14 replies to this topic

[raoul leDuke]

Can anybody throw any light on these pictures. I think they were taken at Blackpool in 1904 but could it be Portmarnock the same year?

The first picture is Charles Rolls in a Mors on the left.


Next could be Arthur Macdonald on the right.


Arthur Rawlinson with a 40HP Darracq


And finally this is captioned Stayte on the left and Guinness on the right

Edited by raoul leDuke, 13 May 2011 - 16:40.

[fuzzi]

I would say almost certainly Blackpool. As far as I know no Gordon Bennett Trial cars ran at Portmarnock and photographs show a much wetter course.

The starter looks very much like Julian Orde.

[tbolt]

There are more images of the 1904 trials at Blackpool here http://www.blackpool...y/motor-trials/

[D-Type]

As an aside, how did they get the aerial photo in 1904? presumably from a balloon.

[tbolt]

As an aside, how did they get the aerial photo in 1904? presumably from a balloon.

We have a tower, it's in the background of one of the other pics.

[D-Type]

I'd forgotten that!

Here's a modern view that's almost identical

[eldougo]

The thread "tbolt" posted of Blackpool 1904, it says that the cars were competing in the" Flying Kilometer" for a British record. That is very confusing i thought UK was in Miles not Kilometers at that time.

Thanks in advance Eldougo.

Edited by eldougo, 15 May 2011 - 06:37.

[David McKinney]

There were (and are, AFAIK) world records over both mile and kilometre distances and variants thereof, as well as for various durations.
They might have preferred to go for Flying Mile records at Blackpool, but presumably the beach was not long enough

[Tim Murray]

i thought UK was in Miles not Kilometers at that time.

It still is, and we're very happy with our miles. However, in recent years kilometre distance signs have started to appear on our motorways. Thin end of the EU-driven wedge, I suspect.

Edited by Tim Murray, 15 May 2011 - 07:20.

[fuzzi]

There were (and are, AFAIK) world records over both mile and kilometre distances and variants thereof, as well as for various durations.
They might have preferred to go for Flying Mile records at Blackpool, but presumably the beach was not long enough

Sorry David, not the beach at Blackpool - Southport or Pendine were the beaches used in Britain for LSR attempts

[Allan Lupton]

Sorry David, not the beach at Blackpool - Southport or Pendine were the beaches used in Britain for LSR attempts

It even says "South Promenade" on the headline. . .
Judging from the Google map there is a straightish bit of about 3000m finishing just North of the tower with a reasonably fast RH bend approaching the South end.
There was enough distance for "standing" mile runs, but for the "flying" records they would have needed a good long acceleration distance. Since there were grandstands at the Finish, it would have been important to finish all the runs in the same place, so they must have worked out that kilometre records would fit and mile would not.
These days we would have a startline and two finish lines at 1 km. and 1 mile and time each run for both distances.

[David McKinney]

I think by "not Blackpool", fuzzi means there were no LSR attempts there

I didn't say there were - I was merely pointing out that throughout Europe (even imperial England) the kilometre was a recognised distance for records

[bradbury west]

Might we assume that the Miss Levitt shown on what looks like a Napier? in the archive link is Dorothy Levitt, as portrayed in the TV programme by Penelope Keith?. See TNF link
http://forums.autosp...w...9&hl=Levitt
Roger Lund

[Allan Lupton]

Since the LSR was/is not an official category as such once officialdom had defined classes and rules (e.g. two-way runs) it is (I'd say) usually the current best flying mile anywhere in the world.
In 1904 a single run over a measured distance would suffice and perhaps for international recognition it would have been over a measured kilometre.
As for beaches, unlike Southport the one at Blackpool seems not to have been used much - but then it has the sea on one side, something that Southport seems not to have, so far as I could see . . . .

[fuzzi]

Sorry not to have been clearer. From what I have found, the beach at Blackpool was not used for motoring events, unlike the beaches at a number of other venues.

As far as I can establish, three courses were used for speed trials or sprints at Blackpool, with some later events using a cut-down version of an earlier course.