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Jenson Button thread


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#3001 speng

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 17:07

It's all to do with perception, he seems to get away with it because what he's saying is perfectly normal, it sounds annoying to you because you dislike him, especially when he is sounding confident.

It's like "Welcome to 2009 baby" perfectly normal thing from a celebrating F1 driver who's just won a GP. To Lewis' fans, who are in a foul mood because he has just been soundly beaten, it sounds arrogant and mocking.

I think you totally mistaken, it is not about Hamilton being beaten. It is about how he could not backup his words with performance

Edited by speng, 11 December 2012 - 17:07.


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#3002 Obi Offiah

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 17:48

They don't call him the "Smiling Assassin" for nothing.

The assassin of what?

#3003 ermo

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 17:51

It's like "Welcome to 2009 baby" perfectly normal thing from a celebrating F1 driver who's just won a GP. To Lewis' fans, who are in a foul mood because he has just been soundly beaten, it sounds arrogant and mocking.


(this probably belongs in 'that other thread')

I'd say Jenson's consistency and racecraft helped him make up for his comparatively poor qualifying performances during the last three seasons. And we've certainly seen some great races from both him and Lewis. But an aggregate difference of 25 points in JB's favour hardly constitutes a sound beating, especially considering that Lewis has more wins to his credit in their time together? Had JB been ahead by 25+ points in the standings at the end of the three individual seasons, I would have agreed. But he hasn't, so I don't.

That said, Jenson has acquitted himself rather well I think.




#3004 P123

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 17:53

Nothing wrong with what JB is saying... it is sort of what the press has been saying since LH left. There will be another driver in the other car of course, who will also be having an input. I'm sure Perez will be learning a lot from JB at the same time, but maybe McLaren will have to reassure Perez that it isn't Button's team, just as they had to reassure JB that it wasn't Hamilton's team when he joined. With that thought, perhaps this is just some early mindgames from JB.

#3005 Lazy

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 17:58

(this probably belongs in 'that other thread')

I'd say Jenson's consistency and racecraft helped him make up for his comparatively poor qualifying performances during the last three seasons. And we've certainly seen some great races from both him and Lewis. But an aggregate difference of 25 points in JB's favour hardly constitutes a sound beating, especially considering that Lewis has more wins to his credit in their time together? Had JB been ahead by 25+ points in the standings at the end of the three individual seasons, I would have agreed. But he hasn't, so I don't.

That said, Jenson has acquitted himself rather well I think.


I was referring only to the race in Oz where he said that.

#3006 Force Ten

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 18:09

They don't call him the "Smiling Assassin" for nothing.

And by "they" you mean the lunatic and the ridiculous, right?

#3007 Force Ten

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 18:09

The assassin of what?

doh... the assassin of Lu' of course.

Edited by Force Ten, 11 December 2012 - 18:12.


#3008 Obi Offiah

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 18:15

doh... the assassin of Lu' of course.

Lu? You mean Lucy Liu? JB has assassinated Lucy Liu!!!

#3009 eronrules

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 18:19

Lu? You mean Lucy Liu? JB has assassinated Lucy Liu!!!


nop, it's lou reed, JB is the table ...

Edited by eronrules, 11 December 2012 - 18:21.


#3010 Coral

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 19:07

LOL. Come on, he hasn't hurt your family or anything! Take it with a pinch of salt. :lol:


No I won't take it with a pinch of salt, thank you. Jenson Button annoys me, and that's that. It annoys me that he can say things like "welcome to 2009" and not be criticised for it. If any other driver had said that, he would have been called arrogant and big-headed. But not Jenson. Jenson gets a free pass to say whatever he likes, and in my opinion this is not because he is a nicer person, but is because he sucks up to the media. I don't like it at all. :(

#3011 PayasYouRace

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 19:33

Why would "welcome to 2009" deserve any real criticism? He'd just taken a very strong victory and it surely must have felt a lot like that first win in the Brawn.

#3012 tifosiMac

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 19:42

Why would "welcome to 2009" deserve any real criticism? He'd just taken a very strong victory and it surely must have felt a lot like that first win in the Brawn.

I'm sure if Hamilton had said 'welcome to 2007' after his last McLaren win he would have been lynched here. No amount of justifying it felt like his first win in that season would stop the frenzy. Its clear some drivers attract less criticism than others and Jenson is one of those drivers. Had he said a few stupid things in the past I'm sure fans would be less tolerant.

#3013 Fox1

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:07

The assassin of what?

