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FIA taking down old archive F1 footage


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#1 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:30

Do any of you guys have an opinion on this?

I find it a really, really sad and cynical move by the FIA.

Most of the time this footage is not commercially available. So what are we supposed to do - never witness these moments ever again?

What good does it do anyone in removing them and banning the account holders?

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#2 Andrew Hope

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:31

All old F1 clips show is how much better it used to be than it is now. How's that for cynical?

#3 Disgrace

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:33

FOM is living in the stone age with regards to F1 on the internet. There needs to be an official YouTube account with more than just a highlights clip with awful music each fortnight.

#4 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:34

All old F1 clips show is how much better it used to be than it is now. How's that for cynical?


That's pretty darned cynical (but I'm inclined to agree with you to an extent)...

It's like banning memories. So, so needless.

#5 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:52

All old F1 clips show is how much better it used to be than it is now. How's that for cynical?


You'd imagine that for them to do so would be a good advertisment for the sport - celebrating its history and allowing fans to relive exciting moments gone by.

But no...

#6 Fastcake

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:57

Does FOM actually have any copyright claim over the old footage? This was before the period they controlled the rights, if this is on youtube, appealing the take down should easily clear up the issue.

#7 MikeTekRacing

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 19:59

what is FIAs role in this? Can somebody edit the title?

#8 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:05

what is FIAs role in this? Can somebody edit the title?


Sorry my bad - I'll edit it (or try to...)

Ah, I can't...

Edited by Deckard79, 29 May 2011 - 20:06.


#9 spacekid

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:08

I find it so sad and frustrating. I just can't see what FOM get from taking this old footage down, but I've been aware of them doing it for some time.

Heck if they put all the old races on line and CHARGED a modest fee for access I'd gladly pay it. I'm not trying to deny them any of their profits, I just sometimes love to watch the old races.

I really can't see what anyone gets out of taking down years old material except the impression of pettiness and a slight sense of bitterness from the fan.

#10 scheivlak

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:12

Does FOM actually have any copyright claim over the old footage? This was before the period they controlled the rights, if this is on youtube, appealing the take down should easily clear up the issue.

AFAIK they don't have the copyright of pre-1982 GPs, I guess they belong to the individual broadcasters of the races.

#11 William Hunt

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:16

It's a really silly move marketing wise because those old clips promote the sport to the fans and to attract new fans on the internet.

#12 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:43

It's a really silly move marketing wise because those old clips promote the sport to the fans and to attract new fans on the internet.


Fully agree. They (FOM) would be doing themselves a favour by allowing clips to be shown (or at least by making those clips available themselves, with their own youtube account).

#13 Hairpin

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:49

Fully agree. They (FOM) would be doing themselves a favour by allowing clips to be shown (or at least by making those clips available themselves, with their own youtube account).

The cynic in me thinks (secretly) that FOM does not give a damn about those clips but they wanna make sure they keep the rights to sue for copyright infringements when the occasion occurs. Copyright, patent, greedy assholes and their lawyers are like mould on our civilization.

Edited by Hairpin, 29 May 2011 - 20:49.


#14 Ross Stonefeld

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:53

How often do we have to do this?

They have to be taken down to maintain copyright, and to avoid violating the TV contracts that give exclusivity to the domestic broadcaster. I shouldnt be able to view F1 in the UK on YouTube, only the BBC. That's why they pay 40mil a year for it.

#15 Apollonius

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:56

How often do we have to do this?

They have to be taken down to maintain copyright, and to avoid violating the TV contracts that give exclusivity to the domestic broadcaster. I shouldnt be able to view F1 in the UK on YouTube, only the BBC. That's why they pay 40mil a year for it.



So how does a two minute 40yr old clip of a GP impact on the BBC's deal? It doesn't.

#16 Hairpin

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 20:57

How often do we have to do this?

They have to be taken down to maintain copyright, and to avoid violating the TV contracts that give exclusivity to the domestic broadcaster. I shouldnt be able to view F1 in the UK on YouTube, only the BBC. That's why they pay 40mil a year for it.

New clips, yes. But this thread is about old archive footage. Would have been good if the thread starter had put up some example of what kind of "old archive F1 footage" he meant, but I have seen them take down stuff that is 25+

#17 zold

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:02

They're fighting a pointless battle, as is usually the case with the internet and copyright, there will always be someone else with the content. I don't doubt that there are people with hard drives full of every F1 race they can find*, and there isn't much FOM can do about it unless they want to go house to house roughing people up. They'd do much better just offering higher quality clips for a small fee (which will still get shared)

*not me

#18 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:05

New clips, yes. But this thread is about old archive footage. Would have been good if the thread starter had put up some example of what kind of "old archive F1 footage" he meant, but I have seen them take down stuff that is 25+


I should probably be more specific.

In my case, I'm referring to archive footage from the 1980s & 1990s.

Someone recently posted a clip of Alesi charging through Monaco in Friday (oh wait, Monaco... Thursday?) Quali, 1990.

It was about 2 minutes long. And, very sadly, removed for the usual copyright violations.

This is one example - I've noticed this hundreds of times.

Edited by Deckard79, 29 May 2011 - 21:09.


#19 scheivlak

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:10

I should probably be more specific.

In my case, I'm referring to archive footage from the 1980s & 1990s.

Someone recently posted a clip of Alesi charging through Monaco in Friday Quali, 1990.

It was about 2 minutes long. And, very sadly, removed for the usual copyright violations.

This is one example - I've noticed this hundreds of times.

As I stated, the crucial year AFAIK is 1982. About the time of the first Concorde Agreement.

