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Bathurst & Phillip Island race dates 1960-1990


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#51 austmcreg

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 08:06

On the other hand, the title of the thread mentions Phillip Island also...

The strand of the race certainly includes the Phillip Island events, it moved to Bathurst at a time when the ARDC were searching for something different for their October meeting (in my opinion, the ARDC had begun their loss of direction by this time) and hence it carried on from there.

I dont think it is well known, but Bathurst was not the first choice for this race after it became obvious that Phillip Island was not going to be feasible for the long haul. Armstrong offered the race to Longford first, but the LMRA had to decline becasue they would not have been able to stop trains for long enough to run a race of this length. The railway bypass they had been planning was not built for various (mainly financial) reasons associated with land lease costs.

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#52 Ray Bell

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 08:26

What a wonderful addition, Rob...

And further evidence that your knowledge of Longford far supasses that of Barry Green.

#53 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 09:19

...........except the track lay dormant during 6 years of "hostilities" of a more dangerous nature....
and "proper racing" ceased in 1973 !

..add to that,the real charm of the Great Race disappeared in 1973 when post-factory modifying
became legal,and the drift away from your car racing your neighbour's car began,and was complete
when V8 Supercars arrived. Sad.

While to a degree I agree with your sentiments really the 73-78 was very good racing. After that not quite so good as everyone wanted freedoms so they could win,,, and then most did not eg Nissan Mazda etc. GpA sorry, boring full of cheating Euro prams and Thupercar, started ok but is now just a rich boys wankers race!! In cars that bear no resemblance to their road going namesakes

#54 racer69

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 09:31

There has been a lot more races than that. The Easter meeting for bikes, the various Production Car events.
The history for Touring Car Events really follows the 'accepted' events. So just because of a date change the 2 litre race is not accepted as such. History yes but not part of the ever changing continuity of events.


Jim Richards is commonly referred to, even by the V8 players, as a 7 time 'Great Race' winner, therefore including the 2-litre race in 1998.

V8Supercars are using the term "Celebrating 50 years of the race" (on their website anyway) as opposed to calling it the "50th race". I can see the point in that, though i personally don't consider the current 1000 to be the 'same' race as the preceeding ARDC examples (just my opinion though)


* I wonder, in fact, whether the NRL Grand Final would be held on the October long weekend if the Bathurst date hadn't changed.


I wouldn't have thought so (although seeing as the NRL grand final moved to nights, perhaps NRL/Ch9 would have still given it a go)

The Channel 7/Advantage International event at Bathurst was scrapped after 1999, and the October long weekend was the final weekend of the Sydney Olympics in 2000, which made it a no-go zone for any big event (Advantage had originally announced their Bathurst event would have been October 22 2000 before they scrapped it), so the weekend was 'available' for 2001.

The NRL swooped in on that date so they could play their final on the Sunday night of the long weekend from 2001 onwards. V8Supercars changed their date for Bathurst to the week after the Labour Day holiday from 2001 onwards as well, so they possibly wanted that date but presumebly the NRL announced their plans earlier

#55 Ray Bell

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 10:17

So there you are saying that this is what happened...

It was only after the 1000 'deserted' the date that the NRL was able to move on it. They could have done it, of course, but would surely have lost some recognition for their event after many Australians had spent a full day in front of the box watching Bathurst and consuming slabs.

#56 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 11:56

Jim Richards is commonly referred to, even by the V8 players, as a 7 time 'Great Race' winner, therefore including the 2-litre race in 1998.

V8Supercars are using the term "Celebrating 50 years of the race" (on their website anyway) as opposed to calling it the "50th race". I can see the point in that, though i personally don't consider the current 1000 to be the 'same' race as the preceeding ARDC examples (just my opinion though)




I wouldn't have thought so (although seeing as the NRL grand final moved to nights, perhaps NRL/Ch9 would have still given it a go)

The Channel 7/Advantage International event at Bathurst was scrapped after 1999, and the October long weekend was the final weekend of the Sydney Olympics in 2000, which made it a no-go zone for any big event (Advantage had originally announced their Bathurst event would have been October 22 2000 before they scrapped it), so the weekend was 'available' for 2001.

