56 replies to this topic

[Laffite]

Without high speed corners, Abu Dhabi seems to me another Singapore GP. Maybe a close call between Alonso and Vettel...

Your thoughts..

[Cenotaph]

i just hope mclaren can put themselves in the mix so we have an exciting finale

[Jackmancer]

It's faster then Singapore but has some similarities in the corners.

[Laffite]

i just hope mclaren can put themselves in the mix so we have an exciting finale

Yes, McLaren Fduct can benefit from the two long straight sections.

[TURU]

Yes, McLaren Fduct can benefit from the two long straight sections.

According to Hamilton, their F-Duct is not working anymore so....

[Zakiruz]

As it has been the case the whole season, Red Bulls are obviously fastest no matter what circuit, however I think ferrari will be a little bit closer.

[Ferrari2183]

I don't know which will be the faster car but I'm willing to bet that Alonso will be faster than Webber.

[Flamini]

There are different opinions about Ferrari and Abu Dhabi. Domenicali said before Korea something like "Korea? We don't know, Brazil should be ok, Abu Dhabi? Some doubts". German "Auto Motor und Sport" said that Ferrari are favourites in Abu Dhabi but that was before Spa (and they said also that Ferrari were favourites in Monza and...Spa).

On the other side the level of downforce in Abu Dhabi is high and rated 8/10, source of this:
http://www.racecar-e...-tech-data.html

Edited by Flamini, 07 November 2010 - 20:12.

[primer]

According to Hamilton, their F-Duct is not working anymore so....

Why is that? It seems like a straightforward device, how can it 'stop working'?
Perhaps Lewis meant that their duct is not giving them as big an advantage now as earlier?

[wj_gibson]

There are different opinions about Ferrari and Abu Dhabi. Domenicali said before Korea something like "Korea? We don't know, Brazil should be ok, Abu Dhabi? Some doubts". German "Auto Motor und Sport" said that Ferrari are favourites in Abu Dhabi but that was before Spa (and they said also that Ferrari were favourites in Monza and...Spa).

On the other side the level of downforce in Abu Dhabi is high and rated 8/10 (source of this: http://www.racecar-e....tech-data.html.

There's a good few heavy braking zones in Abu Dhabi and fewer truly fast corners, so they should be OK on that front. I think Ferrari will be closer to RBR than they were in Brazil.

[Clatter]

Yes, McLaren Fduct can benefit from the two long straight sections.

They all have the F-duct so there is no advantage for Mac now.

I don't see the circuit giving any team an advantage, but RB have been the team to beat just about everywhere and don't see that changing for the last race.

[f1fastestlap]

According to Hamilton, their F-Duct is not working anymore so....

Nice spin...

[JackTorrance]

Looks to me a track where Ferrari will be very close if not faster than Red Bull. Long straights, heavy braking areas...typical F10 territory.

[jeze]

And only one fast non-flat corner, and that has a duration of around 10 metres. Alonso could win this on pace.

[Madras]

Alonso just needs to finish third if Webber wins, is that right?

[benedetti]

Alonso just needs to finish third if Webber wins, is that right?

To lose WC yes, to win - 2nd.

Edited by benedetti, 07 November 2010 - 21:00.

[WhiteBlue]

The bulls have the upper hand and Vettel is the fastest man with the best engine. So on paper it should be easy to predict.

[Wouter]

Alonso just needs to finish third if Webber wins, is that right?

No, if Webber wins he needs a second. There are now 8 points between them, 10 points between 1st and 3rd.

Hamilton questioned if his f-duct was working because he felt he could hardly pass backmarkers. His engineer told him it was fine.

[bl-f1]

The bulls have the upper hand and Vettel is the fastest man with the best engine. So on paper it should be easy to predict.

Judging by what I saw today in the last 20 laps I would say that Ferrari should be comparable to RBR. If this proves to be the case my bet is on Alonso to clinch the third.

[RockyRaccoon68]

Abu Dhabi strikes me as somewhat similar to Hockenheim in places and Singapore in places so I'm thinking Ferrari and Red Bull should be pretty even. Interestingly Webber wasn't too good at both these tracks so Alonso might have a chance of beating him on pace alone. I accept that my view im somewhat biased though because this is also what I so badly want to be true!

[Madras]

It's very tough because obviously Vettel is going to let Webber through if they are running 1st and 2nd - he will definitely do this as he wants Red Bull to win the drivers championship.

