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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#2351 Bloggsworth

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 15:56

Alonso when in control of his emotions is one of the best on the planet, but unless he is in a dominent position, the slightest setback seems to set him both driving and talking emotionally. Drive with your brain, like Button; or with your heart like Hamilton and you stay in control. I would suggest that he played golf, but I expect he would be forever buying new putters or 9 irons, because no faults are his.

There seems to be a basic misunderstanding of the penalty system. If there is time before the conclusion of the race to serve a penalty, a drive through is the prescribed one - there was about half the race to go, so that is what he got. He gained an advantage by cutting a corner (The reason is irrelevant), he should have handed the place back and tried again. If you recall, that's exactly what Hamilton did at Spa (The situation was exactly the same, Raikkonen left him nowhere to go but off the circuit), he then retook Raikkonen at the next corner and was still penalised - Alonso didn't even ATTEMPT to correct the situation, in fact he beetled off into the distance while saying "What should I do". He is an experienced racer, he knew exactly what to do, he was waitng for someone to take him off the hook.

Edited by Bloggsworth, 11 July 2010 - 15:57.


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#2352 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 15:57

and martin brundle is the man to whom we should listen in that case :rotfl:
:down:

He is a highly respected broadcaster and F1 journalist. He says things straight, and I think his opinions are much, much more important than yours.

#2353 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 15:57

Avoided the point I see. Don't worry I didn't expect anything more from you.

i am not avoiding anything!
we were talking that bbc said alonso is not talking to them because he is mad (or something like that) and that is not true, he was just waiting for the interview time!

#2354 Katsumi

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 15:58

there is a special place and time where drivers have to talk to the press, as alonso did!
alonso is not compeled to talk to the press everywhere and for any time!
bbc must respect that, as other press members did!

bbc is not more worth than the others!


Alonso was completely astonished to see any British reporter still around after Silverstone, even after Alonso advised them to turn around and go home because there wasnt anything to see except the back from Alonso's Ferrari ... Alonso once in a while makes a complete ars out of himself. :)

Edited by Katsumi, 11 July 2010 - 15:59.


#2355 Anssi

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 15:58

to tell his race engineer not to speak to him for the rest of the race isn't good.



Kimi told Andrea Stella not to talk to him in the corners last year during a race practice session/qualifying. Stella apparently came on the radio whilst Kimi was on a really fast corner and he distracted Kimi enough so that Kimi went off the track for a moment.

As I saw it, the race engineer Andrea Stella was blabbering on the radio, saying useless things. Whilst Kimi could have been more polite about it, he was right, the engineer was talking too much on the radio. There should be radio silence unless there is something important to say, the driver is doing a very difficult job and it is not right to blabber on the radio, that's just going to cause problems sooner or later.

Keke Rosberg told that he unplugged his radio during a race for McLaren when Ron Dennis was blabbering on the radio. "The radio didn't work for some reason so I didn't hear you!" :smoking:


This is not the first time a driver has gotten annoyed at his team for disturbing him on he radio unnecessarily!



It is funny though, as Ferrari talked of Alonso as someone who talks more, and now Alonso is telling his race engineer to shut up! :lol:

Now both Kimi and Alonso have wanted their race engineer to shut up whilst they are driving. I think the problem is that the race engineer is saying useless things on the radio, as happened in Valencia too, the race engineer just made Alonso fume even more by joining the whining and then giving him more information which wasn't going to make Alonso's race any better but just distract him even more.

Edited by Anssi, 11 July 2010 - 16:05.


#2356 Tifosi90

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:00

I was watching the same race as you. As with any event unfolding before our eyes, we can interpret things differently one of the great beauties of the human mind.

As I understand it, the puncture for Massa was a result of the contact with Alonso in the Becketts complex - meaning that (to my mind) the pass was not a successful one.

I haven't seen the Hamilton GP2 examples. I've certainly never seen it in an F1 race.


Yes the puncture was the result because of contact but Massa was really unlucky to get a puncture from that small tap and Alonso got away with it scott free. The move itself was successful since Massa managed to keep his place for a while until his tyre failed on him. If Massa did not have that terrible luck that move was done and dusted.

Look around youtube for the Hamilton overtake.

#2357 wj_gibson

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:01

You're joking, right? They were neck and neck when the first contact happened. Then Felipe had the line and passed Alonso and then he hit his rear with his frontwing.

Why do people try to alter the truth?


Having watched the relevant footage on the BBC i-player several times over the last few minutes, I see no evidence of the events VicR describes. At best, they banged wheels in Becketts, but Alonso clearly has his nose ahead at thae point of contact.

I can't see Alonso hitting Massa's rear anywhere on the opening lap.

Massa does get ahead of Alonso after their contact. Alonso re-passes Massa into Vale on lap 1. Whether Massa's puncture is taking effect by then is unclear - he does make sideways contact with Barrichello between Vale and Club, so I'm wondering if that might have caused the puncture, now I think about it.

#2358 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:01

He is a highly respected broadcaster and F1 journalist. He says things straight, and I think his opinions are much, much more important than yours.

even if he is regarded by some people to be a highly respectable person, this doesnt give him any denazification certificate which camouflage when he is talking (bullshit) about things he is not into!

#2359 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:01

he is saying before any race, and he did also after this, that mercedes is having the best starts, and they know it!
when the german press print that, i will post it here!

Wow, very good at completely misinterpreting something (like you often do). The fact that MS and Mercedes are having good starts doesn't mean they are cheating by using illegal electronic launch control systems. Hamilton had a good start. I doubt that's because McLaren are cheating. The fact is today a lot of people on the clean side had poor starts, that includes Alonso. That doesn't mean he screwed his start, just that that side of the track seemed less grippy for some reason. Meaning more wheel spin.

I don't really know why I am still arguing abut this, because you are just wrong. And this is off topic.

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#2360 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:03

even if he is regarded by some people to be a highly respectable person, this doesnt give him any denazification certificate which camouflage when he is talking (bullshit) about things he is not into!

Sorry ye, I forgot to mention that he isn't really interested in F1 :rolleyes: .

#2361 gincarnated

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:03

there is a special place and time where drivers have to talk to the press, as alonso did!
alonso is not compeled to talk to the press everywhere and for any time!
bbc must respect that, as other press members did!

bbc is not more worth than the others!


Actually, I think they are. I'm obviously not positive but I think because the may pay the most to FOM that they're given first interviews or first preference. Not really sure what the reason is but it does seem to be the case.

Was it in that little press circle where the drivers do the rounds where Fred didn't talk to the BBC? Would be strange if he passed of the BBC. I don't really care either way. It's not such a big deal.

Ferrari sending their press officer to speak to the BBC was strange though.

#2362 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:04

Wow, very good at completely misinterpreting something (like you often do). The fact that MS and Mercedes are having good starts doesn't mean they are cheating by using illegal electronic launch control systems. Hamilton had a good start. I doubt that's because McLaren are cheating. The fact is today a lot of people on the clean side had poor starts, that includes Alonso. That doesn't mean he screwed his start, just that that side of the track seemed less grippy for some reason. Meaning more wheel spin.

I don't really know why I am still arguing abut this, because you are just wrong. And this is off topic.

who said that they are cheating :confused:
they found a solution within the regulations that give them an advantage over others by starts

#2363 cardin

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:04

still they have systems which help with starts, as ms is always stating!

Felipe seems to be doing a better job at the starts with the same "systems".

#2364 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:05

Sorry ye, I forgot to mention that he isn't really interested in F1 :rolleyes: .

he isnt into alonso psychology,

That has nothing to do with being into formula1 or not!

#2365 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:07

Could you outline precisely what press duties (with which broadcasters) each driver is required to perform?

The point I was making was that usually we see all the drivers talk to all the press (including Alonso). The fact that he only spoke to the Spanish media (and possibly a few chosen others), to me means that he isn't handling the pressure very well. When things go wrong for you in F1 most drivers still speak to the press. They put things behind them. They may feel sore (obviously) but should show a strong mental ability. Doing things like not speaking to the press and telling his engineer not to speak to him tells me that he isn't as strong as he could be emotionally. And it's not just me who thinks this; a few journalists have pointed it out to.

#2366 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:07

Felipe seems to be doing a better job at the starts with the same "systems".

sometimes yes, sometimes no!
ferrari had some problems with their starts so far

#2367 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:08

Alonso when in control of his emotions is one of the best on the planet, but unless he is in a dominent position, the slightest setback seems to set him both driving and talking emotionally.

Well said :up: .

#2368 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:08

The point I was making was that usually we see all the drivers talk to all the press (including Alonso). The fact that he only spoke to the Spanish media (and possibly a few chosen others), to me means that he isn't handling the pressure very well.

a psychologist :down: :drunk:

a few journalists have pointed it out to.


good that you have mentioned that they are just few!
but who are they to judge on that :drunk:

Edited by YellowHelmet, 11 July 2010 - 16:12.


#2369 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:09

i am not avoiding anything!
we were talking that bbc said alonso is not talking to them because he is mad (or something like that) and that is not true, he was just waiting for the interview time!

See my previous post: http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=4470880

#2370 GiancarloF1

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:12

Ferrari is even bigger failure for Alonso, than McLaren was in 2007. I'm astonished how his season fell apart.

#2371 dav115

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:13

Having watched the relevant footage on the BBC i-player several times over the last few minutes, I see no evidence of the events VicR describes. At best, they banged wheels in Becketts, but Alonso clearly has his nose ahead at thae point of contact.

I can't see Alonso hitting Massa's rear anywhere on the opening lap.

Massa does get ahead of Alonso after their contact. Alonso re-passes Massa into Vale on lap 1. Whether Massa's puncture is taking effect by then is unclear - he does make sideways contact with Barrichello between Vale and Club, so I'm wondering if that might have caused the puncture, now I think about it.

This is what I've been posting all over this board and still don't understand. Had Massa's tyre been punctured during their contact in Becketts then there's no way Massa could be full throttle down Hangar Straight, surely? That said, going into Stowe Massa did seem to lose the rear extremely suddenly so perhaps the tyre was slowly deflating down Hangar Straight? Or maybe that was just general oversteer and, as you say, maybe there was contact between himself and Barrichello.

#2372 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:13

Ferrari is even bigger failure for Alonso, than McLaren was in 2007. I'm astonished how his season fell apart.

it is not over yet!
next gps should fit ferrari and without some bad luck he will be winning!

Edited by YellowHelmet, 11 July 2010 - 16:14.


#2373 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:14

maybe there was contact between himself and Barrichello.

that happened

#2374 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:16

Kimi told Andrea Stella not to talk to him in the corners last year during a race practice session/qualifying. Stella apparently came on the radio whilst Kimi was on a really fast corner and he distracted Kimi enough so that Kimi went off the track for a moment.

As I saw it, the race engineer Andrea Stella was blabbering on the radio, saying useless things. Whilst Kimi could have been more polite about it, he was right, the engineer was talking too much on the radio. There should be radio silence unless there is something important to say, the driver is doing a very difficult job and it is not right to blabber on the radio, that's just going to cause problems sooner or later.

Keke Rosberg told that he unplugged his radio during a race for McLaren when Ron Dennis was blabbering on the radio. "The radio didn't work for some reason so I didn't hear you!" :smoking:


This is not the first time a driver has gotten annoyed at his team for disturbing him on he radio unnecessarily!



It is funny though, as Ferrari talked of Alonso as someone who talks more, and now Alonso is telling his race engineer to shut up! :lol:

Now both Kimi and Alonso have wanted their race engineer to shut up whilst they are driving. I think the problem is that the race engineer is saying useless things on the radio, as happened in Valencia too, the race engineer just made Alonso fume even more by joining the whining and then giving him more information which wasn't going to make Alonso's race any better but just distract him even more.

Fine, but I got the impression he told his engineer not to speak to him not because of something his engineer was saying but simply because he was so angry he didn't want to speak to anybody. Now on it's own that's reasonably understandable. However there have been a few incidents with Alonso this season where he doesn't seem able to cope well with pressure.


#2375 MaxisOne

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:17

there is a special place and time where drivers have to talk to the press, as alonso did!
alonso is not compeled to talk to the press everywhere and for any time!
bbc must respect that, as other press members did!

bbc is not more worth than the others!



First off .. The special time and place your talking about .. Yea .. thats usually after the race...
Ill accept that Hes not compelled to talk to anyone... fine ..
BBC respected that .. No one from the BBC was barging down his door.

and umm yea .. BBC is rated quite a bit higher than others especially considering this is the British Grand Prix and additionally the BBC is seen as one of if not the premier English speaking news agency (worldwide).. :kiss:

Edited by MaxisOne, 11 July 2010 - 16:18.


#2376 wj_gibson

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:18

This is what I've been posting all over this board and still don't understand. Had Massa's tyre been punctured during their contact in Becketts then there's no way Massa could be full throttle down Hangar Straight, surely? That said, going into Stowe Massa did seem to lose the rear extremely suddenly so perhaps the tyre was slowly deflating down Hangar Straight? Or maybe that was just general oversteer and, as you say, maybe there was contact between himself and Barrichello.


Yes, this is a very good point.

I'm no physicist, so is it possible for a tyre with a puncture to retain its shape for another 1/3 of a lap? I'm not sure.

It's interesting that Massa ran well wide at Club (the first clear sign of his puncture) - this is just a few seconds after side contact with Barrichello.

#2377 cardin

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:19

sometimes yes, sometimes no!
ferrari had some problems with their starts so far


I know, it's useless to argue with you. You make up stuff, you lie and you deny the obvious.

#2378 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:19

Did he relly say that ?

Yes

#2379 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:20

and umm yea .. BBC is rated quite a bit higher than others especially considering this is the British Grand Prix and additionally the BBC is seen as one of if not the premier English speaking news agency (worldwide).. :kiss:

some people take their selves far to serious!

alonso talked to the press, and just some bbc members are complaining :down:

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#2380 AlanWake

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:20

Kimi told Andrea Stella not to talk to him in the corners last year during a race. Stella apparently came on the radio whilst Kimi was on a really fast corner and he distracted Kimi enough so that Kimi went off the track for a moment.

As I saw it, the race engineer Andrea Stella was blabbering on the radio, saying useless things. Whilst Kimi could have been more polite about it, he was right, the engineer was talking too much on the radio. There should be radio silence unless there is something important to say, the driver is doing a very difficult job and it is not right to blabber on the radio, that's just going to cause problems sooner or later.

Keke Rosberg told that he unplugged his radio during a race for McLaren when Ron Dennis was blabbering on the radio. "The radio didn't work for some reason so I didn't hear you!" :smoking:

This is not the first time a driver has gotten annoyed at his team for disturbing him on he radio unnecessarily!

It is funny though, as Ferrari talked of Alonso as someone who talks more, and now Alonso is telling his race engineer to shut up! :lol:

Now both Kimi and Alonso have wanted their race engineer to shut up during a race. I think the problem is that the race engineer is saying useless things on the radio, as happened in Valencia too, the race engineer just made Alonso fume even more by joining the whining and then giving him more information which wasn't going to make Alonso's race any better but just distract him even more.


"Kimi" :) was my first thought when I heard Alonso saying on the radio to Ferrari: "I don't want to you speak to me anymore on the radio". It was BRILLIANT!!! :clap: :clap: :clap:

#2381 Katsumi

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:20

it is not over yet!
next gps should fit ferrari and without some bad luck he will be winning!


You sayed the exact some thing before the GP from Silverstone ...

#2382 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:20

I know, it's useless to argue with you. You make up stuff, you lie and you deny the obvious.

show me
otherwise :down:

Edited by YellowHelmet, 11 July 2010 - 16:21.


#2383 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:22

who said that they are cheating :confused:
they found a solution within the regulations that give them an advantage over others by starts

http://forums.autosp...w...t&p=4470833

#2384 VicR

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:23

Having watched the relevant footage on the BBC i-player several times over the last few minutes, I see no evidence of the events VicR describes. At best, they banged wheels in Becketts, but Alonso clearly has his nose ahead at thae point of contact.

I can't see Alonso hitting Massa's rear anywhere on the opening lap.

Massa does get ahead of Alonso after their contact. Alonso re-passes Massa into Vale on lap 1. Whether Massa's puncture is taking effect by then is unclear - he does make sideways contact with Barrichello between Vale and Club, so I'm wondering if that might have caused the puncture, now I think about it.


I think you're watching the wrong race or a race in a parellel dimension or simply just taking the mickey out.

#2385 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:23

sometimes yes, sometimes no!
ferrari had some problems with their starts so far

Maybe they should get that launch control system that you claim Mercedes has got :rolleyes: .

#2386 peroa

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:24

Fine, but I got the impression he told his engineer not to speak to him not because of something his engineer was saying but simply because he was so angry he didn't want to speak to anybody. Now on it's own that's reasonably understandable. However there have been a few incidents with Alonso this season where he doesn't seem able to cope well with pressure.


To be fair, he is under enormous pressure. Ferrari, Santander, Tifosi. I can imagine that the Italian press will soon start to ask question, if not already ...
He was brought in as the saviour, hard working, motivating, intelligent - the complete opposite of the lazy magnum eater.