The NRL swooped in on that date so they could play their final on the Sunday night of the long weekend from 2001 onwards. V8Supercars changed their date for Bathurst to the week after the Labour Day holiday from 2001 onwards as well, so they possibly wanted that date but presumebly the NRL announced their plans earlier

Jim Richards won the 2 litre race? That was Steve wasnt it. And JR crashed with one of his other wins. Not a popular win by any means as I and thousands of others believe he should have been disqualified for crashing under yellows.That he caused!

Edited by Lee Nicolle, 05 July 2012 - 11:58.


#57 Tim Murray

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 12:15

In 1998 Jim Richards won the 2-litre race with Rickard Rydell in a Volvo S40. Steve Richards won the V8 race with Jason Bright in a Falcon.

#58 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 12:24

In 1998 Jim Richards won the 2-litre race with Rickard Rydell in a Volvo S40. Steve Richards won the V8 race with Jason Bright in a Falcon.

It was not very memorable,I did not watch any after the first. By then I was getting annoyed with the whole deal.

Though on those stats Brocky won ten. The Easter race in the Sports Sedan monaro against the rest. It was a bit more entertaining and more cars started, yet alone finished the race.

#59 brucemoxon

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 21:04

It was not very memorable,I did not watch any after the first. By then I was getting annoyed with the whole deal.

Though on those stats Brocky won ten. The Easter race in the Sports Sedan monaro against the rest. It was a bit more entertaining and more cars started, yet alone finished the race.


Did you mean the 24 Hour? That wasn't Easter; it was November.


"And JR crashed with one of his other wins. Not a popular win by any means as I and thousands of others believe he should have been disqualified for crashing under yellows.That he caused!"

He didn't 'cause' the yellows - they were everywhere and Jim was one of many caught by the downpour. It's only thought a contentious win by those who don't read the rules.




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#60 GMACKIE

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 21:48

Next year [October, 2013] will be 50 years since the first 'big' race at Bathurst. Perhaps there could be a 'parade' of cars and drivers from 1963?

Not sure how many drivers are still around, but it wouldn't be too hard for me to get hold of an Alabaster Beetle, like the one I drove in '63........if I'm still on the 'right side of the turf'.

For goodness sake, there's no need to start WW 3. All I was wondering was if there would be any event NEXT year to celebrate the 50th anniversary.

The V8 mob have got it wrong, calling THIS year [2012] an "Anniversary". The Bathurst Motor Festival is more like it [Easter, 2013], and as John Medley points out, it will be the 75th anniversary of racing at Mount Panorama. It will also [from a personal point of view] be my 50th anniversary, as Easter, 1963 was my first race at Bathurst. Somehow I'll be having a drive there, all being well.

P.S........Sorry about stuffing up this thread.


#61 wagons46

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Posted 05 July 2012 - 22:35


As long as it is clear that 50 Bathurst 'Great Races' (the real ones) will be achieved this year and that 50 years of the race next year, the 51st race.

I guess it depends on what is more significant.....50 races or 50 years.

Pity they didn't do something after 25 races/years, because that was about the end of the best races.



#62 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 03:57

Originally posted by Lee Nicolle
.....And JR crashed with one of his other wins. Not a popular win by any means as I and thousands of others believe he should have been disqualified for crashing under yellows. That he caused!


You have got to be kidding, Lee!

As Bruce points out, he wasn't the first to crash, he wasn't the only one to crash and the rules say that the race was over before he crashed.

It's all there in the rulebook, I'd have thought you'd be familiar with it...

#63 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 04:50

You have got to be kidding, Lee!

As Bruce points out, he wasn't the first to crash, he wasn't the only one to crash and the rules say that the race was over before he crashed.

It's all there in the rulebook, I'd have thought you'd be familiar with it...

JR crashed, caused double yellows. Than continued on 3 wheels at a great speed and crashed again,, under double yellows. As did the Bargwarna Toyota. Causing the red flag.
The first accident was bad luck, the second race stopping incident was dumb driving. Yes the race may have been pacecar controlled until the rain stopped but these heros over drove and crashed under double yellows.
Ray, any thinking competitor will tell you the same. Do that at a normal race meeting and you would be excluded from the results and fined. Quite correctly,
In fact driving like an idiot on 3 wheels would get you excluded and fined. And really any competitor driving on 3 wheels should be black flagged at any time. Or even with a flat tyre. Unless you are driving very slowly well off the racing line. You are a danger to yourself, fellow competitors and the spectators, crews and officials.

