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F1 alternatives?


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#1 pingu666

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 22:51

seems like theres plenty of people upset/disliking aspects of modern f1, so what alternatives are out there?

Nascar
- plus points of more power, big v8, montoya, more races, more cars, better/really good coverage, very high level

- negative points, "entertainment racing", indenticaliish cars on the outside, most races feel too long, some contrived rulings

Le mans series
- plus points , big viraity of engines, cars look good (mostly), longer races, great stories and coverage, compertion on every level, including tyres :D. extremely competative gt2 class. marque events. cars often look faster than f1 (and yes i know they arent :p )

- negatives, fewer races, longer races so harder to follow, not as powerful as f1

short course off road racing/baja
- plus points, lots of power from screaming v8 engines, nearly a meter of suspension travel :o, very open regulations, casual contact is common and allowed. tyre compertion, lots of energy drink sponsors

-negatives, fractured sport, poor coverage

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#2 GSiebert

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 22:54

Bikes. :p

Bikes > anything with 4 wheels.

#3 scheivlak

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 23:01

seems like theres plenty of people upset/disliking aspects of modern f1,

Have a look here: http://forums.autosp...howtopic=148602
The races have never been rated so high as this year quality wise since these threads began.
The 2011 Chinese GP was the highest rated ever - ahead of a bunch of memorable (semi-)wet GPs.
The Monaco GP has high ratings as well so far.

And in some other thread I saw that the overall TV ratings are on a record scale.

#4 BigCHrome

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 23:32

Le Mans cars make me want to throw up. Never knew a race car could be so hideous. Besides the whole thing is so castrated, Mulsanne straight is a joke now.

#5 Ali_G

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 23:33

Autograss Racing.

Visit your local field and watch amateur mechanics battle it out in bodged cars. It's great fun.

#6 Ali_G

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 23:36

Le Mans cars make me want to throw up. Never knew a race car could be so hideous. Besides the whole thing is so castrated, Mulsanne straight is a joke now.


The new cars aren't great. I find the aero on the new R18 to be too fussy. The stabilisation fin also wrecks the look of the new cars.


Most of the Group C cars were nice along with the late 90's GT1 and GTP cars. Really like both the Toyota GT One and the Audi R8C for instance.

Edited by Ali_G, 30 May 2011 - 23:36.


#7 BigCHrome

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Posted 30 May 2011 - 23:42

The new cars aren't great. I find the aero on the new R18 to be too fussy. The stabilisation fin also wrecks the look of the new cars.


Most of the Group C cars were nice along with the late 90's GT1 and GTP cars. Really like both the Toyota GT One and the Audi R8C for instance.


Yes, Group C/GTP cars were majestic.

#8 Red17

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 08:38

Le Mans cars make me want to throw up. Never knew a race car could be so hideous. Besides the whole thing is so castrated, Mulsanne straight is a joke now.

The new Audi's roof has a striking resemblance to the Alpine that won in Le Mans (the thing was suposedly made of silver but didn't help Pironi much in the heat). Group C cars were so much better looking and I still mourn the day they pulled the plug.

The big Le Mans circuit will always be haunted by the big one in 1955 much like that Northen Loop in Germany is. They are always looking for ways to trim down the circuit and if it wasnt for the big fields and the fact that the Bugatti circuit is rated as crap they would have droped it or made a bypass like in Spa.

As for alternatived to F1. There are none at this moment. The FIA has made some good moves in killing any new rising motorsport. They killed Group C, they killed DTM, they sided with IMS to kill Cart and before that there was Bernie's rule of more than 1 GP for almost a year. How they haven't forced the Monte Carlo Rally back into the WRC puzzles me.

#9 ExFlagMan

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 08:53

FF1600 anyone?

#10 RedBaron

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 09:19

There are no alternatives. I like other motorsport, but nothing else has me on the edge of my seat.

#11 differential

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 09:27

There are no alternatives. I like other motorsport, but nothing else has me on the edge of my seat.

I agree with the honourable gentleman.

#12 Rob

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 09:35

Bikes. :p

Bikes > anything with 4 wheels.


I wouldn't necessarily have agreed with you in the past, but it's certainly true now.

F1 has lost its way with gimmicks. KISS - Keep It Simple, Stupid!

#13 lustigson

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 09:51

Formula One has the prestige, history and broad coverage in all kinds of media. It's had a great run of championship fights since at least 2005, and from 2011 it also has the racing. It is, and most likely will remain, the premier open-wheel racing series in the world for the foreseeable future.

