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Your Top Seven Drivers of 2010 - part IV (final standings)


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Poll: Your Top Seven Drivers (Top Three Drivers in new teams) and Top Three Teams in 2010 (427 member(s) have cast votes)

Please choose a total of seven among the drivers in established teams. In brackets the positions each driver got in our first, second and third poll.

  1. Sebastian Vettel (4/5/7) (317 votes [12.07%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.07%

  2. Fernando Alonso (3/7/2) (304 votes [11.58%])

    Percentage of vote: 11.58%

  3. Mark Webber (9/4/3) (256 votes [9.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.75%

  4. Lewis Hamilton (1/2/3) (333 votes [12.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.68%

  5. Jenson Button (5/3/6) (199 votes [7.58%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.58%

  6. Felipe Massa (7/16/13) (29 votes [1.10%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.10%

  7. Nico Rosberg (6/6/5) (288 votes [10.97%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.97%

  8. Robert Kubica (2/1/1) (336 votes [12.80%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.80%

  9. Michael Schumacher (8/18/15) (47 votes [1.79%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.79%

  10. Rubens Barrichello (13/11/8) (89 votes [3.39%])

    Percentage of vote: 3.39%

  11. Adrian Sutil (10/8/10) (41 votes [1.56%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.56%

  12. Kamui Kobayashi (-/9/9) (179 votes [6.82%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.82%

  13. Vitaly Petrov (12/13/16) (41 votes [1.56%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.56%

  14. Nico HŘlkenberg (18/19/14) (65 votes [2.48%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.48%

  15. Vitantonio Liuzzi (15/17/20) (10 votes [0.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.38%

  16. Sebastien Buemi (18/20/14) (9 votes [0.34%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.34%

  17. Pedro de la Rosa (-/11/-) (14 votes [0.53%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.53%

  18. Nick Heidfeld (-/-/-) (23 votes [0.88%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.88%

  19. Jaime Alguersuari (11/12/12) (46 votes [1.75%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.75%

Please choose a total of three among the drivers in new teams

  1. Heikki Kovalainen (16/10/11) (373 votes [31.96%])

    Percentage of vote: 31.96%

  2. Jarno Trulli (17/-/19) (203 votes [17.40%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.40%

  3. Karun Chandhok (14/15/16) (148 votes [12.68%])

    Percentage of vote: 12.68%

  4. Bruno Senna (-/20/-) (47 votes [4.03%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.03%

  5. Lucas di Grassi (-/-/-) (20 votes [1.71%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.71%

  6. Timo Glock (-/-/-) (251 votes [21.51%])

    Percentage of vote: 21.51%

  7. Sakon Yamamoto (-/-/-) (19 votes [1.63%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.63%

  8. Christian Klien (-/-/-) (106 votes [9.08%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.08%

Please choose your three favourite teams this year - in brackets the positions each team got in our first, second and third poll.

  1. RBR-Renault (-/4/4) (212 votes [17.64%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.64%

  2. McLaren-Mercedes (-/1/2) (229 votes [19.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 19.05%

  3. Ferrari (-/6/3) (157 votes [13.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.06%

  4. Mercedes GP (-/8/7) (84 votes [6.99%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.99%

  5. Renault (-/2/1) (164 votes [13.64%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.64%

  6. Williams-Cosworth (-/5/5) (84 votes [6.99%])

    Percentage of vote: 6.99%

  7. Force India-Mercedes (-/7/7) (34 votes [2.83%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.83%

  8. BMW Sauber-Ferrari (-/9/9) (56 votes [4.66%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.66%

  9. STR-Ferrari (-/12/12) (14 votes [1.16%])

    Percentage of vote: 1.16%

  10. Lotus-Cosworth (-/3/6) (113 votes [9.40%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.40%

  11. HRT-Cosworth (-/10/11) (26 votes [2.16%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.16%

  12. Virgin-Cosworth (-/11/10) (29 votes [2.41%])

    Percentage of vote: 2.41%

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#1 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 19:43

Welcome to the fourth and last part of our 2010 survey: "Who are your Top Seven Drivers of the season".

After some quite interesting and in part surprising surveys I, II and III it will be interesting to see the final outcome.

