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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#8951 AlanWake

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Posted 14 June 2011 - 19:16

I think Fernando Alonso has enough talent to beat anyone on the grid in the same equipment, Lewis Hamilton included. He just needs the right mindset and don't let his emotions affect his driving. In that aspect, I feel he is now a much better driver than he was at the start of 2007 season, he is now much calmer and focused. His year at Mclaren was good AND neccesary for him because he learned some valuable lessons which made him an overall better driver and a better person too.

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#8952 Aieljose

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Posted 14 June 2011 - 19:33

I think Fernando Alonso has enough talent to beat anyone on the grid in the same equipment, Lewis Hamilton included. He just needs the right mindset and don't let his emotions affect his driving. In that aspect, I feel he is now a much better driver than he was at the start of 2007 season, he is now much calmer and focused. His year at Mclaren was good AND neccesary for him because he learned some valuable lessons which made him an overall better driver and a better person too.

True. I don't think we would have seen Alonso go off in the last lap like vettel did. He is much calmer under pressure. He's always been. He also makes less mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel. It's a really shame the F150 has been so bad because he definitely deserves better.

#8953 Anssi

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Posted 14 June 2011 - 20:59

Alonso has a 0 % WDC win percentage at Scuderia Ferrari and chances are very high now that it will stay at 0 % after this season.

He's an excellent F1 driver and this has been my opinion since a long time ago and we have no argument about it at all.

But he doesn't deserve a better car any more than any of the other good drivers and there are certainly many of them.

#8954 Kohque

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Posted 14 June 2011 - 21:46

True. I don't think we would have seen Alonso go off in the last lap like vettel did. He is much calmer under pressure. He's always been. He also makes less mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel. It's a really shame the F150 has been so bad because he definitely deserves better.


Vettel's mistake could have happen to anybody. Wet tracks are a lottery. For Alonso, the car was not the problem. That car was ready to win in Canada. The problem is that when the conditions are bad, shit happens.

#8955 Aieljose

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 05:17

Vettel's mistake could have happen to anybody. Wet tracks are a lottery. For Alonso, the car was not the problem. That car was ready to win in Canada. The problem is that when the conditions are bad, shit happens.

It could but I can't remember the last time i've seen alonso make such a costly mistake on the last lap like that. Can you?

#8956 Kohque

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 06:21

It could but I can't remember the last time i've seen alonso make such a costly mistake on the last lap like that. Can you?


Being costly doesn't mean it is less likely. Unrelated things. A costly mistake from Alonso: Monaco last year.

The problem with argument that "Alonso would not make that mistake" is that it is not true. He had been driving superbly this season: Only a few slow starts due a clutch problem, clipping his front wing, a run-off in Monaco and, understandably, a run-off (that I saw) in Canada. Considering he has started in a 5th average position, it is a very remarkable driving. He have had a very good run since mid season last year. That, however, is not something normal even for Alonso. Saying he does not do mistakes like the one Vettel did on Canada belittles Alonso's effort, IMO.

If you want to praise Alonso, there is no need to make impossible comparisons with another drivers. Check Alonso's onboard in Monaco during practice this year. That, for me, is from another planet. I think Chandlock called him an "streetfighter" few times haha... He seemed genuinely awed, which coming from a recent F1 driver, speaks volumes. The way Alonso hustled with the car in Monaco was... :up: :up: :up:

#8957 Oho

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 06:37

I think he made a wrong decision leaving Mclaren at the end of 2007, He could've won the 2008 championship and put hamilton in his place.


Well chances are Alonso did not decide to leave McLaren as much as he was shown the door.

#8958 Aieljose

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:16

Being costly doesn't mean it is less likely. Unrelated things. A costly mistake from Alonso: Monaco last year.

The problem with argument that "Alonso would not make that mistake" is that it is not true. He had been driving superbly this season: Only a few slow starts due a clutch problem, clipping his front wing, a run-off in Monaco and, understandably, a run-off (that I saw) in Canada. Considering he has started in a 5th average position, it is a very remarkable driving. He have had a very good run since mid season last year. That, however, is not something normal even for Alonso. Saying he does not do mistakes like the one Vettel did on Canada belittles Alonso's effort, IMO.

