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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#6501 TigersWood

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 18:21

I am spanish, It will take a bit as always to get used to it. I liked the Marlboro code bar.....

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#6502 jetalt

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 18:40


It seems that he got pole in the karts' race.

IHMO, it is blatant recklessly being injured and joining this brand of shows. :well:

#6503 prty

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 18:40

Reduced Marlboro adds? That's weird. By the way:

Posted Image

:lol:

#6504 jetalt

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 18:51

http://sphotos.ak.fb...5_8366089_n.jpg

#6505 showtime

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 19:00

It seems that he got pole in the karts' race.

IHMO, it is blatant recklessly being injured and joining this brand of shows. :well:


And won both races.

#6506 jetalt

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 19:16

And won both races.


Yes indeed. :stoned:

http://www.ferrari.c...ble_on_ice.aspx

#6507 GPmaster

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 19:18

Love that Wrooom-party every year. Gives always nice pictures. Does only Ferrari have something like that?

#6508 gaston_foix

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 19:27

Reduced Marlboro adds? That's weird. By the way:

Posted Image

:lol:

:rotfl:

#6509 AlanWake

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 20:20

"I sensed a greater determination than ever from Alonso, who did an exemplary job last season to fight back into contention in the second half of the season after problems in the first half. He will start the season where he left off."

http://www.itv-f1.co...a...en&id=49888

"Fernando Alonso took victory in the 21st Wrooom ice karting event which took place on Thursday night in Italy, beating the field by quite some margin, according to eyewitnesses."

http://thef1times.co...y/display/00206

Only 8 weeks to go until the start of the new season! :up:

Edited by AlanWake, 14 January 2011 - 20:20.


#6510 ghost

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 20:23

Reduced Marlboro adds? That's weird. By the way:

Posted Image

:lol:

Posted Image

#6511 Mastah

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 20:45

He will start the season where he left off.


OK, so we know he'll start from 7th position in Bahrain.


#6512 jeze

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 21:36

He doesn't look good in beard and moustache - and that's a fact. Felipe came with such a look in 2009, and Karma landed him a big accident. Shave Fernando, please, shave  ;)

#6513 AyrtonSauna

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 22:16

"I sensed a greater determination than ever from Alonso, who did an exemplary job last season to fight back into contention in the second half of the season after problems in the first half. He will start the season where he left off."

http://www.itv-f1.co...a...en&id=49888

"Fernando Alonso took victory in the 21st Wrooom ice karting event which took place on Thursday night in Italy, beating the field by quite some margin, according to eyewitnesses."

http://thef1times.co...y/display/00206

Only 8 weeks to go until the start of the new season! :up:

Alonso is always extremely determined so it's hard to imagine him with even more determination! :lol:
But Allen's comments remind me of McLaren's physical conditioning pro from Finland(I can't remember his name so I'll just call him Juha Trainernen) He has worked with Hakkinen,Kimi,Alonso,Hamilton and even worked with the greatest long distance runner of all time Gebreselese.
Trainernen said "If you could tell which driver was going to win by looking into the drivers eyes then it would be Alonso...."
I just hope the bigger helmet size Alonso will need with that extra determination wont effect the aerodynamics badly! :lol:


#6514 fabr68

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 22:26

"I sensed a greater determination than ever from Alonso, who did an exemplary job last season to fight back into contention in the second half of the season after problems in the first half. He will start the season where he left off."

http://www.itv-f1.co...a...en&id=49888

"Fernando Alonso took victory in the 21st Wrooom ice karting event which took place on Thursday night in Italy, beating the field by quite some margin, according to eyewitnesses."

http://thef1times.co...y/display/00206

Only 8 weeks to go until the start of the new season! :up:



Posted Image

Fernando is faster than you, can you confirm you understood the message?

#6515 jetalt

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Posted 14 January 2011 - 23:31

http://thef1times.co...img/wrooom2.jpg
http://thef1times.co...img/wrooom4.jpg
http://thef1times.co...img/wrooom7.jpg


Ice Race Vid:

http://www.motogp.co...titive ice race

Edited by jetalt, 14 January 2011 - 23:42.


#6516 Watkins74

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 01:05

"I sensed a greater determination than ever from Alonso, who did an exemplary job last season to fight back into contention in the second half of the season after problems in the first half. He will start the season where he left off."