Who do you rate to be your Top Seven Drivers over the whole season?
Who do you rate to be your Top Three Drivers in the new teams?
Who do you rate to be your Favourite Three Teams this season?

This time, for added convenience and to be able to include all drivers we have three parts in this survey - the drivers in the established teams in the first block, the drivers in the new teams in the second block (please chose a total of seven drivers out of these two groups) as well as the third part for chosing your three favourite teams in 2010.

This way of proceeding is necessitated by the fact that the poll software does not allow for more than 20 entries per poll.
Also, the fact is that in the final WDC standings the drivers in established teams took P1 - P19, the drivers in new teams took P20 - P27 which is a very clear sign that the championship was basically divided into two groups. Sorry that you cannot place Heikki Kovalainen among the Top Seven in that way, although he ran more than respectably this year.

Please be kind enough to outline your choices as well. Enjoy!


For your convenience - here are the links to the first three polls:

http://forums.autosp...w...202010&st=0

http://forums.autosp...w...131555&st=0

http://forums.autosp...mp;hl=Top Seven

What is quite interesting to me is the positions that the drivers gained in the first three polls (in brackets behind the drivers) and the position the drivers gained in the WDC (they are placed in their WDC order).

Clearly Lewis and Robert have the most sympathies amongst the BB members, while there is obviously a smaller number of Vettel fans active around here. Wonder how that changes now that Sebastian is WDC.... :D

Our forumers also did not take kindly to Massa┬┤s and Schumacher┬┤s exploits so far - I am sure at least in the case of Michael it will look a little bit better now at the end of the year. And Rubens seems like a steady currency or even gaining in value throughout the year. Let us see how these trends continue now.

Edited by aditya-now, 22 November 2010 - 00:06.


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#2 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:27

Andrew Bensons (BBC) Top Ten drivers in 2010:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...f1_drivers.html

I pretty much agree on all except Massa, who was weaker. The top three are exactly how they should be. :up:

#3 marcoferrari

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:28

Who is Jaime Alquersari? :wave: I think there is one guy in F1, who s name is Alguersuari... :)

Edited by marcoferrari, 21 November 2010 - 20:30.


#4 Fastcake

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:46

Andrew Bensons (BBC) Top Ten drivers in 2010:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...f1_drivers.html

I pretty much agree on all except Massa, who was weaker. The top three are exactly how they should be. :up:

I know he's got Alonso first without reading that.

As for the poll, the top five should feature in everyone's lists, all race winners and had fantastic moments. Rosberg and Barrichello got my other votes, great seasons and in Ros' case I'm expecting great things if the Mercedes is good.

Kovi and Glock are easily the best of the new team drivers.

#5 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:48

I know he's got Alonso first without reading that.

As for the poll, the top five should feature in everyone's lists, all race winners and had fantastic moments. Rosberg and Barrichello got my other votes, great seasons and in Ros' case I'm expecting great things if the Mercedes is good.

Kovi and Glock are easily the best of the new team drivers.


How did you know Benson had Alonso ahead? Was it me dropping a hint?

Right now we have Alonso and Rosberg leading in this poll, amazing how Nico┬┤s picked up sympathies at the end of the year....

Edited by aditya-now, 22 November 2010 - 00:51.


#6 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:51

Who is Jaime Alquersari? :wave: I think there is one guy in F1, who s name is Alguersuari... :)



Thanks for the hint, Marco!

#7 sosidge

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:54

I know he's got Alonso first without reading that.

As for the poll, the top five should feature in everyone's lists, all race winners and had fantastic moments. Rosberg and Barrichello got my other votes, great seasons and in Ros' case I'm expecting great things if the Mercedes is good.

Kovi and Glock are easily the best of the new team drivers.


I disagree and so does the poll so far. Two of the top five have been significantly less impressive than the other three.

I ended up choosing three of the top five easily, plus two from the midfield, the last two picks for me were tight between about 4 drivers.


#8 Fastcake

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 20:55

How did you know Benson had Alonso ahead? Was it me dropping a hint?

You read his columns much aditya, the guy's one big Alonso fanboy, even him crashing has Benson claiming he's the greatest ever. Not that there's anything wrong with that mind, it's an opinion piece and you can support anyone you want. Just I happen not to like him based on that.

