26 replies to this topic

[Kingsleyrob]

It's me again, after more insight into the splendid films of Jack Twyford - you may recall my colleagues in my local MG Car Club have a vast amount of footage which we are trying to condense into an entertaining commercially available DVD.

This time I have two queries:

1) The youtube link will take you to two clips from Oulton Park in 1955. The first is we believe, the British Empire Trophy meeting. Any information about the races, the cars and the drivers will be welcome.

The second clip is from a race around the same time but notice that the advertising on the bridge over the start/ finish straight has changed from ,"The Motor" in the previous clip, to "Motor Cycling". We wish to identify the details of this event.

The link to youtube is


2) No link with my next query - just the following questions:

Does anyone have a report on the MGCC Cockshoot Trial held on 14th April 1949, in particular where the event took place? Also any information on the same event in 1950 which may have been held near Ruthin in North Wales?

Many thanks in anticipation of the usual speedy TNF responses.

Rob

Edited by Kingsleyrob, 22 March 2011 - 15:38.

[Sharman]

I was almost certainly there but will need to examine the clips closely to make any useful input except that "D"Type 51 in the second clipwas Duncan Hamilton

[David McKinney]

Empire Trophy winner Archie Scott-Brown in the Lister-Bristol also identifiable towards the end of the relevant clip. Also Bertie Bradnack in the Cooper-Bristol but I'm not sure of the helmetless Aston Martin driver. I thought Pat Griffith or Peter Walker, but neither was on the team that year. Reg Parnell strolling among the parked spectator cars, I think

Perhaps Alan Cox has the programme ;)

[Geoff E]

Both Oulton Park films show the trees devoid of leaves.

This 1956 film of Oulton at Easter 1956 shows "Motor Cycling" on the bridge at 3'02" http://www.britishpa...rd.php?id=40363

[RTH]

Oh, lovely stuff Rob, and great picture quality and excellent colour .

Could someone make up a highlights/best bits/trailer DVD with some commentary that we could show at the TNF Film show and give you a bit of pre-publicity for a forthcoming longer DVD ?

[Sharman]

I think the maroon cycle winged Cooper Bristol was Tony Crook

[Kingsleyrob]

Perhaps Alan Cox has the programme ;)

I think that might have been the programme I had my eye on last Thursday David! If I'd got there earlier I might have been able to have sneaked in before Alan...

Thanks gentlemen for your observations.

Richard, I have a session with my fellow MGCC chaps tonight - I'll certainly put forward your suggestion - thanks for the opportunity.

If the date of your next show in May fits in with my work schedule I could well make it.

Rob

[Eric Dunsdon]

Empire Trophy winner Archie Scott-Brown in the Lister-Bristol also identifiable towards the end of the relevant clip. Also Bertie Bradnack in the Cooper-Bristol but I'm not sure of the helmetless Aston Martin driver. I thought Pat Griffith or Peter Walker, but neither was on the team that year. Reg Parnell strolling among the parked spectator cars, I think

Perhaps Alan Cox has the programme ;)

That was Roy Salvadori surely. And Mike Sparken with the lovely Ferrari?. Wonderful footage!.

[RTH]

Richard, I have a session with my fellow MGCC chaps tonight - I'll certainly put forward your suggestion - thanks for the opportunity.

If the date of your next show in May fits in with my work schedule I could well make it.

Rob

Now that would be good Rob, you are always very welcome.

.......And as no stranger to the microphone yourself, you could tell the tale to the audience yourself about these excellent films.
By the way do you currently have an MG, if so you have kept that quiet !

[Phil Rainford]

What a superb piece of film


PAR

[Geoff.Harrison]

Re Cockshhoot Cup Trial - Have searched my fathers old trials results sheets and can only find 1951, 1952 and 1954
He competed in 1950 but results sheets are missing.
Unfortunately no route cards were kept - obviously ruined by mud !
Try Motor Sport Archive CD .

[Kingsleyrob]

Now that would be good Rob, you are always very welcome.

.......And as no stranger to the microphone yourself, you could tell the tale to the audience yourself about these excellent films.
By the way do you currently have an MG, if so you have kept that quiet !

Well Richard, you might recognise someone on the voiceover when the DVD is completed...

And, yes I do have an MG. Er, two actually. A modern red TF 160 and an Old English White B. My colleagues in the north west have some splendid machinery - MGAs, TDs etc.

