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Official Group Lotus Thread


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#1 alecc

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:10

Hi everyone! :wave:

So there is the Lotus Renault GP 2011 thread, where we should talk about the "Lotus Renault GP" F1 team, that starts the new season in a few days. Great thread for me, since I'm a Kubica fan, and a fan of the Enstone based team.

Unfortunately on this thread, the most posts are pretty offtopic, and about name issues, "the lotus mess" with Tonys team, lotus road cars and so on. I'm not so interested in this topics, and that are discussions that I'm not searching in this thread.

As I noticed, I'm not the only one, and somebody made the Renault R31 thread, thinking, that there will be only merit discussion about the Renault R31 car. But as we saw, it happened there too, that pretty much posts about name issues, "who is the real lotus" discussions and so on.

So I want to go the other way around, to avoid such discussions on those mentioned threads. That is way I made this thread, it's generally about Group Lotus, you can feel free to discuss here, such things like:
-are Lotus road cars nice or rubbish?
-will Lotus sell so much cars to not go bankrupt?
-if not, when they will go bankrupt?
-what you think about the way they go to motorsports in all that series?
-Who has rights to use the "Team Lotus" name?
-Is GL/Bahar the bad one? Or is Tony Fernandez the bad one?
-Who has the heritage of the Lotus brand
-and so on, and so on :)

Discuss! (And keep the Lotus Renault GP 2011 and the Renault R31 threads clean :D )

Edited by alecc, 20 January 2011 - 15:11.


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#2 Wingcommander

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:14

Nice thread. I'm so fed up with all the talk about rights, heritage etc. But the their plans about road cars seem intresting.


#3 Sukhoi

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:21

in this case i think we can combine R31 topic with GLGP topic , it was great before mess started , so i think we don't need extra one especialy for Car, as our little "community" dosnt seem to be sucha big

that topic should have been created instead of R31

not that i moan or something , it's a great way of making both "sides" happy and i support it

PS: i am still waiting for info regarding revision of future Lotus Models , Elan out ? please give any info about it

#4 Carlo's

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:43

Last year we had only one thread concerning Renault, car, overall situation and so on and so for. This year we have already 3 threads, but I agree that it is necessary to have them all. In Official LRGP thread is total mess - facts about the Lotus cars, naming issues, talkings about future tactic of Group Lotus, livery issues and more so I support multi-thread situation.

#5 alecc

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:43

in this case i think we can combine R31 topic with GLGP topic , it was great before mess started , so i think we don't need extra one especialy for Car, as our little "community" dosnt seem to be sucha big

that topic should have been created instead of R31

not that i moan or something , it's a great way of making both "sides" happy and i support it

PS: i am still waiting for info regarding revision of future Lotus Models , Elan out ? please give any info about it


Yup, I'm for the merging of the R31 and LRGP threads too.

BTW are there any info how much will the new Lotus cars cost? In comparison to Porsche, or Lambo?

#6 Carlo's

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:44

Yup, I'm for the merging of the R31 and LRGP threads too.


Official LRGP thread is too polluted, I'm afraid.


#7 swerved

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Posted 20 January 2011 - 15:59

in this case i think we can combine R31 topic with GLGP topic , it was great before mess started , so i think we don't need extra one especialy for Car, as our little "community" dosnt seem to be sucha big

that topic should have been created instead of R31

not that i moan or something , it's a great way of making both "sides" happy and i support it

PS: i am still waiting for info regarding revision of future Lotus Models , Elan out ? please give any info about it



I saw this Evora on a motorway a few days ago.

http://www.birmingha...97319-28011279/

#8 Minardigp

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 11:07

Interesting to read Brundle's view on the naming issue, that TL should just 'let it go'.

http://www.crash.net..._on_a_name.html

In any case, if the licensing agreement with GL was terminated for an immaterial breach (which no one seems to know), then TL will no doubt get substantial damages to help cover their losses due to switching to another name. So if TL were actually 'cheated' with a wrongful termination as some think then they may well be compensated for that.

#9 CaptainJackSparrow

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 20:35

Great idea for a thread, since there are 5 new models coming out I thought I might post a few pictures of each, and to start off with... the new Esprit, due out in early 2013.

Gorgeous bit of kit this, and the specs are shaping up pretty nice.

Price around 108,000 pounds, so it's competitors are the Audi r8 and the Aston Martin Vantage. If it drives as good as it looks they'll be onto a winner I think.

Lotus Esprit

http://photo.autonew...der1600x800.jpg

http://gpf1valencia....allpaper_01.jpg

http://www.dailytorq...s-Esprit-04.jpg

http://www.zercustom...us-Esprit-5.jpg

http://www.zercustom...us-Esprit-7.jpg

http://gotryke.com/w...06-1024x868.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot.....nterior 2.jpg

#10 Roni

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Posted 21 January 2011 - 23:59

Take that woman out of that BEAUTIFUL car!

