'choking', its getting it wrong and they all do it. Its easy for us to sit in our armchairs taking the moral high ground and pretending we have the superior knowledge and mental strength to criticize these guys for making mistakes in an arena where we'll never experience that level of pressure. Its just not that easy my friend. :)


No it's not easy, especially if people move the goalposts all the time, bringing whole seasons in when instead the talk has been about the end of WDC fights. :)

Whatever... I said my part and that's it. :wave:

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#5920 chapilinux

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:17

Quite impressive images on the Spanish TV now. Alonso crying inside the box and all Ferrari Team kissing and embracing him. Alonso didn't blame them for that and he said they are a family for him. Very emotional.

Edited by chapilinux, 15 November 2010 - 14:22.


#5921 robefc

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:22

Well, that's all fair enough, especially as you recognize there is a difference between drivers in those pressure cooker scenarios. :up:

As to the start, especially yesterday it's clear to see that Alonsos reaction time was perfectly fine, only in the 2nd phase he lost out to Button, which indeed happened many times this season. The most obvious reason being that Ferrari isn't up with the best at the start.


Yeah, I wasn't necessarily blaming him for the start.

Although Lewis also got off the line just as well as button but his second phase wasn't as good either, maybe button just got everything perfect.

I could be wrong but I think a lot of alonso fans, along with button fans, had a dig about oz 2010 and how their driver was better at stratgic thinking etc. I could be wrong but regardless this race demonstrates how stupid that idea is, no more important time to take control of strategy but there was no way alonso could take a view on it ,or even if he did there was no way he could override a team with all the info and nothing else to do

#5922 tifosiMac

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 14:25

No it's not easy, especially if people move the goalposts all the time, bringing whole seasons in when instead the talk has been about the end of WDC fights. :)

Whatever... I said my part and that's it. :wave:

Moving the goalposts eh? Ok I think we'll call that a wrap. :wave:

#5923 Smile17

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:02

Quite impressive images on the Spanish TV now. Alonso crying inside the box and all Ferrari Team kissing and embracing him. Alonso didn't blame them for that and he said they are a family for him. Very emotional.


It was heartbraking, really. It wasn't even his fault.

#5924 AlanWake

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:07

Quite impressive images on the Spanish TV now. Alonso crying inside the box and all Ferrari Team kissing and embracing him. Alonso didn't blame them for that and he said they are a family for him. Very emotional.


Can you give me the link to see that video? :up:

EDIT: I finally saw the video. Very impressive, indeed.

Edited by AlanWake, 15 November 2010 - 15:18.


#5925 topical

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:16

Losing this title really seems to have hurt Alonso a lot. In 2007 he actually looked quite happy on the podium in Brazil despite also narrowly losing the title, but this time the pain is obviously a lot worse...

#5926 AlanWake

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:25

Posted Image

I think Raquel will get jealous :smoking:

#5927 AlanWake

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:26

Losing this title really seems to have hurt Alonso a lot. In 2007 he actually looked quite happy on the podium in Brazil despite also narrowly losing the title, but this time the pain is obviously a lot worse...


It will make him stronger ;)

#5928 Architrion

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:32

A link to watch that video, please

#5929 topical

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:33

I hope so. I'm glad Alonso has refused to blame the team and deep in his heart he knows that China, Monaco, Spa and to a degree Silverstone also played a big part in him not winning the championship. If he can cut out those kind of silly mistakes (or maximum 1 or 2 per season, which is normal for even the best drivers) then he should be super strong next year. An on form Alonso was so strong that he could have won the title even against those Red Bulls...unfortunately his form came to him just a couple of races too late in the season, so that one slip up by the team in the last race was already enough to cost the title..

Edited by topical, 15 November 2010 - 15:34.


#5930 Smile17

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:48

A link to watch that video, please


Problem is that it was on tv. It's not the internet (yet), hope someone will post it when found.

Edited by Buttoneer, 15 November 2010 - 16:26.


#5931 AlanWake

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 15:59

A link to watch that video, please


The video is on the LaSexta web now, but I believe if you live outside Spain you could not see it.

#5932 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 16:06

... unfortunately his form came to him just a couple of races too late in the season, so that one slip up by the team in the last race was already enough to cost the title..


Yep. That's it really.