That said, I'm still at odds why Bernie and his crew don't sell some real good stuff -documentary or just full live coverage- from the eighties and nineties.
There is a market for that.

Edited by scheivlak, 29 May 2011 - 21:11.


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#20 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:15

As I stated, the crucial year AFAIK is 1982. About the time of the first Concorde Agreement.

That said, I'm still at odds why Bernie and his crew don't sell some real good stuff -documentary or just full live coverage- from the eighties and nineties.
There is a market for that.


I'd buy memorable races, certainly. I'd pay the price of an average DVD.

But the point is, you can't. So, with the lack of any alternative, of course people will be uploading to youtube.

Giving us no options whatsoever is just sticking two fingers up at us, the fans.

Edited by Deckard79, 29 May 2011 - 21:16.


#21 ryan86

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:46

I mentioned something similiar on a TV forum that if they don't have plans to either repeat a series or release on some form of media, it was quite petty to stop fans interacting with each other to help complete one anothers collections. I think there is something different however betweens fans helping each other and others trying to make a quick buck by using it to make money.


#22 Don_Humpador

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:48

FOM is living in the stone age with regards to F1 on the internet.

Indeed, they have no clue as to the power and money they could make with all that footage. :down:

#23 D.M.N.

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:50

There's nothing stopping other worldwide broadcasters from exploiting their rights (providing they have archive rights of course) like BBC do: http://www.huwselby.com/f1/f1vids.htm (link to all the archive content on their website)

#24 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:52

I mentioned something similiar on a TV forum that if they don't have plans to either repeat a series or release on some form of media, it was quite petty to stop fans interacting with each other to help complete one anothers collections. I think there is something different however betweens fans helping each other and others trying to make a quick buck by using it to make money.


I agree.

Youtube uploads aren't about making a quick buck, though - these are uploads from enthusiasts.

It would be interesting to try and get a response from FOM on this topic...

No doubt they'd ignore us completely, however.

#25 Don_Humpador

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 21:55

There's nothing stopping other worldwide broadcasters from exploiting their rights (providing they have archive rights of course) like BBC do: http://www.huwselby.com/f1/f1vids.htm (link to all the archive content on their website)

Without wanting to turn this into a BBC thread, what FOM could do and what the BBC can realistically do is very very different. The BBC need to serve a wide variety of interests so they can't do as much as they would probably like. As a result the BBC "exploitation" of archive footage is extremely limited.

FOM on the other hand could use it to make a lot of money provided they did a great service.


#26 Deckard79

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 22:01

Without wanting to turn this into a BBC thread, what FOM could do and what the BBC can realistically do is very very different. The BBC need to serve a wide variety of interests so they can't do as much as they would probably like. As a result the BBC "exploitation" of archive footage is extremely limited.

FOM on the other hand could use it to make a lot of money provided they did a great service.


Agreed - what the BBC provide is appreciated but doesn't really cater for the enthusiast. Most of the footage shown is edited down to 5-8 minutes and they have a tendency to stick to battles for the lead, often leaving out key performances and incidents.

#27 William Hunt

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 22:04

sponsors get actually much more exposure when their brand are shown on the cars on youtube so it's in their interest too that they left those clips there. And the FIA / FOM seems keen to make their sport as elitist and as unfriendly possible for their fans, very very sad

#28 jonnoj

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 22:17

What else can we expect from a greedy company that doesn't put a penny into advertising F1? FOM have the rights to hours and hours of F1 racing and because it would initially cost Bernie money to make videos and possibly advertise them, he prefers to keep them locked up. If it were someone else, this massive archive might be regarded as the owners pension - but Bernie's probably looking at how he can take it with him.



#29 Murl

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 22:23

Do any of you guys have an opinion on this?

I find it a really, really sad and cynical move by the FIA.

Most of the time this footage is not commercially available. So what are we supposed to do - never witness these moments ever again?

What good does it do anyone in removing them and banning the account holders?


In general, the media rights holders are stuck with their heads up...some dark place (the way it was about 15 years ago). The world has moved on, they haven't.

Ultimately it will change, and access to archival footage will be much easier and cheaper. In the meantime we don't have much choice but to go to those who can supply it. (and we are not talking about the rights holders, because they WON'T supply it)

Let's face it, the rights holders are digging their own grave. I'll keep them supplied in fresh shovels, gladly. Idiots.

Edited by Murl, 29 May 2011 - 22:23.


#30 King Six

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Posted 29 May 2011 - 22:25

FOM is living in the stone age with regards to F1 on the internet. There needs to be an official YouTube account with more than just a highlights clip with awful music each fortnight.

and they need to make sure shitty rfactor and codemasters f1 videos don't come up in the search

i know it's you guys, who put those shitty videos on youtube and ruin the search results

#31 morrino

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 16:15

These people doesn't know how to promote the sport. New fans can easily be made with just a YouTube account.

#32 wepmob2000

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 19:22


Its ridiculous, its not as if this material is available anywhere else, or if FOM has released dozens of DVD's with lots of old footage in (I wish they would). Instead us fans and collectors of old F1 footage have to furtively swap old recordings, put them on to disc, etc.

I wish FOM or the BBC would open up their archive, so you could pay to download the old races in nice digital quality, instead of relying on recordings on VHS. I can't see what these old crusty's at FOM are guarding, they want to sit on this footage instead of potentially making money from it.

One answer is to download any interesting stuff on Youtube as soon as you see it, using Youtubedownloader or Vdownloader, its kind of like sticking a finger up at the man :wave: