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#51 jcurran

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 21:44

The later type, it is the 14th of 19 in total, examples 15,16 and 17 were type 2D variants, this one is one of two type 2C variants, the other, built for John Walker, is pictured near the start of this thread. The last couple of Monos, 18 and 19, were fitted with 1100 cc engines, Bob Mills' car (the 18th) was assembled sometime in 69 and has type 600 suspension from new.


The Hotchkiss Mono has inboard fronts and Cosworth Mk XVI engine and Mk V Hewland box. Not sure if all the 2D variants had out board front suspension, Garrie's personal car, MD 6755 certainly had outboard front and rear suspension.


G'day James,

I note you mention that you have been able to reunite this car with the 300, does that mean you and Rod have recently purchased it from the states?

James C.

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#52 SJ Lambert

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Posted 25 December 2010 - 22:15

G'day James,

I note you mention that you have been able to reunite this car with the 300, does that mean you and Ron have recently purchased it from the states?

James C.


G'day James, yes, another one to swell the ranks in Tassie!

Edited by SJ Lambert, 25 December 2010 - 22:20.


#53 jcurran

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 00:06

G'day James, yes, another one to swell the ranks in Tassie!

G'day James,

Makes a nice set, well done in getting another Elfin back to Aus. You guys are going to have a major problem working out who drives what!

James.

#54 Brian Lear

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Posted 27 December 2010 - 08:39

That's him! Charles (Chuck) Krueger and Phil were both Upstate New York residents, making Watkins Glen this car's home track. It also ran in Phil's hands at Cumberland and with Chuck at Lime Rock. Neither Phil nor Chuck are with us any longer, but Chuck's son, also Charles, has allowed us to reunite this car with it's long time stablemate, the first of the Elfin 300's.

So the odds are that if this shot wasn't taken in NY, then it would have been in a surrounding state. I lived in Upstate NY for a year or so a while back and it has the feel of quite possibly being somewhere near the Finger Lakes to me.

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Chuck Krueger sent me that picture about 10 - 12 years ago and he marked it "Watkins Glen"

The Mono pictured in post 43 is M6442 currently owned by Graham Hoinville. It is distinctive in that it is the only one with a painted tub.

Brian Lear
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#55 SJ Lambert

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Posted 28 December 2010 - 02:33

Chuck Krueger sent me that picture about 10 - 12 years ago and he marked it "Watkins Glen"

The Mono pictured in post 43 is M6442 currently owned by Graham Hoinville. It is distinctive in that it is the only one with a painted tub.

Brian Lear
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G'day Brian - do you have any others of Mono 6653?

Graham's car in post 43 appears to have an Elfin rocker cover as installed on Cortina motors........

Cheers James

#56 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 28 December 2010 - 10:58

G'day Brian - do you have any others of Mono 6653?

Graham's car in post 43 appears to have an Elfin rocker cover as installed on Cortina motors........

Cheers James

I saw one of those being carried around at Stratalbyn swap meet. I doubt that they guy who bought it will part with it though. At a guess it is on a Mk1 Cortina now.

#57 SJ Lambert

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 11:37

I think the Mono is chassis number 6441.


Highly likely (Mono on second row of grid Oct 64 Mallala with Garrie Cooper at the wheel)- has to be really, as Garrie didn't knock another one together for himself til Oct 65 according to Brian Lear's register (and the "other" one is now the immaculate one that Brian runs)
So it may well have been 6441's debut race meeting and very probably sporting an iron head prior to getting a DOHC Lotus one later on.

I reckon 6441 had an aluminium flywheel fairly early on, though it may not have been fitted prior to the T/C head going on.

#58 pallas1970

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Posted 26 February 2011 - 22:14

Speaking of aluminium, now have the original aluminium nose cone back with 6441 (thanks Brian and Grant!) which will be freshened for show and keep the fiberglass one for go, anyone have the aluminium engine cover per chance? James

#59 SJ Lambert

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 03:16

I recently came across a couple of old B&W negs that may be of interest to some readers of this thread.
The photos were taken in the Elfin factory some 45 years ago during the build of the mono for the Clisby V6 engine.