Personally, I'm quite attracted to the IndyCar Series, though I only take the effort to watch the Indy 500, since it costs me too much time to watch all races, be it on TV or online. I like the 24 Heures du Mans and the affiliated Le Mans Series', too, but don't watch the races for the same reason. Ditto the DTM, both pre-1997 and current (although I thoroughly dislike the mandatory pitstops).

MotoGP has its charms — quite a lot of them, actually — but I've never been attracted to bike racing in general as I am to cars, both open-wheel and tintops.

#14 Marbles

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 10:21

SCCA regional events often provide the best pure racing that I see all year.

#15 King Six

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 10:22

Bikes. :p

Bikes > anything with 4 wheels.

Oh come on, enough with that myth. I've been watching Bike races for abit now, they're all awful and boring, and slow.

I was watching the Indy but the advert breaks made me switch it off. Plus there wasn't much happening, seemed rather processional for some time. I know I missed all the fun eventually, maybe the current F1 season(s) and the BBC is making me spoiled.

Edited by King Six, 31 May 2011 - 10:24.


#16 Rob

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 10:59

Oh come on, enough with that myth. I've been watching Bike races for abit now, they're all awful and boring, and slow.


What bike racing have you been watching? And since when does slower necessarily mean better?

#17 Disgrace

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:05

Currently, BSB is my second favourite motorsport. It's good fun and the element of danger remains as they should, likewise WSBK is good too. BTCC as well, even if the cars are rubbish. WTCC is castrated by awful cars running on F1-spec circuits, which makes it doubly-dull. MotoGP has lost the plot recently as well with it's dangerous dabble into penalty culture.

Edited by Disgrace, 31 May 2011 - 11:06.


#18 Rob

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:11

MotoGP has lost the plot recently as well with it's dangerous dabble into penalty culture.


Going to the 800cc bikes was a big mistake. Reducing the engine capacity was never going to produce bikes as spectacular as the 990s.

#19 Disgrace

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:13

Going to the 800cc bikes was a big mistake. Reducing the engine capacity was never going to produce bikes as spectacular as the 990s.


That too. 2006 was spectacular, better than the F1 season but every season since has been mediocre. Can't wait for next season though, especially if the Rossi and Ducati gel for a proper assault. :up:

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#20 GSiebert

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:16

Currently, BSB is my second favourite motorsport. It's good fun and the element of danger remains as they should, likewise WSBK is good too.


:up:


#21 ArnageWRC

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:18

As for alternatived to F1. There are none at this moment. The FIA has made some good moves in killing any new rising motorsport. They killed Group C, they killed DTM, they sided with IMS to kill Cart and before that there was Bernie's rule of more than 1 GP for almost a year. How they haven't forced the Monte Carlo Rally back into the WRC puzzles me.


F1 is untouchable! Anything that has looked to threaten it, has swiftly been killed off. And most of this happened under Max’s reign – thanks to BE’s possible influence??
There is lots of great Motorsport – the problem nowadays is lack of mainstream coverage, which means Joe Public/ Mr Sports Editor is only interested in F1 – whereas in years gone by other series had better coverage and interest.
As for the Monte-Carlo Rally – they wanted to run a ‘proper’ event. None of this ‘office hours’ Rallying which the FiA WRC demanded. They found a home in the IRC – which let them do what they wanted – and gave them hours of live TV on Eurosport! It’s up to the FiA/
WRC to make ther series so attractive, the Monte organisers want to come back.



#22 lustigson

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:23

There is lots of great Motorsport – the problem nowadays is lack of mainstream coverage, which means Joe Public/ Mr Sports Editor is only interested in F1 – whereas in years gone by other series had better coverage and interest.

+1

#23 DrF

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 11:52

BTTC:

Pros: incredibly close racing and non stop fun and games, not to mention all the strategy, contoversy and general ego like F1. Free to watch on ITV
Cons: Louise Goodman

NASCAR looks like fun (I've only followed the races Kimi's been in)

Edited by DrF, 31 May 2011 - 11:53.


#24 karne

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 14:27

I watch a bit of NASCAR when I can - I love that Marcos Ambrose is doing well now, but most of the races are at stupid o'clock my time so I don't get to see many of them. Can't wait for the road courses so the Marcos Ambrose School of Road Racing can come into session. Seriously, when the commentators compare Juan Pablo Montoya to Marcos not the other way around, I think it becomes pretty obvious who's the best at road courses! :lol: I love the intensity of the racing, and the presentation of the TV coverage is second to none - smooth, unforced commentators with great chemistry, graphics everywhere that do crazy things, no fewer than six pitlane reporters, and best of all - no token females on their coverage! The girls there know exactly what they're talking about!


