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Hudson special - Australian Grand Prix 1949


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#1 GREENXC

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 04:01

Im after any photos or information on a hudson special that competed at the 1949 australian grand prix. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

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#2 Wirra

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 04:40

This photo is reportedly 1939

http://www.slv.vic.g...9144/1/pi001219

Edited by Wirra, 31 January 2011 - 04:41.


#3 GREENXC

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 05:29

This photo is reportedly 1939

http://www.slv.vic.g...9144/1/pi001219

Im fairly sure there were 2 hudson specials and that was the first one. Im after the second car.

#4 Wirra

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 06:08

Here is a reported 1951 photo.

http://aussieroadrac...MaxStahlP3.html

#5 cooper997

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 08:12

At the 1949 AGP at Leyburn, Qld - Sunday, September 18th - NSW driver, Frank Kleinig's Hudson carried #1 and was on scratch for the handicapped AGP. It was event 4 and covered 35 laps/150 miles. There's a photo of Kleinig's Hudson in the Australian Grand Prix - 50 race history book on page 143 (that was originally used in the period AMS report). This car is owned by Tom Roberts in Melbourne and was at Phillip Island in 2008 as part of the 80th anniversary AGP parade.

The other more mysterious Hudson special from the same event carried #3 and in the same book has 'B Woods' as the entrant and Alf Bowes as the driver in the grid position listing. The original owner of my programme has indeed crossed out 'B Woods' and put 'bowes' to the side, but it could also be interpreted as 'bowers'. This car had a handicap of 3 minutes and 'B Woods' must have lived in Qld going by the programme.

This AGP is covered in Australian Motor Sports, October 1949 issue. A good spread (5 wide on the front row) of the start grid is shown on the cover. But you need an expert of early Australian motor racing like John Medley to come along and help explain a bit more.

Stephen

#6 GREENXC

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 08:58

At the 1949 AGP at Leyburn, Qld - Sunday, September 18th - NSW driver, Frank Kleinig's Hudson carried #1 and was on scratch for the handicapped AGP. It was event 4 and covered 35 laps/150 miles. There's a photo of Kleinig's Hudson in the Australian Grand Prix - 50 race history book on page 143 (that was originally used in the period AMS report). This car is owned by Tom Roberts in Melbourne and was at Phillip Island in 2008 as part of the 80th anniversary AGP parade.

The other more mysterious Hudson special from the same event carried #3 and in the same book has 'B Woods' as the entrant and Alf Bowes as the driver in the grid position listing. The original owner of my programme has indeed crossed out 'B Woods' and put 'bowes' to the side, but it could also be interpreted as 'bowers'. This car had a handicap of 3 minutes and 'B Woods' must have lived in Qld going by the programme.

This AGP is covered in Australian Motor Sports, October 1949 issue. A good spread (5 wide on the front row) of the start grid is shown on the cover. But you need an expert of early Australian motor racing like John Medley to come along and help explain a bit more.

Stephen

The pics and info i want is on the hudson speedcar driven by Alf Bowes.

#7 David Shaw

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 09:18

I found a photo in a Chrysler Restorers newsletter. Have a look at the top photo on page 18
http://www.chrysler-...u/crcmag158.pdf
According to the caption on page 19 it is the car on row 2 closest to the camera.

The article was written by TNFer Ray Bell, and coincidentially I was just looking at this article today.

#8 Ray Bell

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 09:32

"Cappy" Woods had a speedcar with a chassis that could be extended, as I understand it...

The car had a 6-cyl Terraplane engine and they fitted larger wheels for the Leyburn race.

Edited by Ray Bell, 31 January 2011 - 10:48.


#9 baz

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 12:43

Im after any photos or information on a hudson special that competed at the 1949 australian grand prix. Any information would be greatly appreciated.

At the Gingertown Garage located at the Ginger Factory tourist centre Yandina Qld. is a 1939 Hudson special. I know nothing about the car but I think it may still run in historic events. Check it out.

#10 Ray Bell

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Posted 31 January 2011 - 13:25

Is it blue?

There is bound to be a number of pre-war Hudson Specials somewhere.