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Front view with Ron Lambert in the foreground.

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Garrie and Fulvio in consultation...



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#60 ellrosso

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 03:28

Great shots James - were they taken on med format camera rather than 35mm?

#61 SJ Lambert

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 03:54

[quote name='SJ Lambert' post='4758898' date='Dec 14 2010, 22:09'][/quote]


[quote name='ellrosso' post='4868702' date='Feb 27 2011, 14:28']Great shots James - were they taken on med format camera rather than 35mm?[/quote]


They're kaydee's shots, so not sure what format he was using.....

There was a fellow at Conmurra Ave later on, when the Clisby Mono was near complete, the day Kaydee and Dad were taking shots of it shoulder to shoulder (see post 25).
The fellow, left of picture, had a camera that may well have been medium format, I reckon he was putting it to good use. Apologies for not knowing who he is.

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Post #25

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[quote name='kaydee' post='4524829' date='Aug 2 2010, 18:14']
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Edited by SJ Lambert, 27 February 2011 - 03:55.


#62 kaydee

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 06:36

[quote name='SJ Lambert' date='Feb 27 2011, 12:54' post='4868712']
They're kaydee's shots, so not sure what format he was using.....

There was a fellow at Conmurra Ave later on, when the Clisby Mono was near complete, the day Kaydee and Dad were taking shots of it shoulder to shoulder (see post 25).
The fellow, left of picture, had a camera that may well have been medium format, I reckon he was putting it to good use. Apologies for not knowing who he is.

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Hi James,
My B&W photos of the Clisby mono were 2 1/4 square format taken on a YashicaMat twin lens reflex camera.
I'm 99% sure that the gentleman left of picture is Reg Whitford who was General Manager of Clisby Industries.
He was a photographic enthusiast and also had a similar YashicaMat camera - which is what he appears to be holding...
Kevin




#63 SJ Lambert

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Posted 16 March 2011 - 07:23

Does the Mono have the swept back wishbone or the later rear suspension?


Found this blurb in Dec 1966 RCN, the Hotchkiss Mono does have this single top link and trailing arm rear suspension.

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Edited by SJ Lambert, 16 March 2011 - 09:26.


#64 Tux

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 10:17

Gidday All,

I am working on James Calders Mono and have a parts problem.
Does anyone know what vehicle the top radiator hose for the Mk1 with a Twin Cam was sourced from?
It rather resembles a question mark shape.
It runs from the water pump up, over and down into the tub.

Thanks, Tux

#65 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 12:55

That sounds like a question for Brian Lear...

As a long-time owner and operator of a Mono with Twink, as well as having himself immersed in keeping records of Elfins generally, he's bound to have come across something.

#66 SJ Lambert

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 18:42

Garrie's behind the wheel of this early Mk2, probably Brian Lear's example. Routing for one side of the water plumbing is shown. May not be the side Tux is after though..........will see what else I can find.

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#67 Ray Bell

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 20:41

With the cockpit in place, that looks like it could be quite an effective heater...

There might have been a 'running change' to this part of the design, methinks, as this photo hardly depicts what Tux has described.

#68 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 22:52

With the cockpit in place, that looks like it could be quite an effective heater...

There might have been a 'running change' to this part of the design, methinks, as this photo hardly depicts what Tux has described.

just the ideal car to race in cold climates!!

#69 Tux

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Posted 25 March 2011 - 22:58

The left side is as shown in the photo above, and is the same or at least similar to the Mk2. We are good here, our hose is ok and should be easily replaced when the time comes.

The right side is where I have problems.

This is the hose

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Here is the right side with the hose in place

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And again here without the hose

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As you can see it is different to the Mk2 and therein lies the problem.

It is such a short hose with sharp bends, travelling as it does direcly from the water pump straight into the tub.

I hope this makes it a little clearer, sorry the photos are not better.

#70 SJ Lambert

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Posted 26 March 2011 - 01:26

How about heading to your local friendly radiator hose supplier with the existing one, go out the back and find one with the right bend in it, then cannabilise it?