#9 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 21:00

I disagree and so does the poll so far. Two of the top five have been significantly less impressive than the other three.

I ended up choosing three of the top five easily, plus two from the midfield, the last two picks for me were tight between about 4 drivers.


The Top Five being Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel/Rosberg/Kubica makes a lot of sense and is probably reflecting the level of skill. Still I would neither discount Button and Webber, both have their qualities as well. To me it┬┤s Alonso/Hamilton/Vettel and then Button/Webber/Rosberg/Kubica second tier.

Mercedes GP (-/8/7) [ 0 ] [0.00%]

....so far.

From hero to zero it seems. The beautiful Brawn cars turned grey, and their reputation turned awry...
How popular Mercedes Benz seems to be.


#10 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 21:02

You read his columns much aditya, the guy's one big Alonso fanboy, even him crashing has Benson claiming he's the greatest ever. Not that there's anything wrong with that mind, it's an opinion piece and you can support anyone you want. Just I happen not to like him based on that.


Thanks for the answer, I didn┬┤t read his pieces that regularily. I thought I had somehow inadvertently let something slip - or I am being perceived as a notorious Alonso-fanboy! :blush:

#11 scheivlak

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 21:28

Note that we were asked in the earlier poll about our three favourite teams - which is a bit different than the three top teams.

Edited by scheivlak, 21 November 2010 - 21:28.


#12 aditya-now

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Posted 21 November 2010 - 22:40

Note that we were asked in the earlier poll about our three favourite teams - which is a bit different than the three top teams.


"Your" three top teams meaning they are "favourite" teams to you. Sorry for having not been consistent in my wording and thank you for your hint. :up:

Edited by aditya-now, 22 November 2010 - 00:08.


#13 Jackmancer

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 07:39

Heikki taking the biggest lead :)

#14 apoka

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:10

Andrew Bensons (BBC) Top Ten drivers in 2010:

http://www.bbc.co.uk...f1_drivers.html

I pretty much agree on all except Massa, who was weaker. The top three are exactly how they should be. :up:

I do not completely agree, in particular I'd certainly put Rosberg ahead of Button and Webber. How much further you put him up is debatable, but he could well have been best driver of the season in my books. I really hope he will soon get a car capable of winning races. I also would place the top 3 in WDC (Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso) in reverse order compared to Benson, i.e. Vettel first, then Hamilton, then Alonso. However, it's close between them.


#15 thuGG

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 08:54

In no particular order:
Vettel
Alonso
Webber
Hamiton
Button
Rosberg
Kubica

Kovalainen
Glock
Klien

Renault
RBR
Lotus

Edited by thuGG, 22 November 2010 - 08:54.


#16 aditya-now

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 12:47

I do not completely agree, in particular I'd certainly put Rosberg ahead of Button and Webber. How much further you put him up is debatable, but he could well have been best driver of the season in my books. I really hope he will soon get a car capable of winning races. I also would place the top 3 in WDC (Vettel, Hamilton, Alonso) in reverse order compared to Benson, i.e. Vettel first, then Hamilton, then Alonso. However, it's close between them.


Also the majority of the participants in our survey see Rosberg ahead of Webber and Button. In my book Rosberg is certainly 4th behind Alonso, Hamilton and Vettel - so the top three are fine in the order Benson sees them (although I would put Vettel ahead of Hamilton at this time).

Thus my order:

Alonso
Vettel
Hamilton
Rosberg
Button
Webber
Kubica

(to realistically gauge Kubica it would be helpful to have a competitive teammate who is a known quantity - against Heidfeld Kubica was nothing so special, Petrov is hardly a benchmark).


#17 noikeee

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 13:48

Mercedes GP (-/8/7) [ 0 ] [0.00%]

....so far.

From hero to zero it seems. The beautiful Brawn cars turned grey, and their reputation turned awry...
How popular Mercedes Benz seems to be.


They're the new Toyota.

#18 Wheels23

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 14:32

For me in no order:

Fernando Alonso - Its Fernando :p
Mark Webber - Challenging for the title.
Sebastian Vettel - WDC for a reason because he won it fair and square with great performances
Lewis Hamilton - Its Lewis :p
Nico Rosberg - Well because he was solid when it came to results and had podiums
Robert Kubica - Podiums, front Row spots, the best of the rest
Rubens Barrichello - Was in the points a lot after the midseason, since Valencia and still got it.