#5933 aditya-now

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 16:27

Its always going to be obvious from ones POV the traits of a rival driver.
Alonso has shown instances where the pressure has got to him and this is natural in fierce competition. During 2007 he made mistakes whilst trying to compete against his teammate, for example the first corner at Canada where he out breaked himself and proceeded to make the same mistake another twice. Fuiji he pushed too hard to catch Lewis and made an unforced error which put him into the barriers. Lewis had similar instances that year where he tried too hard. We saw Fernando make an unforced error in Hungary '10 where he went wide on an exit and crashed into the barriers. Fernando went wide yesterday through frustration with Petrov on several occassions so the two drivers (Lewis and Fernando) are very similar in terms of being unable to handle the pressure in certain situations. Vettel due to the dominance of the RB6 has not really been in a position where he's had to fight his way through the field and has started the majority of races from the front. Over the next few years I'd like to see a platform where he can show his racecraft through taking risks, as he might not be in a position where his car can deliver pole position every race. He's a stunning driver and its going to be a very exciting season next year IMO.

Back to my original point, I do think its double standards to laugh at others for doing something which you happily do against other drivers. None of the top four drivers this year have got to the end of the season without making mistakes. Every one of them have crashed in vital races due to unforced errors but thats racing. Its not 'choking', its getting it wrong and they all do it. Its easy for us to sit in our armchairs taking the moral high ground and pretending we have the superior knowledge and mental strength to criticize these guys for making mistakes in an arena where we'll never experience that level of pressure. Its just not that easy my friend. :)

:up:

Excellent post! Thanks for putting it all into perspective.



#5934 Buttoneer

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 16:28

Please can posters cut out the trolling.

#5935 muelte

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 16:56

Can anyone link that video? I've been searching laSexta web and didn't find that one...

#5936 Yorkie

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:23

He-he, over in the McLaren thread Hamiltons engineer thinks Lewis won it. :drunk:

Not that it matters much...

Does it actually mean anything? :confused:

Losing this title really seems to have hurt Alonso a lot. In 2007 he actually looked quite happy on the podium in Brazil despite also narrowly losing the title, but this time the pain is obviously a lot worse...

Well he was happy that Lewis/McLaren didnt win it

#5937 sosidge

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:30

I am simply stunned that anyone can describe Alonso's WDC run in, including Singapore, the overtakes at Brazil and Abu Dhabi qualy, as choking.


I totally agree.

Unfortunately, people are using the end of the season as an opportunity to reinforce their prejudices about drivers, rather than using the results to fairly assess their acheivements.

Alonso drove brilliantly in the latter half of the season to put a car that was a clear margin behind the Red Bull into the championship lead. He did nothing wrong in Abu Dhabi, but the strategy call by the team, although justified, proved to be the wrong one.

#5938 OO7

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:36

Alonso didn't lose anything by trying too hard, at that stage he had in fact nothing to lose anyway.

Considering all that gets thrown around, one can argue Alonso choked with his poor start, when he lost a place pretty easily to Button.

#5939 OO7

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:41

Back to my original point, I do think its double standards to laugh at others for doing something which you happily do against other drivers. None of the top four drivers this year have got to the end of the season without making mistakes. Every one of them have crashed in vital races due to unforced errors but thats racing. Its not 'choking', its getting it wrong and they all do it. Its easy for us to sit in our armchairs taking the moral high ground and pretending we have the superior knowledge and mental strength to criticize these guys for making mistakes in an arena where we'll never experience that level of pressure. Its just not that easy my friend. :)

Precisely tifosiMac :up: .
Unfortunately many cannot see this and are only interested in 'bashing' drivers they don't like. This is what causes so may threads on this forum to erupt then implode.

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#5940 Mr2s

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:45

Considering all that gets thrown around, one can argue Alonso choked with his poor start, when he lost a place pretty easily to Button.


Would you like to go into more detail about his "poor" start? Bad clutch, bogging down, slow reaction, positioning, or perhaps Button just had a great start?

Alonso has been suspect on starts in the past, but cant see where the poor bit was on Sunday.

#5941 yr

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:46

Alonso didn't lose anything by trying too hard, at that stage he had in fact nothing to lose anyway.

EDIT: talking about yesterday. ^^ Fuji is your one and only valid example of Alonso throwing points away in a WDC fight (and let's not forget that in that race his car was damaged by Vettel previously). In any case, one driver related error / DNF isn't a trend, it's coincidence.

Hamilton OTOH did [many mistakes that cost him points], many times in every of his WDC fights 2007, 2008, 2010.

What you try is paint every failure to win the crown with the same brush. But that's BS, and I think you know that.