If you want to praise Alonso, there is no need to make impossible comparisons with another drivers. Check Alonso's onboard in Monaco during practice this year. That, for me, is from another planet. I think Chandlock called him an "streetfighter" few times haha... He seemed genuinely awed, which coming from a recent F1 driver, speaks volumes. The way Alonso hustled with the car in Monaco was... :up: :up: :up:

I never said he doesn't make mistakes. He does. I said he hasn't made a big mistake like that on the last last when he was under extreme presure from another driver. Monaco is not comparable because you can't even compare the pressure facing a driver during FP3 vs the last lap of the race with less than a 1 second lead. I don't want to get into a big arguement with you, i just believe Alonso handles pressure better than any driver on the grid. The fact that you couldn't find an answer to my question kind of proves my point.

#8959 rommel

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:27

Alonso sometimes makes careless mistakes, although rarely critical race ending ones, or when it really matters. He might bin it running midfield trying to make up places, but at the front, you can usually bet your house on him.

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#8960 Kohque

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 08:21

I never said he doesn't make mistakes. He does. I said he hasn't made a big mistake like that on the last last when he was under extreme presure from another driver. Monaco is not comparable because you can't even compare the pressure facing a driver during FP3 vs the last lap of the race with less than a 1 second lead. I don't want to get into a big arguement with you, i just believe Alonso handles pressure better than any driver on the grid. The fact that you couldn't find an answer to my question kind of proves my point.


No, what you said is that Alonso would not make the mistake Vettel did, not the he hasn't. My answer was that Vettel's mistake can happen to anybody (especially in a wet track), even to Alonso (just differing opinions on something that could or could not happen). And then I said these comments devalue how difficult is to keep driving at that level (This is the only arguable point).

What you asked: "I can't remember the last time i've seen alonso make such a costly mistake. Can you?"... Monaco was kinda costly (cost=points lost), more so than Vettel's. So that should answer to your question.


#8961 Fontainebleau

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 09:55

Well chances are Alonso did not decide to leave McLaren as much as he was shown the door.

These comments by Haug seem to indicate he did want to leave indeed:

"This weekend at Spa-Francorchamps, Mercedes Motorsport Boss Norbert Haug, declared: "If a driver does not want to stay, we must sit together and talk about it. But in the middle of the World Championship fight, that is perhaps the wrong moment.""

http://www.f1technical.net/news/7092

Which is logical, given what had been happening during the year. Would McLaren have wanted him to stay? Anybody's guess, but I would not be surprised if Dennis had not relished the prospect ;) Whitmarsh, on the other hand, is on record saying that he is sorry he lost Alonso and that he thinks things could have been done differently.

So I don't think Alonso made a mistake in leaving after 2007, when Dennis was still around - I think their relatinship was far too damaged. But who knows, things could have turned out differently if Dennis had been forced to resign his position as a consequence of Spygate instead of as a consequence of Liegate, and Whitmarsh had taken over the team at that point - however, this is F1-fiction! :)

Edited by Fontainebleau, 15 June 2011 - 09:56.


#8962 kryziuotis

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 10:33

What you asked: "I can't remember the last time i've seen alonso make such a costly mistake. Can you?"... Monaco was kinda costly (cost=points lost), more so than Vettel's. So that should answer to your question.

It's bad example, because mistake was pretty small. It was in practice and drivers always push the boundaries there, because mistakes during practice usually don't result in any points lost. For example Rosberg did the same this year and nobody even counts it as a mistake, because his car was repaired till qualifying. So Alonso was simply unlucky that his car couldn't be repaired. So he lost points more due to unusual circumstances than becasue of this mistake.

The mistakes that really shows how a driver is able to handle pressure, are the ones where you can clearly predict the outcome of mistake. A driver comes under pressure, he understands the cost of a mistake himself - he knows, that he has to drive mistake free to keep his position, yet he still makes it. And Alonso doesn't make this kind of mistakes - that's what original poster wanted to say.

#8963 Kohque

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 11:25

It's bad example, because mistake was pretty small.

OK, cool. You don't like it.

The mistakes that really shows how a driver is able to handle pressure, are the ones where you can clearly predict the outcome of mistake. A driver comes under pressure, he understands the cost of a mistake himself - he knows, that he has to drive mistake free to keep his position, yet he still makes it. And Alonso doesn't make this kind of mistakes - that's what original poster wanted to say.

Dude, I know what he said.

#8964 BalazsF1

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 13:23

I'd like to ask you wheter there are a collection of stories or a book in English about Fernando on the Net.

#8965 velgajski1

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 15:07

True. I don't think we would have seen Alonso go off in the last lap like vettel did. He is much calmer under pressure. He's always been. He also makes less mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel. It's a really shame the F150 has been so bad because he definitely deserves better.


Vettel still did least mistakes this season, and in first half of 2010. Alonso did more mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel, so you cannot generalise like that.