#64 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 05:21

Did you mean the 24 Hour? That wasn't Easter; it was November.


"And JR crashed with one of his other wins. Not a popular win by any means as I and thousands of others believe he should have been disqualified for crashing under yellows.That he caused!"

He didn't 'cause' the yellows - they were everywhere and Jim was one of many caught by the downpour. It's only thought a contentious win by those who don't read the rules.




Bruce Moxon

Bruce, Richards crashed first at the top, then drove 11/10ths on 3 wheels and joined the accident under double yellows at Forest Elbow. That is end of story.

#65 275 GTB-4

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 06:44

Bruce, Richards crashed first at the top, then drove 11/10ths on 3 wheels and joined the accident under double yellows at Forest Elbow. That is end of story.


AFAIR Jums 3 wheel accident was well after the elbow...and not at 11 Tenths...at a nice controlled pace until he came across the kerfuffle around BG19.2 (so 200m from the Elbow)...


Edited by 275 GTB-4, 06 July 2012 - 07:46.


#66 Catalina Park

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 07:58

When Jim was returning to the pits on three wheels I said to my brother "The smart thing for Jim to do is park it sideways across the elbow and block the track so they throw out the red flag."
When he made it around the elbow I though he had lost his chance, but then came the kink...

#67 GeoffR

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:16

So where did Richards hit the wall in the first instance (I did watch the entire race but it was a long time ago)?

Looking at that Youtube footage the race would have been red flagged anyway given the 3 cars already 'parked' at the Elbow and one at least partially on the racing line.

#68 Catalina Park

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:20

He hit the wall at the cutting. As usual despite having 50 cameras around the circuit Channel 7 missed the first impact.

#69 GeoffR

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 09:51

OK & thanks, that explains it. I can remember seeing him sledge across the top of the mountain on 3 wheels but not the impact that caused it.

#70 david5

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Posted 06 July 2012 - 13:17

The 2-litre events cannot, in my opinion, be counted. They were an aberration in the lineage of races and the cause of the 'traditional' event losing its 'traditional' date.*


Ray I find this an interesting comment. Channel 7 & the ARDC made the decision for the race to be for 2 litre race cars. Channel 10 & Mr Cochrane were responsible for the V8 race at the alternate date. The fact that the 2 litre series never took off was the factor in the long weekend date becoming vacant.

#71 275 GTB-4

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Posted 07 July 2012 - 07:34

When Jim was returning to the pits on three wheels I said to my brother "The smart thing for Jim to do is park it sideways across the elbow and block the track so they throw out the red flag."


Easy enough in a Quey Mike....not so much in a three-wheeling Godzilla!! ;)

#72 Ray Bell

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Posted 08 July 2012 - 14:50

Originally posted by Lee Nicolle
Bruce, Richards crashed first at the top, then drove 11/10ths on 3 wheels and joined the accident under double yellows at Forest Elbow. That is end of story.


There were three cars crashed at the kink before Jim arrived there... I'd imagine each of them were intact before they went off the road...

How someone who has been involved in racing could suggest that Jim was driving at "11/10ths" is beyond me. He didn't know what damage he had done or he surely would have parked it, so he had done the hard part of the half a lap before he hit the torrent of water that put him into the other cars, until that time he was driving within his capabilities.

And the whole tone of your posts suggests that you're among those Jim was responding to that day.

#73 Hank the Deuce

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 01:01

I had thought that Richo's initial hit was at the right-hander above the Cutting - where Cecotto had bored in in the wet in 1987, where KB had rolled the Camaro in 1982 when the nearside rear wheel broke, past where Johnson hit The Rock. He was crawling back from that, reporting via two-way that he'd be in with a "flat" (although the team, watching the monitors, knew the car was finished), he was on slicks, and I had also thought that the reds were already out when he went off below Forrest's. He was barely moving 20 klicks or so I guess, but the torrent of water washing across the apex of Forrest's Elbow and down the hill, is what took the car off... the footage shows it slew on the water, and it more-or-less washes it down into the wall, along which it slides into the rest of the garbage...

IIRC there were some irregularities in some of the final placings - some had been taken from two laps previous IIRC, but according to the rules, Richards had led the lap prior to the reds being displayed, and was therefore the rightfully-declared winner.

