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Pre-War sprints and hillclimbs photos


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#51 ratkinso

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 14:16

Found a few more from post-war CAPA - the same meeting, I should think:

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Cheers,

Richard

Edited by ratkinso, 02 December 2010 - 14:56.


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#52 ratkinso

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 15:04

Those are all of the CAPA photos, I'm afraid, but plenty of other stuff to come. This page of the album is labelled Shelsley September 1933 - no other annotation, so all contributions gratefully received:

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Cheers,

Richard

#53 Dutchy

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 15:42

Is the car in the second photo in post 52 the Harker Special?

#54 mgtd

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 15:55

What a great thread. I admit I had to research the meaning of CAPA. Now I'm fully signed up. Keep 'em coming Richard.

Stephen

#55 simonlewisbooks

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 16:02

Isn't that an early incarnation of BLOODY MARY on the right in the lower photo?

#56 ratkinso

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 17:09

From the same page, but not at Shelsley, surely?

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Cheers,

Richard

#57 David McKinney

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 17:41

Isn't that an early incarnation of BLOODY MARY on the right in the lower photo?

I thought so

Sorry the CAPA photos have dried up - loved 'em :up:

#58 Pete Stowe

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 19:58

and some more CAPA images, I presume from North Hill, undated:

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Cheers,

Richard


Not North Hill, but Purton in Gloucestershire which they used around 1947-48; I think this may be 11 July 1948, also that is probably Dick Caesar's Bentley to the side.
Tony Taylor had only just finished his long post-war rebuild of the Caesar Special around this time, so this is perhaps one of the earliest occasions it'd had run since 1939, prior to it's first proper outing at Prescott in September '48.

#59 john medley

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 20:14

Wonderful stuff

The last page of print material mentions the war. Perhaps this was written in September 1939, but its location as presented to us suggests it just as easily could have been exactly one year before, at the time of Neville Chamberlain's visit to Hitler and his " little piece of paper that guaranteed peace for our time"/ postponement of the Donington Grand Prix/ panic in France/ mobilization of French and British armies/ SCH Davis writing in The Autocar " This could be the end of our world as we know it".

Does anyone know?


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#60 Vitesse2

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 20:43

I think we can be certain it's from late 1939 or early 1940, John. Note that "National Service" is capitalized - although the term had been bandied around for a while, the National Service Act did not pass into law until the outbreak of war. Post-war, it came to mean only compulsory military service, but the National Service Act gave the government power to direct civilians aged 18-41 into war-related industries - I doubt very many CAPA members were over 41, which would explain the comment that "few ... will not be engaged in some form of National Service".

#61 Allan Lupton

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Posted 02 December 2010 - 21:27

Is the car in the second photo in post 52 the Harker Special?

VK5610 in the next set is the Harker and looks quite similar - its got twin rears in the domestic garage and singles + wings in the other photo but it's the same car.

#62 john medley

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 02:29

Thanks, V2 (yet again)

#63 RogerFrench

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 04:13

Isn't that an early incarnation of BLOODY MARY on the right in the lower photo?


Just what I was going to say!

This really is a cracking good thread! Lots of Austin Sevens, for a start.

Edited by RogerFrench, 03 December 2010 - 04:16.


#64 Stephen W

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 09:32

From the same page, but not at Shelsley, surely?

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The top photo doesn't look like Shelsley however the other two could well be. The 2nd photo could be in the paddock 'sheds' whilst the third photo could be in the barn adjacent to the startline.

:wave:

#65 Alan Cox

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Posted 03 December 2010 - 09:43

The 2nd photo could be in the paddock 'sheds' whilst the third photo could be in the barn adjacent to the startline.

They look as though they were all taken in the same shed to me, Steve. i.e Left-hand end shed, same proportion to the fascia boarding.

#66 ratkinso

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 16:39

Shelsley again, June 1934 meeting:

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Cheers,

Richard

#67 David McKinney

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 16:50

Top might be Horton's MG
Seocod and bottom might be Rt Hon Earl Howe in the ex-Caracciola Mercedes
Third clearly W W Straight in his 8CM Maserati (FTD in record time)

#68 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 16:57

Second and fourth pictures are Earl Howe in his Mercedes SSK.

Ooohhh!! Gold dust!!! The third is Whitney Straight's Maserati. But that's Dick Seaman driving it! :clap: Picture must have been taken in practice, as Whitney ran with twin rears - according to Motor Sport these special hubs only turned up in time for the last hour of practice.

