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1:43-scale Moss cars


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#301 Barry Boor

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Posted 15 November 2014 - 18:04

I haven't got it but it looks quite nice in the pictures.

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#302 Mal9444

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Posted 15 November 2014 - 18:17

I haven't got it but it looks quite nice in the pictures.

Indeed, Barry, which is why I'm tempted. On the other hand, we 've had so much trouble with faux Vanwalls and Cooper T51s masquerading as cars in which SCM did this, that or the other thing that I thought it wise to ask. Wheels and exhausts seem to be the big difficulty, not least because The Boy spent so much of his time fiddling with the machinery.



#303 D-Type

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Posted 15 November 2014 - 21:16

I've had a look at the Grand Prix Models and Diecast Legends sites.  Neither lists this particular model but they both speak favourably of True Scale models so I would think this should be OK. 

As Porsche basically lent a works car to Rob Walker, SCM didn't have much opportunity to fiddle with it so a blue painted works car should be accurate.



#304 Mal9444

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Posted 16 November 2014 - 06:51

Ordered. I'll post some pics.



#305 Mal9444

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Posted 18 November 2014 - 14:14

Ordered. I'll post some pics.

Arrived this morning. A very nice little model, beautifuly detailed. I would have posted some pictures but upon so attempting discover that Imageshack (the which I have used, albeit infequently and only ever to post to TNF, for all the time I've been posting) is no longer free and they want my to buy a premium account. So, sorry - no pictures.

 

Incidentally - prices seem to vary widely: £67.99 is the highest I've seen on Amazon with other sellers at £57.99, £55.99, £36.99 and £32.99. I bought mine for £26.99 inc p&p driect from TrueScale using eBay.

 

Moss raced the car in 1960 at varying events with varying degrees of success: this model is numbered for the newly-established non-championship Austrian GP in October '60, which he won.

 

Sorry about the lack of photos.



#306 raceannouncer2003

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 06:43

Postimage should work:

 

http://postimage.org

 

Vince H.



#307 Roger Clark

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 08:28

 

Moss raced the car in 1960 at varying events with varying degrees of success: this model is numbered for the newly-established non-championship Austrian GP in October '60, which he won.

 

 

Also numbered for the Aintree 200?

 

The Austrian race was in September and I don't think it had the Austrian GP title.



#308 D-Type

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 09:36

According to "All My Races" the Porsche sported number 7 in the Lavant Cup, Aintree 200, and the Austrian GP.  The photos don't show the car at all 3 races so it isn't possible to identify it more precisely.  It was also number 7 in the Cape GP and SA GP but the photo shows it was silver there. 

If I can find the time, I'll plough through the Motor Sport DVD for further clues.



#309 Roger Clark

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 14:39

Moss was number 21 in the Lavant Cup.  There are photographs in My Cars, My Career and in Autosport.



#310 D-Type

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 16:46

:o Whoops! Dunno how I misread that! - Maybe because his Cooper was No. 7 in the Glover Trophy.



#311 Mal9444

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 18:14

Postimage should work:

 

http://postimage.org

 

Vince H.

http://s16.postimg.o...18_Austria1.jpg

 

http://s16.postimg.o...18_Austria2.jpg

 

http://s16.postimg.o...18_Austria3.jpg

 

Thanks, Vince. Though I cannot seem to get it to post thumbnails. The first link is the model itself, the next two is it nestling among all those confusing Coopers. I hope!


Edited by Mal9444, 19 November 2014 - 18:19.


#312 Mal9444

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Posted 19 November 2014 - 18:47

According to "All My Races" the Porsche sported number 7 in the Lavant Cup, Aintree 200, and the Austrian GP.  The photos don't show the car at all 3 races so it isn't possible to identify it more precisely.  It was also number 7 in the Cape GP and SA GP but the photo shows it was silver there. 

If I can find the time, I'll plough through the Motor Sport DVD for further clues.