#71 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 26 March 2011 - 02:07

Check out an early Escort or Cortina top hose. I reckon they do similar contortions. If that is an original Elfin design they would have gone next door to MotorTraders for the hose so would have been something reasonably current and easy to get.
Though ideally if you can get there a 90deg copper elbow would be better with 2 short pieces of straight hose to join them. Or weld together 2 pieces of steel mitred at 45 deg. The non constant radius of that would still flow more water than that hose.
Or a piece of convulated hose. Though change them regularly as they never seem to last all that long. Like once a year.Buy that from bigger Repco stores etc

Edited by Lee Nicolle, 26 March 2011 - 02:11.


#72 Tux

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Posted 26 March 2011 - 21:14


Gidday All,

Thanks for your replys.

Unfortunately Motor Traders no longer allow you to search through their shelves looking for parts; unless you harass them! :lol:
We found that they have reduced the amount and variety of their stock. No hoses to match. ):
What was a current part in 65 is an old rare spare now. We looked there (Rare Spares) too.

We searched other parts suppliers, no luck there either. We did find that the top ball joint on the front suspension is from an old Valiant and that the older parts are the same shape as the originals. The newer parts are different but still fit.

Hadn't thought of hitting a radiator place, will try that next.

We are trying to maintain originality as far as possible, so would prefer to avoid a welded up type arrangement. Though we may have to as a last resort or as a stop gap measure.
Pegasus have supplied several hoses with different bends and some joiners, we will try cobbling one together before attempting to welding one up.

By the way, City Plastics in Adelaide have the original buck for Mono windscreens and can do new screens in clear or dark tint. They also have the special drill bit needed to drill the mounting holes in the plastic.

Tux

#73 SJ Lambert

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Posted 26 March 2011 - 21:53

Posted ImagePosted Image



Here's the car with both a Twin Cam and a pushrod engine in it. The pushrod engined shot shows what would have been the original aluminium pipe to small hose. The Twin Cam shot is less helpful, sorry. Not entirely sure whether that looped hose is an oil line or water hose.

James

Edited by SJ Lambert, 26 March 2011 - 21:57.


#74 Tux

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Posted 27 March 2011 - 22:13


Gidday James,

The Twin Cam photo semes to show the filler neck running down the block and connecting with an aluminium hose through the tub.
Ours is slightly different. The filler is elsewhere, but the hole in the tub is in the same place.

We have checked Cortina, Escort, Herald, GT6, Standard 10 and Anglia hoses to no avail.

As has been stated before Garrie probably went down the road and searched the shelves till he found what he needed.
Given this was around 64 or 65, and the small size of the hose we can probably discount American and Australian cars as the donor vehicle.
So it was probably off an English car or one of the more common European cars.
I forgot to check the Hillman Imps the other weekend at Phillip Island; was a bit busy fielding the freshly rebuilt Lotus 7.

I had a look in my notes and the ball joint was a Powermax brand, part number TE173R. We required 2 right hand joints.

Also City Plastics have the buck for Elfin Formula V screens.

Tux



#75 Leo D

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Posted 27 May 2011 - 12:57

Jack Hunnam Elfin Mono, Calder Raceway circa 1966-1968?
Image kindly supplied by Ray Sinclair.

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#76 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 27 May 2011 - 23:59

Gidday James,

The Twin Cam photo semes to show the filler neck running down the block and connecting with an aluminium hose through the tub.
Ours is slightly different. The filler is elsewhere, but the hole in the tub is in the same place.

We have checked Cortina, Escort, Herald, GT6, Standard 10 and Anglia hoses to no avail.

As has been stated before Garrie probably went down the road and searched the shelves till he found what he needed.
Given this was around 64 or 65, and the small size of the hose we can probably discount American and Australian cars as the donor vehicle.
So it was probably off an English car or one of the more common European cars.
I forgot to check the Hillman Imps the other weekend at Phillip Island; was a bit busy fielding the freshly rebuilt Lotus 7.