#11 FW09

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 02:32

I don't like it. Especially the rear side window / air intake area looks droopy. The cockpit looks like some cheap Japanese gizmo. Except the Lotus badge, which is from another era. It doesn't fit.

This would have been better:
http://image.interne...id-supercar.jpg


#12 Nustang70

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 06:18

I don't like it. Especially the rear side window / air intake area looks droopy. The cockpit looks like some cheap Japanese gizmo. Except the Lotus badge, which is from another era. It doesn't fit.

This would have been better:
http://image.interne...id-supercar.jpg


Ah, I forgot about that one. Yeah, that's got more character than the Esprit they are planning on producing. I don't dislike the new Esprit's styling, but it is very generic.


#13 korzeniow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 14:52

Great thread :up: I like it!

Posted Image

Director of Design Donato Coco says: "Check out the front of the car: It’s a mixture of a shark and a cat. Very muscular, very sleek. I love this car, it's one of my favourites.”



#14 CaptainJackSparrow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 16:47

So it is considered an inevitability? It can't be healthy to be asking these questions of a new associate of F1, who hasn't really made any impact yet. It's all well and good posting pictures of photoshopped prototype models but we need something concrete and money-making to so much as break even after this massive expansion programme in road cars and motorsport.


Questions like this get asked all the time of car companies, how many get bailed out each year, there are alway some big names, but govt's never let any fail. Don't forget Group Lotus is the victim of a hell of a lot of FUD on here spread by fans of a certain Malaysian F1 team.

Anyway, the Esprit doesn't go into production until next year, so it ain't going to be making money till it's sold.

You gotta spend money to make money, you gotta spend big on marketing, that's a fundamental rule of this business, is the one area you shouldn't cut as it affects the bottom line for everything else.

#15 Disgrace

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 16:48

-will Lotus sell so much cars to not go bankrupt?
-if not, when they will go bankrupt?


So to you, a Renault fan, bankruptcy is considered an inevitability? If we're even so much as discussing this, it can't be healthy for Renault.

They're a new associate of F1, their only impact thus far has been negative: created a scandal for the 2011 off-season and inevitable court meetings as well as divided fans.

It's all well and good posting pictures of photoshopped prototype models but they need something concrete to make money to so much as break even after this massive expansion programme in road cars and motorsport. I'm surprised Renault fans wish such uncertainty and controversy upon their team with support of Group Lotus' association.

Edit: you're too quick for me. :lol:

Questions like this get asked all the time of car companies, how many get bailed out each year, there are alway some big names, but govt's never let any fail.


These are generally American car companies going bankrupt as a result of decades of inefficiency. Why are you comparing apples with oranges?

Don't forget Group Lotus is the victim of a hell of a lot of FUD on here spread by fans of a certain Malaysian F1 team.


So what we say on the Autosport forums has direct relevance to Group Lotus real-life financial health. Right.

Edited by Disgrace, 22 January 2011 - 16:55.


#16 Wingcommander

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 18:32

Launching five new models to compete with Porsche&co seems way too ambitious to me. Like Hunnylander mentioned in some other thread, McLaren's approach sounds much more sensible.


#17 korzeniow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 18:43

Launching five new models to compete with Porsche&co seems way too ambitious to me. Like Hunnylander mentioned in some other thread, McLaren's approach sounds much more sensible.


Well, everyone can't do McLaren, don't you think?

#18 dau

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 19:44

Questions like this get asked all the time of car companies, how many get bailed out each year, there are alway some big names, but govt's never let any fail. Don't forget Group Lotus is the victim of a hell of a lot of FUD on here spread by fans of a certain Malaysian F1 team.


Yea. Sure. That's the reason for all the skepticism regarding Lotus' plans.

Edited by dau, 22 January 2011 - 19:46.


#19 CaptainJackSparrow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 20:46

The Lotus Elite (2013)

Anyway, continuing a look at the new range, and no.2 in the range which Korz hit upon above, the Lotus Elite:

Lotus says the Elite will redefine the idea of a 'modern classic' and judging by the pictures, this elegant and well-proportioned model certainly has the looks to do that. It wll also incorporate some of the very latest technological innovations Lotus has to offer. A retractable hard top version and the optional use of hybrid technology with KERS are two examples of Lotus tailoring technology to deliver performance.

Designed as a GT, the front-mid-engined Elite is rear-wheel drive and at 4.6 metres long, similar in length to an Audi A5 with a two plus two seating layout. Power comes from monster 5.0-litre V8 engine with 620bhp that revs to 8500rpm and can cover the 0-62mph benchmark in 3.5 seconds with a top speed of 196mph.