Heikki Kovalainen - Seemed a lot better as a driver at Lotus than in McLaren
Timo Glock - Always on the pace of the Lotus or close
Sakon Yamamoto - Why? Because he did surprisingly bring the car home and wasn't actually that bad then well he is normally.

Mercedes - Because I always like the big manufacture teams, don't know why.
Lotus - Because they were the best of the new teams
STR - For the Sake of it.

#19 Dunder

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 14:35

In no particular order:

Vettel
Webber
Hamilton
Button
Alonso
Rosberg
Kubica

Kovalainen
Trulli
Glock

McLaren
Williams
Louts

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#20 aditya-now

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Posted 22 November 2010 - 23:49

So the Hamiltonistas are back in force, according to the present state of things in the poll. As this is kind of a sympathy vote I am amazed that he was only third last time and now, after many races of self-inflicted trouble and only one decent race to show for he is back in P1. Is it a compassion vote after all?

Kubica back in 2nd, the two competitors of Abu Dhabi leading the survey....

The WDC in 3rd, his best ranking this season, but understandably so.
Alonso only 4th, surprising considering his great showing the last 7 or so races (especially considering Lewis┬┤showing in the same last 7 or so races - it seems that these two are the obverse and reverse of the same coin - when one is up the other one is down.... :D

Nico deservedly strong in 5th, then Webber and Button...

Still the "right" 7 pilots in the lead, but in a surprising order.

Kobayashi in 8th, gaining a place on Barrichello in 9th. Not bad for a pilot in his 18th (!!!) WDC season. In fact Rubens is "The Legend", in whichever way you want to look at it.

Michael Schumacher in 12th, crawling back after abysmal 18th and 15th in the second and third part of the poll. 12th is were I would place him also tentatively in terms of real strength, so although this is largely a sympathy vote, the positions (H├╝lkenberg 10th, Sutil 11th) are quite adequate of the real balance of powers.

Ironical that we may not see H├╝lkenberg next year in a cockpit.

Heikki and Timo standing out among the new teams, with Jarno third - I wonder how it must feel for these three excellent chaps....

McLaren back in P1, this is an English board, of course. The unconventional RBR gained some sympathies in the end, bringing them into 2nd after P4 throughout the year. Then Renault (which, like Kubica, draws enormous and partly inexplicable sympathies), and finally the Reds, the most traditional team in the sport in P4.

Curious how the standings will evolve from here.

#21 Bonaventura

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 07:39

So the Hamiltonistas are back in force, according to the present state of things in the poll. As this is kind of a sympathy vote I am amazed that he was only third last time and now, after many races of self-inflicted trouble and only one decent race to show for he is back in P1. Is it a compassion vote after all?

Curious how the standings will evolve from here.

If you look at other Boards, other driver votes
other fan opinions
You can see that Lewis Hamilton is very highly rated
it's not only Lewis fans
The most non Lewis supporters rate him directly behind their hero
because he is one of the very best drivers.

#22 undersquare

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 09:58

There's a lot of noise in this poll, because it's not a very good format. Some moderately good drivers would be in everyone's top 7, some top drivers would be deliberately left out by antifans, and some would be raised artificially by fans who only cast one vote.

Still it does show some trends, the main one that as predicted Sebis's wdc has elevated him from nowhere to being among the top guys. We admire success.

And I think he belongs there. I would just like to see him in a less stable car for a season, to be absolutely sure.

#23 Fastcake

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 10:15

There's a lot of noise in this poll, because it's not a very good format. Some moderately good drivers would be in everyone's top 7, some top drivers would be deliberately left out by antifans, and some would be raised artificially by fans who only cast one vote.

Still it does show some trends, the main one that as predicted Sebis's wdc has elevated him from nowhere to being among the top guys. We admire success.

And I think he belongs there. I would just like to see him in a less stable car for a season, to be absolutely sure.

Unfortuately there's no way to stop the raving fans marking their guy up and everyone else down (seriously can't this forum force all seven votes?)

