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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#3351 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:24

By the same reason that Fernando can be anything you want except honest and speaking his mind all the time. Funny that when he's sincere, people attack him for being against the team, against the world, against anything that moves. The whining boy. When he tries to preserve the diplomacy of a team, he's now hipocryte. In Spain we say that one thing is black or white, but it can't be white today and be black tomorrow.

That's not true at all, Alonso is always looking after himself, not the team, not the sport, nothing. A few races ago when things didn't go his way, he's crying about the FIA. At McLaren when things didn't go his way, he's crying about unfair treatment.

Only today because they helped him win, he's backing the team. It sounds like he should be the one you should be saying that Spanish phrase to, as he clearly isn't abiding by it.

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#3352 AlainProstX

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:24

That's a pretty forced smile, if you ask me.


You haven`t seen his impressions after he got out of the car, seeing felipe before stepping up to the podium or sitting on that chair infront of the whole press.

Or you have forgotten the teamradio after his race victory. No "Yeah, Waka Waka baby".

#3353 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:25

If that's what Lauda said, then he basically repeated what I said above, only adding that Fernando was speaking a load of what might be described as ordure.

ah lauda is known for his alonso-phobia, nothing to care about

Edited by YellowHelmet, 25 July 2010 - 20:27.


#3354 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:27

That's not true at all, Alonso is always looking after himself, not the team, not the sport, nothing. A few races ago when things didn't go his way, he's crying about the FIA. At McLaren when things didn't go his way, he's crying about unfair treatment.

Only today because they helped him win, he's backing the team. It sounds like he should be the one you should be saying that Spanish phrase to, as he clearly isn't abiding by it.

thanks god, your opinion is not important!
the teams which he races for (maybe execption mclare) know him better and were always very glad to have him

#3355 Mr2s

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:27

He's an emotional wreck. In 2007 he got beat by a rookie and now he has descended into being a b-rate driver who NEEDS team orders to win.

he needed team orders to beat hamilton (which he didn't get). He needed team orders to win in Singapore. And he needed team orders now.

He's worse than Schumi.


in 2007 he was *equal* to a driver he has a lot of respect for and hugs after most races. You're a piss poor judge of charater as well as lacking knowledge of motorsport.

Your other comments are troll worthy.

#3356 Mr2s

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:29

That's not true at all, Alonso is always looking after himself, not the team, not the sport, nothing. A few races ago when things didn't go his way, he's crying about the FIA. At McLaren when things didn't go his way, he's crying about unfair treatment.


Not much difference to senna and hamilton then. The fact you use the word "cry" only makes it look like youre the one in pain. I wonder why?


#3357 gaston_foix

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:29

I completely agree. The only thing that may have stopped me from doing it would be the thought: "no one's tried a 'we needed this for the WDC' justification before where the other driver wasn't out of it yet ... this could get us in bother with the rules". With the rule not there, I'd absolutely do it.

To be clear:

1. I think what Ferrari did made sense - without the rule, I would do exactly the same in their shoes

2. even with the rule, I think they are ok: the WDC justification works for me - of I were on the WMSC, I would not be arguing to punish them

BUT

3. I think this justification is taking things to an extreme that hasn't been tested before - there should be no surprise that there is more fuss about this one than others in the recent (ie post rule change) past, or that the FIA will get involved. This is not bitterness or conspiracy, this is more marginal than anything else seen since the rule change.

4. I find the pretence that it wasn't a team instruction, or that it can't be proven to be one, pretty poor: it was 100% obvious. And I find Ferrari's attempt to continue this pretence, frankly, an insult to my intelligence.

I think on points 1 and 2 we agree. It's possibly points 3 and 4 where we differ.


3. I disagree with you. RedBulls Turkey Webber's save fuel is much worse if you taking aside how it was manged. I mean Ferrari managed very bad. But in RedBulls case there is not obvious which driver is better. So there is no point for team orders. In Ferrari case it is obvious from the moon that FA is faster.

4. Of course there is 100% team orders. But what do you want, Ferrari to say that publicly? However any FA fan to say no team orders is just a fanboy...

#3358 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:30

thanks god, your opinion is not important!
the teams which he races for (maybe execption mclare) know him better and were always very glad to have him

Just as important as yours mate! :clap:

At the end of the day all I want is to see Alonso prove that he is deserving if he wins the title. So far he hasn't with mistake after mistake and then today didn't help matters. If he'd just get his head down and win on track none of us would be having this discussion.

#3359 rhukkas

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:31

thanks god, your opinion is not important!
the teams which he races for (maybe execption mclare) know him better and were always very glad to have him


Renault seem to be very happy with Kubica. At least no one is requiring team mates to drive into walls any more.

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#3360 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:33

Not much difference to senna and hamilton then. The fact you use the word "cry" only makes it look like youre the one in pain. I wonder why?

Not at all, I'm happy to see the best man win the title, whether that's Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel, Webber or Button. Whoever does win, should win in manner that makes you think they really deserve it - rather than being gifted wins on a plate like today.

And how else do you explain his radio communications? Especially the one a few races ago when he told the team not to come on the radio anymore, if that's not a hissy fit I'm not sure what is! :lol:

#3361 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:34

Renault seem to be very happy with Kubica. At least no one is requiring team mates to drive into walls any more.

alonso never required it,
so look for other people to accuse

alonso advised kubica to renault!

#3362 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:34

Renault seem to be very happy with Kubica. At least no one is requiring team mates to drive into walls any more.

Good point actually, Kubica's doing a far better job in a bad Renault than Alonso ever did. Plus he keeps his mouth shut and races fairly - he's someone I hope wins the title some day, I'm actually really disappointed those rumours of him alongside Alonso at Ferrari weren't true as I would have loved to see that! Unless they were true and it was Alonso who stopped it from happening (or alternatively Santander who also seem to have too much power at Ferrari)

#3363 gaston_foix

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:35

Read in the Spanish forum "Forocoches", a well respected forum in which some Spanish race drivers usually post and with the same prestige of this forum...

There's a interesting theory of the race here, and very well elaborated:

"Pues yo apuesto a que ha sucedido lo siguiente:

ha habido una reunión previa en la que se ha acordado que en caso de un 1-2 con el segundo pidiendo paso por ser pretendidamente más rapido, éste debería dejar crecer el gap hasta más allá de los 3 segundos, y seguidamente recuperarlos. En caso de lograrlo, se le haría saber al primero que el segundo había demostrado en pista ser efectivamente más rápido y se le cedería la prioridad.

Sea quien sea el que demuestre tener el ritmo superior.

Me baso para afirmarlo en que:

1) Después de una reunión previa, Fernando se mostró seguro de que Massa no sería un problema.

2) En las primeras vueltas, Massa tenía permiso para luchar.

3) En cuanto se ha Fernando ha dejado crecer la diferencia hasta los 3 segundos, ha habido un mensaje por radio del ingeniero de Massa a éste dicidendo "ahora Felipe, es el momento, hay que darlo todo, the gap is all now. We can win the race."

4) Después de este mensaje, y pese a Felipe lograr varias vueltas rápidas, Fernando recupera el terreno fácilmente.

5) En cuanto lo vuelve a tener a tiro, el mensaje a Massa es otro: "Massa, Fernando es más rápido. Confirma que has entendido el mensaje"

Conclusiones:

Massa podía mantener en pista la diferencia, y habría mantenido la victoria. Esta se la jugaron en el intervalo en que se turnaron en las vueltas rápidas.

Massa es considerablemente más lento, los 3 segundos de ventaja le duraron... cuántas vueltas?

Por último, si la hipótesis del acuerdo previo para actuar de esta forma es cierta, me parece muy inteligente por parte de Ferrari.

Igualmente, siempre me pareció que mi forma de proceder, si yo fuera el propietario de un equipo, sería muy parecida a esa. Nada de dejar que rajen entre ellos, ni jugarretas, ni nada. El que presuntamente se crea más rápido, que lo demuestre en la pista. Si lo hace, nada de que el más lento comprometa la victoria.

Finalmente, Massa mostró su enfado por lo que había pasado, y podía no respetar lo acordado (otros sistemáticamente incumplen pactos previos), pero sí se comportó de acuerdo con las reglas que habían acordado.

Acabo diciendo que si no fuera así cómo han sucedido las cosas, vegüenza para Ferrari, y retiraría lo dicho. Pero si el pacto daba la posibilidad de reclamar prioridad en la pista a ambos, me parece una solución justa".

---Translation (if someone can correct me and help me in the translation, much more better):

"I bet it could have happen as follow:

There was a previous briefing in which was agreed that in the case of 1-2, with the second driving asking to overtake based on he was thinking he was faster, this second driver should give a gap or more than three seconds, and, inmediately to recover the speed. In that case, the leading driver should know that the second driver was faster in the track and, hence, to let the second driver to overtake him. (Second driver should have the priority to overtake).

Whoever he was, he had to show he had a better pace.

I'm based on this:

1) After the previous briefing, Fernando was sure that Massa wouldn't be a problem for him.

2) In the first laps, Mass had green light to fight for the race.

3) When Alonso was behind with more than 3 seconds of gap, there was a radio-message for Massa saying: "Now, Felipe, is the moment. You have to deliver it to the maximum, concentrate, the gap is all now. We can win the race."

[(Radio transcripts needed here)]

4) After this message, and despite Felipe is doing some fastest laps, Fernando is recovering time easily.

5) When Fernando is again just in the back of Massa, Massa is radioed again with a very different message: "Felipe, Fernando is faster than you. Confirm that you understood the message".

Conclusions:

Massa could have the gap on track and race for the win. But both drivers raced each other in the fastest laps episode.

Massa was evidently slower. His 3 seconds gap lasted... how many laps?

Last... if the theory of the previous agreement to behave like this is true, I think that it's a smart move by Ferrari

If I were the owner of a team, my behaviour would be really similar. Nothing about them fighting each other, no dirty tricks. The one who thinks he's fasters has to show that in the track. And if he shows it, the one slower can't compromise his win.

Finally, Massa showed his anger about all what had happened, but he, at least, could have respect (other ones, sistematically didn't do that) the agreement. Anyway, he behaved according to the previous briefing.

I want to finish saying that if things were not according to this theory, shame for Ferrari and I would regret for what I've said. But if the agreement gave both driver to claim for priority in the track, I think that it was a fair agreement"

--------

The most plausible theory for me at the moment according to the radio-comunications, according to certain moments in the race (there's a TV broadcast in Ferrari garage in which someone is explaining, in Spanish, to Emilio Botin, the owner of Santander, that Fernando -being second at that time- "debe dejar tres o cuatro segundos a Felipe antes de atacar" ---"Fernando has to allow about 3, 4 seconds to Felipe before attacking again).


I tend to believe this. I remember Smedley saying this....


#3364 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:36

Not at all, I'm happy to see the best man win the title, whether that's Alonso, Hamilton, Vettel, Webber or Button. Whoever does win, should win in manner that makes you think they really deserve it - rather than being gifted wins on a plate like today.

And how else do you explain his radio communications? Especially the one a few races ago when he told the team not to come on the radio anymore, if that's not a hissy fit I'm not sure what is! :lol:



Exactly and on his performace this season there are 4 other drivers who deserve it way more than Alonso. I pray one of them wins the title.

#3365 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:36

Good point actually, Kubica's doing a far better job in a bad Renault than Alonso ever did.

alonso won two wdc and two wcc with renault :eek:

#3366 skid solo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:36

You right... The fans are robbed, there is no argue about it. But you Macca fans are to harsh to Alonso. The guy proved that he is the best of the 2 as Hammy proved in 2008. So you Macca fans should stop bashing Alonso for this. Ferrari handled this bad, but Domenicali was never good as doing this kind of things...


I am formost a formula 1 fan. I have been watching this sport a long time and have supported many teams and many drivers over the years.

#3367 NadsatII

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:37

That's not true at all, Alonso is always looking after himself, not the team, not the sport, nothing. A few races ago when things didn't go his way, he's crying about the FIA. At McLaren when things didn't go his way, he's crying about unfair treatment.

Only today because they helped him win, he's backing the team. It sounds like he should be the one you should be saying that Spanish phrase to, as he clearly isn't abiding by it.



Yeah: But it's the way British press portrays him. In the same level that we Spaniards are racists, we throw bananas to a black football player and this long etc of stupid prejudices.

If you could learn Spanish and hear Alonso in his own words in Spanish, he never sounded as a whining boy, this thing of boy throwing the toys out the 'something' and a long etc. He's always realistic, honest. If he says: "Hamilton will win this race", that happens. "We have some opportunity here", and that happens. He's a kind of a driver which is always honest and speak his mind.

That thing about Alonso being beated by his rookie team-mate is just a lie by the British press. First: he was not beaten by his rookie team-mate, because both of them ended with the same points. He was beaten by his own team, and that was the reason of his sadness and disappointment. And he didn't blackmailed his team.

It was his team who stole Ferrari data, not Alonso. And when Alonso knew that, he expressed to Ron Dennis that he didn't like that. No need to comeback to Hungary 2007. But the witness of a crime is not the criminal, it's just the witness.

British press should be more... Press. In the kind that journalists first hear all the sourcers and get informed, and then they give objetive information. Not the other way.

#3368 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:38

alonso never required it,
so look for other people to accuse

How can you say that's not true, but accuse McLaren of wrongdoing against Alonso? Let's stay consistent here.

#3369 grazioli82

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:38

Alonso seems to have an entitlement complex. He seriously believed Hamilton should have let him through at Indy 2007.

His actions and attitude show him up for what he is. He and Ferrari are made for each other and the Spanish 'journalists' will be in conference now to work out a line to defend him in their propagandist rags.

I quite enjoy watching him drive but I am looking forward to him retiring and taking the racist, ignorant football hooligan portion of his fans with him.

#3370 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:38

I am formost a formula 1 fan. I have been watching this sport a long time and have supported many teams and many drivers over the years.

finally we have something in common.
todays result was not satisfying, but it was the right decision.

#3371 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:38

alonso won two wdc and two wcc with renault :eek:



He said in a bad Renault

#3372 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:40

How can you say that's not true,


the team said alonso was not involved and alonso said the sam!

but accuse McLaren of wrongdoing against Alonso?

e.g. we are racing alonso.
many bad words via press from dennis against alonso
etc.

#3373 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:41

He said in a bad Renault

in a bad renault alonso finished fifth and was the driver with second most points in the second half of the season!

Edited by YellowHelmet, 25 July 2010 - 20:42.


#3374 skid solo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:43

finally we have something in common.
todays result was not satisfying, but it was the right decision.


Certainly for Alonso it was yes and I would imagine for many Hamilton fans if the shoe was on the other foot they would say the same.

Ferrari missed a golden opportunity for the best PR of the year with Massa winning a race a year to the day since he was nearly killed at the wheel of a F1 car.

To leave it alone would have been a very good decision.

#3375 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:44

To leave it alone would have been a very good decision.

not regarding the championship
and that for they are racing!

#3376 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:44

in a bad renault alonso finished fifth and was the driver with second most points in the second half of the season!


i wonder were 10 of those points come from.

#3377 Gareth

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:45

in a bad renault alonso finished fifth and was the driver with second most points in the second half of the season!

How well would he have done in those 2 stats without Singapore 08?

#3378 skid solo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:45

not regarding the championship
and that for they are racing!


In the immortal words of Lightning McQueen.... "It's just a cup"

#3379 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:45

Certainly for Alonso it was yes and I would imagine for many Hamilton fans if the shoe was on the other foot they would say the same.

Ferrari missed a golden opportunity for the best PR of the year with Massa winning a race a year to the day since he was nearly killed at the wheel of a F1 car.

To leave it alone would have been a very good decision.



Exactly there was no reason to change round the result. a 1-2 is a 1-2.

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#3380 StanByk

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:46

It's nonsense written by someone who doesn't understand the inflections of Smedley's English.

Talking of which, any fluent German speakers here who can translate this accurately ?

Niki Lauda said "Ich habe noch nie im Leben jemanden solchen Scheiß reden hören. Der hat ja keinen Charakter, dieser Alonso.“

Hi Biggles,
I am a native German speaker:
Niki Lauda: I have never in my live heard anyone talk such rubbish. This Alonso, he's got no character.

Lauda uses the word Scheiss, the direct translation would be sh*t, but I think rubbish is the better translation in this context.

#3381 Mr2s

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:48

How well would he have done in those 2 stats without Singapore 08?



pretty good considering he was quicker than the superior Mclaren and Red Bull after the *second* safety car. Or perhaps Piquet caused the second SC too?

#3382 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:48

Hi Biggles,
I am a native German speaker:
Niki Lauda: I have never in my live heard anyone talk such rubbish. This Alonso, he's got no character.

Lauda uses the word Scheiss, the direct translation would be sh*t, but I think rubbish is the better translation in this context.

lauda is known for his alonso-phobia.
in 2007 when alonso had a beard for one race or two and than not again, he said that a driver who change between having a beard and not is a bad character.
typical lauda :down:

#3383 F1Champion

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:49

It is massively irritating to always see Alonso losing his emotions, every time he is behind his team mates in a race, he believes it is his divine right to be allowed to pass him. He never seems to think that he must earn the pass, and instead is onto the radio to call the pit wall to make the decision.

Does he think that a team mate must keel over to him all the time? Can he instead not get it into his head that maybe, just maybe that team mate earn the right to be ahead of him by performing better than him?

(PS - How he could celebrate afterwards, was amazing, really does show his true personality.)

#3384 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:49

Exactly there was no reason to change round the result. a 1-2 is a 1-2.

again:
regarding the wdc, there was, and thats why they did it!

#3385 Gareth

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:49

pretty good considering he was quicker than the superior Mclaren and Red Bull after the *second* safety car. Or perhaps Piquet caused the second SC too?

You think he deserved that win? Ok, good for you.

#3386 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:50

It is massively irritating to always see Alonso losing his emotions, every time he is behind his team mates in a race, he believes it is his divine right to be allowed to pass him. He never seems to think that he must earn the pass, and instead is onto the radio to call the pit wall to make the decision.

after a theory posted here, he deserved it, after showing he was faster!

#3387 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:50

alonso won two wdc and two wcc with renault :eek:

I said in a "bad" renault, not in the good days when they had the illegal mass damper system :p

Yeah: But it's the way British press portrays him. In the same level that we Spaniards are racists, we throw bananas to a black football player and this long etc of stupid prejudices.

If you could learn Spanish and hear Alonso in his own words in Spanish, he never sounded as a whining boy, this thing of boy throwing the toys out the 'something' and a long etc. He's always realistic, honest. If he says: "Hamilton will win this race", that happens. "We have some opportunity here", and that happens. He's a kind of a driver which is always honest and speak his mind.

That thing about Alonso being beated by his rookie team-mate is just a lie by the British press. First: he was not beaten by his rookie team-mate, because both of them ended with the same points. He was beaten by his own team, and that was the reason of his sadness and disappointment. And he didn't blackmailed his team.

It was his team who stole Ferrari data, not Alonso. And when Alonso knew that, he expressed to Ron Dennis that he didn't like that. No need to comeback to Hungary 2007. But the witness of a crime is not the criminal, it's just the witness.

British press should be more... Press. In the kind that journalists first hear all the sourcers and get informed, and then they give objetive information. Not the other way.

Finally an Alonso fan who can be objective and reasonable :)

Yes I do see your point, but the British media have never been that harsh on Alonso anyway. There was a bit of a bad spell in 2007, but that was obviously going to happen when he was quite openly attacking a very highly regarded British team and a British rookie driver who captured the hearts of a nation. But since then it all died away, even through the whole crashgate scandal, there was hardly any bad press relating to Alonso, and he is regularly referred to as the "most complete" driver in F1.

Again in 07, it was not that he had the info, it was that he did nothing for a while, and then tried to threaten Ron Dennis with taking it public - if he was a true team player he should have taken it straight to the boss as soon as he found out about it and that would have earned him points with Ron Dennis as well instead of alienating himself from him.

A nation's press is always going to slightly favour a nation's team and driver (I imagine in Spain the press is biased towards Alonso), but there's never any negativity and that's why I've found this thread quite surprising. I personally am disappointed with Alonso as I don't like his attitude or temperament. Firstly he shouldn't expect to be number 1, he should earn it. Secondly there's no point shouting and screaming about the FIA, that's only going to come back and bite you and it did with the drive through penalty at the last race. They weren't corrupt, it just took a certain amount of time to work through everything and give Lewis the drivethrough penalty. He got a penalty at the end of the day so there was no room for complaint after that.

There's just too much controversy following him around, look at other good drivers and that simply isn't the case.

#3388 NadsatII

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:51

In other hand... what most of people seem to have forget is that Ferraris lapped almost everyone today until P7 (Alonso even passed Kubica in the last laps), so Ferrari seem to be unbeatable now, a fighting face to face with Red Bull, which puts Alonso in the first line of fight for the world-championship. Hungary sounds to be the same thing. Red Bull boss's face today, before the race, seemed really scared and nervous. Not a single smile there. Ferrari sounds really serious and strong now. And Alonso said last week: "We're on bound to the championship".

The McLaren's about 30-40 seconds back sound weak at this moment.

That could be the reason of all this fuss about Ferrari team orders...

#3389 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:51

Hi Biggles,
I am a native German speaker:
Niki Lauda: I have never in my live heard anyone talk such rubbish. This Alonso, he's got no character.

Lauda uses the word Scheiss, the direct translation would be sh*t, but I think rubbish is the better translation in this context.



He is right though Alonso talks rubish his post race press confrence was awful. There is noting about the guy to like.

#3390 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:52

There's just too much controversy following him around, look at other good drivers and that simply isn't the case.

:confused:
every great driver is to some amount controversial!
senna was, lauda was, prost was, hamilton is, schumacher was/is and alonso is
the medias make this

#3391 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:53

That could be the reason of all this fuss about Ferrari team orders...

absolutely :up:

#3392 grazioli82

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:53

again:
regarding the wdc, there was, and thats why they did it!


Fair enough. As he said in '06. F1 is not a sport







#3393 lexmeister2

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:53

Ferrari missed a golden opportunity for the best PR of the year with Massa winning a race a year to the day since he was nearly killed at the wheel of a F1 car.

Another good point, they would have come out of today as heroes if that had happened, and had a revitalised Massa on board that would have been in a better position to help the team. Over the next few races Alonso should easily seal his superiority within the team, so there was no need to belittle Massa today and instead they could have had him onside to help in the future.

#3394 Mr2s

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:54

Hi Biggles,
I am a native German speaker:
Niki Lauda: I have never in my live heard anyone talk such rubbish. This Alonso, he's got no character.

Lauda uses the word Scheiss, the direct translation would be sh*t, but I think rubbish is the better translation in this context.



So Lauda didn't listen to Michael schumacher's post Adelaide 94 comments then. They will simply never be beaten for lies, guilt and cringe worthyness. The same year 2 drivers died makes it particularly sickening.





#3395 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:54

In other hand... what most of people seem to have forget is that Ferraris lapped almost everyone today until P7 (Alonso even passed Kubica in the last laps), so Ferrari seem to be unbeatable now, a fighting face to face with Red Bull, which puts Alonso in the first line of fight for the world-championship. Hungary sounds to be the same thing. Red Bull boss's face today, before the race, seemed really scared and nervous. Not a single smile there. Ferrari sounds really serious and strong now. And Alonso said last week: "We're on bound to the championship".

The McLaren's about 30-40 seconds back sound weak at this moment.

That could be the reason of all this fuss about Ferrari team orders...



Can you blame them it means if Massa is leading any more races he moves over for Alonso with Ferrari now looking quick they could do that every race. Its hardly fair that is it.

#3396 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:55

Fair enough. As he said in '06. F1 is not a sport

it was always also about politics. thats the way it is!
but todays TO was nothing new, and shouldnt be that important!

Edited by YellowHelmet, 25 July 2010 - 20:56.


#3397 BrendanMcF

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:55

Eddie Irvine thanked and praised Mika Salo, then gave him the trophy when he did the same thing at the same circuit in 1999, when team orders were allowed.

Love him or hate him, Irv had the good grace to admit when he'd been gifted a win...

#3398 skid solo

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:57

It is a shame when the soul of my favourite sport is removed. There was no dignity today in F1. Nothing upsets me more than watching grown men lying to the camera's and indirectly to me. Trying to convince me that I am mistaken about what I know I have just seen. The rights and wrongs can be argued, championships won but what people often remember is moments like these...Just ask Michael Schumacher.

One fond memory I will always have is Massa's magnanimous defeat in the 2008 championship. Today his race engineer was wrong to call him magnanimous and right to say sorry!

#3399 YellowHelmet

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:57

Eddie Irvine thanked and praised Mika Salo, then gave him the trophy when he did the same thing at the same circuit in 1999, when team orders were allowed.

Love him or hate him, Irv had the good grace to admit when he'd been gifted a win...

over than it was officialy allowed, so he could say that!
under todays dumb rule, you cant say it!

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#3400 Massa_f1

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Posted 25 July 2010 - 20:57

Eddie Irvine thanked and praised Mika Salo, then gave him the trophy when he did the same thing at the same circuit in 1999, when team orders were allowed.

Love him or hate him, Irv had the good grace to admit when he'd been gifted a win...



Irvine was a sportsman and also has the balls to admit when things got handed to him on a plate Germany 99 and Mal 99