It will also be available with a hybrid powerplant as an option. This uses an electric motor alongside the petrol engine and with the lightweight body (of 1650kg) it can emits just 215g/km of CO2, helped by the use of KERS (Kinetic Energy Recovery System) which was used by several manufacturer's in the 2009 Formula One system. Production of the Elite is set to commence in early 2014 with the launch due in Spring the same year. It's expected to cost around £115,000.

http://www.honestjoh...plete-new-range

http://www.wekop.com...-wheel-base.jpg

http://2.bp.blogspot...tus-Elite-2.jpg

http://www.egmcartec..._images_004.jpg

http://blog.miroslav...us-Elite-07.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot...ite-concept.jpg

http://3.bp.blogspot...tus-Elite-8.jpg

http://www.autonewst...es-its-roof.jpg

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#20 korzeniow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 20:56

I didn't know Elite has retractable roof. Look great on last picture.

The car is indeed elite, looks very luxury but its very sporting at the same time, with astonishing performance figures

#21 MadYarpen

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 20:59

I didn't know Elite has retractable roof. Look great on last picture.

The car is indeed elite, looks very luxury but its very sporting at the same time, with astonishing performance figures

Shame that last picture is a computer render...

#22 hippie

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 21:35

On October 5, 2010, Cars In Context published a review of the new Lotus concepts. It's well worth reading.

#23 CaptainJackSparrow

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 21:59

Cool video on the Esprit, Coco shares some of his thoughts:



Interesting picture with a competitor, there is talk of potentially including the Esprit in a future Bond film, am sure everyone remembers the submarine Esprit from years ago:

Posted Image

#24 One

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Posted 22 January 2011 - 23:06

Looks terrible honestly, a worst series of cars that I have ever seen issued attached to the Lotus Name a cheap copy of Lamo IMHO.

By the way this is exactly what Alecc did NOT wanted in this thread? Now see who messed the intention of the initiator?

Remember, Kubica is a way better driver to be messed up with this cheap ambition. Watch out Kubica, these guys can damage your future seriously.

#25 FW09

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 00:28

What about those wing "mirrors" that are actually tiny little cameras? Are they legal? Where are the displays?


#26 Disgrace

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 00:34

What about those wing "mirrors" that are actually tiny little cameras? Are they legal? Where are the displays?


Minimalist wing mirrors are a norm amongst all concept cars. Just type "concept car" in Google Images for all of your lack of wing mirror needs.

#27 FW09

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 00:43

Minimalist wing mirrors are a norm amongst all concept cars. Just type "concept car" in Google Images for all of your lack of wing mirror needs.


Yes, but they are usually still mirrors, or completely lacking. With Lotus, you can see they are designed as cameras.

Posted Image

Only the displays are missing. :)


#28 Roni

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 00:48

Yes, but they are usually still mirrors, or completely lacking. With Lotus, you can see they are designed as cameras.

Posted Image

Only the displays are missing. :)

Nope. When you change lines, one of the screens turns to mirror display.

#29 FW09

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 00:51

Nope. When you change lines, one of the screens turns to mirror display.


And that is legal in what country?

I'm sure they are just concept car gizmos. In production models there will be real mirrors. If they ever get to production...


#30 Callisto

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 02:09

Great idea for a thread, since there are 5 new models coming out I thought I might post a few pictures of each, and to start off with... the new Esprit, due out in early 2013.

Gorgeous bit of kit this, and the specs are shaping up pretty nice.

Price around 108,000 pounds, so it's competitors are the Audi r8 and the Aston Martin Vantage. If it drives as good as it looks they'll be onto a winner I think.

Lotus Esprit

http://photo.autonew...der1600x800.jpg

http://gpf1valencia....allpaper_01.jpg

http://www.dailytorq...s-Esprit-04.jpg

http://www.zercustom...us-Esprit-5.jpg

http://www.zercustom...us-Esprit-7.jpg

http://gotryke.com/w...06-1024x868.jpg
awesome car

http://3.bp.blogspot.....nterior 2.jpg



#31 Disgrace

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Posted 23 January 2011 - 16:46

Group Lotus' owners Proton under fire for F1 investment.

Dany Bahar could make a good megalomaniac Bond villain who is about to get his comeuppance when it goes tits up. :lol:

Edited by Disgrace, 23 January 2011 - 16:47.


#32 Reinmuster

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Posted 24 January 2011 - 11:11

You gotta spend money to make money, you gotta spend big on marketing, that's a fundamental rule of this business, is the one area you shouldn't cut as it affects the bottom line for everything else.