As for Vettel he did rather well in the Toro Rosso, and the Red Bull can't stay top forever.

#24 aditya-now

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 10:43

Unfortuately there's no way to stop the raving fans marking their guy up and everyone else down (seriously can't this forum force all seven votes?)


That┬┤s a weakness of the poll software, indeed. This option (to necessitate seven votes) as well as other options are unfortunately missing (no more than 20 votes in one poll possible).
You can only either have one vote or multiple votes, and we can┬┤t stop someone from voting more than seven times as well.


#25 Gareth

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 10:55

My choices (alphabetical order):

Top Seven Drivers:

First up, the easy decisions: Alonso, Hamilton, Kubica, Vettel
Next up, the guy I think is top 5 material so solidly in here: Button
Last up, the guys on the cusp: Rosberg, Webber

Just missing out: Barrichello, Kobayashi, Sutil.
Missed out because I rated him solely on 2010 rather than the past, or possible future potential: Schumacher

Drivers from new teams:

Glock, Kova and Trulli - all pretty easy choices for me

Teams:

Not really a team fan, TBH. So no easy choices here.

Best of the newcomers: Lotus
The team my favourite driver drives for: McLaren
South Yorkshire's finest: Virgin (a rare sight in Rotherham ... :D )

#26 Dunder

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 13:16

So the Hamiltonistas are back in force, according to the present state of things in the poll. As this is kind of a sympathy vote I am amazed that he was only third last time and now, after many races of self-inflicted trouble and only one decent race to show for he is back in P1. Is it a compassion vote after all?


The way you have set up the poll means that the voting at the top should always be very close. Personally, I fail to see how anyone could exclude any of the top 5 in the voting from their top 7 if the voting was done from a purely objective viewpoint.

"Missing" votes for Alonso, Hamilton or Vettel probably have a lot more to do with posters' personal dislike of those drivers.


#27 aditya-now

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 16:29

The way you have set up the poll means that the voting at the top should always be very close. Personally, I fail to see how anyone could exclude any of the top 5 in the voting from their top 7 if the voting was done from a purely objective viewpoint.

"Missing" votes for Alonso, Hamilton or Vettel probably have a lot more to do with posters' personal dislike of those drivers.


One would think so - how could anyone exclude anyone of the Top 5 or even Top 7 (which was the original inspiration in asking for the Top 7 - Vettel/Alonso/Hamilton/Webber/Button/Rosberg/Kubica seem to be supreme this year). Yet some people go with Koba, some with Jaime, some with Rubens, and they are right, as this vote is called "Your Top Seven Drivers in 2010", not the objectively (does such a thing exist?) best drivers.

Still it makes you wonder when you find an Alonso quite some way behind Kubica in the poll - what scintillating races has Alonso shown this year, what races Robert, with all due respect....
All I can surmise is that Alonso is not as universally beloved here as Lewis, and that Kubica has an amazing amount of sympathy here - I still do not see him a much stronger driver than Nick Heidfeld, at least there is no final prove for it yet.

#28 Dunder

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 16:39


All I can surmise is that Alonso is not as universally beloved here as Lewis
, and that Kubica has an amazing amount of sympathy here - I still do not see him a much stronger driver than Nick Heidfeld, at least there is no final prove for it yet.


Well it is not quite universal.

37 of the 187 voters did not include Hamilton
47 of the 187 voters did not include Alonso.


#29 Les

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 16:43

My Top 7:

1. Vettel - He just wins it by a shade from...
2. Alonso - Then its a close call between Hamilton, Webber and Kubica for the next three places...
3. Webber
4. Kubica
5. Hamilton
6. Button
7. Kobayashi - My reasoning is that he is so exciting so he deserves to be there over the more consistent Rosberg who personally does little to excite me.

To Make it a top 10 I would have:
8. Rosberg
9. Barrichello
10. H├╝lkenberg




#30 ZZei

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 16:47

1.Hamilton
2.Vettel
3.Kubica
4.Alonso
5.Webber
6.Rosberg
7.Button

#31 korzeniow

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 16:51

All I can surmise is that Alonso is not as universally beloved here as Lewis, and that Kubica has an amazing amount of sympathy here - I still do not see him a much stronger driver than Nick Heidfeld, at least there is no final prove for it yet.