Sadly we don't have anyone with a Magnette, one of my favourites, particularly the ZB Varitone.

Rob

[RTH]

Ah... I restored and took my driving test in this 1949 TC while I was at school in 1967, really sorry to let it go when I needed something secure .



I do have a video diary of 2 blokes doing the Pirelli Classic Marathon 21 years ago in a ZA Magnette in cream and brown factory colours.

Edited by RTH, 22 March 2011 - 18:24.

[Phil Rainford]

I do have a video diary of 2 blokes doing the Pirelli Classic Marathon 21 years ago in a ZA Magnette in cream and brown factory colours.

While Rob has a splendid trophy from the Pirelli Classic Marathon.........but that is another story



PAR

[David McKinney]

That was Roy Salvadori surely

No doubt

[Eric Dunsdon]

[quote name='David McKinney' date='Mar 22 2011, 16:29' post='4905242' I'm not sure of the helmetless Aston Martin driver. I thought Pat Griffith or Peter Walker, but neither was on the team that year.

Perhaps Alan Cox has the programme ;)
Peter Walker did drive for Aston-Martin that year finishing 8th in the International Trophy Race support event at Silverstone in May. He won the Goodwood Nine Hours with Dennis Poore, the same pairing finishing fourth in the Dunsdrod TT. Walker also drove at Le Mans with Paul Frere and in the British Grand Prix support race at Aintree where he again finished fourth.
[/quote]

[Alan Cox]

I do, by chance, have he 1955 British Empire Trophy race programme - not, I hasten to add, one of those offered by Phil on Thursday night, but purchesed on EBay a couple of years ago. I think the one you had your eye on, Rob, was the '55 Gold Cup.
Entry list:
Heat 1 Up to 1500cc
1. Ken McAlpine Connaught
2. Les Leston Connaught
3. David Blakely Emperor-HRG
4. Peter Jackson MG
5. Eric Brandon Halseylec
6. Peter Gammon Lotus
7. Colin Chapman Lotus
8. John Coombs Lotus
9. George Nixon Lotus-Turner
10. Austen Nurse Lotus
11. Brian Naylor Lotus
12. Don Beauman Leonard-MG
14. Ian Burgess OSCA
15. Jacques Péron OSCA
16. Wolfgang Seidel Porsche
17. John Newton Killeen
18. Reg Bicknell/J Habin Revis

Heat 2 1501-2700cc
21. Maurice Tew Frazer Nash
22. Reg Parnell Aston Martin
23. Lance Macklin Austin Healey
24. Ron Flockhart Austin Healey
25. David Shale Austin Healey
26. Peter Scott Russell Lotus-Bristol
27. Tony Crook Cooper-Bristol
28. Bert Rogers Cooper-Bristol
29. Mike Keen Cooper-Bristol
30. Jack Walton Cooper-Bristol
31 Colin Murray Frazer Nash
32. Tony Brooks Frazer Nash
33. John Dalton Austin Healey
34. Allan Moore Lister-Bristol
35. Jack Sears/W B Black Lister-Bristol
36. Archie Scott-Brown Lister-Bristol
37. Mike Anthony Lotus
38. Cliff Davis Maserati

Heat 3 Over 2700cc
40. Roy Salvadori Aston Martin
41. Graham Whitehead Aston Martin
42. Peter Collins. Aston Martin
43. Ken Wharton Aston Martin
44. Bertie Bradnack Cooper Jaguar
45. George Abecassis HWM
46. Tony Gaze HWM
47. Luigi Piotti Ferrari
48. Mike Sparken Ferrari
49. Bob Berry Jaguar
50. Dan Margulies Jaguar
51. Duncan Hamilton Jaguar
52. David Boston Jaguar
53. Joe Kelly/Hon Edward Greenall Jaguar
54. Ninian Sanderson Jaguar
55. Peter Blond Jaguar
56. Dick Shattock RGS-Atalanta

At approx 2m 15s into the film you can catch a rare shot of David Blakely with the Emperor. Eight days later, his racing career was over.

Are you sure, Rob, that the second clip is from the same year? Apart from the advert on the footbridge, the whole area has the look of another twelve months of maturity compared to the Empire Trophy film.

Edited by Alan Cox, 23 March 2011 - 13:29.

[Kingsleyrob]

Thanks Alan that's great. Thanks to everyone else too .