Being a fan of Alonso. I think he needs to calm himself down a little bit.

#6517 bauss

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 04:47

just look at that beard and mustache, its business time for Fernando.... rivals have been warned

#6518 kosmos

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 05:46

The square with the scuderia logo in the front of the helmet is awfull.

#6519 JackTorrance

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 06:54

just look at that beard and mustache, its business time for Fernando.... rivals have been warned


He looks great. And hes on top of everybody. If the car is good he will be hard to beat.

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#6520 cheapracer

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 07:17

"Fernando Alonso took victory in the 21st Wrooom ice karting event which took place on Thursday night in Italy, beating the field by quite some margin, according to eyewitnesses."


Sinc you went out of your way to underline this it should be reviewed.

Kart race Alonso got the inside start into the first corner from inside pole and later Massa caught him and hit him from behind causing a coming together with another kart in 3rd and throwing some of the barrier in front of the pair of them - you don't get hit behind when you are quite some margin in front.

He won the FIAT 500 race a couple of car lengths in front from inside pole, not by quite some margin.


#6521 Mika Mika

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 07:43

I thought Alonso had a bad arm so couldnt race, he didn't ski..?

#6522 Craven Morehead

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:14

He beat 'em all with one arm tied behind his back.

#6523 Craven Morehead

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:15

;)

#6524 HPT

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:21

Sinc you went out of your way to underline this it should be reviewed.

Kart race Alonso got the inside start into the first corner from inside pole and later Massa caught him and hit him from behind causing a coming together with another kart in 3rd and throwing some of the barrier in front of the pair of them - you don't get hit behind when you are quite some margin in front.

He won the FIAT 500 race a couple of car lengths in front from inside pole, not by quite some margin.


Massa hit him in the beginning part of the race. He did win the race by some margin. Watch the video again.

#6525 ArtShelley

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 08:34

Alonso is always extremely determined so it's hard to imagine him with even more determination! :lol:
But Allen's comments remind me of McLaren's physical conditioning pro from Finland(I can't remember his name so I'll just call him Juha Trainernen) He has worked with Hakkinen,Kimi,Alonso,Hamilton and even worked with the greatest long distance runner of all time Gebreselese.
Trainernen said "If you could tell which driver was going to win by looking into the drivers eyes then it would be Alonso...."
I just hope the bigger helmet size Alonso will need with that extra determination wont effect the aerodynamics badly! :lol:


I agree that it's had to imagine Alonso being even more determined. He's got an amazing will to win and I think it's this kind of drive that separates the very best from the rest.

Regarding the second part of your post - that would be Aki Hintsa. But I've never heard of him make any such statement, so am curious about it. Could you please provide a reference or link to that quote?

#6526 Lotusseven

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 10:57

Love that Wrooom-party every year. Gives always nice pictures. Does only Ferrari have something like that?


Looks like Marussia Virgin Racing got an event in St.Moritz according to Glock

http://yfrog.com/h2s2btcj



#6527 AlanWake

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 11:22

Massa hit him in the beginning part of the race. He did win the race by some margin. Watch the video again.


Indeed.

This is a pic when he won the race:

Posted Image


#6528 The Ragged Edge

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 12:14

Posted Image

Fernando is faster than you, can you confirm you understood the message?


The race was fixed before hand. We couldn't have him complaining before the 2011 season has even started. :p


#6529 TigersWood

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 13:26

Don't you get bored of the "Fernando is faster than you..."? Move on!

Fernando is ready and there will be no mercy this year.

#6530 kosmos

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 13:33

The race was fixed before hand. We couldn't have him complaining before the 2011 season has even started. :p


Or maybe he already destroyed Massa's morale in this silly event :drunk:

#6531 The Ragged Edge

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Posted 15 January 2011 - 13:39

Or maybe he already destroyed Massa's morale in this silly event :drunk:


Who knows? You may be right. With Massa now the confirmed subservient, we'll never if he had it in him to beat Alonso on merit, or was it more team orders? Jokes aside, it is clear Alonso has the beating of Massa, and only an idiot would deny that. Makes you wonder just how fast the 2007 and 2008 Ferrari's were?