#11 baz

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Posted 01 February 2011 - 11:08

Is it blue?

There is bound to be a number of pre-war Hudson Specials somewhere.

Yes Ray, the hudson is indeed blue. I will see if i can get some more info.

#12 baz

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 10:48

Is it blue?

There is bound to be a number of pre-war Hudson Specials somewhere.

The Hudson Special at Yandina is a recreation built within the last 15 years. It is one of several cars built by Dick Vermulian, all in the style of vintage racers.
These cars are usually driven in a very spirited manner by very brave men.

#13 tinshed

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Posted 04 September 2011 - 02:14

Im after any photos or information on a hudson special that competed at the 1949 australian grand prix. Any information would be greatly appreciated.


This car was a midget speedcar stretched for this event. Unusually for a speedcar of the time it had a full clutch and gearbox ( terraplane ) and 4 wheel
brakes. The body is aluminium and the chassis a combination of small Citroen and 't' ford. It was road raced at the 49 A.G.P. and at Lowood in 1950 and
1952. I have not found any record of it competing at Strathpine which is surprising being a Brisbane car. By 1950 it had alloy rear wheels and a 4 link
front axle. In that year Wal Kobek won 2 feature races at the Exhibition speedway with it. I think he must have been a peddler as I don't know that
any body else did much with what must have been a comparatively heavy car. Alf Bowers crashed at Lowood in 1952 avoiding an ejected driver lying on the track. I would love to know if it was stretched for Lowood or run as a speedcar as other cars were at Leyburn and Strathpine at this time. The car
is missing some bits but still exists today. Can I ask what your interest is in this car ?

#14 GREENXC

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Posted 05 September 2011 - 00:38

This car was a midget speedcar stretched for this event. Unusually for a speedcar of the time it had a full clutch and gearbox ( terraplane ) and 4 wheel
brakes. The body is aluminium and the chassis a combination of small Citroen and 't' ford. It was road raced at the 49 A.G.P. and at Lowood in 1950 and
1952. I have not found any record of it competing at Strathpine which is surprising being a Brisbane car. By 1950 it had alloy rear wheels and a 4 link
front axle. In that year Wal Kobek won 2 feature races at the Exhibition speedway with it. I think he must have been a peddler as I don't know that
any body else did much with what must have been a comparatively heavy car. Alf Bowers crashed at Lowood in 1952 avoiding an ejected driver lying on the track. I would love to know if it was stretched for Lowood or run as a speedcar as other cars were at Leyburn and Strathpine at this time. The car
is missing some bits but still exists today. Can I ask what your interest is in this car ?

How do you know it still exists ?

#15 tinshed

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Posted 05 September 2011 - 07:56

How do you know it still exists ?

Seen it, touched it, sat in it, compared it to period photos etc.

#16 GREENXC

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Posted 05 September 2011 - 22:15

Seen it, touched it, sat in it, compared it to period photos etc.

How long ago did you see it, touch it, sit in it ? Do you know who owns the car now ?

Edited by GREENXC, 06 September 2011 - 00:26.


#17 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 00:49

Thanks for re-opening this...

An interesting car, your detail includes a couple of things I never knew. Please tell us more!

#18 tinshed

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 02:42

How long ago did you see it, touch it, sit in it ? Do you know who owns the car now ?

Yes I know who owns it. Can I ask again your particular interest in this car ? In answer to Ray, I don't know much more other than
it's tail was made 6 inches longer with a spacer after the Lowood crash. The body by they way appears to have been built without the
aid of any form of measuring device. It also got a slightly different black and gold colour scheme
that now is heavily blistered after an accidental workshop fire apparently sometime around when it stopped racing. The last drivers
name painted on the cockpit is that of George Edgar but you can still the outline of BILL WOOD complete with crown logo under the
black paint. I spoke with Stan Eastwood [ I think ] in Toowoomba who also raced a speedcar at times at Leyburn and confirmed
that it was a fast car back then, but any of the old speedway blokes that remembered it from the the mid to late fifties referred to it as
a ' heap of shit '. Thats the evolution of the racing car for you. Some of it good bits like the alloy wheels ended up on other cars.