I had a look in my notes and the ball joint was a Powermax brand, part number TE173R. We required 2 right hand joints.

Also City Plastics have the buck for Elfin Formula V screens.

Just be careful with those ball joints, a lot of 'modern' ball joints do not go to the same angles as the original ones. And they bind and do all sorts of strange things to handling, or other components. What diameter is that hose? it may have been cut ot of something else.
To drill perspex you need to sharpen the drills differently, I did plastics 40 years ago and have forgotten the specs. Though have used standard ones very carefully with no troubles, just go slowly and gently.

Tux


Edited by Lee Nicolle, 28 May 2011 - 00:02.


#77 SJ Lambert

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:17

Jack Hunnam Elfin Mono, Calder Raceway circa 1966-1968?
Image kindly supplied by Ray Sinclair.

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Thanks Leo D and Ray, that's Jack's last Mono, the first of the Mk 2Ds, frame no. MD 6754, built immediately after the Hotchkiss Mk2C. Rear suspension looks the same as the Mk 2C (would be interested to see shots of it from the rear to confirm). Front sports the new outboard shocks. Jack drove it well from reports I've read.

Brian Lear's register has it being assembled in Jan 67 and having passed to Ivan Tighe sometime in 68 - Jack appears to be quite pleased with it there, so perhaps it's 'early days 67'?

James

#78 Leo D

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 03:42

James,

Unfortunately I have no access to any rear shots of the Jack Hunnam car.

The Alf Costanzo Mono at Calder...

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Alf again in the Mono at Bathurst, Image provided by Ray Sinclair

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#79 john medley

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:31

The Hunnam car is fairly close to the completion of its restoration, I was told at Winton ten days ago by its current owner

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#80 2Bob

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 04:46

Thanks Leo D and Ray, that's Jack's last Mono, the first of the Mk 2Ds, frame no. MD 6754, built immediately after the Hotchkiss Mk2C. Rear suspension looks the same as the Mk 2C (would be interested to see shots of it from the rear to confirm). Front sports the new outboard shocks. Jack drove it well from reports I've read.

Brian Lear's register has it being assembled in Jan 67 and having passed to Ivan Tighe sometime in 68 - Jack appears to be quite pleased with it there, so perhaps it's 'early days 67'?

James



That means it is the car I owned after Bob Minogue (who was after Ivan Tighe) - see post 21. In Bob's hands it held a number of F3 lap records in Victoria , and maybe elsewhere too.

#81 2Bob

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 05:06

Thanks Leo D and Ray, that's Jack's last Mono, the first of the Mk 2Ds, frame no. MD 6754, built immediately after the Hotchkiss Mk2C. Rear suspension looks the same as the Mk 2C (would be interested to see shots of it from the rear to confirm).


Photo of rear when I had it - sorry about the quality.

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People shown are Tom Galbraith, owner of Motorlab my sponsor then and also sponsor of Jim Doig and his cars especially the Motorlab Asp (which he still sponsors).
Tom's (then) wife, Irmie. Roy Pim, pit crew. Roy is the son of Neville Pym well known South Austrlalian Sporting Car Club identity. (Roy is now around 60 so how old does that make Neville?)

Clubbie in the background I'm guessing would be Dean Hosking's ASP I think, possibly with Bob Butcher's similar car beyond it. Photo taken on a Saturday 'open' test day some time in early 1970's. Mono has 1,100cc Ford as run by Bob Minogue before me.

#82 SJ Lambert

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Posted 09 June 2011 - 14:01

The Hunnam car is fairly close to the completion of its restoration, I was told at Winton ten days ago by its current owner



The Hotchkiss car is trailing badly then, Ron has got it down to the tub in recent days. Front and rear suspension over haul heads the long to do list.

#83 Ray Bell

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Posted 09 June 2011 - 21:49

We'll just have to trust him to get it done... but aren't you helping?

Not neglecting the beautiful little 300, of course...

#84 SJ Lambert

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Posted 09 June 2011 - 22:10

We'll just have to trust him to get it done... but aren't you helping?