Edited by The Ragged Edge, 15 January 2011 - 13:40.


#6532 Lorenzo

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 01:49

Who knows? You may be right. With Massa now the confirmed subservient, we'll never if he had it in him to beat Alonso on merit, or was it more team orders? Jokes aside, it is clear Alonso has the beating of Massa, and only an idiot would deny that. Makes you wonder just how fast the 2007 and 2008 Ferrari's were?


I wouldn't be so certain that Fernando will have it all his own way this season. Assuming that the new car is competitive first of all and if Felipe can get the front end to work for him on the Pirelli's, this may not be entirely a done deal already. I personally rate Fernando very highly, however Felipe has proven to be no slouch either and when he is confident in the front end he is a totally different animal. We all saw Germany this year, Fernando was NOT really faster than Felipe if you examine the facts lap in, lap out...so watch this space.

The exciting thing would be if both guys can hook themselves up at the same time and push each other further forward, because they will need every single advantage they can get this year, with at least another 3x teams being very very competitive.

#6533 Yorkie

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:02

Who knows? You may be right. With Massa now the confirmed subservient, we'll never if he had it in him to beat Alonso on merit, or was it more team orders? Jokes aside, it is clear Alonso has the beating of Massa, and only an idiot would deny that. Makes you wonder just how fast the 2007 and 2008 Ferrari's were?

:cool: :cool: :cool:



#6534 hotstickyslick

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 02:19

Makes you wonder just how fast the 2007 and 2008 Ferrari's were?

They were excellent cars and I'm convinced that Alonso would've done better than both Massa and Raikkonen had he drove in them even more so after last year.

#6535 jetalt

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 12:12

Alonshow Wrooom 2011: Card's trick with Valentino:

http://img227.images...campiglio11.jpg




#6536 kosmos

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 14:26

Posted Image

:rotfl:

Alonso looks less shy since he joined Ferari.

#6537 AyrtonSauna

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 14:36

I agree that it's had to imagine Alonso being even more determined. He's got an amazing will to win and I think it's this kind of drive that separates the very best from the rest.

Regarding the second part of your post - that would be Aki Hintsa. But I've never heard of him make any such statement, so am curious about it. Could you please provide a reference or link to that quote?

That's the guy! Aki Hintsa! thanks and I found the full interview which really isn't about Alonso but Hintsa himself.A really interesting Man in my opinion.

Q;Fernando Alonso?

"- I have worked with him too. If you could say that you can see from some driver's eyes who wins you wouldn't have to guess twice. Alonso's will to win, both in good and bad, is something that I haven't seen during my career. He does well because of that will."

Full interview http://kimiraikkonen....net/?t=2971300

#6538 noikeee

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 14:39

Posted Image

:rotfl:

Alonso looks less shy since he joined Ferari.


That hat + facial hair combo is epic.

#6539 aditya-now

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Posted 16 January 2011 - 20:09

http://sphotos.ak.fb...5_8366089_n.jpg


Looks fantastic! :up:

Ice karting must be real fun - Fernando, a master on and off the ice!


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#6540 jjcale

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 10:32

I am a fan of FA but not a supporter (if that makes sense) and I have not studied his technique as much as LH who I am both a fan and supporter of, but I am in agreement with the assement below by "David Ryan" who posts sometimes in the comments James Allen's blog. The comment can be found on this page http://www.jamesalle...to-go/#comments.

What do you think about this?

David Ryan Reply:
January 16th, 2011 at 5:08 pm

Alonso’s cornering technique relies upon induced understeer, which requires oversteer on braking/entry and understeer thereafter to maximise exit speed and acceleration. That by definition means an understeering car is preferable for optimum performance, as the oversteer can be induced under braking without triggering further oversteer thereafter and compromising corner speed.

As a result, a stronger front tyre will make inducing understeer harder as it will maintain traction longer and thus make the rear tyres breaking traction under acceleration more likely. Alonso can and most certainly will drive around it, as he did in 2007, but it could mean the car is less in sync with his driving style than the Renaults (which is why he could get away with such dramatic steering inputs – the car reacted exactly as expected) and as was the case with the McLaren. He was still very fast, but not as dominant over the field as he had been in 2005 and 2006. His driving style still uses this technique, albeit in a toned-down manner – it’s why he has very little oversteer on exit compared with other drivers – but as with all the field there is a limit to how far he can modify his style before it starts to hamper his pace.