Of course it's your personal opinion, but the question of the poll is about top drivers of 2010. In case of Kubica, do you really need to reffer to Heidfeld?

#32 bauss

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 17:08

1. Hamilton
2. Vettel
3. Alonso
4. Kubica, Button, Rosberg
7. Webber


#33 Number62

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 17:29

Ed Straw's top 10 (sorry if i'm repeating)

http://www.racer.com...article/191253/



#34 Fastcake

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 21:21

Well the Kubicists are out in force again, he's currently topping and Renault too are getting a large amounts of votes. Not that he hasn't been a very good driver this year (I sure included him), but ahead of Hamilton, Alonso and Vettel? I don't think so, seriously people, fixing the vote so he gets the top won't make him the best ever.


A lot of people seem to be excluding Webber, I guess it's because of him bottling it in Abu Dhabi, but he's had some fantastic performances this season, I think that's a little harsh. I also wonder whether Chandhok's votes comes from his performances or the fact he's a great commentator/nice guy.



P.S Hope you don't mind me bumping your poll  ;)

#35 bimmeric

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 22:16

Well the Kubicists are out in force again, he's currently topping and Renault too are getting a large amounts of votes. Not that he hasn't been a very good driver this year (I sure included him), but ahead of Hamilton, Alonso and Vettel? I don't think so, seriously people, fixing the vote so he gets the top won't make him the best ever.


A lot of people seem to be excluding Webber, I guess it's because of him bottling it in Abu Dhabi, but he's had some fantastic performances this season, I think that's a little harsh. I also wonder whether Chandhok's votes comes from his performances or the fact he's a great commentator/nice guy.



P.S Hope you don't mind me bumping your poll ;)

Well Kubica is going to do really well in this type of poll, as most people will agree he was in the top 7 drivers this year. If you asked for people to vote for only the driver they thought was best Vettel, Alonso and Hamilton would most likely beat him. Also since he hasn't been in a winning car he doesn't have as many haters as Alonso, Hamilton and Vettel.

#36 aditya-now

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 23:25

Well it is not quite universal.

37 of the 187 voters did not include Hamilton
47 of the 187 voters did not include Alonso.


You are right. At least it shows that no one is regarded as supreme, yet we do not know if everyone gave the seven votes they were asked for or if some gave just one vote (e.g. Jaime Alguersuari). In any case, the poll will be more reliable if and when we get 500+ quotes.

We managed in the first part of The Top Seven, maybe we will manage now again - I am curious how many different posters are frequenting the BB off-season and how many are willing to contribute their vote.


#37 aditya-now

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 23:28

Of course it's your personal opinion, but the question of the poll is about top drivers of 2010. In case of Kubica, do you really need to reffer to Heidfeld?


If I refer to Petrov (it┬┤s 2010, after all) - he is a less known quantity. The proof of the pudding is in the eating. The proof of Kubica will come if and when he gets a teammate of the stature of Alonso, Vettel or Hamilton. Heidfeld and Petrov so far do little to gauge Kubica reliably.

#38 Lights

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Posted 23 November 2010 - 23:30

Vettel
Alonso
Hamilton
Button
Rosberg
Kubica
Barrichello

#39 korzeniow

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 01:27

If I refer to Petrov (it┬┤s 2010, after all) - he is a less known quantity. The proof of the pudding is in the eating. The proof of Kubica will come if and when he gets a teammate of the stature of Alonso, Vettel or Hamilton. Heidfeld and Petrov so far do little to gauge Kubica reliably.


What proof will come? Proof that Kubica is among the best 7 drivers of 2010?

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#40 aditya-now

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 09:00

What proof will come? Proof that Kubica is among the best 7 drivers of 2010?


"the proof will come if and when" means so far it is rather difficult to gauge the relative strength of Kubica. For all we know the 2010 Renault could be a super car. Petrov does not give us a clear picture and does not work as a real measure for Kubica.

Against Heidfeld Kubica was not that extraordinary.

Whether the proof will come or not only time will tell. Vettel has been measured against Webber, Alonso has been measured against Trulli, Fisichella, Hamilton, Massa, Hamilton has been measured against Alonso, Kovalainen and Button, Button has been measured against R.Schumacher, Fisichella, Villeneuve, Barrichello and Hamilton. Webber has been measured against Heidfeld, Coulthard, Vettel, thus we can see with relative certainty where they stand.