Off course as a car manufacturer you can borrowing money big time, while in same time sponsors F1 team, and to rely on markets that filled by Ferrari and Porsche to sell your car and waiting for them to make money for you in couple of years.. while the loans paid by money from Malaysian taxpayers..




#33 dau

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Posted 24 January 2011 - 11:19

And that is legal in what country?

I'm sure they are just concept car gizmos. In production models there will be real mirrors. If they ever get to production...


Yes, of course they are just concepts. Lots of design elements will have to change for the production models, but the overall look should be very similar.

#34 Sausage

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Posted 24 January 2011 - 19:01

IRL: If this is all to be believed: http://hondaracinghpd.blogspot.com/

Lotus will:

Lotus Cars appears poised to buy into KV this year, taking an ownership stake in the team it partially sponsored last year. Expect a large influx of Group Lotus personnel behind the pit wall in 2011, and (at least) two green-and-yellow – or perhaps black-and-gold – cars this season.


Edited by Sausage, 24 January 2011 - 19:03.


#35 Wingcommander

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Posted 24 January 2011 - 22:24

Seems to me they are spreading their money all over the place.


#36 Minardigp

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Posted 25 January 2011 - 10:31

Looks like Lotus is set to open a London Store akin to the Ferrari one, not surprising perhaps given it was Bahar's idea for the Ferrari one on Regent Street.

http://www.edp24.co...._store_1_782782

#37 korzeniow

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 21:27

Do you want to see something stunning?

Here it is:

Posted Image

Posted Image

It’s latest T124 Evora variant the GT Concept Car

It's the basis for this years Le Mans 24 Hours

More info: http://www.racecar-e...ora-gt-concept/

#38 DanardiF1

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Posted 01 March 2011 - 21:37

Do you want to see something stunning?

Here it is:

Posted Image

Posted Image

It’s latest T124 Evora variant the GT Concept Car

It's the basis for this years Le Mans 24 Hours

More info: http://www.racecar-e...ora-gt-concept/


At least it's a real Lotus :p

Looks cool, is that going to be running in GT2 then?

#39 mechadaniel

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 01:36

The render look great - the real thing looks awful...

From the front it reminds me of the Japanese fashion Ganguro:

Posted Image

Posted Image

:)

Edited by mechadaniel, 02 March 2011 - 01:37.


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#40 BRG

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 13:33

Great, Lotus back to Le Mans. I wonder what the ACO will come up with to disqualify them this time...

#41 King Six

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 13:38

I like how they included the Total-Red on the car despite the fact that clearly everyone hates it, but it's awkwardly part of this... whole program they're doing

#42 WestMcLaren99

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 15:04

I like how they included the Total-Red on the car despite the fact that clearly everyone hates it, but it's awkwardly part of this... whole program they're doing


I also like how they included it and don't seem to be sponsored by TOTAL. JPS and TOTAL must be loving new Lotus

#43 BRG

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 18:04

I also like how they included it and don't seem to be sponsored by TOTAL. JPS and TOTAL must be loving new Lotus

Sorry, am I missing something? I don;t see any thing about Total on the car, or is any red paint now automatically a reference to Total? If so, Total must be over the moon about Ferrari's all-red livery...

#44 highdownforce

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 18:18

Sorry, am I missing something? I don;t see any thing about Total on the car, or is any red paint now automatically a reference to Total? If so, Total must be over the moon about Ferrari's all-red livery...

There's no reference to Total.
And no reference to JPS neither.

P.S.: Am I the only one who have spotted that Bruno Senna name is on the rendering of the car?
Posted Image

Edited by highdownforce, 02 March 2011 - 18:21.


#45 WestMcLaren99

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 20:30

P.S.: Am I the only one who have spotted that Bruno Senna name is on the rendering of the car?
Posted Image


This Month last year:
Posted Image


#46 highdownforce

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 20:34

Was Trulli behind the wheel?

#47 WestMcLaren99

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Posted 02 March 2011 - 20:39

Was Trulli behind the wheel?


Yes he was. He visited Hethel and briefly served as a test driver before the F1 season started last year.

#48 peacockantony

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Posted 03 March 2011 - 08:59

Was Trulli behind the wheel?



Yes he was. He visited Hethel and briefly served as a test driver before the F1 season started last year.

This was when GL had a good relationship with TF's team, before the Bahar affair ruined it

#49 highdownforce

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Posted 03 March 2011 - 13:37

Thanks!

#50 TennisUK

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Posted 24 March 2011 - 21:15

I notice in this week's Autosport (print) it is mentioned that GL's foray in to manufacturing Lotus Indycar aero is actually likely to be done by Dallara, continuing the theme of getting other people to make their racing cars...