If Alonso didnt throw away points anywhere else than in Fuji and Hamilton was throwing points out of window, left and right, everywhere he went, then the only conclusion can be made is: with same car as Alonso he drove significantly better than Fernando in races where he didnt make mistakes... otherwise he wouldnt have ended up higher in final standings. Just imagine if he wasnt a rookie and thus didnt make so many mistakes - he would have made Alonso look like idiot.


#5942 Villes Gilleneuve

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:46

Quite impressive images on the Spanish TV now. Alonso crying inside the box and all Ferrari Team kissing and embracing him. Alonso didn't blame them for that and he said they are a family for him. Very emotional.


Yes, he doesn't blame Ferrari for a stupid early pitstop, but he blames Petrov for not "understanding he is faster".

Sorry Fernando, but if you ever want to see #3, you are going to have to pass cars in the race.

#5943 JKTRacing

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:51

Fernando split the RedBulls and missed the world championship by 4 points.

All this hate is uncalled for, if you knew anything about F1 you would understand, Alonso's 2011 season was his best one yet

#5944 as65p

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:54

If Alonso didnt throw away points anywhere else than in Fuji and Hamilton was throwing points out of window, left and right, everywhere he went, then the only conclusion can be made is: with same car as Alonso he drove significantly better than Fernando in races where he didnt make mistakes... otherwise he wouldnt have ended up higher in final standings. Just imagine if he wasnt a rookie and thus didnt make so many mistakes - he would have made Alonso look like idiot.


I guess it's too far back for you? The underlined is plain wrong, as evident by Alonso finishing in front of Hamilton 10:7 when both finished. Let's say for the sake of the argument that they matched eachother, but by no means was Hamilton faster every time he made no mistakes, that's bollocks.

Besides, I was talking about yesterday, not Fuji '07, when I said that Alonso didn't throw points away.

Edited by as65p, 15 November 2010 - 17:56.


#5945 sosidge

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 17:55

Yes, he doesn't blame Ferrari for a stupid early pitstop, but he blames Petrov for not "understanding he is faster".

Sorry Fernando, but if you ever want to see #3, you are going to have to pass cars in the race.


You mean, like he passed Hamilton and Hulkenberg in Brazil?

Or like he passed Hamilton in Korea?

The memories really are short in the world of the hater, aren't they?

#5946 Birelman

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 18:01

I am simply stunned that anyone can describe Alonso's WDC run in, including Singapore, the overtakes at Brazil and Abu Dhabi qualy, as choking.

Because none of those moments is where he choked....

#5947 fabr68

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 18:13

You mean, like he passed Hamilton and Hulkenberg in Brazil?

Or like he passed Hamilton in Korea?

The memories really are short in the world of the hater, aren't they?


More like the on track pass Hamilton made on Kubica at Abu Dhabi...oh wait

I love it how a pitwall strategy mistake is a driver choking.

#5948 Gareth

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 18:37

Because none of those moments is where he choked....

Which moment did he choke in, then?

Getting out dragged off the start (I'm no technical expert but I think that is more to do with the clutch than the choke *badoom, tish*)?

Getting called in at the wrong time by the team?

Not overtaking a car with a significant straightline speed advantage?

I don't see how any of those things can be blamed on Alonso.

#5949 robefc

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 19:09

Fernando split the RedBulls and missed the world championship by 4 points.

All this hate is uncalled for, if you knew anything about F1 you would understand, Alonso's 2011 season was his best one yet


Surely alonso fans can't think this? I wasn't watching in 2005/6 but I thought he made like one mistake in those 2 seasons? And was up against MS, not 2 non WDCs, one who had a car that liked to blow up and let alonso through quite frequently. He's always famed for his consistency, he had that for the second half of this season but not the first.

That is assuming you mean 2010 and aren't just being optimistic about next year?!

Edited by robefc, 15 November 2010 - 19:10.


#5950 Mr2s

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Posted 15 November 2010 - 19:15

I am simply stunned that anyone can describe Alonso's WDC run in, including Singapore, the overtakes at Brazil and Abu Dhabi qualy, as choking.


Not stunning, just just part of the routine here for the oddballs.
Alonso was in the same boat as Hamilton and Webebr stuck all "choking" behind slower cars. It's almost a compliment that people are 100% focused on his every move right down to his feeling like walking straight to weigh room, instead of giving Vettel the hug he normally gives Lewis and Massa (drivers who the same oddballs and gutter media claim he hates).