Kubica has only been measured against Heidfeld and the unknown quantity Petrov (and some people here deny Kubica being compared against Heidfeld, as "this means nothing about the 2010 Kubica").

So for better or worse, we cannot say just how good Kubica really is. He could be brilliant, he could be very good, he could be just good. He could be a driver more or less in the Heidfeld mode. So far there is no proof unless he is being directly compared in an F1 car against another top pilot.

#41 slideways

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 09:38

Nice work on the poll.

Lotus: 8.82%
Mercedes: 7.17%
Williams: 6.28%
:up:


#42 tghik

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 10:41

Whether the proof will come or not only time will tell. Vettel has been measured against Webber


Hello aditya, just wanted to ask your thoughts on Vettel ?

#43 aditya-now

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 10:52

Hello aditya, just wanted to ask your thoughts on Vettel ?


Proved against Webber in 2010, 5 wins, WDC. Kubica proved against Petrov in 2010, 0 wins.

Yet you have a point: Vettel surely has profited from an excellent car. What would interest me would be a straight comparison Vettel - Kubica or Alonso - Kubica or Hamilton - Kubica. Alas, we probably will never get it.


#44 sosidge

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 11:10

Nice work on the poll.

Lotus: 8.82%
Mercedes: 7.17%
Williams: 6.28%
:up:


Another example of this curious sentimentality about performance on this board.

Lotus are nothing to do with the Lotus of old, yet people choose to believe that they are carrying on the "spirit". The car has barely outperformed the Virgin this year and has been miles off the established teams.

Yet to read this board you would think they were the finest team on the grid with a genius designer and a top geezer at the helm!

Meanwhile, poor old Williams, who have authentic continuity since their heyday and have had a good season in the midfield, are ranked lower.

#45 faaaz

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 12:21

ham and mclaren leading...seriously?
Lets get some non english voters in here! lol

#46 flyer121

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 12:59

ham and mclaren leading...seriously?
Lets get some non english voters in here! lol


They will always lead .. no matter what !
Stopped bothering long ago ...

#47 zawisza

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 17:33

" For all we know the 2010 Renault could be a super car.


Renaults engineers should have known something. :p It was a secret they couldn't tell?

#48 korzeniow

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 17:58

Renaults engineers should have known something. :p It was a secret they couldn't tell?


Forget about engineers, they are meaningless. We need PROOF!

#49 aditya-now

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 18:07

Dear Zawisza, dear Korzeniow

greetings to Warsaw and Krakow, and congratulations on Robert Kubica faring so exellently in this poll. For your information, also I have him among my Top Seven drivers, of course, and I have always liked his style and behaviour a lot, he is "a chip of the old block" as the Brits would say, and has many of the qualities that the classic F1 drivers in the 50s and 60s had.

Nonetheless, so far Robert has proofed himself only against Heidfeld and Petrov, and I would be curious to see where Robert really stands. Would you not also be interested?
It should not have escaped your attention that Petrov was not totally destroyed by other drivers (and Petrov was not so far behind Robert in Abu Dhabi), so either Petrov is quite good (if we assume that Robert is excellent, which I believe), or the Renault is not such a bad car after all.

Cheers, Aditya

#50 robefc

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Posted 24 November 2010 - 18:21

ham and mclaren leading...seriously?
Lets get some non english voters in here! lol


5 drivers with almost nothing between them in the poll...personally I'd have lewis, alonso and vettel pretty much level pegging with kubica just behind and rosberg further back.

But I'm not sure what appears to be so biased about the poll?

I could make a case for hamilton being the leading driver (car probably a bit slower than ferrari overall, points loss from mechanical DNFs more than make up the points gap to alonso in the WDC).

But could also make a case for alonso (recovered from silly mistakes to come within a whisker of winning the WDC with the second fastest (and only marginally quicker than 3rd fastest) car after an ultra consistent second half of the season and thrashed his teammate.

And vettel (best car but lost 3 wins thanks to mechanical issues otherwise would have been out of sight or everyone including his teammate).