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Barrichello/Schumacher Incident


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#1251 SimMaker

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:46

Perspective


Ok, One last time....

These are small. but the ones out there, are faaaar away.......



:smoking:

Edited by SimMaker, 02 August 2010 - 16:48.


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#1252 highdownforce

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:48

It seems from some angles that Rubens was closer to the wall than required ...


Also, the opposite....

Posted Image

Edited by highdownforce, 02 August 2010 - 16:49.


#1253 cheapracer

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:49

Perspective


http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Experience

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expert

Edited by cheapracer, 02 August 2010 - 16:50.


#1254 Slartibartfast

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:52

http://en.wikipedia....wiki/Experience

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expert

It is gratifying to have my credentials recognised!

#1255 britishtrident

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:52

He should've put Rubens to the wall. :smoking:


You obviously don't realise just how dangerous this incident was it had all the ingredients for a car going airbourne at 180 mph, fliping end over end over the pit wall. The other major danger was Rubens was forced into the pit exit road, what would have happened if a race car or the safety car & medical car had been exiting the pit lane.

Schumacher will never learn.

#1256 ivand911

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:53

Also, the opposite....

Posted Image

And your picture Michael is further away from white line? In cheapracer picture he is closer?


#1257 Birelman

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:53

Also, the opposite....

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Nice!! Some pics are pretty impressive!

#1258 Birelman

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:55

He should've put Rubens to the wall. :smoking:

LOL I thought he did, Rubens was just too stubborn and missed it! :)

#1259 highdownforce

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:57

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I still don"t know what Rubens think when he start his overtake from the right side. Ha has to know that the track will be tighter soon. But his crying works well, Shumi gets a penalty, the brazilian is the hero of the moment...


and Schumi has only his 7WDC... :cool:

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#1260 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:59

His "apology" goes in the way of "if Rubens thinks that I squeezed him unfairly than I apologize for that.
Making clear that according to Michael´s own view there was nothing outrageous in the move.


Still hating, eh?

"muss ich doch sagen, dass die Stewarts Recht haben mit ihrer Einschätzung: das Manöver gegen ihn war zu hart."

It's going to be a long 4 weeks.We need testing in this time.


#1261 highdownforce

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 16:59

And your picture Michael is further away from white line? In cheapracer picture he is closer?

it looks like that the distance between the wall and the line increases as the pit lane exit approaches.

#1262 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 17:03

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Lol so if MS points his car towards pit exit as soon as he exits final corner Rubens shouldn't attempt an overtake? Balls. If there is still a gap there you are entitled to go for it. If you don't close the door before someone has got alongside it's your own fault and you should leave enough room.

Funny how people who praise MS for being hard and 'on the edge' seem to think all other competitors should be pussies and dare not to challenge the master.

#1263 ivand911

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 17:06

Lol so if MS points his car towards pit exit as soon as he exits final corner Rubens shouldn't attempt an overtake? Balls. If there is still a gap there you are entitled to go for it. If you don't close the door before someone has got alongside it's your own fault and you should leave enough room.

Funny how people who praise MS for being hard and 'on the edge' seem to think all other competitors should be pussies and dare not to challenge the master.

Yes ,they challenge but why they cry after this? They have to say nothing special , tough fight, not to cry over radio.

Edited by ivand911, 02 August 2010 - 17:08.


#1264 Dunder

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 17:09

And your picture Michael is further away from white line? In cheapracer picture he is closer?


The white line is not parallel to the wall.
Cheapracer's photo is slightly later.


#1265 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 17:09

Yes ,they challenge but why they cry after this?


Err because Schumacher continued to close the door after Rubens was already alongside? I realise there was no collision and Rubens completed the pass but it was horrendously dangerous driving from Schumacher to keep pushing when he had already lost track position. The only outcome he could've forced was a huge accident.

#1266 B747

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 17:45

I am a Schumacher fan but... it was just an stupid unnecessary move.

for it; MS deserves: :down:

#1267 Cr0aker

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 18:00

And lost.


But did not cry about I afterwards. Rubens lost all the man points he earned for that balls-to-the-wall pass by crying for a black flag right after. Was Michale's move too harsh? I guess, but Ruben's bleating about it was worse IMHO.

