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Fernando Alonso thread [merged]


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#4801 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 21:48

No way, it's just hard racing, obviously a solid wall makes it more clearly apparent, but Button was just as close to the grass as Alonso was to the wall (...)


Bullshit:


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#4802 KnucklesAgain

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 21:49

Forgive me if I'm wrong but there is grass just in front of where they are in that picture following the line out of the pits..........Alonso has pushed Button right over to the point where he has just enough room without going on to the grass, same way Vettel pushed Alonso right over so he has just enough room without hitting the wall.


You are forgiven for being wrong, once again:


#4803 as65p

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 22:35

The 2007 season left Alonso's reputation as both the fastest and most sporting driver in absolute tatters.


He sure left a deep impression at the team. Three years on and he's still in MW's head... :p

#4804 Dunder

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 22:40

Whitmarsh should wear a white knight armor and ride a steed on his quest for honour and truth. Fairy tales are great for kids, it's a shame reality is quite different.


You would know that how exactly? Because someone elses account is different and you choose to believe it?


#4805 as65p

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 22:57

You would know that how exactly? Because someone elses account is different and you choose to believe it?


I think that's the point, nobody knows. Random snippets from only one party don't really help.

#4806 showtime

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 23:03

You would know that how exactly? Because someone elses account is different and you choose to believe it?


Is impossible for me to know if he said that or not because I wasn't there. It's just that I have problems to believe people like him, that love to pretend to be fair, honourable and righteous when it's well known they have as many sins to confess as the rest.

I asked Martin Whitmarsh point blank on Saturday in Monza whether the team and it shareholders had spoken after the 2007 season about how they let Raikkonen steal the title by allowing their drivers to race and whether they had resolved never to let that happen again. He replied that this was the McLaren credo and would stay that way as long as he’s in charge, even if it means losing the title this year.

Don't make me laugh Martin :lol: :lol: :lol:

Edited by showtime, 15 September 2010 - 23:04.


#4807 Mandzipop

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 23:12

As Martin Brundle said, an Italian reporter told him that Fernando is the most popular Ferrari driver since Gilles Villeneuve. So I am quite sure that Fernando knows how to cope being a Ferrari driver. He did all the right moves and was forgiven even his chain of mistakes earlier in the season. When at a critical junction of the season he triumphs, and it would not surprise me if he still takes the title.

Also Fernando´s words "I think any racing driver is not complete unless you win in Monza with Ferrari" is a well pondered statement, both towards his team and the tifosi as towards his competition (Hamilton).
Schumacher was never dearly loved in Italy, for the average Italian he was an instrument for making the Scuderia win, respected, but not loved. Of course you could tell that Michael would want to race in red, but at this point I think Ferrari are quite happy that they have Alonso instead of Schumacher. Also, how would Ferrari make a team strategy stick with Michael being slower than Felipe - he would have to support Massa and be his number 2, and then, he would be well behind (like he is with Rosberg) so he would be useless even as a number 2.

Alonso is the right driver for Ferrari, beloved, just the right personality and charisma, and unlike Kimi, his performance will not drop in the coming years - my feeling is that he wants to go for 5 WDCs.


That was a media statement from Martin. Has he actually asked the Tifosi? Personally as a Ferrari fan, I don't give a stuff who the driver is, as long as he is the best. My favourite drivers don't drive for Ferrari. I think one will. The other one I cant even see that he will be in F1 next year. :cry:

#4808 Dunder

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 23:43

Is impossible for me to know if he said that or not because I wasn't there. It's just that I have problems to believe people like him, that love to pretend to be fair, honourable and righteous when it's well known they have as many sins to confess as the rest.

I asked Martin Whitmarsh point blank on Saturday in Monza whether the team and it shareholders had spoken after the 2007 season about how they let Raikkonen steal the title by allowing their drivers to race and whether they had resolved never to let that happen again. He replied that this was the McLaren credo and would stay that way as long as he’s in charge, even if it means losing the title this year.

Don't make me laugh Martin :lol: :lol: :lol:


Well let's be fair. Have you seen any evidence to the contrary this year? All I have seen is the coded hold station message in Turkey which is hardly unusual.

He has repeated that basic stance recently and would thus be ridiculed if he were to favour either Hamilton or Button at this stage. McLaren are not in as strong a position in terms of the championships as they were 3 years ago and from that perspective it could be more beneficial to give one (presumably Hamilton) the nod.

You can choose to believe what you want, we all can, but to state someone is lying based pretty much only on that choice speaks volumes.