For my two bob, I think the thing that people found least-digestible about the whole thing was that the winning vehicle - one which had polarised popular opinion over its "true" eligibility and worth as a Group A touring car since its introduction two years prior - was a sodden wreck, and there was a folk-hero in an older homologation special (which by that stage was a lot more palatable to the punters than the R32) who was poised to take the win should the result have been able to be validly disputed...

...never mind that if the race had not been flagged, there was a second R32 handily placed to possibly take the honours anyway...

The whole public reaction - for mine anyway - was a product of the domination of the Gibson Skylines... and the apparent arrogance with which they conducted themselves throughout that time... their up-and-comer, Mark Skaife, was described by Ray's second-best friend Wayne Webster (tongue in cheek, Ray) as a guy who polarises popular opinion - "some people hate him... others REALLY hate him..." and the team's oft-stated position was that they were doing nothing more than the best job they could do, and it was up to the rest of them to lift their game... and then continued celebrating win after win...

The GTR's levels of sophistication were something that CAMS were ill-equipped to deal with... Fred Gibson recalls CAMS consulting him over how to cut some of their advantage, due to GMS knowing much more about the cars than CAMS, and anything that Fred conceded had already been considered with regard as to overcoming the resulting handicap... and that they did so after being weighted out to nearly 1700kg - a good 400-odd kilos more than anything else there - showed that it wasn't too hard for them to do...

They were the most-professional team, with arguably the best budget, with the best homologation package, with - again arguably - the best contemporary driver line-up of the time. No more, no less. But that made them Tall Poppies, too.

That the following year's change to the basis of the "SuperCircus", with fundamentally a silhouette category was received so warmly, is a measure of just how irrelevant the punters thought Group A had become...

Edited by Hank the Deuce, 10 July 2012 - 01:05.


#74 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:18

What you haven't included there is the reason for much of the 'polarisation' of the crowd...

Mike Raymond was right into giving these people and cars names to suit the occasion, to stirring the pot like it was boiling. He did a lot of harm to our sport.

#75 Hank the Deuce

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:39

true, Ray, and in that respect, his jingoism in the evolution of the category was little different to that shown by the commentary team during the 1987 event. The podium crowd there was marginally-less hysterical that the one in 1992, but at least they didn't throw cans in '87...

To my mind, it seems that touring cars have been predominantly marketed in such a way as to merely gather as much attention from the less-"informed" populus as possible, as the more "racing"-oriented punter would be more likely to enjoy a club day at Lakeside where there was nothing more "virile" or gutsy than a stack of Clubmans and 2C's, than to shell out the cabbage to get into Queensland Raceway to see the rortier tin-tops... well, for mine, that day at Lakeside wins hands-down anyway....

While the anoraks et al will ever remain the minority, it does bring twinges of pain to see what is thrust forward as our premier domestic form of motor sport. While I don't mind watching Craig Lowndes or Shane Van Gisbergan letting the cars flow a little, the whole premise that the pit strategies are now the most exciting part of the event says all that there is to say about current affairs in domestic top-grade racing...

...but we digress...

Edited by Hank the Deuce, 10 July 2012 - 03:43.


#76 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:42

There were three cars crashed at the kink before Jim arrived there... I'd imagine each of them were intact before they went off the road...

How someone who has been involved in racing could suggest that Jim was driving at "11/10ths" is beyond me. He didn't know what damage he had done or he surely would have parked it, so he had done the hard part of the half a lap before he hit the torrent of water that put him into the other cars, until that time he was driving within his capabilities.

And the whole tone of your posts suggests that you're among those Jim was responding to that day.

Ray, Richards had already crashed at the cutting. And continued at a great pace on 3 wheels in bad conditions then crashed under waved[double] yellows at the kink. Yellows mean danger, DRIVE to the conditions. As the TV showed he was on a mission to get back to the pits at a great pace.
As I have said before the first crash was bad luck but the second was inexcusable. That is why the crowd gave him the just reception. And he should have been excluded.
His performance on the rostrum after was really 'bringing the sport into disrepute'
Others have had suspensions and fines for far less. Before and after.

#77 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:51

true, Ray, and in that respect, his jingoism in the evolution of the category was little different to that shown by the commentary team during the 1987 event. The podium crowd there was marginally-less hysterical that the one in 1992, but at least they didn't throw cans in '87...