#2387 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:25

a psychologist :down: :drunk:

good that you have mentioned that they are just few!
but who are they to judge on that :drunk:

They're only opinions. Of course nobody can prove if Alonso isn't coping with pressure or not. That is what people do on forums you know, give opinions :rolleyes: .

#2388 cardin

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:25

show me
otherwise :down:


I'll give you the oportunity to show it yourself. Just bring us some quotes from MS saying mercedes have better starting "systems" than everybody else.

#2389 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:26

Maybe they should get that launch control system that you claim Mercedes has got :rolleyes: .

i never said they had a launch control!
i said within the regulations they are aware to have the best starts

#2390 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:27

it is not over yet!
next gps should fit ferrari and without some bad luck he will be winning!

There is a famous saying "you make your own luck". Today if he had given Kubica that position back straight away he would have likely finished 4th or even on the podium.

#2391 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:27

I'll give you the oportunity to show it yourself. Just bring us some quotes from MS saying mercedes have better starting "systems" than everybody else.

i am waiting for that interview to be printed.
ms said their starts are the best (which implies their system is the best, whatever it is!)

#2392 cardin

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:28

i never said they had a launch control!
i said within the regulations they are aware to have the best starts


Aren't you foegetting the word "systems".

#2393 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:28

There is a famous saying "you make your own luck". Today if he had given Kubica that position back straight away he would have likely finished 4th or even on the podium.

i never said alonso is free of that, but he communicated with the team and they said to him to hold position!
if the stewards have reacted faster, there would be no need of penalty, just saying to him let kubica repass.

about you make your own luck (alonso tried as hamilton did two weeks ago ;) )

Edited by YellowHelmet, 11 July 2010 - 16:29.


#2394 MaxisOne

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:28

some people take their selves far to serious!

alonso talked to the press, and just some bbc members are complaining :down:



Im not complaining .. but dont come on here telling me that it looks kosher to avoid talking to the BBC after the British Grand Prix post race when all and sundry and i do mean everybody (even from his team) lined up to talk to them ... It doesn't wash.. :down:

#2395 MaxisOne

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:30

i never said alonso is free of that, but he communicated with the team and they said to him to hold position!
if the stewards have reacted faster, there would be no need of penalty, just saying to him let kubica repass.


Really ??

Your waiting for the stewards to tell Alonso he needed to repas when HE KNEW he should have done it immediately after he passed 4 wheels off the track??

Really ??
:rolleyes:


#2396 Verderer

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:30

I see YellowHelmet is workin overtime.

Alonso's hybris is largely his own creation, and at this rate he will completely destroy his own career and reputation. It's not about whether he can win the championship anymore, it's about whether he has a future in F1 after this. He might come out of it smelling roses, but it doesn't look too promising now.


#2397 YellowHelmet

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:30

Im not complaining .. but dont come on here telling me that it looks kosher to avoid talking to the BBC after the British Grand Prix post race when all and sundry and i do mean everybody (even from his team) lined up to talk to them ... It doesn't wash.. :down:

maybe in the meantime he talked to them, but he is not compelled to do it!
he talked to other press memebers and they have printed it already!

#2398 syph0nJZ05

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:31

To be fair, he is under enormous pressure. Ferrari, Santander, Tifosi. I can imagine that the Italian press will soon start to ask question, if not already ...
He was brought in as the saviour, hard working, motivating, intelligent - the complete opposite of the lazy magnum eater.

Similar thing to Schumi's comeback though. Similar amount of pressure and expectation. Equally he isn't delivering, yet he handles the pressure and the situation very well.

#2399 velgajski1

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Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:32

I see YellowHelmet is workin overtime.

Alonso's hybris is largely his own creation, and at this rate he will completely destroy his own career and reputation. It's not about whether he can win the championship anymore, it's about whether he has a future in F1 after this. He might come out of it smelling roses, but it doesn't look too promising now.


Yep, so far this is worse than Kimi's 2008. and that was bad enough. Alonso needs to improve very soon, and stop to think about stewards, wdc, wcc and focus on racing.

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#2400 cardin

cardin
  • Member

  • 2,065 posts
  • Joined: October 02

Posted 11 July 2010 - 16:32

i am waiting for that interview to be printed.
ms said their starts are the best (which implies their system is the best, whatever it is!)


I see, you are changing the tune now. Nice try, but no, it doesn't imply anything and if he's saying it before every race this season as you stated, it wouldn't be dificult to find a quote, right ? I'm not holding my breath waiting for the quote.