And I wonder why.  As D-type remarked earlier and as recorded in MCMC this was essentially a works car painted blue and entered by Rob Walker for Moss to drive. Although Alf Francis does seem to have fettled it, including swapping the factory gear change for an old 250F gear change because Moss didn't like the Porsche version (and had fluffed a couple of changes because of it) the car, according to AMR, was definitely factory-prepared for Austria (which was indeed in September - 18th to be precise - my careless error).  And presumably for South Africa. All My Races has a photo from SA which shows the car apparently silver (certainly not blue) but it clearly stated R C Walker as entrant in both cases. And of curse, Moss drove works-enterd Porsche sports cars several times.

 

It's intriguing that the Moss/Porsche/Walker arrangement seems to presage precisely the arrangement Moss came to, but never got to fulfil, with Enzo Ferrari just a year later.

 

Anyway - I'm quite pleased with my latest acquisition - the first new purchase for quite some time. A Certain Person well-known to all here has built for me the SMTS kit of the 1961 air-conditioned Lotus 18 the which I have yet to see - but I'm told it will be with me soon. Can't wait and will post a pic or two. I'm sure it will be anything but A Load of Old Rubbish - know what I mean?



#313 Mal9444

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 07:02

I believe I have now cracked putting thumbnails up:

 

60_Porsche_F2_718_Austria1.jpg

 

60_Porsche_F2_718_Austria3.jpg
image upload

 

I'm afraid my faithful Sony Cybershot is, these days, just that: shot. It keeps making funny noises and can't seem to focus properly. Santa has been infomed...



#314 D-Type

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 09:52

That looks a nice model with a lot of detail for 1:43.  :up:



#315 Rob Miller

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Posted 20 November 2014 - 14:39

However, as with most historic racing cars these days, the tires look a little wide.



#316 Mal9444

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Posted 26 December 2014 - 11:51

So. How would you define the Perfect Christmas Pressie? Something you've long wanted but for which you could never justify the self-indulgent expense? If that sounds accurate then Santa and her Little Elf hit the jackpot this year.   Even got it signed.

 

54_Maser250_FAintree1.jpg

 

Careful research, including sending various pictures to the Man Himself to verify colour schemes, configuration and whether or not it should have a Union flag, carried out over several months by Talented Daughter. Not sure with which I am the more impressed: the model (which I have long coveted, as regular readers will know) or the effort put in to make sure they got it exactly right. Which they did. (As 'Er Indoors remarked - 'at those prices it had better be [expletive deleted] right'.)

 

Really very, very chuffed.



#317 Dino246

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Posted 27 December 2014 - 10:25

Wow Malcolm, you've really hit the jackpot this year. That looks marvellous. Pray tell us which firm supplied it. I bought a  Renaissance version quite cheaply a few years back but soon discovered why it was cheap. It was just too difficult for my very limited talents to build. I passed it on to my chum Pat but even he hasn't got very far.

 

Did you get a new camera as well? Can we see more pictures please? :clap:

 

Happy New Year

 

Tony L



#318 Mal9444

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Posted 27 December 2014 - 11:31

Indeed, Tony - and a new camera. Thanks for your email: I'll reply over the weekend. It is an SMTS kit, (the same kit, presumably, as the one you made for me of the '54 Monacco) GP winner made-up by them. Daughter Ellen started the search last October, including contacting your man to check details about badges and decals. Stirling advised her that there should be no Union flag, if I wanted a model of the car as first delivered which is what I was keen on. But if you look at pictures of the car taken at Bordeaux, Silverstone or Aintree - its first three racing venues - it already has a little Union flag, on the bodywork just above the offside suspension opening. Also the nose number should be a black 7 on a white circle. By the time it was at Silverstone in May 1954 it also, if the picture on p146 of All My Races is to be believed, sported the inverted horseshoe and a BRDC badge.

 

This year's Christmas card from S&S is also rather special, don't you think?

 

2014_Christmas_Cardand_Pressie.jpg

 

I am now wondering what to do about the number, the Union flag and the other decals...

 

What I wanted was the car as first delivered. As we know it didn't stay 'that peculiar, sickly shade of Adriatic sea green' for long. 