#8966 Aieljose

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 18:06

Vettel still did least mistakes this season, and in first half of 2010. Alonso did more mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel, so you cannot generalise like that.

The first half yes but what about the second half and the first half of this year? He's clearly made lass mistakes than Hamilton over the last year and a half and he's about even with vettel although vettels mistakes have been more costly. Also my main point is about going off in the last lap which Alonso hasn't done. Sugar coat it anyway you like but vettel choked last sunday.

#8967 Man of the race

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Posted 15 June 2011 - 19:02

The first half yes but what about the second half and the first half of this year? He's clearly made lass mistakes than Hamilton over the last year and a half and he's about even with vettel although vettels mistakes have been more costly. Also my main point is about going off in the last lap which Alonso hasn't done. Sugar coat it anyway you like but vettel choked last sunday.


Vettel's mistakes have hardly been more costy. He did win WDC last year and did not mess up royally the last race. This year, he's been fast and consistent, In Montreal he got a rewarding 2nd place with plenty of points, compared to Alonso's retirement (edit: was previously "disqualification", sorry about bad wording) and zero outcome. Vettel decided to drive more on the edge to succeed, which he did. Eventyally he gained more than lost when the day's job was done. Lewis on the other hand... he is the most entertaining racer there is. And he just gets better and better every year, not at avoiding mistakes but at avoiding being bore.

Edited by Man of the race, 16 June 2011 - 04:24.


#8968 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 03:10

Vettel still did least mistakes this season, and in first half of 2010. Alonso did more mistakes than both Hamilton and Vettel, so you cannot generalise like that.


You are cherry picking. Vettel made plenty of mistakes last year. This year, Vettel, Button and Alonso had been driving really well. It is Hamilton who has made more unforced errors by far this year.

Edited by Kohque, 16 June 2011 - 03:10.


#8969 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 03:16

Vettel's mistakes have hardly been more costy. He did win WDC last year and did not mess up royally the last race. This year, he's been fast and consistent, In Montreal he got a rewarding 2nd place with plenty of points, compared to Alonso's disqualification and zero outcome. Vettel decided to drive more on the edge to succeed, which he did. Eventyally he gained more than lost when the day's job was done. Lewis on the other hand... he is the most entertaining racer there is. And he just gets better and better every year, not at avoiding mistakes but at avoiding being bore.

Alonso did not mess up in the last race. The strategy did.

Alonso was not disqualified. He was taken out of the race by another car.

Dude, what kind of thick lens people wear when they watch the races? :lol:

#8970 Man of the race

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 04:47

:stoned:

Alonso was not disqualified. He was taken out of the race by another car.


Sorry, bad wording. It was supposed to be "retirement". Disqualification seems to refer to stewards' action indeed, which was not the intention nor the case.

#8971 Jordana

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 10:31

Alonso did not mess up in the last race. The strategy did.

Alonso was not disqualified. He was taken out of the race by another car.

Dude, what kind of thick lens people wear when they watch the races? :lol:



And who are you going to fire after the mess up with Alonso's strategy? Chris Dyer is not there anymore! :stoned:

It looked more like he parked his car in a weird way after just a racing incident! :rotfl:

Edited by Jordana, 16 June 2011 - 10:32.


#8972 YellowHelmet

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 10:37

It looked more like he parked his car in a weird way after just a racing incident! :rotfl:

great view of that what happened in canada 11 :up:

#8973 trogggy

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 10:43

great view of that what happened in canada 11 :up:

'...taken out by another car' isn't great either.

#8974 Jordana

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 10:58

great view of that what happened in canada 11 :up:



Being honest... Canada 2011 was a disgrace for motorsport... After watching les 24 du Mans, the bike GP in Silverstone... Canada was ridiculous!



#8975 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:04

And who are you going to fire after the mess up with Alonso's strategy? Chris Dyer is not there anymore! :stoned:

It looked more like he parked his car in a weird way after just a racing incident! :rotfl:


Alonso was not responsible for Ferrari firing him, babe.

I am also sad he left F1. Send him a letter. Maybe, you can convince him to come back.  ;)



#8976 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:09

'...taken out by another car' isn't great either.

OK, taken out by another car in a racing incident. Believe me, he really, really, did not park his car on purpose.

Edited by Kohque, 16 June 2011 - 11:10.


#8977 teejay

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:12

Being honest... Canada 2011 was a disgrace for motorsport... After watching les 24 du Mans, the bike GP in Silverstone... Canada was ridiculous!


What the hell do you base that on?