Not neglecting the beautiful little 300, of course...



Tyranny of distance for the Mono prevents me doing too much as Ron's shed's in Tassie - I suspect I'll get engine over here in Vic to freshen up at some stage and original exhaust might stand being coated in Leongatha. Am close to a charge of 300 neglect at the moment as it's in my shed at the minute - have yet to re-install the engine in that either........

Edited by SJ Lambert, 11 June 2011 - 03:22.


#85 SJ Lambert

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Posted 02 October 2011 - 09:03

MC6653 is making some progress at the moment - engine has come apart today to reveal 81mm bores as anticipated and no nasty surprises. Suspension Arms are being re-chromed. Carbies are getting a birthday - internal throttle return springs are both broken at the top of spring -carbs don't appear to have any other real poblems.

We're just thinking about what approach to take with fuel tank and roll bar whilst prepping nose for a new paint job (and getting a new tail to match).


#86 SJ Lambert

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Posted 17 November 2011 - 11:42

Ian Hobbs has kindly forwarded me this Mono pic and we're trying to nail down which one it is. Anyone know???


Posted Image



#87 Lola5000

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Posted 17 November 2011 - 12:15

Speaking of aluminium, now have the original aluminium nose cone back with 6441 (thanks Brian and Grant!) which will be freshened for show and keep the fiberglass one for go, anyone have the aluminium engine cover per chance? James

When I sold the car to Steve Lunn,she had the aluminium engine cover and also the orginal wheels from memory 6inch ftont and 8 inch rear.
Plus the Alumnium nose cone in unpainted repaired condition .

#88 SJ Lambert

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Posted 17 November 2011 - 12:25

When I sold the car to Steve Lunn,she had the aluminium engine cover and also the orginal wheels from memory 6inch ftont and 8 inch rear.
Plus the Alumnium nose cone in unpainted repaired condition .



Bill Hemming has a couple of 8" Rears in the rough in magnesium in case anyone is looking to return their Mono to original specs!!!

#89 Ray Bell

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Posted 17 November 2011 - 13:06

Originally posted by SJ Lambert
Ian Hobbs has kindly forwarded me this Mono pic and we're trying to nail down which one it is. Anyone know?

Posted Image


The rollover hoop looks unique, that should be a giveaway...

#90 SJ Lambert

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Posted 17 November 2011 - 20:12

The rollover hoop looks unique, that should be a giveaway...


I don't know which one it is, I think the red upholstery must be an indicator and rear suspension upper attachment point onto the tub would make it a later 2D variant, despite the early nose on it. I don't think it's MD6755. It could be John Ampt's MD6756 that went to Alf Costanzo - I don't know what colour that car started life as.

lyntonh shows Alfie in a Mono in the wet at the Farm in 71 - I can't tell which chassis it is though.

http://forums.autosp...w...t=0&start=0

Edited by SJ Lambert, 17 November 2011 - 22:02.


#91 DanTra2858

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 03:41

I don't know which one it is, I think the red upholstery must be an indicator and rear suspension upper attachment point onto the tub would make it a later 2D variant, despite the early nose on it. I don't think it's MD6755. It could be John Ampt's MD6756 that went to Alf Costanzo - I don't know what colour that car started life as.

lyntonh shows Alfie in a Mono in the wet at the Farm in 71 - I can't tell which chassis it is though.

http://forums.autosp...w...t=0&start=0


Looking at the photo Alf Costanzo car it appears to have a higher roll over bar & of a larger diameter tubing plus the brace is completly different to the car sitting on the pallet.

#92 SJ Lambert

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 04:16

Looking at the photo Alf Costanzo car it appears to have a higher roll over bar & of a larger diameter tubing plus the brace is completly different to the car sitting on the pallet.



I reckon any of the Elfin crew would grin sheepishly when quizzed about the height of the factory fitted roll hoops on all their cars through to 68 (and maybe beyond). By Warwick Farm '71, Costanzo has obviously put a realistic value on his noggin'!!!!

#93 Ray Bell

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 05:14

Can you give us a complete list of Monos as at the approximate date of this pic?