Tongue in cheek comment on my part. I do believe JB is a master of what he does out of the car, and I'm not talking about technical or leadership ability. I think he's better at the political game, and if the environment is right, that can be a huge asset.

#3014 Rocket73

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:21

ever since lewis's move to merc was confirmed, JB has given on a no. of occations these type ''Interviews''. it's not some journo's trick questions or out of context quotes. and Don't forget the team is "Mclaren'', not Ferrari, and the driver is JB, not FA. if JB hadn't quoted that famous 'i won't be a No.2 driver' quote, things would've been different.


what's wrong with 'Humility'??? ever heard kimi boast about anything???


you are presenting the man who told his RE to shut up twice on the radio and then swore on the podium as a shining beacon of humility?


(dont get me wrong I am a big fan of Kimi)

#3015 Rocket73

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:24

Why would "welcome to 2009" deserve any real criticism? He'd just taken a very strong victory and it surely must have felt a lot like that first win in the Brawn.


I would have to agree that it wasn't the wisest thing to say but he was pumped and it may have just been a reference to winning the first race of the season. :well:



#3016 ayali

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:25

No I won't take it with a pinch of salt, thank you. Jenson Button annoys me, and that's that. It annoys me that he can say things like "welcome to 2009" and not be criticised for it. If any other driver had said that, he would have been called arrogant and big-headed. But not Jenson. Jenson gets a free pass to say whatever he likes, and in my opinion this is not because he is a nicer person, but is because he sucks up to the media. I don't like it at all. :(

LOL nothing to do with sucking up to the media and everything to do with being intelligent and using the media to your advantage.
Knowing what the press want and need, giving them that but asking and getting what you need in return.
It's what true professionals do.

Schumacher, Alonso, Vettel do too, it's an asset.
Some drivers who can't manage the press have a weakness, especially when they care what people think about them.

In your case I can see why the fact that Button masters this game annoys you but really keeping your nose clean, not saying or tweeting stupid things and managing the press is a quality, not something to resent a driver for.

#3017 Rocket73

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:28

:up:

#3018 eronrules

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:28

you are presenting the man who told his RE to shut up twice on the radio and then swore on the podium as a shining beacon of humility?


(dont get me wrong I am a big fan of Kimi)


you do know you're talking about kimi right ... :smoking: i was pointing out to the interviews he gives, he always credits the team and says 'we' and admits his faults like in india. also after the race, he explained what he meant and RE/Slade also acknowledged it.

#3019 Rocket73

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:30

ok cool but you can see how a few "comments" can be misleading

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#3020 PayasYouRace

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 20:37

I would have to agree that it wasn't the wisest thing to say but he was pumped and it may have just been a reference to winning the first race of the season. :well:


May have? I struggle to think of what else it could have been.

#3021 PARAZAR

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 22:14

No I won't take it with a pinch of salt, thank you. Jenson Button annoys me, and that's that. It annoys me that he can say things like "welcome to 2009" and not be criticised for it. If any other driver had said that, he would have been called arrogant and big-headed. But not Jenson. Jenson gets a free pass to say whatever he likes, and in my opinion this is not because he is a nicer person, but is because he sucks up to the media. I don't like it at all. :(


There's no need to get annoyed. I quite like JB's character and the fact that he's mastered the media and PR skill. Because it is a skill and part of the F1 game.

#3022 tkulla

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 22:25

Whether he means to or not, talking about leading the team takes pressure off of Perez and that's a good thing. I don't think Sergio's drop in form after being announced as a McLaren driver was a coincidence - he was suddenly getting more attention and more scrutiny. And next year will be way more intense than that.

#3023 lewymp4

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 22:49

In your case I can see why the fact that Button masters this game annoys you but really keeping your nose clean, not saying or tweeting stupid things and managing the press is a quality, not something to resent a driver for.


I wonder if this was a good example, of Jenson's so-called intelligent ability of how to handle the press?

http://www.topnews.i...title-bid-27180


#3024 ayali

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 23:16

I wonder if this was a good example, of Jenson's so-called intelligent ability of how to handle the press?

http://www.topnews.i...title-bid-27180

You decide for yourself dude
Can't really be bothered to click your linky
Too many sour lewy grapes and all that lately ;)

Just tried to explain to dear Coral why her annoyance is misplaced perhaps :)

#3025 Dalton007

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 08:49

No I won't take it with a pinch of salt, thank you. Jenson Button annoys me, and that's that. It annoys me that he can say things like "welcome to 2009" and not be criticised for it. If any other driver had said that, he would have been called arrogant and big-headed. But not Jenson. Jenson gets a free pass to say whatever he likes, and in my opinion this is not because he is a nicer person, but is because he sucks up to the media. I don't like it at all. :(


He doesn't suck up, he uses the media to his advantage. Let's be candid about this, the media are sharks and when they smell blood in the water they will come after you. Jenson is just keeping them at bay. And when Jenson said "Welcome to 2009" that's his adrenaline pumping, like when Vettel shouts "YES" or when Lewis goes "WHOOOOOOO".