Therefore Alonso does not have it that easy if Red Bull are fast at this last track. If RB are the fastest car Alonso is screwed unless a RB has a failure or Webber screws up.

However if it is close then Alonso obviously just needs 2nd place behind Webber, or 5th if Webber is 2nd (obviously that would mean someone other than Vettel is 1st!)

[zeph]

Hahahaha, gotta love this guy:

Q: (Ottavio Daviddi - Tuttosport) Fernando, the two guys beside you seem pretty confident of their chances for the title; and you?
FA: Hundred percent. I just need to finish second. It doesn’t matter who wins in Abu Dhabi if I finish second. So the main goal for us is to be on pole on Saturday and to win the race on Sunday. If we cannot do that, because we are not quick enough, we try to be second. With that, the problem is finished.

[inaki]

I was seeing Abu Dhabi's configuration and it is a very interesting circuit for the closing of championship.



Main characteristics:

• Long circuit 5.5 km.
• 2 big "straights"
• Sand on track?
• 21 corners
• Counterclockwise
• 2 fast sections and a "tricky" infield with slow corners just before finish line.
• Tough on brakes

Additionally:
5 very slow corners



and 3 ideal spots for overtaking



By any means, RBR has demonstrated so far to be the best car this year but there are several factors to take into account reflecting about last GP of this season.
Taking about title contenders: Does this circuit specially match or fit better to any of the teams?

• Macca does not have to had a good braking balance at least in Brazil. Last year Lewis abandoned because of brakes.
• Maccas and RBRs are ahead of Ferrari in F-Duct and have more straight speed.
• Ferrari has a narrower possibility to choose fresh engines, but has a good balance and so far looks better in reliability.

Your options and your thoughts.

Best regards

Edited by inaki, 07 November 2010 - 21:55.

[Madras]

Hahahaha, gotta love this guy:

Q: (Ottavio Daviddi - Tuttosport) Fernando, the two guys beside you seem pretty confident of their chances for the title; and you?
FA: Hundred percent. I just need to finish second. It doesn’t matter who wins in Abu Dhabi if I finish second. So the main goal for us is to be on pole on Saturday and to win the race on Sunday. If we cannot do that, because we are not quick enough, we try to be second. With that, the problem is finished.

He's right, good mental attitude really.

[Clatter]

Judging by what I saw today in the last 20 laps I would say that Ferrari should be comparable to RBR. If this proves to be the case my bet is on Alonso to clinch the third.

How can you come to any conclusion about the RB and Ferrari performance based on the last laps? The pitstops were over and RB could control the race, they had performance in hand.

[Nesto]

How can you come to any conclusion about the RB and Ferrari performance based on the last laps? The pitstops were over and RB could control the race, they had performance in hand.

Fernando was on pace with the RBRs but time lost behind Hamilton and Hulkenberg creating an impossible gap to bridge. Once in P3, he neither gained nor lost ground.

[juandiego]

It looks like to have some characteristics of Singapore and Monaco, so perhaps Ferrari could match the Bulls.

Edited by juandiego, 07 November 2010 - 22:48.

[Clatter]

Fernando was on pace with the RBRs but time lost behind Hamilton and Hulkenberg creating an impossible gap to bridge. Once in P3, he neither gained nor lost ground.

He lost time.

[KateLM]

Ferrari have been saying that they are worried about Abu Dhabi for a while now, and I'm not sure why.

On paper its not a typical Red Bull track, but it wasn't last year either and they were still quickest.

[inaki]

Ferrari have been saying that they are worried about Abu Dhabi for a while now, and I'm not sure why.

On paper its not a typical Red Bull track, but it wasn't last year either and they were still quickest.

IMO last year it was totally different. Remember that only Brawn had the double diffuser properly done, so Ferrari and Maccas were out of the equation.

[Ferrari2183]

Ferrari have been saying that they are worried about Abu Dhabi for a while now, and I'm not sure why.

On paper its not a typical Red Bull track, but it wasn't last year either and they were still quickest.

Source please...

[sv401]

Ferrari have been saying that they are worried about Abu Dhabi for a while now, and I'm not sure why.

Could it be because of the engines, rather than the track layout ?

[Tenmantaylor]

It'll be Red Bull with a token Alonso in there somewhere to mop up if they screw up. Low DF, high DF, long straights, short straights, Red Bull are just the fastest there is no other way about it. Newey is a genius.