#69 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 17:07

I'd go with David's id on Horton's offset single-seater MG K3. Motor Sport says he was first away in the 1100cc class, so the number would fit.

#70 monoposto

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 18:06

Second and fourth pictures are Earl Howe in his Mercedes SSK.

Ooohhh!! Gold dust!!! The third is Whitney Straight's Maserati. But that's Dick Seaman driving it! :clap: Picture must have been taken in practice, as Whitney ran with twin rears - according to Motor Sport these special hubs only turned up in time for the last hour of practice.


Dick Seaman ? There is a similar photograph in "Maserati 3011"

It certainly looks like Straight wearing collar and tie and leather flying helmet, but yet to don his goggles. The car carried number 51 to the left of the starting handle for its timed runs, with the number 12 still visible on the radiator from its 4th place finish in the Moroccan GP

#71 Tim Murray

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 18:29

If it is Straight, would he not have been wearing his usual light-coloured crash helmet?

#72 ratkinso

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 19:03

I'm really grateful to you guys for sorting out the who's and what's (or should that be whos and whats - doesn't look right!). The quality of these snaps isn't too good but aren't they sooooo evocative of a different approach to motorsport?

Some rather "in the distance" competiton shots from the same meeting:

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Appears that it has always been a well attended event!

Cheers,

Richard

Edited by ratkinso, 04 December 2010 - 19:04.


#73 monoposto

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 19:05


The photographs of the timed runs certainly show Straight in his usual light coloured helmet.

However, now, the more I look at the leather capped driver the more in doubt I am . . .


#74 Geoff E

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 19:28

The third is Whitney Straight's Maserati.


In the September meeting, the car ran with double rear wheels again and was painted "black and silver".

It was a wet meeting and Straight wore a light helmet with a peak.

Edited by Geoff E, 04 December 2010 - 19:30.


#75 David McKinney

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 20:41

In post 72:

I should recognise the top one
The second is Lord Howe's Mercedes again
The third looks like the White Riley (R Mays)
... and I give up on the others

#76 Vitesse2

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 20:46

If it is Straight, would he not have been wearing his usual light-coloured crash helmet?

He didn't always wear a lid, Tim. But the driver in that picture is demonstrably taller than Whitney Straight - which Dick Seaman certainly was. This picture from 8W shows Straight (in a wind cap) in the same car at Monaco in 1934. Chin level with the steering wheel:

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"Mystery" driver: much taller. Much more upright stance.

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#77 David McKinney

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Posted 04 December 2010 - 20:53

Chin level with the steering wheel

...due to the photographer being lower down :)


#78 fuzzi

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 07:41

From David McKinney:

In post 72:

I should recognise the top one

I think it might be the last version of the Vauxhall-Villiers in Mays's hands

Edited by fuzzi, 05 December 2010 - 07:42.


#79 David McKinney

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 07:50

I see a likeness, but I don't think Mays ran it in 1934, did he?



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#80 Stephen W

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 08:58

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Surely the same car on two different runs on the same day?

:wave:

#81 Geoff E

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 09:11

I see a likeness, but I don't think Mays ran it in 1934, did he?


Mays drove the "White Riley" in the June meeting. In September he had ERAs R1A and R3A.

At the June meeting, Straight's Maserati was "in the American racing colours of blue and white"

#82 Alan Cox

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 09:15

Aside from the two small trees on the inield, the Shelsley Esses look much the same today. A prime candidate for a "Then and Now" shot.

#83 fuzzi

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:00

Steve is right about it being the same car, different runs.

Mays did drive the Villiers on the same day as the White Riley, and set 42.4secs, under the Stuck's long-standing record, but slower than the White Riley (42.2) and Straight (41.4). The give away would also be that Peter Berthon rode with Mays in the Villiers.

The moral is look it up first then make a comment. :drunk:

#84 David McKinney

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 10:17

And well you should

The times you quote are from the Autumn 1933 meeting - we're talking Spring 1934, when Straight's winning time was 40.0 and, now I've looked it up AGAIN, Mays did not run the Vauxhall-Villers

#85 fuzzi

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 11:04

Collapse of Stout party.

:lol: :wave: :rotfl:

Edited by fuzzi, 05 December 2010 - 11:06.