#1268 razno

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 18:06

But did not cry about I afterwards. Rubens lost all the man points he earned for that balls-to-the-wall pass by crying for a black flag right after. Was Michale's move too harsh? I guess, but Ruben's bleating about it was worse IMHO.


Yes, rubens would get my huge respect if he told something like a webber afterward on team radio and williams ask steward for punishment.
This way it look like alonso crying...

Respect for rubens, but not huge one....




#1269 Fat Albert

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 18:06

F1 used to be a sport for men with guts and huge balls.

now its a very VERY faded shadow of its former self.. most drivers are gutless, whiny, moaning, spoilt and pampered these days.

It must be their life expectancy, Jackie Stewart attended 57 funerals of colleagues during his career!

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#1270 BillBald

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 18:47

Anyway, lots of words will get thrown about but the problem still lay in the unrealistic difficulty of passing in F1 that raises the need for Rubens and others to attempt desperate moves.


Are you joking?

Part of the reason for 'the difficulty of passing' is that you have drivers who are prepared to defend like this!!

The FIA should have stamped this out years ago, nothing short of race bans will do.



#1271 ensign14

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 18:49

One those pictures where the lines are drawn on, why are the black lines going at an angle of about 15 degrees to the right of where the tyres on the Mercedes are pointing?

#1272 Sergino

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 19:05

One those pictures where the lines are drawn on, why are the black lines going at an angle of about 15 degrees to the right of where the tyres on the Mercedes are pointing?


That is how the brain of MS and his fans reflects reality... :lol:

#1273 Disgrace

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 19:19

Actually I think he did not admit that. Merely it was a elegant double insult disguised as an apology.


:up: He apologised for Rubens reaction.

"If he feels I was then I'm sorry, this wasn't my intention."

So what he's saying is that he is a whiner and he is sorry for that.

atleast Schumi is man enough to admit he went over the line.



If we're talking about being "man enough" then people are seriously underestimating how "man" Rubens was during the move, which is actually the important thing. Not to mention that Rubens didn't mince his words from interview one. Michael minced his words in his apology, a day after.

Edited by Disgrace, 02 August 2010 - 19:22.


#1274 VC10

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 19:21

Apologies if this has already been said -

Last year Top Gear revealed that Michael 'the cheating bastard' Schumacher was The Stig. Less then a month after Rubens Barrichello beat The Stig's time in a reasonably priced car, MS tries to run Rubens into the wall in Hungary. Is this a coincidence? :)

#1275 highdownforce

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 19:23

One those pictures where the lines are drawn on, why are the black lines going at an angle of about 15 degrees to the right of where the tyres on the Mercedes are pointing?


1. Tarzaan is horrible at drawing.
2. The captured frame is not Schummy's final steer.

At some time he most have turned the wheel more to the rigfht, I'd hazard a guess that it was closer to the pit exit.
Because with that angle he would, probably, not be so close to the line as he was.

#1276 turin

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 19:29

I think if you travel at fairly large speeds, vision get blurred and distorted, colors vary and so on. That chap Einstein said it.

#1277 cardin

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:19

I hated this incident. I was thoroughly enjoying how he has been embarassing himself in his return and was wishing he would continue until mercedes kicked him out of there. Now I fear he'll do something with catastrophic consequences and I'll not be able to enjoy it anymore.

#1278 ensign14

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:29

Apologies if this has already been said -

Last year Top Gear revealed that Michael 'the cheating bastard' Schumacher was The Stig. Less then a month after Rubens Barrichello beat The Stig's time in a reasonably priced car, MS tries to run Rubens into the wall in Hungary. Is this a coincidence? :)

:lol:

#1279 aditya-now

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:29

Apologies if this has already been said -

Last year Top Gear revealed that Michael 'the cheating bastard' Schumacher was The Stig. Less then a month after Rubens Barrichello beat The Stig's time in a reasonably priced car, MS tries to run Rubens into the wall in Hungary. Is this a coincidence? :)


:up:

And also the satisfaction Rubinho took from beating the Stig! :lol:


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#1280 aditya-now

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:42

Still hating, eh?


Schumi as a person has never been worthwhile to be hated (no person actually should be hated), yet his actions are despicable. And his half-hearted apologies as well. Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).


#1281 DFV

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:46

Schumi as a person has never been worthwhile to be hated (no person actually should be hated), yet his actions are despicable. And his half-hearted apologies as well. Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).


+1

:up:


#1282 Kovalonso

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:48

http://www1.folha.uo...ores-vips.shtml

Portuguese:
"Um grupo de torcedores VIPs teve de ser contido por seguranças no final da noite deste domingo para evitar que agredissem o alemão Michael Schumacher. O motivo da ira deles foi a maneira como o piloto da Mercedes fechou Rubens Barrichello contra o muro quando o brasileiro tentava ultrapassá-lo. "

Googled:
A group of fans, VIPs had to be restrained by security guards late on Sunday to prevent assaulted German Michael Schumacher. The reason for their anger was the way the Mercedes driver Rubens Barrichello has closed against the wall when the Brazilian tried to overtake.

A very reliable newsite in Brazil is saying that some VIP Fans were trying to kick Shumy's ass at the padock and that the security had to help Michael to leave the circuit.

Is any other site mentioning that ?

Edited by Kovalonso, 02 August 2010 - 20:50.


#1283 JackTorrance

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:50

His "apology" goes in the way of "if Rubens thinks that I squeezed him unfairly than I apologize for that.
Making clear that according to Michael´s own view there was nothing outrageous in the move.


That reasoning is not a Schumacher exclusive.

Hamilton said exactly the same when he rammed Raikonen out of the Montreal 2008 race:

"IF I ruined Kimis race, THEN I apologise."

What he ment with 'IF'...it baffles me.

Edited by JackTorrance, 02 August 2010 - 20:51.


#1284 JPW

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:52

Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).

Of course they weren't genuine apologies to Rubens and frankly the little whiner doesn't deserve them either, for the whining that is not for his driving. BTW you'll see that Michael's "apologies" still aren't on the English part of his website :lol:

Typical PR thingy, say you understand the stewards + FIA and respect them and a bit of a clever worded thing like "if he felt threatened I'm sorry for that" to Rubens and the outside world.

Case closed, 4 weeks holiday :lol:

#1285 Andy35

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:53

Wow the MS fanboys on this thread have taken a real beating since the incident.

The media gave it to Rubens.
Professional drivers gave it to Rubens
The FIA gave it to Rubens
Mercedes GP gave it to Rubens when they didn't contest the decision.
And finally even Michael, however begrudgingly, gives it to Rubens.


Only some people on forums don't still give it to Rubens. Mind you, forum folk are always right with their mighty keyboards of truth and justice :lol:

Andy




#1286 highdownforce

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:54

http://www1.folha.uo...ores-vips.shtml

Portuguese:
"Um grupo de torcedores VIPs teve de ser contido por seguranças no final da noite deste domingo para evitar que agredissem o alemão Michael Schumacher. O motivo da ira deles foi a maneira como o piloto da Mercedes fechou Rubens Barrichello contra o muro quando o brasileiro tentava ultrapassá-lo. "

Googled:
A group of fans, VIPs had to be restrained by security guards late on Sunday to prevent assaulted German Michael Schumacher. The reason for their anger was the way the Mercedes driver Rubens Barrichello has closed against the wall when the Brazilian tried to overtake.

A very reliable newsite in Brazil is saying that some VIP Fans were trying to kick Shumy's ass at the padock and that the security had to help Michael to leave the circuit.

Is any other site mentioning that ?


VIPs hunting Schummy?! :drunk:

No more info about, other sites are linking it, but just as a reference for the Folha report.
The mentioned article as written by a journalist that was sent to the race, but the piece of 'news' itself doesn't brings more light to it.

Edited by highdownforce, 02 August 2010 - 20:57.


#1287 Diablobb81

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:58

Schumi as a person has never been worthwhile to be hated (no person actually should be hated), yet his actions are despicable. And his half-hearted apologies as well. Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).


Maybe you forgot what you wrote :
"making clear that according to Michael´s own view there was nothing outrageous in the move."

Which basically is a nice distortion of the truth. He admitted that the move was wrong.

You can interpret what he said about Barri how you want. But i expected that.

#1288 Kovalonso

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 20:59

JA readers condemn Schumy.

How do you feel about Schumacher's move on Barrichello?
Outrageous 73% (6,426 votes)
Hard but fair 22% (1,887 votes)
I've no problem with it 5% (459 votes)
Total Votes: 8,772

#1289 JackTorrance

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:04

JA readers condemn Schumy.

How do you feel about Schumacher's move on Barrichello?
Outrageous 73% (6,426 votes)
Hard but fair 22% (1,887 votes)
I've no problem with it 5% (459 votes)
Total Votes: 8,772




I dont think its outrageous, but i also dont think it was fair. Id settle for stupid and unsportsmanlike.

#1290 Sakae

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:10

Could, would, should, might...

Cars didn't touch, Rubena hasn't plaster the wall, and got just scare; so, Michael has appologized that big bad wolf had scared little Rubens.



__________________

Now, back to reality; if RB has anything to say about the past association, he should say it if he has any guts, instead spewing induendos. Why he doesn't, one wonders?

Edited by Sakae, 02 August 2010 - 21:12.


#1291 santori

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:18

Schumi as a person has never been worthwhile to be hated (no person actually should be hated), yet his actions are despicable. And his half-hearted apologies as well. Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).


It seems okay to me. 'I wasn't seeking to endanger him with my move. If he feels I was then I'm sorry, this wasn't my intention' just means that he wasn't actively trying to hurt Rubens, not that he feels that the move was right. I don't think anything snide needs to be read it.

#1292 Kovalonso

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:19

The italian papers - in particular - are slating Schumy very hard.

#1293 prty

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:24

Wow the MS fanboys on this thread have taken a real beating since the incident.

The media gave it to Rubens.
Professional drivers gave it to Rubens
The FIA gave it to Rubens
Mercedes GP gave it to Rubens when they didn't contest the decision.
And finally even Michael, however begrudgingly, gives it to Rubens.


Only some people on forums don't still give it to Rubens. Mind you, forum folk are always right with their mighty keyboards of truth and justice :lol:

Andy



I also give it to Rubens, but talking about more general stuff, if most people say it's A doesn't mean it's necessarily A, I think it's not right for people to use opinions of other people as "weight" for their arguments, if they are right it's not needed.

#1294 libano

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:31

Schumi as a person has never been worthwhile to be hated (no person actually should be hated), yet his actions are despicable. And his half-hearted apologies as well. Towards Rubens his apology was half-hearted, whereas towards the stewards it was seemingly a full apology (guess why).


i can't help but have a certain admiration for your devotion towards hating on MS. hats off. i don't drop by that often but whenever i do you're pounding at it with dedication. i think a mind with such determination could be put to excellent use in the real world. shame you waste yours in cyberspace...

#1295 wrcva

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:38

another view...



#1296 baddog

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:40

I think it was appropriate to apologise. I said to my partner that when Michael saw the video I expected he would be surprised by how close it was. Close enough to be indefensible really. I didnt expect a public apology but it is appropriate.

#1297 Cenotaph

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 21:45

this issue seems blown out of proportion to me. sure, it was a dangerous maneuver, but nothing unlike what we have seen from other drivers, particularly in 2008. Whatever.

#1298 Raelene

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 22:35

Making clear that according to Michael´s own view there was nothing outrageous in the move.


???? how do you get that from this?

MS

the move against him was too hard,"



#1299 Anssi

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 23:11

That reasoning is not a Schumacher exclusive.

Hamilton said exactly the same when he rammed Raikonen out of the Montreal 2008 race:

"IF I ruined Kimis race, THEN I apologise."

What he ment with 'IF'...it baffles me.



Yeah... that made me wonder whether the man is stupid - or that maybe he has narcissistic personality disorder - those kinds of people very rarely admit to mistakes and if you get them to apologise they make it sound like it is just another insult. That's how Lewis' 'apology' came across to me. If that's not what he meant then he needs to choose his words better.

Edited by Anssi, 02 August 2010 - 23:13.


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#1300 snakeking1

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 23:38

Posted Image

Posted Image

Looking at the above two images, it really depends on whether you consider Schumacher:

a) To have incredible spacial awareness
b) To have been utterly reckless


I am impressed when so many people exaggeratted that Schumi's squeezed too far, especially when Rubens says that there is only a hair's space in between, or 2cm between Rubens at the wall. Over-reaction by everyone. :mad: :mad: :mad:

Looking at this image again, it is at least 20cm to 30cm distance to the wall.

So Schumi is right to say that he gave Rubens too much room

Edited by snakeking1, 02 August 2010 - 23:39.