#4809 showtime

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Posted 15 September 2010 - 23:55

Well let's be fair. Have you seen any evidence to the contrary this year? All I have seen is the coded hold station message in Turkey which is hardly unusual.

He has repeated that basic stance recently and would thus be ridiculed if he were to favour either Hamilton or Button at this stage. McLaren are not in as strong a position in terms of the championships as they were 3 years ago and from that perspective it could be more beneficial to give one (presumably Hamilton) the nod.

You can choose to believe what you want, we all can, but to state someone is lying based pretty much only on that choice speaks volumes.


Don't forget he's including the past not just this year by talking about McLaren credo. And is not only the team orders topic, is McLaren's fake pose of saints and justice protectors when they have many reasons to put the head down and close their big mouths. I'm not buying it but I see many people do, they definitely are good at pretending.

#4810 Classic Ferrari

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 02:32

They look pretty similar to me. Both Button and Alonso are given as little room as possible, both have to put 2 wheels over the white line, but both are quite securly on the tarmac.

I think the Vettel move was hard but fair (albeit silly and costly for himself) racing. Similarly I thought the Alonso move was hard but fair stuff.

Calling Vettel's move dirty but Alonso's fine makes no sense to me, though.

Vettel's move was silly for the fact that he was pushing a car up against a concrete barrier, ala Michael against Rubens but with less speed. There Micheal received a penalty. In terms of Alonso' move, there was actual run off track area in which Button could use. As they approached the grass area Alonso actually move away back onto the racing line to get better exit for the next corner.

Also in regards the white line, in Vettel's case most of Alonso's car was actually over the line itself, while only Button's right wheels where touching it.

Alonso's move was more one of intimidation rather than stupidity. Button held firm and kept the lead, just two experienced drivers going at it.

Edited by Classic Ferrari, 16 September 2010 - 06:27.


#4811 Buttoneer

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 09:52

It's strange that, as far as I can tell, Button fans weren't bothered in the slightest but a few Hamilton fans were upset by that move. :well:

Absolutely. It was an aggressive move which Button reacted to, but it's clear that Alonso left plenty enough room for his car. Firm but fair, which is what you can expect from drivers of that calibre who are comfortable of their own abilities.

#4812 cardin

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 12:50

He sure left a deep impression at the team. Three years on and he's still in MW's head... :p

A 100,000,000.00 impression to be exact.

Edited by cardin, 16 September 2010 - 12:51.


#4813 NadsatII

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 13:08

I think i have to agree with you. I've heard many saying things like ' the many faces of Fernando Alonso'
But for me it's just a feeling and the way I imagine him to be, nothing more. So tell me which times has he openly shown another face or whatever you suggest? In front of the cameras he's always nice, behind the scenes is something we don't know...


I met him a couple of times and I can tell you that, behind the scenes he's even really funny and a very close guy. He never rejects to have a picture with someone or make a joke to someone...

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related



#4814 Smile17

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 13:20

The 2007 season left Alonso's reputation as both the fastest and most sporting driver in absolute tatters.


To be honest with you, I think the 2007 season was Alonso's most impressive one. He scored the same points as 'the mclarren boy' and lost the title by almost nothing.
Considering the fact that the whole team was against him, it was a hell of a performance. He beated them all on his own.

Believe me, they can't stand him at Mclarren! I can understand it...




#4815 Clatter

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 13:26

To be honest with you, I think the 2007 season was Alonso's most impressive one. He scored the same points as 'the mclarren boy' and lost the title by almost nothing.
Considering the fact that the whole team was against him, it was a hell of a performance. He beated them all on his own.

Believe me, they can't stand him at Mclarren! I can understand it...


I assume that is supposed to be sarcastic. I certainly hope so as I can't believe anyone would believe the rubbish you have just said.

#4816 showtime

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 13:27

To be honest with you, I think the 2007 season was Alonso's most impressive one. He scored the same points as 'the mclarren boy' and lost the title by almost nothing.
Considering the fact that the whole team was against him, it was a hell of a performance. He beated them all on his own.

Believe me, they can't stand him at Mclarren! I can understand it...


He made a mistake at Hungary, not that it wasn't a fair move but it was like giving free ammo to his hunters. He lost the calm (comprehensibly) a few times that year and that costed him the third championship.

#4817 Smile17

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 13:47

He made a mistake at Hungary, not that it wasn't a fair move but it was like giving free ammo to his hunters. He lost the calm (comprehensibly) a few times that year and that costed him the third championship.


Sarcastic? Who.. me?

I completely agree with you, but still if you look at the whole picture, he wasn't gonna win a championship there anyway.
However it's in the past and the current season is much more interesting...





#4818 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 16:16

As Martin Brundle said, an Italian reporter told him that Fernando is the most popular Ferrari driver since Gilles Villeneuve.

:lol: :lol: :lol:
martin is such a funny guy

#4819 Ferrari2183

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 16:21

:lol: :lol: :lol:
martin is such a funny guy

And I suppose you can prove otherwise... That theory is actually not that far-fetched.

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#4820 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 17:06

let's see
he's known for his love of ferrari - I wish you guys the best luck unless the car is red

he's brought hmmm...nothing? they had a wdc that left, he came in

he's brought fantastic driving that the tifosi have not seen in years..jumped starts, cutting corners, quite a fair bit of crashes, fantastic reactions on the lights at the start etc

wow, the ferrari fans must really love him instead of

Alain Prost (who's he?), Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Michael Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello or Felipe Massa

surely :)

anymore evidence needed?


he's got 2 wins against his teamates only one...oh, sorry, it's 3-0

#4821 Ferrari2183

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Posted 16 September 2010 - 17:28

let's see
he's known for his love of ferrari - I wish you guys the best luck unless the car is red

he's brought hmmm...nothing? they had a wdc that left, he came in

he's brought fantastic driving that the tifosi have not seen in years..jumped starts, cutting corners, quite a fair bit of crashes, fantastic reactions on the lights at the start etc

wow, the ferrari fans must really love him instead of

Alain Prost (who's he?), Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Michael Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello or Felipe Massa

surely :)

anymore evidence needed?


he's got 2 wins against his teamates only one...oh, sorry, it's 3-0

Of all those you mentioned only Schumacher won titles. Prost likened the car to a truck... Berger and Alesi didn't achieve much as Ferrari drivers (actually they didn't achieve much in Formula 1)... The two Brazilians have won??? Nada.

Gilles, the most loved Ferrari driver, has only a second place in the 1979 championship where Schekter beat him by a few points. 6 wins and numerous retirements.

So what you using as evidence is pretty useless. It's not hard to imagine that the Tifosi have opened their hearts to Alonso. Hell even I'm starting to like the guy, but my reasons are purely team based and what I've read from the engineers.

#4822 lexmeister2

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 10:44

Looking at that vid Alonso's move on Button was far more aggressive and dangerous than I remembered, Vettel's move was safer in that it was more predictable - Alonso just suddenly darts across the track and Button has to take quite quick evasive action. Coupled with the fact he then went and simply rammed the back of Jenson's car at turn 1, it really wasn't a great bit of driving from a double WDC.

Awful start, dangerous move across the track, and then a surprisingly hard crash all in the space of a few seconds - anyone who tries to defend that as good, quality driving needs their head checked :rotfl:


Seriously though, Alonso is a great driver, but I'm pretty sure that Schumacher was well loved by Ferrari fans. But it's obvious that a latin driver is going to be more loved by the incredibly passionate Italian fans, it's only natural.

#4823 NadsatII

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 10:58

Looking at that vid Alonso's move on Button was far more aggressive and dangerous than I remembered, Vettel's move was safer in that it was more predictable - Alonso just suddenly darts across the track and Button has to take quite quick evasive action. Coupled with the fact he then went and simply rammed the back of Jenson's car at turn 1, it really wasn't a great bit of driving from a double WDC.

Awful start, dangerous move across the track, and then a surprisingly hard crash all in the space of a few seconds - anyone who tries to defend that as good, quality driving needs their head checked :rotfl:


Seriously though, Alonso is a great driver, but I'm pretty sure that Schumacher was well loved by Ferrari fans. But it's obvious that a latin driver is going to be more loved by the incredibly passionate Italian fans, it's only natural.



Are you talking seriously? :rolleyes:

And what do you mean with "latin driver"? Could you enlighten us with all your wisedom about what "latin" means?

Sounds a little bit racist there...

#4824 Ramses1348

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:01

wow, the ferrari fans must really love him instead of

Alain Prost (who's he?), Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Michael Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello or Felipe Massa


You forgot the one they liked the most : Nigel "Il Leone" Mansell!

Do they have a nickname for Alonso? :o

#4825 as65p

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:01

Looking at that vid Alonso's move on Button was far more aggressive and dangerous than I remembered, Vettel's move was safer in that it was more predictable - Alonso just suddenly darts across the track and Button has to take quite quick evasive action. Coupled with the fact he then went and simply rammed the back of Jenson's car at turn 1, it really wasn't a great bit of driving from a double WDC.

Awful start, dangerous move across the track, and then a surprisingly hard crash all in the space of a few seconds - anyone who tries to defend that as good, quality driving needs their head checked :rotfl:


And you don't wonder at all why your in such a minority with that view? Na? Thought so... maybe it's headcheck time for you, rather than anyone else, eh?

#4826 as65p

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:02

You forgot the one they liked the most : Nigel "Il Leone" Mansell!

Do they have a nickname for Alonso? :o


As long as it's not fred...

 ;)

#4827 Ferrari2183

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:15

You forgot the one they liked the most : Nigel "Il Leone" Mansell!

Do they have a nickname for Alonso? :o

Mansell was just as paranoid as Alonso. IIRC he accused the team of giving him sub standard equipment as opposed to Prost.

#4828 Clatter

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:17

Mansell was just as paranoid as Alonso. IIRC he accused the team of giving him sub standard equipment as opposed to Prost.


With good reason though. They even gave his chassis to Prost while lying about it. Makes the Silverstone wing business look silly.

#4829 Ferrari2183

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:26

With good reason though. They even gave his chassis to Prost while lying about it. Makes the Silverstone wing business look silly.

:lol:

You right though. Mansell got pole the race before and Prost said the team were giving Mansell the better equipment. So the mechanics swapped cars without Mansell knowing.

#4830 lexmeister2

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 11:37

And what do you mean with "latin driver"? Could you enlighten us with all your wisedom about what "latin" means?

Sounds a little bit racist there...

No it's not racism at all, I'm sure Italians will feel far more comfortable, it's not them being racist it's just natural. It's the same way a lot of British fans feel more comfortable with Button or Hamilton as opposed to other drivers (ignoring driving skill for the minute)

And you don't wonder at all why your in such a minority with that view? Na? Thought so... maybe it's headcheck time for you, rather than anyone else, eh?

So hang on, you're saying those first few seconds of the Italian Grand Prix was Alonso driving at his finest? :lol:

I cannot understand the mindset that you love Alonso so much that you can't accept (or don't even see it) when he does something wrong - I have great respect for Alonso as a driver, when he drives well I'll be the first to say he drove well (which he did after that first corner was over) but when he drives badly you simply have to accept that and agree he screwed up for a few seconds.

#4831 Dunder

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 12:23

Oh come on.

That type of 'mini-chop' is accepted as legitimate in modern F1 and I am pretty sure that Button was prepared for it. Alonso's move was pretty futile and certainly less aggressive than the ones that Vettel has done earlier in the season.

As for the contact at T1, again it was the tiniest of errors. It is a very fine balance between defending your position and ensuring no contact when braking with full tanks and cold tyres. Alonso was slightly fortunate not to pick up damage and Button was slightly unfortunate to have suffered some.

#4832 lexmeister2

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 12:30

Oh come on.

That type of 'mini-chop' is accepted as legitimate in modern F1 and I am pretty sure that Button was prepared for it. Alonso's move was pretty futile and certainly less aggressive than the ones that Vettel has done earlier in the season.

As for the contact at T1, again it was the tiniest of errors. It is a very fine balance between defending your position and ensuring no contact when braking with full tanks and cold tyres. Alonso was slightly fortunate not to pick up damage and Button was slightly unfortunate to have suffered some.

No I don't have a problem with the chop, just that I also didn't have a problem with the Vettel chop either - I just found it confusing that the Vettel one was "so bad" while the Alonso one was perfectly fine...........the double standard was the problem, not the move.


And yes a small error, but it was a hefty thump that Button was lucky not to have lost his rear wing from - that was more of an issue to me as it could have easily taken Button out of the race, and not something someone as experienced as Alonso should really be doing, especially when he was only defending against his teammate (who he knew he'd be able to get past anyway)

Edited by lexmeister2, 17 September 2010 - 12:32.


#4833 Aerosoul

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Posted 17 September 2010 - 14:13

And you don't wonder at all why your in such a minority with that view? Na? Thought so... maybe it's headcheck time for you, rather than anyone else, eh?


well said :up: :up: :up:

#4834 aditya-now

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 07:54

That was a media statement from Martin. Has he actually asked the Tifosi? Personally as a Ferrari fan, I don't give a stuff who the driver is, as long as he is the best. My favourite drivers don't drive for Ferrari. I think one will. The other one I cant even see that he will be in F1 next year. :cry:


So one is Sebastian Vettel - imagine a team Alonso / Vettel at Ferrari - what a shootout that will be...
The other one is Lewis Hamilton? Or Robert Kubica? Even more difficult to imagine any of those two to be paired with Fernando...

So if it is a media statement that Fernando is the most popular Ferrari driver since Gilles Villeneuve, there must be some truth to it - who would come up with such a statement, even think of it, when it is not true?

#4835 Massacrator

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:02

Alonso and Singapore - a match made in heaven?

http://www.formula1....10/9/11285.html

#4836 kosmos

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:23

Another blog post: http://www.ferrari.c...ny-welcome.aspx

Too bad that Alonso never recognize his own mistakes

If you look at how the F10 performed in the Principality – leaving aside my own personal problems – then that’s another reason to be confident about this race.




#4837 topical

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:25

Another blog post: http://www.ferrari.c...ny-welcome.aspx

Too bad that Alonso never recognize his own mistakes


I would say 'leaving aside my own personal problems' is a subtle way of admitting a mistake. Or do you want him to say, 'leaving aside my idiotic crash in practice'?


#4838 absentia

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 10:30

Kosmos was just trying to be funny :D

#4839 pikamoku

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 11:17

... or ironic

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#4840 Massacrator

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 11:26

... or sarcastic

#4841 absentia

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 11:42

Exactly.

#4842 topical

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 11:43

Kosmos was just trying to be funny :D


I guess I missed that....

#4843 cardin

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 12:29

let's see
he's known for his love of ferrari - I wish you guys the best luck unless the car is red

he's brought hmmm...nothing? they had a wdc that left, he came in

he's brought fantastic driving that the tifosi have not seen in years..jumped starts, cutting corners, quite a fair bit of crashes, fantastic reactions on the lights at the start etc

wow, the ferrari fans must really love him instead of

Alain Prost (who's he?), Gerhard Berger, Jean Alesi, Michael Schumacher, Rubens Barrichello or Felipe Massa

surely :)

anymore evidence needed?


he's got 2 wins against his teamates only one...oh, sorry, it's 3-0


What I'd really like to know is the methodology they used to measure, and compare, this fuzzy warm feeling called 'love'. That's an enourmously silly discussion.

#4844 topical

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 12:39

What I'd really like to know is the methodology they used to measure, and compare, this fuzzy warm feeling called 'love'. That's an enourmously silly discussion.


One reason for The Tifosi to like Alonso: he's faster than Raikkonen, who was generally slower than Massa, and, though he's made too many mistakes this season, he is impassioned and doesn't act like he doesn't care.
Whether he's the most loved driver for Ferrari in the last 20 years? I doubt it, not yet. Let's come back to the question in a couple more years...

#4845 as65p

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 12:59

What I'd really like to know is the methodology they used to measure, and compare, this fuzzy warm feeling called 'love'. That's an enourmously silly discussion.


All the more funny how it get's people agitated so easily. :D

#4846 Watkins74

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 13:09

What I'd really like to know is the methodology they used to measure, and compare, this fuzzy warm feeling called 'love'. That's an enourmously silly discussion.

:up:

Plus the examples are absurd. Prost complained so much about Ferrari he didn't even finish his 2nd season.

#4847 Anssi

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Posted 23 September 2010 - 13:43

Prost complained so much about Ferrari he didn't even finish his 2nd season.


Alain Prost is a very intelligent man.

#4848 Massacrator

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:28

Bild posted an interview with Alonso:

http://www.bild.de/B...eltmeister.html (german)
http://www.elcorreo....1009240924.html (spanish news about it)

He basically says (from what I understand in the spanish news site) that he believes he will win this championship with Webber second Vettel third Hamilton fourth and Button fifth.

#4849 TURU

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:49

He basically says (from what I understand in the spanish news site) that he believes he will win this championship with Webber second Vettel third Hamilton fourth and Button fifth.


Hm, nice ... so he finally got his crystal ball from eBay ??

#4850 bauss

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Posted 24 September 2010 - 09:53

Bild posted an interview with Alonso:

http://www.bild.de/B...eltmeister.html (german)
http://www.elcorreo....1009240924.html (spanish news about it)

He basically says (from what I understand in the spanish news site) that he believes he will win this championship with Webber second Vettel third Hamilton fourth and Button fifth.


lol Alonso, thats cute...we'll see