#86 David McKinney

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 12:38

(Sorry)

#87 Patrick Sumner

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 13:07

If only we could find that Waddy had used fibreglass before the war then VSCC special building today would be much easier for many. The body is almost certainly light alloy. (Robert Waddy was known to be a master welder).
[/quote]

I believe you’re correct, he was noted for his welding. We have my father’s film of him in 1939 when he used to come to the house and work in the garage. The clip is titled ‘The Demon Welder’ with Waddy playing up to the camera and then in action gas welding with a fag hanging out of his mouth! My mother reminds me that he was also very keen on jazz and rather turned his nose up at her musical taste. Quite a character and in my view it was guys like him with their lateral thinking that laid the foundations for the post war emergence of the British racing car industry. Lovely photos on this thread.

#88 Eric Dunsdon

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 17:13

Didn't Fuzzi feature front and rear engines, 4 wheel drive and a throttle pedal that when moved sideways could alter the power split between front and rear engines(and therefor wheels)?
If thats true then it's probably no wonder the run was remarked on....

According to my copy of the BRDC Motor Racing 1948-1949 book, Lance Macklin driving Fuzzi finished 2nd in the over 3000cc class at the Stanmer Park sprint meeting in June 1948 behind Dennis Poore's Alfa. From what I read on this thread, Fuzzi seems a most unlikely car for Lance Macklin!.

Edited by Eric Dunsdon, 05 December 2010 - 17:16.


#89 JMH

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Posted 05 December 2010 - 19:32

The first photo in post 66 is indeed Ron Horton in MGK3 Chassis 007. The June 34 meeting is also most probably correct as the car has been upgraded with 34 pattern brakes. The number 1 shown might be a bit of a red herring though as the car carried No1 in that years' Mannin Beg race & didn't remove it in several subsequent events (usually carrying extra numbers, so how confusing must that have been for the time keepers)! It's a photo I have not seen before, Ratkinso; I have sent you a pm as I would love a copy.
JMH

#90 Sharman

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 11:20

No apologies for for bumping a "prime" thread. Looking at the names of the cars entered at North Hill my memory seems to be playing tricks (again!). Salome is a well known Shelsley special but Loki, Piglet and Lazarus all seem to ring bells. I have read about them elsewhere but cannot locate the WHERE. I've Googled till I'm blue in the face but am obvious;y not putting in the right references. Who can help a poor old lost soul?

#91 David McKinney

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 12:35

Wasn't there a CAPA book?

And is it in your library?

#92 Dutchy

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 13:02

Going back to the last photo in post 72 I don't think it is the Vauxhall Villiers. For a start it sits too high and I thought the Villiers always ran twin rear wheels. It looks more like a Bentley to me but admit that I have no evidence top back my assertion.

#93 Sharman

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 14:16

Wasn't there a CAPA book?

And is it in your library?

David
I have never had a CAPA book and what remains of my once comprehensive collection of refererence data can no longer be dignified by the word collection, it is merely dribs and drabs. The rest disappeared in a fit of spite.
John

#94 ratkinso

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 15:58

A few more from Shelsley June 1934 - not too clever, but hopefully of interest:

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Cheers,

Richard

#95 Vitesse2

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 16:10

Right: this one is definitely Whitney Straight, taken in competition - note the twin rears.

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But I still maintain this is Seaman having a run in practice!

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#96 Stephen W

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 16:43

A few more from Shelsley June 1934 - not too clever, but hopefully of interest:

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This area of the course has changed considerably - pity as it really did look wonderful back then.

Keep them coming!

Thanks Richard

#97 ratkinso

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 16:28

This area of the course has changed considerably - pity as it really did look wonderful back then.

Keep them coming!

Thanks Richard


Anything to oblige! There are more Shelsley shots, but these are next, chronologically.

Syston Park March 1935 - any Ids?

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Cheers,

Richard

#98 Ted Walker

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 16:39

Photos 2 and 3 are the Bolster brothers

#99 David McKinney

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 17:32

Beta me to it, Ted :)

Top one's somebody's Aston Martin, and the bottom looks like an MG Montlhéry Midget front on something else

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#100 Vitesse2

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 18:16

Top one's somebody's Aston Martin, and the bottom looks like an MG Montlhéry Midget front on something else

No idea on the Aston, but the fourth picture is Guy Campbell's Scuderia Joysticks Amilcar.