#319 Jager

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Posted 03 January 2015 - 17:36

Mal, are you aware of the IXO 'Moss' Jaguar MkIV's ? I don't think I've seen these in your pictures.

 

RAC239 - Winner SIlverstone Touring Car 1952 :

 

1937-3744.jpg

 

RAC238 - Winner SIlverstone Touring Car 1953

 

1976-3879.jpg



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#320 Mal9444

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Posted 03 January 2015 - 19:19

Thanks Jager - yes, I've seen them advertised. Still pondering... :up:



#321 Mal9444

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 13:40

Mal, are you aware of the IXO 'Moss' Jaguar MkIV's ? I don't think I've seen these in your pictures.

 

RAC239 - Winner SIlverstone Touring Car 1952 :

 

1937-3744.jpg

 

RAC238 - Winner SIlverstone Touring Car 1953

 

1976-3879.jpg

Anyone bought one of these? Any reactions: good, bad or indifferent? In particular, what is that black line under the bonnet: accurate model maki ng of a bonnet that did not quite fit, or poor manufacture and paintwork? We've seen this car at Goodwood Revival several times and the bonnet looked ok then, IIRC.



#322 Jager

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Posted 05 January 2015 - 06:52

The IXO pictures might just be the preproduction models. Pictures of the actual models on other retail websites shows a better fit and a strip of chrome trim where the black line is.

 

https://ck-modelcars...zoom/132473.jpg



#323 Mal9444

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 14:08

Even more research, and discussion with Keith at SMTS, decided that the definitive configuration for the inaugural Aintree 200, the car's first appearance in Britain and Moss's only win in it when painted green, was as you see below. So I posted it back to Hastings and they turned it round same day - fantastic service. No BRDC badge (according to the photograph at the top of page 100 of My Cars, My Career by one Doug Nye) but definitely Union flag and nose number black out of white.  The bird of prey decal on the original had me baffled, but according to Keith at SMTS Moss had at the time endorsed a comic strip in The Eagle. I used to get the Eagle (Dan Dare, Pilot of the Future, and all that - well, this is The Nostalgia Forum, after all) in 1954 but I must confess I don't remember Stirling Moss being in it.  So here are a few more pics as requested by Tony. Now installed in the collection.

 

 

 

54_Maser250_FAintree02.jpg

 

54_Maser250_FAintree03.jpg

 

54_Maser250_FAintree04.jpg

 

54_Maser250_FAintree05.jpg

 

54_Maser250_FAintree06.jpg

 

15011201.jpg



#324 Mal9444

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 14:10

The IXO pictures might just be the preproduction models. Pictures of the actual models on other retail websites shows a better fit and a strip of chrome trim where the black line is.

 

https://ck-modelcars...zoom/132473.jpg

Thanks Jager. I reckon I'll get one.



#325 E.B.

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 22:03

Thanks Jager. I reckon I'll get one.


I think the chrome strip is fine in those pics anyway, it's just the way the light has (or hasn't) caught it.

#326 Mal9444

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 13:21

Anyone care to identify this one for me?

 

59_Cooper_T51_Lisbon_wrong_number.jpg

 

I have it in my collection but cannot now for the life of me think why I bought it since I already have a #14 for the 1959 Italian GP

 

59_Cooper_T51_Italian_GP.jpg

 

and this:

60_Cooper_T53_P_International_Trophy.jpg

for the 1959 Portugese GP in Lisbon.

 

I now cannot marry the second model (with driver) to any race (even changing the number) that I can see in All My Races.  Is it the corect car (with number changed to #4) for the 1959 Portugese GP in Lisbon and is the #4 I have for Portugal actually a 1960 T53? And if so - what race?



#327 D-Type

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 14:38

Have you looked at the 1961 Intercontinental Formula races?  Maybe the Daily Express Trophy where he drove a T53P carrying #4.

 

Could the rogue #14 be from a southern hemisphere or F2 race?


Edited by D-Type, 20 January 2015 - 14:42.


#328 Barry Boor

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Posted 20 January 2015 - 22:32

Check up the practice session at the Dutch Grand Prix of 1961.

I have a T.53 in Walker colours with #14 on it from that race (in 43rd scale).

Edited by Barry Boor, 20 January 2015 - 22:33.


#329 Roger Clark

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 18:24

The car wearing number 14 with driver doesn't look like a T53 to me.



#330 Barry Boor

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 18:39

Quite correct, Roger. That is the winning T.51 from Monza 1959. I have that one too.

#331 Roger Clark

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Posted 21 January 2015 - 23:24

Sorry, i thought your previous post was suggesting that it was Zandvoort 1961!



#332 Mal9444

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 14:20

So... what you're telling me is

 

59_Cooper_T51_Lisbon_wrong_number.jpg

 

that I have two models of the same car and race?

59_Cooper_T51_Italian_GP.jpg


Edited by Mal9444, 22 January 2015 - 14:22.


#333 Barry Boor

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 14:51

It would appear so but the upper one that you just posted seems to have funny coloured wheels.

I must admit, I mistook your T.53 as being #14 not #4 (didn't look carefully enough) and therefore, the Dutch Grand Prix practice car that I mentioned afore. The T.53 with #4 on it may be a 1961 Intercontinental car but I don't have numbers for those races.

#334 Mal9444

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 15:20

All very confusing. And when I take it out of the cabinet I realise that the #14 with driver is a re-paint, with my own numbers. Must have had something in mind but as you know for reasons various I haven't played with these toys for a couple of years. (In fact, here they are in preparation

130221_3_Coopers.jpg and then completion )

1302243_Coopers_02.jpg

So of course I now cannot remember what race it was that I thought I was modelling. The driverless #14 is definitely the '59 Italian GP and the driverless # 4

600000_Cooper_T51.jpg

I currently have as the '59 Portugese GP.  But this must be a mistake because that started life as a model of Jack Brabham's works 1961 T53.

 

So at least I now know what I've got to do to sort it out.

 

I think. :confused:

 

... edit: I think I was aiming for his 1961 win in the May of that year Silverstone BRDC International Trophy (p 321 of All My Races) "in which I drove the excellent 'Intercontinental' Cooper T53P against one of the best non-championship grids of the season... that included reigning world champion Jack Brabham and future title holders Jim Clark and John Surtees".  Moss won the race, in the wet, a lap ahead of the whole field.

 

So... renumber the with-driver ~14 to #4 for '59 Portugese GP. and re-catalogue the #4 for 1961.

 

Thank you one and all (take a special bow, Duncan Rollo).


Edited by Mal9444, 22 January 2015 - 15:42.


#335 Barry Boor

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Posted 22 January 2015 - 15:42

You can certainly re number one of the T.51s for Portugal and then investigate the 2.5 litre car from 1961.

#336 Roger Clark

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 13:44

Are the mirrors on the number 14 without a driver too far from the windscreen? The 14 with driver doesn't appear to have any mirrors, nor the external water pipe.

#337 Mal9444

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 17:49

Are the mirrors on the number 14 without a driver too far from the windscreen? The 14 with driver doesn't appear to have any mirrors, nor the external water pipe.

Roger: the 14 with driver was originally that commonly seen Chris Bristow car, so almost certainly there will be details wrong - as indeed we all know there are often details wrong on models purportedly of Moss cars by even highly reputable makers. Vide all those 1955 British GP winning W196s with four-spoke steering wheels and red numerals - not to mention Vanwalls by the legion with wrong wheels, nose bands and lord knows what else, 1960 TT Ferrari 250 SWBs with white rouindels and bright orange Maser 450s. So as for the out-of-position mirrors on the driverless #14, which is Biante's version of the '59 Italian GP car, you may well be right.

 

By the way - anyone still needing a model of this car there's a nice one available on eBay - if you're prepared to pay £399 for a Quartzo!

 

http://www.ebay.co.u...00694321545?pt=

 

:lol:



#338 Barry Boor

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 17:51

This seller has to be 'aving a laugh, Shirley!



#339 Mal9444

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Posted 23 January 2015 - 17:57

This seller has to be 'aving a laugh, Shirley!

Well - I certainly had one!

 

Not least because the easiest way to get a signed Stirling Moss model is to send an unsigned Stirling Moss model to the man himself along with a polite note and a sum of money, stamps or postal order sufficient to cover the return postage.



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#340 Jager

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 06:47

Mal, thought you might be interested to know Spark have just released the 1956 Moss /Collins LeMans #8 Aston Martin DB3S that took 2nd place :

 

20-32409.jpg



#341 Mal9444

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 08:31

56_Aston_Martin_DB3_SLM.jpg

 

Thanks Jager. I've had this model (above) for some time. Just taken it out of the cabinet to check the maker - all it says on the base plate is BAMMA, with the two M letters one above the other.  Just Googled BAMMA models - and what comes back has nothing to do with toy cars!!!!

 

Nice Spark model though. Yet again, considering Moss's numerous successes in, especially, the DBR1 one might think there would be more models of those around. Yet the only 1:43rd scale DBR1 that I've ever seen is this somewhat crude version of the '59 Le Mans car

59_DBR1_Le_Mans02.jpg

- which was being presented as that year's Nurburgring winner with the number #1. Completely wrong body. I bought it in error and had to re-number it for Le Mans. These are the only two Moss Astons I've ever seen in 1:43rd.

 

I do have this:

Collins_TT53.jpg

which is Peter Collins' 1954 Dundrod TT winning DB3s. I re-worked and re-numbered it from a different car for my (far from complete) Dundrod collection.



#342 Jager

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Posted 25 January 2015 - 18:07

Mal, is it possible your "Bamma" is actually a "Gamma" ?



#343 Mal9444

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Posted 27 January 2015 - 09:47

Jager - yes, I do believe you are correct.

Gamma_Aston_DB3s.jpg

 

Eyesight ain't what it used to be - along with much else besides.

 

From good ole Wikipedia: "Gama is the acronym for Georg Adam MAngold, who started the company in Fürth in 1882 making tinplate mechanical toys . Most toy production up through World War II and up until the late 1950s was lithographed tinplate..." and much else besides.

 

This is the selection on the Car Model website: http://www.carmodel....rk/gamma-models

 

and this on Grand Prix models  http://www.grandprix...E SEARCH&back=2.

 

Only the one Moss model, it seems, and that out of production. There's a 450s kit from the 1957 Sebring 12hrs, #19, which I assume is Fangio's winning car - Moss drove a 300s and came second, with Harry Schell.


Edited by Mal9444, 27 January 2015 - 09:54.


#344 RCH

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Posted 28 January 2015 - 09:46

Hi Malcolm, I'm sure you've realised it but GAMA and GAMMA are 2 different entities. The one that interests you would be GAMMA an Italian kit manufacturer.



#345 Mal9444

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Posted 31 January 2015 - 06:36

Indeed, Rod: finger trouble. Thanks.



#346 Mal9444

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Posted 03 February 2015 - 21:18

Haven't bought the Jag yet but have just acquired this:

61_Porsche02.jpg

 

61_Porsche03.jpg

 

61_Porsche05.jpg

 

for the princely sum of £14.99 + £5.00p+p on eBay - from Lithuania (!) of all places.

 

Sorry Rod :wave:

 

I know it ain't right - but what's a poor pensioner to do?

 

Porsche RS60 1961 Targa Florio, with Graham Hill. Retired just 5 miles from finish on final lap while leading by 65 seconds. Differential failed.

 

Model by Minichamps


Edited by Mal9444, 03 February 2015 - 21:18.


#347 D-Type

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Posted 03 February 2015 - 22:52

A word of warning.  I was in what used to be Allders in Croydon the other day, now a bunch of independent traders.  One was selling various 1:43 models at discounted prices.  This included the Oxford Monte Carlo Rally Sunbeam Talbot.  Something looked wrong, - no front number plate. So I didn't buy it on the basis I could go back later if I changed my mind.  When I got home I checked and found two on e-pay.  One had the correct plaque and front number plate - and the other didn't.  So, be warned there's some duff ones out there.