For comparison, Massa is best suited to a neutral car but can adapt to medium understeer or oversteer as required (as 2009 demonstrated, with the F60 understeering more than the F2008). However, strong understeer or oversteer are beyond his range. Alonso in comparsion copes very well with strong or medium understeer, and can make a neutral car work as well. However, he is not comparatively as good with oversteering cars. It’s all a matter of fractions and degrees, but in F1 that is quite important.

To illustrate the point, compare Alonso and Kubica’s relative form in 2009 and 2010 – leaving aside the strengths or weaknesses of the cars at their disposal, both drivers were much better suited to their cars and performed at a higher level in 2010 where the front tyre was narrower and weaker. As I said it is a matter of fractions and degrees and is not going to render them incapable of challenging for the title simply because the tyres have changed, but that wasn’t what I suggested.

My point was more that there is the potential that if the front tyre remains strong compared with the rear, that could reduce Alonso’s advantage over Massa and thus bring about a situation more akin to 2007. At the same time, it may not. It is however a variable which should be considered.


This should probably go into the FA v FM thread but I am taking it here first to see if FA's fans agree with the assessment of his technique as this is an assumption that needs some kind of verification before posing the question in the other thread.

#6541 as65p

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 10:46

I am a fan of FA but not a supporter (if that makes sense) and I have not studied his technique as much as LH who I am both a fan and supporter of, but I am in agreement with the assement below by "David Ryan" who posts sometimes in the comments James Allen's blog. The comment can be found on this page http://www.jamesalle...to-go/#comments.

What do you think about this?


I think he's spot on with this bit:

...At the same time, it may not....



#6542 ArtShelley

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 10:58

That's the guy! Aki Hintsa! thanks and I found the full interview which really isn't about Alonso but Hintsa himself.A really interesting Man in my opinion.

Q;Fernando Alonso?

"- I have worked with him too. If you could say that you can see from some driver's eyes who wins you wouldn't have to guess twice. Alonso's will to win, both in good and bad, is something that I haven't seen during my career. He does well because of that will."

Full interview http://kimiraikkonen....net/?t=2971300


Thanks. Though that statement is a little different to what you originally quoted. And interesting too - I wonder what he means by "both in good and bad"?

#6543 as65p

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 11:10

...I wonder what he means by "both in good and bad"?


Really, you wonder? It simply means that he can be a reckless bastard, if it's a means to the goal of winning.

Don't tell me that's news to you! :)

#6544 gaston_foix

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 12:08

I am a fan of FA but not a supporter (if that makes sense) and I have not studied his technique as much as LH who I am both a fan and supporter of, but I am in agreement with the assement below by "David Ryan" who posts sometimes in the comments James Allen's blog. The comment can be found on this page http://www.jamesalle...to-go/#comments.

What do you think about this?



This should probably go into the FA v FM thread but I am taking it here first to see if FA's fans agree with the assessment of his technique as this is an assumption that needs some kind of verification before posing the question in the other thread.


JA said that Alonso like oversteer.

#6545 Mika Mika

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 12:11

JA said that Alonso like oversteer.


At Renault and McLaren they always said he far prefered understeer - along with Button whereas Schumacher and Hamilton were the oversteer junkies.

#6546 MichaelPM

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 12:44

At Renault and McLaren they always said he far prefered understeer - along with Button whereas Schumacher and Hamilton were the oversteer junkies.

Renault was mainly understeer and McLaren was neutral, Ferrari was??? neutral-oversteer. Liking a certain style seems an irrelevant argument when history shows he can challenge for championships and get race wins in very different cars with very different base characteristics.

Just realised that apart from Minardi (obviously) Alonso has won atleast one race in his first F1 season with a team.

#6547 gaston_foix

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 12:59

At Renault and McLaren they always said he far prefered understeer - along with Button whereas Schumacher and Hamilton were the oversteer junkies.

I only quoted what JA said.