#19 GREENXC

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 03:23

Yes I know who owns it. Can I ask again your particular interest in this car ? In answer to Ray, I don't know much more other than
it's tail was made 6 inches longer with a spacer after the Lowood crash. The body by they way appears to have been built without the
aid of any form of measuring device. It also got a slightly different black and gold colour scheme
that now is heavily blistered after an accidental workshop fire apparently sometime around when it stopped racing. The last drivers
name painted on the cockpit is that of George Edgar but you can still the outline of BILL WOOD complete with crown logo under the
black paint. I spoke with Stan Eastwood [ I think ] in Toowoomba who also raced a speedcar at times at Leyburn and confirmed
that it was a fast car back then, but any of the old speedway blokes that remembered it from the the mid to late fifties referred to it as
a ' heap of shit '. Thats the evolution of the racing car for you. Some of it good bits like the alloy wheels ended up on other cars.

My interest is that i also know who owns it. Was hoping to maybe get some more pictures of the car for him.

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#20 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 06:17

Barrie Watt is sure to know more about the car...

I did a bit of sniffing around about this car when the Leyburn 50-year anniversary was on.

#21 tinshed

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 08:11

My interest is that i also know who owns it. Was hoping to maybe get some more pictures of the car for him.

Now I am intrigued. Do I know you? I own the car, but have met a least one other person at Speed on Tweed who claimed to have it.
He suddenly had to leave when I showed him a photo of it in my shed. Another guy claimed his mate had it, but couldn't tell me who
his mate was.

#22 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 08:36

Do we have some intrigue happening here?

It should be pretty easy to pick the real car, surely...

#23 GREENXC

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 13:28

Now I am intrigued. Do I know you? I own the car, but have met a least one other person at Speed on Tweed who claimed to have it.
He suddenly had to leave when I showed him a photo of it in my shed. Another guy claimed his mate had it, but couldn't tell me who
his mate was.

Well i went for a quick drive 2 minutes up the road this afternoon to check if the car was still there and it was. If you reckon you own the car then you can tell me who you bought it off ?

#24 Dick Willis

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 20:50

This thread gets more intriguing every day, can't wait to find the outcome.

#25 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 21:15

Hell, Dick, don't do that to me...

When I saw you'd replied to this thread I thought maybe you were going to claim you owned this car too!



PS. it should be easy to pick the real car by the chassis rails.

#26 GMACKIE

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 22:02

I might go and take a photo of the chassis rails and post it up.

Please do.............I'd love to see it before it ends up at Mecum Auctions. :lol:


#27 Ray Bell

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 22:08

I'll second that...

I've only ever read about them!

#28 GMACKIE

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 22:33

On Hudson specials, I remember looking at two of them being built in Victoria, by a bloke called 'Woolfie'. It must have been nearly 20 years ago. Anyone know what became of them?



#29 tinshed

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Posted 06 September 2011 - 23:02

Well i went for a quick drive 2 minutes up the road this afternoon to check if the car was still there and it was. If you reckon you own the car then you can tell me who you bought it off ?

George Woods, Cappy's son, from his house in Salisbury about 12 years ago. I have a receipt somewhere on his old towing company letter head.
I would love to see your pictures. I will respond with mine if I can work out how to post them. How did your secretive friend acquire the 'car'?

#30 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 00:18

George Woods, Cappy's son, from his house in Salisbury about 12 years ago. I have a receipt somewhere on his old towing company letter head.
I would love to see your pictures. I will respond with mine if I can work out how to post them. How did your secretive friend acquire the 'car'?

how much of the "car" do you have ?


#31 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:17

I would have thought George would have been too emotionally involved to ever sell any such thing...

He cried when I spoke to him back about that time.

#32 GMACKIE

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:34

He cried when I spoke to him

Doesn't everyone? :wave:


#33 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:49

Not so you'd notice...

But this bloke was a cot case when it came to thinking about his father and what had happened to him in the wake of the war, how he'd been taken away from him and that kind of stuff.