We might be able to work it out from that...

#94 Lola5000

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 05:47

its running a push rod motor looking at the engine cover.

#95 Paul Hamilton

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 06:39

its running a push rod motor looking at the engine cover.


I think its a twin cam, Rob. It has a cross flow head and that looks like the front of the cam cover protruding through the engine cover under the roll bar hoop.

As the car is all packed up for shipment it may be the car used by Tony Maw in Asian events which travelled a bit between Edwardstown and SE Asia. I am not sure what colour that car was when Tony had it but Graham Hoinville now has it painted red and it certainly did have the later rear suspension which you can see here.

#96 Lola5000

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 07:04

I think its a twin cam, Rob. It has a cross flow head and that looks like the front of the cam cover protruding through the engine cover under the roll bar hoop.

As the car is all packed up for shipment it may be the car used by Tony Maw in Asian events which travelled a bit between Edwardstown and SE Asia. I am not sure what colour that car was when Tony had it but Graham Hoinville now has it painted red and it certainly did have the later rear suspension which you can see here.

Oh ok ,the engine cover looked different to the one i had on #6441.
Great little cars,so pretty.
Looks like a strong field for Eastern Creek M/0.


#97 SJ Lambert

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 07:30

There's no doubt about this one.

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#98 SJ Lambert

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 07:40

Will put a complete list in here (shall edit it in as I get the chance).



Mk1s

6440 - Ron Tonkin

M6441 Garrie Cooper - 1500 cc Ford pushrod initially

M6442 Bill Pile

M6443 Jack Hunnam - small capacity Ford?

M6444 Bob Jane

M6445 Granton Harrison (famous for having pranged a boat, car and aeroplane......)

M6446 Mel McEwin - Ford pushrod engine

M6447 Ron Tonkin

M6548 Andy Brown - Clisby V6 1500cc

M6549 Mal Ramsay - Holbay Ford 1100cc Downdraft


Mk 2
MB 6550 Garrie Cooper


MB 6651 Allan Grice (downdraft 1100cc)

MC 6652 John Walker - outboard rear shocks.

MC 6653 Phil Hotchkiss (Oct 1966)

MD 6754 Jack Hunnam - I think this was the first one with outboard shocks in the front as well as rear. previously inboard on the front.

MD 6755 Garrie Cooper

MD 6756 John Ampt

Mk3 No number? - Bob Mills 1100cc Cosworth

Mk 2D

MD 6957 Chris Milton 1100 cc

Edited by SJ Lambert, 01 January 2012 - 20:21.


#99 DanTra2858

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Posted 18 November 2011 - 09:52

Will put a complete list in here (shall edit it in as I get the chance).



Mk1s

6440 - Ron Tonkin

M6441 Garrie Cooper

M6442 Bill Pile

M6443 Jack Hunnam

M6444 Bob Jane

M6445 Granton Harrison (famous for having pranged a boat, car and aeroplane......)

M6446 Mel McEwin

M6447 Ron Tonkin

M6548 Andy Brown

M6459 Mal Ramsay


Mk 2
MB 6550 Garrie Cooper


MB 6651 Allan Grice (downdraft 1100cc)

MC 6652 John Walker - outboard rear shocks.

MC 6653 Phil Hotchkiss (Oct 1966)

MD 6754 Jack Hunnam - I think this was the first one with outboard shocks in the front as well as rear. previously inboard on the front.

MD 6755 Garrie Cooper

MD 6756 John Ampt

Mk3 No number? - Bob Mills 1100cc Cosworth

Mk 2D

MD 6957 Chris Milton 1100 cc



Putting motor size to one side how do you tell the differance between a Mk1, Mk2, Mk2d & Mk3 or any other Mk. ????????

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#100 Ray Bell

Ray Bell
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Posted 18 November 2011 - 10:43

Having looked at the list, I reckon there's a chance that it was Gricey's car...

Obviously he didn't have a Twin-Cam, but in its later life it did. And it might have got into the condition above when being packed for transportation by 'plane.