I recalled the programme being from 1955 - a special year for me!

My DVD committee members are in touch with this link and will see your query about 1955. I'm not sure why that assumption has been made, but they usually have a good rationale.

As for my treasured Pirelli Classic Marathon trophy, Phil, it probably needs a polish now, but here it is being presented to me by ace garagiste Barry.

Pity about the snow bringing a halt to the 2010 Scalextric Kilton GP, let's hope we can sort something out later this year.



In the true spirit of TNFship I have nicked this picture off David Beard, hope you don't mind David.

Rob

Edited by Kingsleyrob, 23 March 2011 - 12:03.

[Geoff E]

I have noticed another difference in the "trackside furniture".

The two races on YouTube have, in addition to the advertising change on the bridge, hanging Esso signs at either side of the track. The spring 1956 Pathe clip does not have those Esso signs.

[Pete Stowe]

Does anyone have a report on the MGCC Cockshoot Trial held on 14th April 1949, in particular where the event took place? Also any information on the same event in 1950 which may have been held near Ruthin in North Wales?

Many thanks in anticipation of the usual speedy TNF responses.

Rob

Cockshoot Trial 1949 was 10th April, based at Llangollen.
1950 was 26th March, start Llangollen, finish Ruthin.
Source: Autocar reports.

[Sharman]

Sorry Duncan was in the first clip. At the end of the 2nd clip a single seater appears, how about Geoff Rchardson inthe RRA?

[Graham Gauld]

Sorry Duncan was in the first clip. At the end of the 2nd clip a single seater appears, how about Geoff Rchardson inthe RRA?

As there seems to be a lot of interest in the 1955 British Empire Trophy race at Oulton I have attached a couple of photos I took at the event. Also the Mike Sparken and Luigi Piotti 750 Monzas were very much alike but you can recognise Piotti as he had a white edging round the lower part of his visor. Also in the film there is a shot of Ninian Sanderson in the Ecurie Ecosse C type Jaguar. This was the last time EE raced a C type as they had hoped to have one of the ex-factory D types for the event but when it was not ready they put Ninian into one of the C's




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Duncan Hamilton.

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Now Eric Brandon in the Halsylec leading the 1500s.



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Luigi Piotti ( Ferrari Monza)



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Looking across the lake to Joe Kelly's Jaguar, right, which hit the BBC Commentary box, on the left.

[Graham Gauld]

As there seems to be a lot of interest in the 1955 British Empire Trophy race at Oulton I have attached a couple of photos I took at the event. Also the Mike Sparken and Luigi Piotti 750 Monzas were very much alike but you can recognise Piotti as he had a white edging round the lower part of his visor. Also in the film there is a shot of Ninian Sanderson in the Ecurie Ecosse C type Jaguar. This was the last time EE raced a C type as they had hoped to have one of the ex-factory D types for the event but when it was not ready they put Ninian into one of the C's




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Duncan Hamilton.

[/IMG]

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Now Eric Brandon in the Halsylec leading the 1500s.



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Luigi Piotti ( Ferrari Monza)



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Looking across the lake to Joe Kelly's Jaguar, right, which hit the BBC Commentary box, on the left.

Sorry the Halseylec is in second place behind Don Beauman.

[RTH]

Great pictures Graham.

[Sharman]

Horrible accident that Graham, just how good was Joe Kelly? I see his designated alternate driver was Edward Greenall (the Hon Eddie as he was known) who was possibly also out of his depth in a C type, I don't recall him in anything other than an 11 until and that a few years later.

[Eric Dunsdon]

Apart from Reg Parnell, Archie Scott-Brown, Duncan Hamilton, Ninian Sanderson, Roy Salvadori and Bertie Bradnack as already mentioned, I also spotted Les Leston-Connaught, Jack Sears-Lister-Bristol and the Austin Healey's of Ron Flockhart and John Dalton in the first clip.

[Graham Gauld]

Horrible accident that Graham, just how good was Joe Kelly? I see his designated alternate driver was Edward Greenall (the Hon Eddie as he was known) who was possibly also out of his depth in a C type, I don't recall him in anything other than an 11 until and that a few years later.

Joe was one of many private entrants who ran nice cars but were never going to be big time winners. As I often say to people who mock tail enders : in order for one man to win a race 23 people have to lose it. Without them there is no race to win. Joe was a "character" at a time when there were many such characters who raced for fun but raced very serious cars.