To my mind, it seems that touring cars have been predominantly marketed in such a way as to merely gather as much attention from the less-"informed" populus as possible, as the more "racing"-oriented punter would be more likely to enjoy a club day at Lakeside where there was nothing more "virile" or gutsy than a stack of Clubmans and 2C's, than to shell out the cabbage to get into Queensland Raceway to see the rortier tin-tops... well, for mine, that day at Lakeside wins hands-down anyway....

While the anoraks et al will ever remain the minority, it does bring twinges of pain to see what is thrust forward as our premier domestic form of motor sport. While I don't mind watching Craig Lowndes or Shane Van Gisbergan letting the cars flow a little, the whole premise that the pit strategies are now the most exciting part of the event says all that there is to say about current affairs in domestic top-grade racing...

...but we digress...

It is now a high speed demo derby, you are given negative points when you do not hit something per lap. I watched townsville Saturday but I found catching up on some jobs more interesting Sunday. The only time I looked in there was a pacecar.

#78 Ray Bell

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:51

I'm afraid you've got a jaundiced eye over all of this, Lee..

I think Jim showed remarkable restraint under the circumstances. And I don't think his pace was as great as you contend.

#79 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 07:19

I'm afraid you've got a jaundiced eye over all of this, Lee..

I think Jim showed remarkable restraint under the circumstances. And I don't think his pace was as great as you contend.

having talked to officials at the event, watched it live on TV there is no doubt. He had an accident he did not need too. That and the Bargwarnas causes the red.
As Michael [Catalina] said parking it sideways was in his interest. But crashing was in no ones.
That and Todd Kelley crashing in NZ 5 years or so ago while driving race pace under a yellow.He ran into the back of someone,, under safety car as he had to catch up ground lost racing. That was equally dumb an totally inexusable.

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#80 DanTra2858

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 03:13

having talked to officials at the event, watched it live on TV there is no doubt. He had an accident he did not need too. That and the Bargwarnas causes the red.
As Michael [Catalina] said parking it sideways was in his interest. But crashing was in no ones.
That and Todd Kelley crashing in NZ 5 years or so ago while driving race pace under a yellow.He ran into the back of someone,, under safety car as he had to catch up ground lost racing. That was equally dumb an totally inexusable.


We all have moments during our life on the track, did you not have any or are only the name drivers allowed to be talked about, I am sure they have more skill than both you & I.

#81 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 10:39

We all have moments during our life on the track, did you not have any or are only the name drivers allowed to be talked about, I am sure they have more skill than both you & I.

Every competitor has had moments and crashes.
But not brain fade stupidity, though I have witnessed it from others and been to the stewards hearings.As a witness. But that was for passing under yellows, not crashing!

#82 Ray Bell

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 11:44

So did he pass under yellows or did he crash when caught out on cold slicks by the run-off of a sudden downpour?

I'd suspect he wasn't going very fast at all when he got into that slide that took the car into the other crashed cars. And note that he followed the same path as those cars into the wall... could there be a reason for that?

#83 brucemoxon

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 00:56

I'd suspect he wasn't going very fast at all when he got into that slide that took the car into the other crashed cars. And note that he followed the same path as those cars into the wall... could there be a reason for that?



The laws of physics. Inertia - the car was moving in a given direction and friction was drastically reduced, so it moved in a straight line, having ceased to be otherwise acted upon. Until he started hitting stuff.

And gravity - the wall was downhill.

It was over 20 years ago; can't we move on? Check the official results.



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#84 GMACKIE

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 02:45

It was over 20 years ago; can't we move on? Check the official results.

Bruce Moxon

Marvelous idea, Bruce. :up:


#85 Ray Bell

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 10:05

The name of a top driver and a gentleman among competitors is being besmirched here...

I don't think we should allow that to happen.

#86 Falcadore

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 23:41

On the other hand, the title of the thread mentions Phillip Island also...

The strand of the race certainly includes the Phillip Island events, it moved to Bathurst at a time when the ARDC were searching for something different for their October meeting (in my opinion, the ARDC had begun their loss of direction by this time) and hence it carried on from there.

Let's not also forget that it was probably someone like Mike Raymond who gave the event the 'Great Race' title, it's totally meaningless but enables one to escape the ever-increasing number of sponsors' names that have been applied to it over the years.

The 2-litre events cannot, in my opinion, be counted. They were an aberration in the lineage of races and the cause of the 'traditional' event losing its 'traditional' date.*

So what do we have? The 52nd Anniversary of the race this year, the 53rd running of the event this year.



* I wonder, in fact, whether the NRL Grand Final would be held on the October long weekend if the Bathurst date hadn't changed.


Couple of things here Ray. While you might not like the Super Touring events, they are recognised by the current race organisers. Recently the V8 Supercar website in recounting the 50 greatest moments in its history, highlighted the Nissan vs Volvo duel in 1998. And it should be celebrated. In my opinion it is the hardest fought two car battle for the win in the races history. The two cars were never seperated by more than 30 seconds apart from pitstops and most of the time was under ten. Rydell vs Neal and father vs son in the Richards clan.

Secondly the NRL grand final first alterred its date because of the Sydney 2000 Olympics, not because Bathurst left the weekend vacant. The 2000 October long weeknd fell during the Olympics with the closing ceremony being held on October 1. So Bathurst would have had to have moved anyway. In 2001 when service returned to normal, the NRL final fell on the long weekend by accident as September Sunday fell on the long weekend as happens on odd occasion and coupled with Channel 9 insisting on the Grand Final being held at night caused the NRL to fall in love with the long weekend with the holiday Monday suiting the NRL for its crowd to be able to sleep it off before work on Tuesday. At the time V8 Supercar organisers were not all that fussed when the dates fell except they had a high profile link with Champ Car at Surfers Paradise on October 27. The 'Insert Circuit Here' 500 was being held as early as August at this point with another round placed in between the 500 and Bathurst. Sandown had been moved to December to be used as the season finale. V8 Supercar did not rediscover their love of the long weekend in time to save it.

I do remember being at the V8 Bathurst in 1997 and being asked to sign multiple-petitions to return the race to the long weekend to receive puzzled expressions when I asked who they were going to send the petitions to.

It was a very messy and petty time. One of several spikes of ugliness occured around the somewhat cynical creation of the Future Touring Car class so that Channel 7 could claim V8 cars racing on the long weekend 1000 race in 1999, only to see one of the major manufacturers get into the courts in order to prevent Future Touring from putting certain types of spoilers and wings on cars intending to enter this race.

For the ugliness of the fight at the time, it is quite refreshing to see V8 Supercar is now embracing the history.

A slight sideways point - the 1962 Bathurst race was won by a Daimler and featured Triumph TRs, Healey Sprites, MGAs. What we would call a GT race today. Yes I know, the Mazda RX-7 (amongst one or two others) is a problem in stating it's been purely a touring car race.

Edited by Falcadore, 17 September 2012 - 09:09.


#87 Falcadore

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Posted 11 September 2012 - 23:51

they have chosen to celebrate 50 races, correctly, this year 2012, whether we like it or not


No they have not. Because I have cause to speak to people within on many occasions I can confirm for you that it is very specifically 50 YEARS, not 50 races. They have been careful with the wording for the obvious reason. This was done mainly to sidestep debate on just how many races have been held, but also so they can embrace all of history rather than be selective.

It would be an uncomfortable situation for a football newspaper writer to ask Jim Richards about his six wins only to be told, no, I've won seven.

#88 275 GTB-4

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 10:17

For goodness sake, there's no need to start WW 3.

P.S........Sorry about stuffing up this thread.


How can we help Greg?? Ezyout? Stock and Die? straight fluted reamer!! LOL :wave:


#89 GMACKIE

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Posted 15 September 2012 - 20:52

How can we help Greg?? Ezyout? Stock and Die? straight fluted reamer!! LOL :wave:

Now look here Fred, don't be a BSF.....or even a BSP. How much is your wit worth? NF much. :lol: :wave:


#90 275 GTB-4

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 01:01

Now look here Fred, don't be a BSF.....or even a BSP. How much is your wit worth? NF much. :lol: :wave:


OK..I give up...we have a winner....Greg's wit is at least half as better then mine! :lol:


#91 Ray Bell

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Posted 16 September 2012 - 19:53

Yes, that's right...

We declared that a 'no contest!' a long time ago.