#8978 trogggy

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:13

OK, taken out by another car in a racing incident. Believe me, he really, really, did not park his car on purpose.

'Taken out' sounds like he was tootling along minding his own business, that's all.

#8979 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:23

'Taken out' sounds like he was tootling along minding his own business, that's all.

OK, dude, then just tell me how to say it ('contact from behind?', 'touched by other car in the rear wheel?'...) .



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#8980 trogggy

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:32

OK, dude, then just tell me how to say it ('contact from behind?', 'touched by other car in the rear wheel?'...) .

How many ways would you like?

'He retired after coming together with Button'?
Too risqué?


#8981 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:35

How many ways would you like?

'He retired after coming together with Button'?
Too risqué?

I don't even know what you are mumbling about.

'Coming together with Button' sounds good. Breath now.

#8982 trogggy

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:36

I don't even know what you are mumbling about.

'Coming together with Button' sounds good. Breath now.

Guessing english isn't your first language then (and that's not supposed to be an insult).

#8983 Jordana

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:41

What the hell do you base that on?


First of all... Show a little respect my friend... Start a sentence with thet "what the h".... Not nice.... :rolleyes:

I base it on a F1 race lasting 4 hours is ridiculous and it's even more ridiculous if you take into account that half of that time the race was stopped and what we watched on tv was pathetic. And it gets worse if you take into account that of those 2 hours the race was on, almost half of that time, the safety car was on track... :smoking:

Edited by Jordana, 16 June 2011 - 11:44.


#8984 Jordana

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:44

Alonso was not responsible for Ferrari firing him, babe.

I am also sad he left F1. Send him a letter. Maybe, you can convince him to come back. ;)



Babe, Alonso is never responsable for anything... :stoned:

And talking about Dyer, I would not mind to see him hired by Mercedes Petronas, he has good friends there! :p

#8985 4MEN

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:49

Being honest... Canada 2011 was a disgrace for motorsport... After watching les 24 du Mans, the bike GP in Silverstone... Canada was ridiculous!


:up:
... and the Isle of Man TT...


#8986 Jordana

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:51

:up:
... and the Isle of Man TT...


Yes my friend... :smoking:

#8987 Kohque

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 11:54

Guessing english isn't your first language then (and that's not supposed to be an insult).

You guessed it right. I'll try to remember 'coming together' next time.

#8988 puxanando

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 11:56

Alonso on P3 in the world- Sportman-gaining list! :)

Hamilton P13 and Schumi on 20!

#8989 YellowHelmet

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 11:59

Alonso on P3 in the world- Sportman-gaining list! :)

Hamilton P13 and Schumi on 20!

thank you for that.

but in this list some sportsman are missing.
e.g. Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Tiger Woods etc.

#8990 Dunder

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:03

thank you for that.

but in this list some sportsman are missing.
e.g. Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Tiger Woods etc.


There is a separate list for Americans.


#8991 Jordana

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:03

thank you for that.

but in this list some sportsman are missing.
e.g. Kobe Bryant, Lebron James, Tiger Woods etc.



Here they are...

http://sportsillustr...2011/index.html


Nevertheless, it's a funny list and it makes no sense in comparaison to other lists like for example Forbes'...



#8992 YellowHelmet

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:05

thx @ Dunder and Jordana

#8993 puxanando

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:07

:) :up: But Alonso earns more money than the other F1 driver and also more than some very good footballer......

#8994 YellowHelmet

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:13

:) :up: But Alonso earns more money than the other F1 driver and also more than some very good footballer......

and lives in a country where the taxes are very high. :up:
no tax refugee (anymore) :up:

#8995 Hole

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:16

and lives in a country where the taxes are very high. :up:
no tax refugee (anymore) :up:


Wasn't he living in Switzerland? Where does he live now?

#8996 YellowHelmet

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:16

Wasn't he living in Switzerland? Where does he live now?

back to spain.

#8997 Fontainebleau

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:17

:) :up: But Alonso earns more money than the other F1 driver and also more than some very good footballer......

Well, if you take into account the risks that different sportsmen run in their activity when analysing their earnings, I would say that motorsport does not pay well :p

#8998 Jordana

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:17

:) :up: But Alonso earns more money than the other F1 driver and also more than some very good footballer......



Sorry but Forbes does not agree...  ;)


http://ascology.com/...-Full-list.html







#8999 Jordana

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:18

back to spain.



But he moved back to Spain very recently, could it be last month?

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#9000 YellowHelmet

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 12:19

But he moved back to Spain very recently, could it be last month?

about