Edited by Tenmantaylor, 08 November 2010 - 00:11.

[PretentiousBread]

I think it'll be extremely even between Alonso and Vettel. The track should suit the Ferrari, and of course it will suit the Red Bull because it is suited to literally any track bar the anomaly that is Monza. The McLaren f-duct advantage is often overstated, it was a decent advantage at the start of the season, now it's only a very marginal advantage, even at tracks with long straights so I can't see it being enough to elevate them to the front. Hamilton clearly did something special at Abu Dhabi last season, but I think he just unlocked the maximum potential of a car that was sufficiently pointy for the corners and kers enabled for the straights. On top of his already potent kers advantage, he was able to run less wing and maximise his top speed. Although Hamilton did a remarkable job last year, I can't see him being able to repeat it because his machinery just isn't as suited to the track this time round. That said, he should be there or there abouts, but I highly doubt we'll see a repeat of last years domination in qualifying.

[noikeee]

Have you guys not learned yet that Red Bull is the quickest car everywhere now?

With only one mid-speed corner, and a few long straights, Abu Dhabi shouldn't be their favourite track and I expect McLaren and Ferrari to be closer, but wouldn't bet against them.

[PretentiousBread]

Have you guys not learned yet that Red Bull is the quickest car everywhere now?

With only one mid-speed corner, and a few long straights, Abu Dhabi shouldn't be their favourite track and I expect McLaren and Ferrari to be closer, but wouldn't bet against them.

Yes, it's not so much about which track favours who, but rather which tracks give McLaren or Ferrari a chance against Red Bull.

[Seanspeed]

I think this could be a good 3 way battle between all the top teams.

This track looks like Korea, except for less fast corners and fast changes of direction. Alonso was only a couple tenths off the Red Bull in Korea, so it could be a Ferrari track, especially as they'll be bringing the supersoft tires which Ferrari likes.

But Mclaren could be very good, too. The track is smooth, there's some long straights and not a lot of places where they'll lose out massively due to a lack of downforce or anything.

Its gonna be exciting, I think.

[Birelman]

It's very tough because obviously Vettel is going to let Webber through if they are running 1st and 2nd - he will definitely do this as he wants Red Bull to win the drivers championship.

Therefore Alonso does not have it that easy if Red Bull are fast at this last track. If RB are the fastest car Alonso is screwed unless a RB has a failure or Webber screws up.

However if it is close then Alonso obviously just needs 2nd place behind Webber, or 5th if Webber is 2nd (obviously that would mean someone other than Vettel is 1st!)

LOL That would be such a fitting end too this championship!!!! Vettel 1st, Webber, 2nd and Alonso 5th would be a 3 way tie. I'm not sure, but all would have 5 wins? is that right? In that case, what? Poles?, or second places? LOL that would be so fitting to this championship!!!!!!!!

[Cenotaph]

LOL That would be such a fitting end too this championship!!!! Vettel 1st, Webber, 2nd and Alonso 5th would be a 3 way tie. I'm not sure, but all would have 5 wins? is that right? In that case, what? Poles?, or second places? LOL that would be so fitting to this championship!!!!!!!!

i think Vettel would be champion in that scenario, 5 wins vs 4 wins from webber. And he is tied with Alonso in most 1st, 2nd and 3rd places but he has one more 4th place that would give him the title. i checked this in the afternoon but wasnt too thorough, though, so i might be wrong.

where's the AQUA 2010 thread when we need it?

[Birelman]

i think Vettel would be champion in that scenario, 5 wins vs 4 wins from webber. And he is tied with Alonso in most 1st, 2nd and 3rd places but he has one more 4th place that would give him the title. i checked this in the afternoon but wasnt too thorough, though, so i might be wrong.

where's the AQUA 2010 thread when we need it?

I think so too, but in the interview they said he had to beat Alonso by 16 points, so, there may be something we are missing, it could be that Alonso holds that tie breaker advantage

[Cenotaph]

nah, just rechecked both the rules and results.

this how it is atm, according to wikipedia:

alonso 5x 1st, 2x 2nd, 3x 3rd, 2x 4th.
vettel 4x 1st, 2x 2nd, 3x 3rd, 3x 4th.

so if vettel wins and they tie on points, vettel is champion.

[Birelman]

nah, just rechecked both the rules and results.

this how it is atm, according to wikipedia:

alonso 5x 1st, 2x 2nd, 3x 3rd, 2x 4th.
vettel 4x 1st, 2x 2nd, 3x 3rd, 3x 4th.

so if vettel wins and they tie on points, vettel is champion.

Sounds good!!! I'm still worried though, even Alonso is saying he only needs 5th if Seb wins, so, I'm kinda puzzled, I think you're right though, hopefully lol

It might be academic, cus it's unlikely Alonso will be an lower than 3rd if he's still running in the race, everything running normally that is.

[Captain Tightpants]

Could it be because of the engines, rather than the track layout ?

Makes sense. Abu Dhabi has one of the longest straights on the calendar - which then enters a heavy braking zone and goes straight into the second-fastest section of the circuit. And all of that is preceded by the fast first sector. High speed, heavy braking; high speed, heavy braking; high speed, heavy braking - and that's half a lap. Everything else is stop-start, so I think Abu Dhabi coud be a real car-breaker, which doesn't bode well for Ferrari.

It'll be Red Bull with a token Alonso in there somewhere to mop up if they screw up. Low DF, high DF, long straights, short straights, Red Bull are just the fastest there is no other way about it. Newey is a genius.

The Bulls have won on just about every circuit this year that they won on last year; the only real exception I can think of is Shanghai. But they won in Brazil and Japan and Great Britain. And they were strong in Turkey and Hungary and Belgium and Singapore. They took a one-two last year, and since the RB6 plays on the RB5's predecessors, it's going to be their race to lose. The only unknown is Ferrari, who sucked in Abu Dhabi last year.

[Tenmantaylor]

Makes sense. Abu Dhabi has one of the longest straights on the calendar - which then enters a heavy braking zone and goes straight into the second-fastest section of the circuit. And all of that is preceded by the fast first sector. High speed, heavy braking; high speed, heavy braking; high speed, heavy braking - and that's half a lap. Everything else is stop-start, so I think Abu Dhabi coud be a real car-breaker, which doesn't bode well for Ferrari.


The Bulls have won on just about every circuit this year that they won on last year; the only real exception I can think of is Shanghai. But they won in Brazil and Japan and Great Britain. And they were strong in Turkey and Hungary and Belgium and Singapore. They took a one-two last year, and since the RB6 plays on the RB5's predecessors, it's going to be their race to lose. The only unknown is Ferrari, who sucked in Abu Dhabi last year.

Ferrari sucked in Germany last year too...

[Bren]

3 drivers in it, 5 days to go, the wait is going to kill me!

hopefully we see a fantastic race, i really dont mind who is WDC now, i just want to be entertained.

[TURU]

The Bulls have won on just about every circuit this year that they won on last year; the only real exception I can think of is Shanghai. But they won in Brazil and Japan and Great Britain. And they were strong in Turkey and Hungary and Belgium and Singapore. They took a one-two last year, and since the RB6 plays on the RB5's predecessors, it's going to be their race to lose. The only unknown is Ferrari, who sucked in Abu Dhabi last year.

It's not particulary wise to predict who will be strong where, based on last year. Especially when there are some teams that have cars of completely different design philosophy and completely different level of competitiveness to last year's. Or is it ??

It will be between Red Bull and Alonso. If Ferrari can find similiar pace to Singapore, then it might get interesting for Ferrari. Otherwise, Webber will run away with the title. McLaren will be behind Ferrari and RedBull.

[sv401]

Ferrari sucked in Germany last year too...

That is not entirely true, since there was no race in Hockenheim last year, and Ferrari finished on the podium at the other German track. However, a good comparison might be Singapore, which is indeed similar to Abu Dhabi (other than the long straight and hairpins), with the same tyre compounds and even similar air/track temperatures. The results were also similar at these two tracks last year, with Hamilton and Red Bull at the front, and Ferrari out of points.

[Baddoer]

It will be Korea #2. Ferrari very close to Red Bulls but fraction behind.

[One]

If Helmut Marko do nothing stupid to favour Vettel then the most likely outcome is:

1. Webber
2. Vettel
3. Alonso

[King Six]

Although Red Bull took a one-two finish in Abu Dhabi last season, Domenicali doesn't think that is necessarily a good form guide.

"We know that the Red Bull is strong, it was very strong last year, but last year we were in a different scenario, we had stopped development," he said.

Asked if he expected Ferrari to be in better shape in Abu Dhabi than it was in Brazil, he said: "I think so... I hope."

http://www.itv-f1.co...d...35&PO=49635