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Starting money and prize money


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#1 Derwent Motorsport

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Posted 05 April 2010 - 18:32

I was going through some of my collection of Ingliston programmes from ther 70s and 80s and noted what appeared to be very genrous prize money for the races and classes. Given a maximum of 16 starters, there was a good chance of getting some money at the end of the day.
I also remember that they gave starting money as well. There used to be a guy who travelled up from Wales with a Lotus Buick(?) for the single seater race and I have friends who got starting money for taking part in the annual historic race.
I think generally starting money and prize money everywhere died out in the 80s - is that right?

Going back to Ingliston, did everyone get starting money and what was the entry fee relative to the prize money? As a clubby race meeting could get over 8,000 paying spectators, I assume it was paid for from the admissions?

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#2 Derwent Motorsport

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 14:00

I'm just bumping this up as I am sure someone must have an input.

#3 CoulthardD

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 15:16

When I started racing the the 'MG Trophy' championship back in 2003, it was supported by MG-Rover. That year, they paid prize money down to 10th place and, occasionally, I picked up the odd £20 note for my troubles! :)

I suspect prize money died out when organising clubs started to rent the track from the owners, with the gate money going to said owner, to top up the rental income.

DC

#4 RTH

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 15:27

I started racing in 1971, there was certainly never any sign of any start money in club and national events, typically the prize money was only paid to top 3 places and that was less than the entry fee each of the 26 starters had paid. We even started 48 minis in a race on the full pre '75 circuit at Snetterton. However today entry fees are 40 times what they were then.

#5 Andrew Kitson

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 15:58

I started racing in 1971, there was certainly never any sign of any start money in club and national events, typically the prize money was only paid to top 3 places and that was less than the entry fee each of the 26 starters had paid. We even started 48 minis in a race on the full pre '75 circuit at Snetterton. However today entry fees are 40 times what they were then.


At the very first Snetterton meeting in October 1951, an AMOC sprint event, there was £100 prize money which must have been an enormous sum back then. There was an after event party at Hamblyn Country Inn in Botesdale, owned by circuit boss Oliver Sear..where it is said the £100 was spent over the bar!


#6 John Saunders

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 20:57

We ran a car in the Ford Credit Fiesta Championship in the mid 80's, they paid £40 start money (about the same as the entry fee at that time)
for the UK races.
There were one or two European races each season which paid £100 start money & NO entry fee, (all paid by Ford Europe).
The £100 start money covered the cost of the ferry & fuel for the weekend back then. But the bodywork damage (there was a lot of that) was down to us.
There was also prize money for the first six, about £60 for 1st down to £10 for 6th.

Edited by John Saunders, 08 April 2010 - 09:36.


#7 bradbury west

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 21:06

I was going through some of my collection of Ingliston programmes from ther 70s and 80s..I also remember that they gave starting money as well. There used to be a guy who travelled up from Wales with a Lotus Buick(?) for the single seater race .


I am not sure just when your programmes cover, but from information supplied by a very knowledgeable chap up there, a very keen photographer and former close friend of Jim Clark, it was quite a regular thing to offer good start money to attract a good grid. This explains why many FFord1600/F4 drivers would go up from London and the South and why there was always a good Irish contingent, to the point wher e they would sign up to contest an entire 4, 5 or 6 race series.

From my own vested research I know that the start money paid for the whole trip, so I was told. It might be that the North Sea oil money was finding its way into sponsorship, as it also did with some of the entrants, hence some of the quality entries found there.
Roger Lund



#8 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 22:19

Having done various forms of motorsport since the late 70s these days the competitors seem to foot the bill to run the meeting. Entry fees are 100-200% higher and prize money or tow money. Not these days.

In my rallycross days as a front runner I used to win enough to pay my entry and usually to get there. And that was grass roots.
When I started circuit racing in the early 80s at the big meetings I used to win $100-$150 prize money on a $30 entry. And I was a middle marker no more.

During the 90s the Grand Prix caused the end of prize money and entrys soared.
No more prize money, there was never any towmoney it was user pays and still is. That is why so many categories have gone or are struggling for numbers. The promoters have forgotten how to promote, they just charge the competitor. This is at state level or national.
Sure costs have gone up, insurance has skyrocketed, every expense has gone up, CAMS fees are through the roof [and to the competitor too] but why should the competitor pay so much?

I have dabbled with classic speedway for 17 years. We do 'Spirited Demonstations' and can put on a decent show and are good to pad out the program. Far better than clowns or burnouts or similar. We used to get towmoney, not much but it usually got you there [or paid for a bed] Because we do not race liscences were minimal, now they are going up 20% per year. Now one promoter will give some towmoney and he is the guy doing it the hardest, but he still is making a small return.

Because of all these fees in all motorsport there is less events held, with less competitors. And the young guys just cannot afford it anymore. These days you go to a local circuit meeting and the average age is over 40. It is spot the competitor without grey hair! Bugger all young competitors and the new ones are grey headed too! Drifting was a big thing for a while but has gotten too expensive and seems to be in trouble. While it does nothing for me it is still motorsport. Sort of.


#9 Thundersport

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Posted 07 April 2010 - 22:41

The various Brands Hatch run Championships of John Webb stewardship of the 80s and very early 90s were generous with prize money; even Formula First paid a prize fund! Thundersports/Multisports/P100 has prize money however Formula Forward in 1990 offered a reward of 40k if someone won the first 6 races (I think) and from memory Eugene O'Brien did just that. British F3000 paid £500 a point for the first couple of seasons with £4500 at stake for a win that wasn't to shoddy either.

#10 Manfred Cubenoggin

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Posted 08 April 2010 - 13:39

I won the region Formula Ford division in Ontario in 1977 and spent a bundle particularly as I'd written off my Crossle 30F in a bone-crusher at Mosport mid-year of 1976.

A month or so after the last and championship deciding race, I received a cheque from the Ontario Division of the CASC for $210. That would pay for about two tires in the day.

Frankly, I was astounded to receive anything. I thought that, being amateurs, we were racing strictly for 'tin' and the fun of it. I'm a pro afterall! :rotfl:



#11 taylov

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 15:53

As one who never got a chance to get to Ingliston (sadly), I was suprised to hear about starting money being paid as late as the 1980s.

It is more often associated with Continental races either side of WW2. It was used to attract entries to the plethora of minor and voiturette races that used to take place every summer weekend on road tracks across France and Italy.

Stirling Moss talks about how teams such as HWM could race weekend after weekend as a result of start money supplementing the prize funds.

However a form of it used to be a feature of major Grands Prix as well. The 1935 Monaco GP paid a prize of 100,000 Fr to the winner; 40,000 for 2nd; 20,000 for 3rd and 10,000 for 4th place. Under "Prix Speciaux" are the equivalent of start monies. Every car that lasted a minimum of 10% of the race (in what was then a 100 lap race) received 1,000 Fr with a further 10,000 Fr for those who finished the race.

Tony

#12 bradbury west

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 16:42

It is more often associated with Continental races either side of WW2. It was used to attract entries to the plethora of minor and voiturette races that used to take place every summer weekend on road tracks across France and Italy. Tony


This continued through the 60s in Europe much to the delight and hopeful financial advantage of the brigade of 1000cc formula 3 competitors, who shared components etc at times to help each other to be sure of starting. These f3 races, often graded as Internationals, usually boosted the status and attraction of the meeting, which was otherwise little more than a national clubbie.

Prior that in the 50s, David Piper was one of the pioneer privateers, along with Brian Naylor and ACBC, who worked the system to their advantage, when 1100cc sports racers were the de rigeur car.
Roger Lund

#13 Peter Leversedge

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Posted 09 April 2010 - 22:31

DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THIS SUBJECT

#14 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 April 2010 - 21:12

DON'T GET ME STARTED ON THIS SUBJECT

A touchy subject Peter?

#15 fredeuce

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Posted 11 April 2010 - 22:42

Drifting was a big thing for a while but has gotten too expensive and seems to be in trouble. While it does nothing for me it is still motorsport. Sort of.


Lee, I'm not surprised to hear that. I can't see how you can do all of that tail out action, trying to fry the tyres and not eat up gear boxes and diffs etc. No surprise the expense is mounting.

I always thought this form of motorsport a bit lame. I view it as motorsports response to synchronised swimming! Plenty of big style points up for grabs. Like so much these days is all about the instantaneous fix of excitement and little substance. There is only one form of drifting in my opinion and that is speedway.

As for the promoters forgetting how to promote, it seems the only thing they want to promote are those V8 Supercars things. They absorb disproportionately way too much money at the expense of other categories. I will hop off the soap box now.