#3026 tifosiMac

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 09:07

I wonder if this was a good example, of Jenson's so-called intelligent ability of how to handle the press?

http://www.topnews.i...title-bid-27180

I remember that happening and credit to Jenson for telling it how it is when faced with such a stupid interviewer. I know Lewis would have got his ass handed to him if he'd done the same but I respect drivers for showing a little passion. I wish we saw more of this from Jenson. :up:

#3027 Rinehart

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 09:26

Its just astonishing that anyone would think that saying "Welcome to 2009" after he's just crossed the line to win the opening race in Australia, just as he did in 2009 is in any way, shape or form, wrong.



#3028 Dalton007

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 10:24

Its just astonishing that anyone would think that saying "Welcome to 2009" after he's just crossed the line to win the opening race in Australia, just as he did in 2009 is in any way, shape or form, wrong.



It's a reason to hate someone, especially some of the Lewis fans. You'd think he'd snatched their presents on Christmas Day.

#3029 tifosiMac

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 10:35

It's a reason to hate someone, especially some of the Lewis fans. You'd think he'd snatched their presents on Christmas Day.

Unfortunately there are 'some' Jenson fans who also do this sort of thing on the Hamilton threads so its hardly surprising here. I think people need to see the bigger picture and support the fact these guys are very good racing drivers who respect one another.

#3030 Coral

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 12:29

Its just astonishing that anyone would think that saying "Welcome to 2009" after he's just crossed the line to win the opening race in Australia, just as he did in 2009 is in any way, shape or form, wrong.


So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!

#3031 Clatter

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 12:35

So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!


Wow. You really are desperate to find something negative over such a simple statement of enjoyment at having won the opening race of the season. Lets not forget that this was on the team radio for the benefit of the team, not the world. He would not have known what would be broadcast. Any hint of an insult is a total figment of your imagination.

#3032 ayali

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 12:40

And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!

Even Alonso said that with his (early season) Ferrari he'd not challenge for the title.
Really getting desperate now, dislike Jenson because he's not a good fortune teller

:lol:

#3033 tifosiMac

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 12:49

So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!

I don't really have a problem with a sportsman making a cocky statement in the heat of the moment. Jenson said what he said most likely to pump himself and the team up, but he didn't know what was in store at that point. One thing is for certain, if Lewis had said something similarly cocky, the same people criticising you here would be taking equal offence. I don't quite share your view here but we are all entitled to interpret things how we like. Take no notice of the rest. :)

#3034 Rocket73

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 16:23

So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!


:rotfl:

Come on...ridiculous

#3035 Rocket73

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 16:27

May have? I struggle to think of what else it could have been.


I think some took it as a declaration that he was going to win the season as he did in 2009...

the macca was fastest in testing and JB owned one and all in australia so it's quite possible.


it would seem that some took at as a hideous insult to the mothers of all racing drivers worldwide..

#3036 Force Ten

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 16:47

I don't really have a problem with a sportsman making a cocky statement in the heat of the moment. Jenson said what he said most likely to pump himself and the team up, but he didn't know what was in store at that point. One thing is for certain, if Lewis had said something similarly cocky, the same people criticising you here would be taking equal offence. I don't quite share your view here but we are all entitled to interpret things how we like. Take no notice of the rest. :)

Yeah, I wouldn't bet a house on it.

#3037 sheepgobba

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 17:41

I think you totally mistaken, it is not about Hamilton being beaten. It is about how he could not backup his words with performance


Don't think Hamilton was soundly beaten as some suggest.

#3038 lewymp4

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 18:16

I know Lewis would have got his ass handed to him if he'd done the same

Unfortunately that's the double standard that Lewis will always have to endure and deal with.




#3039 PayasYouRace

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 18:48

I think some took it as a declaration that he was going to win the season as he did in 2009...

the macca was fastest in testing and JB owned one and all in australia so it's quite possible.


it would seem that some took at as a hideous insult to the mothers of all racing drivers worldwide..


Well exactly. He'd started 2012 in the same manner as 2009. It was a good omen so to speak. Things were looking good at that point.

It was no worse than any other driver's victory celebrations over the radio. Also, like any other driver, he attracts some very bizarre and undeserved criticism from fans of "the enemy". :lol:

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#3040 Murraytastic

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 22:43

JB runs sub 3 hours in Honolulu Marathon.

http://www.run247.co...icle-3184-.html

#3041 Dalton007

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:21

So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!


:rotfl:

You had a go at me for not supporting Lewis, or couldn't understand why I didn't like him. Well, "Let he be without sin to cast the first stone."

Edited by Dalton007, 13 December 2012 - 10:39.


#3042 Bartel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:54

So why did Jenson say "welcome to 2009" rather than "welcome to 2012?" I think he said it because he thought this year would be the same as 2009...i.e. he thought he had a dominant car and would cruise to the WDC. Which is not only an insult to his team-mate, but also to the other 22 drivers on the grid. And let's not forget Jenson's declaration that Alonso would not challenge for the WDC...he got that one wrong, didn't he?!

Nobody in their right mind thought Alonso could challenge for the title, and to add to that, nobody thought McLaren would shoot themselves in the foot for most of the season, Red Bull to go backwards, and for a the weather to play into Ferraris hands so to me I think Jenson made a fair assumption there.

"Welcome 2009" well, it was, he dominated the race, and dominated Lewis in the same car in that race regardless of what anyone says, Lewis took a great pole yes he did, but he couldn't touch Jenson in the race. I took the 2009 comment more as a Australian Grand Prix remark more than the season, had he won the first 3 or 4 races and said it after then yes, but I think you took it the wrong way, we all know you're very sensitive about Lewis.

#3043 LiJu914

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:14

Anyway in hindsight he should´ve said "Welcome 2008"....would´ve been a better description for his performances to come.

#3044 Dalton007

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:51

Jenson comes fifth in Jame's ranking:

http://www.jamesalle...rivers-of-2012/

#3045 LiJu914

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:04

Jenson comes fifth in Jame's ranking:

http://www.jamesalle...rivers-of-2012/


Taking the season as a whole Button didn´t have a slower car than Vettel and didn´t have more reliability issues - one became WDC while the other finished 5th with almost 100 points less and behind two drivers in slower cars and also his teammate, who suffered form much much worse reliability.
I wonder how that qualifies for being the 5th best driver as it is evident that Jenson was not as good as all the drivers, who finished in front of him, and it´s hard to believe that there really wasn´t a single driver left in the rest of the field, who did a better job this year.

Edited by LiJu914, 13 December 2012 - 11:05.


#3046 speng

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:07

Jenson comes fifth in Jame's ranking:

http://www.jamesalle...rivers-of-2012/

Yep, not a top 3 driver in JA list.

#3047 speng

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:13

:rotfl:

You had a go at me for not supporting Lewis, or couldn't understand why I didn't like him. Well, "Let he be without sin to cast the first stone."

:lol:

#3048 BARHonda006

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:14

I've lurked in this forum for quite a while now, and I have to say I'm quite dissapointed at the Jenson bashing that has increased in this thread in the last couple of months. I think, as a race winner, JB does deserve to be JA's top 5. The guy hasn't had one of his better seasons, but give the guy a break. Ever since the LH to Merc announcement, it seems that LH fans have decided to jump on to the easy option of bashing the Button.

Just as a side note, I have been reading this forum for 2 years.

Edited by BARHonda006, 13 December 2012 - 11:15.


#3049 SophieB

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:15

Taking the season as a whole Button didn´t have a slower car than Vettel and didn´t have more reliability issues - one became WDC while the other finished 5th with almost 100 points less and behind two drivers in slower cars and also his teammate, who suffered form much much worse reliability.
I wonder how that qualifies for being the 5th best driver as it is evident that Jenson was not as good as all the drivers, who finished in front of him, and it´s hard to believe that there really wasn´t a single driver left in the rest of the field, who did a better job this year.


He did still win three races, though.

I think 5th seems about right for this year. Sounds low but then it seems hard to argue he should replace any of the four drivers above him. Raikkonen, possibly.

#3050 trogggy

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:18

Yep, not a top 3 driver in JA list.

I doubt he's in anyone's top 3 for 2012. You'd have to be in serious denial to put him there.
Like his team-mate the year before in fact.