#34 john medley

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 01:49

Greg
Perhaps "Wolfie" is Wolfgang Reiben from near Castlemaine who built 2 extraordinary Hudson Specials of about 1916(?) vintage and some quality some years ago. I recall them running at Winton then. These days I think he and others are The Feral Sports Car Club ( you will be entertained.... Google search that club name)

#35 Ian G

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:03

On Hudson specials, I remember looking at two of them being built in Victoria, by a bloke called 'Woolfie'. It must have been nearly 20 years ago. Anyone know what became of them?


Yeah..one of them was driven by Steve McQueen in the LeMans movie. :rotfl:

Sorry,interesting thread,at least it hasn't reached Lotus Cortina or GT Falcon status yet.

#36 GMACKIE

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:04

Greg
Perhaps "Wolfie" is Wolfgang Reiben from near Castlemaine who built 2 extraordinary Hudson Specials of about 1916(?) vintage and some quality some years ago. I recall them running at Winton then. These days I think he and others are The Feral Sports Car Club ( you will be entertained.... Google search that club name)

That would be him, for sure, John. IIRC he was a trimmer, but built a good motor car!

On the same day that we met Wolfgang, we went to see a mate of his, who everyone called "Grunt"! He was a Kiwi, and that's how he pronounced his name.......Grant. :lol:


#37 Dick Willis

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:20

Mr Willis knows the real owner of the car. For privacy reasons i'm hoping he won't say. I might go and take a photo of the chassis rails and post it up.


Now I'm even more intrigued, I wish you blokes wouldn't hide behind these "nom-de-plumes"

#38 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:23

What's so 'nom-de-plume' about 'Green XC'?

How many people do you know would name themselves over a mossy Falcon?

#39 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:49

What's so 'nom-de-plume' about 'Green XC'?

How many people do you know would name themselves over a mossy Falcon?

What's wrong with a mossy falcon ?

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#40 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 02:52

I'm just saying that Dick should know you by your 'nom-de-plume' as you must be somewhat unique...

Of course, if the moss is too extensive it could hamper a number of things.

#41 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 03:06

Does somebody actually have some photos of the hudson speedcar that they can share ?

#42 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 03:52

I think the only ones I have ever seen are in the AGP book...

Then it would appear on the movie clip I have, however briefly, and Bill would probably have others. As would John Holmes and Don Thallon.

#43 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 04:28

I think the only ones I have ever seen are in the AGP book...

Then it would appear on the movie clip I have, however briefly, and Bill would probably have others. As would John Holmes and Don Thallon.

Ahhh the famous JH.

#44 tinshed

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 04:29

Does somebody actually have some photos of the hudson speedcar that they can share ?

This is becoming a bit tiresome.. No pictures of the rails.. no answer as to how he came by them...A man who is part of the secret service?
How do you put photos up?

#45 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 05:04

Photos?

Send them to me if you can't do it... e.mail address as below...

#46 tinshed

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 06:34


Some photos of the elusive Hudson then and now. The young boy in the suit is George, Cappy is in the car, and Wal Kobeck is
waiting with helmet to do the business. The other picture is at the A.G P. I think that I have enough of it and the receipt to
say that I own it. Any missing parts would be gratefully reunited with it. From what George told me there is a sworded tale
as to why they are missing.

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

#47 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 08:35

Some photos of the elusive Hudson then and now. The young boy in the suit is George, Cappy is in the car, and Wal Kobeck is
waiting with helmet to do the business. The other picture is at the A.G P. I think that I have enough of it and the receipt to
say that I own it. Any missing parts would be gratefully reunited with it. From what George told me there is a sworded tale
as to why they are missing.

Posted Image

Posted Image

Posted Image

How old is that last photo ?


#48 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 08:40

The chassis in the first photo is not the same chassis in the third photo.
On the third photo the mounting point for the front arms on the rh side are different to the 2nd photo.

Edited by GREENXC, 07 September 2011 - 08:51.


#49 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 09:02

Those arms on the right hand front are totally different from 2nd photo to 3rd photo.

#50 GREENXC

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Posted 07 September 2011 - 09:06

The front nose in the first photo is different to the third photo.