#6548 ArtShelley

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 14:44

I am a fan of FA but not a supporter (if that makes sense) and I have not studied his technique as much as LH who I am both a fan and supporter of, but I am in agreement with the assement below by "David Ryan" who posts sometimes in the comments James Allen's blog. The comment can be found on this page http://www.jamesalle...to-go/#comments.

What do you think about this?

David Ryan Reply:
January 16th, 2011 at 5:08 pm

Alonso’s cornering technique relies upon induced understeer, which requires oversteer on braking/entry and understeer thereafter to maximise exit speed and acceleration. That by definition means an understeering car is preferable for optimum performance, as the oversteer can be induced under braking without triggering further oversteer thereafter and compromising corner speed.

As a result, a stronger front tyre will make inducing understeer harder as it will maintain traction longer and thus make the rear tyres breaking traction under acceleration more likely. Alonso can and most certainly will drive around it, as he did in 2007, but it could mean the car is less in sync with his driving style than the Renaults (which is why he could get away with such dramatic steering inputs – the car reacted exactly as expected) and as was the case with the McLaren. He was still very fast, but not as dominant over the field as he had been in 2005 and 2006. His driving style still uses this technique, albeit in a toned-down manner – it’s why he has very little oversteer on exit compared with other drivers – but as with all the field there is a limit to how far he can modify his style before it starts to hamper his pace.

For comparison, Massa is best suited to a neutral car but can adapt to medium understeer or oversteer as required (as 2009 demonstrated, with the F60 understeering more than the F2008). However, strong understeer or oversteer are beyond his range. Alonso in comparsion copes very well with strong or medium understeer, and can make a neutral car work as well. However, he is not comparatively as good with oversteering cars. It’s all a matter of fractions and degrees, but in F1 that is quite important.

To illustrate the point, compare Alonso and Kubica’s relative form in 2009 and 2010 – leaving aside the strengths or weaknesses of the cars at their disposal, both drivers were much better suited to their cars and performed at a higher level in 2010 where the front tyre was narrower and weaker. As I said it is a matter of fractions and degrees and is not going to render them incapable of challenging for the title simply because the tyres have changed, but that wasn’t what I suggested.

My point was more that there is the potential that if the front tyre remains strong compared with the rear, that could reduce Alonso’s advantage over Massa and thus bring about a situation more akin to 2007. At the same time, it may not. It is however a variable which should be considered.




This should probably go into the FA v FM thread but I am taking it here first to see if FA's fans agree with the assessment of his technique as this is an assumption that needs some kind of verification before posing the question in the other thread.


I'm not so convinced. The explanation seems to make sense on the face of it, but on further thought not so much. Reason being that the Renault actually had immense front end grip. Alonso would barrel into a corner and use the prodigious grip from the front tyres to rip the steering wheel towards the corner and the front end would do just that. Then he would get the car pointed in a straight line joining the corner entry, apex and exit and floor the throttle and use the Renault's famous superb rear traction to power out of the corner. The Renault didn't have a huge amount of lateral grip from the rear tyres as compared to the fronts, but it did have amazing traction so as to get the power down and hence a great exit out.

That's why I don't buy the theory because if the Renault was an understeery car, there is no way that going deep into a corner and hacking at the wheel would not induce excessive understeer. The method of driving an understeery car is to actually get it turned in nice and early and continue braking deeper into the corner which transfers dynamic weight to the front and increases front end grip whilst unsettling and reducing the rear end grip. With the car now turned in, the braking can be reduced/power can be added to gradually transfer the balance back towards the rear and power out of the corner.

With an oversteery car, the opposite is better - brake late and hard in a straight line, turn in sharply to hit the apex** which lines up with the corner exit.

** there is no such thing as a perfect apex to the corner as is sometimes mistakenly thought. It depends on the point of turn in and the line of exit out

#6549 ArtShelley

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 14:45

Really, you wonder? It simply means that he can be a reckless bastard, if it's a means to the goal of winning.

Don't tell me that's news to you! :)


Reckless? In what way?

#6550 as65p

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Posted 17 January 2011 - 15:53

Reckless? In what way?


Hm, it certainly would be fun to discuss 2007 with roles reversed, i.e. me trying to prove that Alonso is reckless and bastardly at times... :p

But I reckon we won't get very far with it, so I'll leave it to you to figure it out, I'm sure you can. :wave: