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The FOTA Breakaway Series - One Year Later


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Poll: The FOTA breakaway series. (136 member(s) have cast votes)

How do you feel about the FOTA breakaway series?

  1. I was all for it at the time and I'm still wish they had gone ahead with it. (50 votes [36.76%])

    Percentage of vote: 36.76%

  2. I was all for it at the time but now I'm happy it was canceled. (40 votes [29.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 29.41%

  3. I was against it at the time and I'm still happy it was canceled. (42 votes [30.88%])

    Percentage of vote: 30.88%

  4. I was against it at the time but I now wish they had gone ahead with it. (4 votes [2.94%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.94%

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#1 Apex

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 15:28

Today it's exactly one year since the FOTA teams announced their decision to leave Formula One and start their own racing series. This move was very popular among the fans at the time (you can re-visit the thread about the announcement here) but, as we all know, their plans were canceled a few days later when they reached an agreement with the FIA.

A lot has changed since then, two manufacturers have left, three new teams have joined and, perhaps most importantly, Max Mosley was forced to leave.

So, how did you feel about the breakaway series at the time? What about now? Have you changed your mind?

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#2 undersquare

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 15:53

They still have half the money leaving the sport. I can't believe they couldn't get it together - link some track dates with some TV contracts...

#3 Owen

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 15:55

The real FOTA agenda was removing Max. And they got there. Eventually.

#4 Fastcake

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 15:57

I hated the idea and I'm dam glad it only existed as a bargaining chip to present to the press.

There was no way this could go have gone ahead - it was just impossible to organise a new racing series with a half dozen teams continually disagreeing over the smallest technical rule change. How they could of run a series is beyond me.

#5 phil1993

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:06

The only decent part of it was that there were some quality tracks on the calendar.

#6 Apex

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:06

The real FOTA agenda was removing Max. And they got there. Eventually.

This is what I felt as well, and I suspect much of the support they got from the fans was in fact due to the unpopularity of Max rather than the idea of a breakaway series being genuinely popular.

#7 Owen

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:09

This is what I felt as well, and I suspect much of the support they got from the fans was in fact due to the unpopularity of Max rather than the idea of a breakaway series being genuinely popular.

Yeh I can't help agreeing. It was a damaging fight as well. There was lots of collateral damage on both sides. We appear to have come out of it with a healthier sport though.

#8 demoing

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:12

Hows about adding an option of I never believed FOTA were able to do it.

#9 Apex

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:14

The only decent part of it was that there were some quality tracks on the calendar.

I don't remember any calendar being announced. However, I do remember a lot of speculation and wish-thinking going on about what tracks could potentially be on their calendar.

#10 undersquare

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:15

I hated the idea and I'm dam glad it only existed as a bargaining chip to present to the press.

There was no way this could go have gone ahead - it was just impossible to organise a new racing series with a half dozen teams continually disagreeing over the smallest technical rule change. How they could of run a series is beyond me.


It would have depended totally on them choosing/creating an independent governing body. One without the FIA voting system that so invites corruption.

Edited by undersquare, 18 June 2010 - 16:45.


#11 Sakae

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 16:27

They should have gone ahead. Racing would have been closer to what I like to watch.

#12 KateLM

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 19:09

I never thought they would really go through with it.

I wonder what would have happened if the FIA hadn't backed down? We'll never know of course but I think it would have ended in tears.

Edited by KateLM, 18 June 2010 - 19:10.


#13 swerved

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 19:30

They should have gone ahead. Racing would have been closer to what I like to watch.



I also wish they had gone ahead, it's depressing that speculators take so much money out of the sport whilst the teams are told to tighten their collective belts, at the time i thought "the teams couldn't do any worse than the FIA" and i haven't changed my opinion, if you take all of the animals out of the circus, all you're left with is a few clowns in an empty big tent.

#14 August

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 20:30

I'm happy the breakaway series didn't happen. It would've been bad for the sport. Formula One would've lost its top teams meaning it's no longer the top-tier series and the new top-tier series would've lacked the heritage and the name of F1. Last year I was for the new series but that was just for the same reason as the teams had, we need to get rid of Max.

Still, the FOTA series might be in some ways better. Bernie's done great job as he's made F1 into one of the biggest sports in the world. Still, IMO he's currently destroying this great sport by giving GPs to countries with no racing heritage. Having GPs in Asia would be a good thing if people there would be really interested in F1 and GPs would be driven in front of full grandstands but seems that Asian people are not interested in F1 and there are Asian GPs just because of wealthy Asian sponsors. It is clear that the things can't go on like this. If those Asian GPs won't have more spectators then they can't keep on hosting GPs. Then F1 loses a big source of money. The FOTA series probably would've had more races in Europe and less in Asia, meaning the series is where the fans are.

#15 noikeee

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 21:51

The FOTA breakaway story had so many twists and turns I can't even remember whether I was for or against it.

#16 Clatter

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Posted 18 June 2010 - 21:53

I was in full support of FOTA. I would have supported the breakaway if it had of happened, but knew that was not the aim.

#17 FigJam

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Posted 19 June 2010 - 03:01

I was in full support of FOTA. I would have supported the breakaway if it had of happened, but knew that was not the aim.


:up:

#18 Slartibartfast

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Posted 19 June 2010 - 22:19

The real FOTA agenda was removing Max. And they got there. Eventually.

That is the impression I had too. So, in a sense, the breakaway did happen.

It wasn't a one-sided fight, though. Mosley may have gone, but so have Dennis and Briatore (the latter thanks to a spectacular own goal). Will it take another FOTA-FIA war to ged rid of Donnelly, Whiting, Montezemolo and the Poison Dwarf?

#19 Radoye

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Posted 19 June 2010 - 23:47

The real FOTA agenda was removing Max. And they got there. Eventually.

:up:

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#20 GTRacer

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Posted 20 June 2010 - 00:08

the thing with fota and the fans that i always found a bit weird was that many of the rules the fans complain about were actually things that were put in place by fota rather than the fia.

the testing restrictions, refueling ban, tyre rules, aero rules and some of the engine limitations were all fota ideas which the fia adopted. the fota series included all of those regulations and was generally more limited from a technical standpoint so i was always surprised many of the fans that suppodely hated these restrictions and regulations supported the fota breakaway.

since fota have more of a say in the regulations now the f1 you will see in coming years will start to look more like what a fota series would have anyway so the fact they didnt breakaway wont ultimately matter.



oh and the general paddock feelings of a year ago (and i was in the paddock for much of last summer) always was that a fota series wasnt viable because the manufacturer's involved didnt have the money to set it up and run it, it was more a barganing chip against max mosley than something which was ever going to become reality.

#21 aditya-now

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Posted 20 June 2010 - 00:18

Without Toyota and BMW it would have become an interesting series. Still, I wish they would have proceeded. An opportunity missed.

#22 Aquarius

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Posted 20 June 2010 - 01:52

Without Toyota and BMW it would have become an interesting series. Still, I wish they would have proceeded. An opportunity missed.


I don't think it was "an opportunity missed"... it seemed like the sort of thing that has happened to US open-wheel racing more than once (the CART/USAC split and the CART/IRL split) and especially in case of the latter, both sides lost out badly. I think that if the "split" had occurred in F1, it would have had very similar results.

#23 Captain Tightpants

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Posted 20 June 2010 - 01:58

Personally, I was never happy for it. The concept was doomed from the start, and was clearly a political ploy. You just can't have the teams making the rules, enforcing the rules and playing by the rules the way FOTA intended, and it wouldn't be hard to see a situation arising where teams started manipulating the rulebook for the sake of favouring themselves at the expense of someone else. Costs would have increased exponentialy and it would have forced smaller teams out until the whole thing got so big and so bloated that it just imploded.

#24 ali.unal

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 20:27

It's on again. Here is what John Hewett had to say about it:

"The teams are in my view in the driving seat; they simply need to remain united and determined to achieve a new and sustainable future for the sport," concludes Howett. "The future potential increase in revenue is huge, and in my view the initial team EBITDA generated from a new series would be no worse, and most likely better than that derived from the current agreement. They can and should control the commercial governance of the sport."

2010-2012 Concorde Agreement will be terminated at the end of the year 2011 so teams and commercial rights holder have to make an agreement on commercial terms and races ahead. It will be tense times yet again. News Corp/Exon bid, di Montezemolo's breakaway threats and position takings are the first signs.

What about the next move?

Edited by ali.unal, 16 June 2011 - 20:33.


#25 highdownforce

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 20:36

2013 engine regulations, hell can break loose because of that.

#26 Kubiccia

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 20:43

I heard that the breakway still can happen. The contract with Bernie finishes in 2013 and there are some teams interested in creating a "Team's series".

I fully support it. I want the teams with all the money, I'm sure we'll have better tracks, regs and etc

#27 KnuX

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 20:58

Absolutely. Why do we need CVC exactly? No good reason.

There are some problems, yes, but all of them are solvable.

#28 Red17

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:16

I don't think it was "an opportunity missed"... it seemed like the sort of thing that has happened to US open-wheel racing more than once (the CART/USAC split and the CART/IRL split) and especially in case of the latter, both sides lost out badly. I think that if the "split" had occurred in F1, it would have had very similar results.

Reading some of the articles back then I got the feeling that the general fear on the paddock was precisely that a similar epic fail would happen. Both sides would lose

The breakaway was just a double ruse, it was about getting Max out of the seat and get a good excuse for bailing out. I dont think anyone gave it much credibility, it had no name, no sponsors, no money, no calendar and it really had no teams, how many actually said «we will be on the breakaway grid for sure»?

#29 Fastcake

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:19

Nothings changed, just more posturing, and by pretty much only Montezemolo this time around. The teams won't run the series any better, don't expect some magical dream F1 to appear just because they brought the rights.

#30 Rob

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:19

Max and Bernie's 100 year deal has made F1 very fragile. Long term, things will come to a head over this. The only resolution is a breakaway series. I think it will happen in time.

#31 undersquare

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:24

Max and Bernie's 100 year deal has made F1 very fragile. Long term, things will come to a head over this. The only resolution is a breakaway series. I think it will happen in time.

Hasn't Todt said he's aiming to renegotiate that?

#32 Fastcake

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:30

Hasn't Todt said he's aiming to renegotiate that?

You can't just renegotiate a contract like that.

#33 WhiteBlue

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 21:38

None of the options really fits the reality of F1. The break away is the proper weapon to fight for the teams share of the TV money. To use it in the negotiations about resource restrictions or a budget cap was a foolish idea to start with. The issue was being decided anyway and FOTA was only serving Montezemolo's ego by going on the war path for it. Six weeks later they agreed to a solution that was already proposed weeks before the break away was announced. It was essentially Ferrari who did not want restrictions but the economic reality was such that they had to accept them from their own organization FOTA in the end. They could have as well saved everybody a great deal of excitement by agreeing to the Mercedes compromise in May 2009. The result would have been the same. In 2009 FOTA had no means to fight their own fight for a decent part of the TV money. The main and traditional teams including Ferrari were all locked in contracts with Ecclestone and a break away would have ruined them. Now is the time to make a stand for 2013. I'm very curious if they will do a proper job of it when it counts or if Ecclestone will once again succeed to herd them into dispute about silly issues like sabotaging the turbo engines. I'm really of two minds about the prospect. With Ferrari there is always a partisan to undermine the teams front and stab them in the back. They have done it before and the likelihood is they will do it again.

#34 Rob

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 22:38

Hasn't Todt said he's aiming to renegotiate that?


The only way would be to look at getting the sale to Bernie nullified in the courts. I don't think it's going to happen, particularly whilst Max is still there in the background.

#35 Sausage

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Posted 16 June 2011 - 22:49

Hasn't Todt said he's aiming to renegotiate that?


First he said he wanted to but recently he has gone on record saying it is what it is. He compared it to selling a house and 10 years later have it worth a lot more. Pretty stupid but I guess a FIA president has to stay relative when you know you can't do anything anymore against your predecessor selling management of F1 for peanuts years ago.

I think a FOTA breakaway would never work unless it somehow involves the FIA breaking this contract. If you take what Par said recently about tv-money at face value you know the bigger teams will either want a ton more cash or a breakaway.

2013 engines is a whole different matter. Ferrari could break away due to it, but it's hard to know if anyone would follow. Probably not a lot, maybe Mercedes if it remains commited to top formula racing. Looking at the FIAT cvc bid at least you know they'd have a strong backer in terms of money.

Maybe a new thread is in order, since this one was started when it all seemed pretty rosy. Years in F1 must count for 10 real years! :lol:

#36 CF22

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Posted 17 June 2011 - 00:15

I was for it because I really wanted to see something new, and to be honest I still wish to see what it would've been, but all along we knew it was a bargaining chip to remove Mosley and undo the $40 million a year cap. Yes, watching the races today is somewhat enjoyable but I don't like the idea of the fictional passing created by the DRS and the lottery with the tires to a lesser extent. Having the F1 name gone or diminished would've been a shame but the sport should be directed by the group of teams (FOTA) instead of the FIA and Bernie. Anyway, if Ferrari goes I go with them.