I used to watch the V8 Supercars, but I can't anymore. It's so boring, the races are so poor in quality, the technical advances are killing the cars, the tracks are getting to the abysmal stage, and the new crop of drivers isn't all that great. Lowndsey is still my awesome amazing driver, but I'm afraid I can't sit through V8 races just for him. The only V8 race nowadays that I watch is Bathurst - and even that's getting worse since Dunlop are incapable of making proper race tyres.


I used to love watching rallying - especially after I used pacenotes for the first time, it was interesting to hear how the top guys did it - Dad jokes that the way I read the notes sounded very similar to the English-speaking navigators on the WRC coverage :lol: But the TV presentation is poor and the product itself is so rubbish nowadays - hardly any major manufacturers, Loeb is still no. 1 (Atkinson could have changed that, but noooo, he was denied a seat by Mr. I-Can't-Be-Bothered-Trying-In-F1-Anymore Raikkonen).


It's still F1 that does it for me on Sunday nights.

#25 H0R

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 14:35

Indycar. I like the drivers, the races and even the cars are not too bad. Well, I might be the only one around here to like the cars, but anyway.

#26 pingu666

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Posted 31 May 2011 - 14:51

indycar has that lame rule where you cant defend at all, which is ok on ovals where chopping in front of someone will take there air and send them into the wall, but its stupid on road courses

#27 MatsNorway

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:14

http://www.youtube.c...tailpage#t=139s

Don`t forget rallycross. its coming to USA. check out the older races from the 80s as well. turbo porches with 800hp on the gravel.

epic stuff.

Edit: found it. finish mad men in mad porsches.

http://www.youtube.c...feature=related

downsides is ofc that its poor cover of it.

I wish someone uploaded the indycar races on a regular basis on to thepiratebay like the f1 races..

Edited by MatsNorway, 01 June 2011 - 12:38.


#28 ColchesterF1

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:20

Mini Challenge! Not just because i'm part of one of the teams!

#29 krapmeister

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:27

http://www.youtube.c...tailpage#t=139s

Don`t forget rallycross. its coming to USA. check out the older races from the 80s as well. turbo porches with 800hp on the gravel.

epic stuff.


Geez - I would have thought that Kimi would love driving in that sort of thing...

#30 Zarathustra

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:27

I do like IndyCar but the no defending into the corners rule is ridiculous. Nascar is pretty good but the races are too long and there's so many adverts and the cautions get a bit silly sometimes. Also being on Premier Sports is not ideal. TOCA need to sort out the BTCC regs fast because that's going downhill at the moment, somehow viewing figures are up but with the S2000 and NGTC cars and turbo and normally aspirated engines it's a bit of a mess. WTCC is pretty boring, ditto DTM. V8 Supercars are pretty entertaining, especially with a bit of weather but plenty of the drivers seem a bit amateur with over-optimistic passing attempts and stuff. I don't have any real interest in rallying or drag racing. I watch rallycross if it's on Motors or something but I don't get particularly excited about it. I think my favourite stuff though is the Formula Renault, Formula Ford, GP3 etc.

#31 Ali_G

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:49

indycar has that lame rule where you cant defend at all, which is ok on ovals where chopping in front of someone will take there air and send them into the wall, but its stupid on road courses


You'll find that before 1980, these set of rules were the accepted standard in F1 also.

Senna chopping people up by squeezing them at apexs and driving them off the track at the exit is what lead to a steady change in what was acceptable.

#32 ajcrean

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 12:51

Indycar. I like the drivers, the races and even the cars are not too bad. Well, I might be the only one around here to like the cars, but anyway.


You're brave! :-) First time I've heard of someone actually liking those cars...

I'm slowly getting into IndyCar (was a big ChampCar fan but lost interest once they unified.) The driver talent pool is a lot stronger than a decade ago. It's early days but there are encouraging signs that American open-wheel racing is getting back on its feet...

#33 PayasYouRace

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 15:54

You'll find that before 1980, these set of rules were the accepted standard in F1 also.

Senna chopping people up by squeezing them at apexs and driving them off the track at the exit is what lead to a steady change in what was acceptable.


Not quite. There's a difference between driving etiquette of F1 pre-1990's and Indycar's stupid rule.

Example: At the 1979 Dutch GP, Alan Jones defends from Gilles Villeneuve into Tarzan by driving down the inside of the pit straight. Villeneuve still get past round the inside. A totally acceptable piece of defensive driving (no swerving or blocking), yet it would be penalised by Indycar because Jones was simply taking the inside line.

---------------------------------

However, that is about the only thing that bothers me about Indycar today. If by an alternative to F1 you mean top level single-seaters, Indycar is the only game in town and quite fun to watch to boot.

#34 Andrew Hope

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 16:00

If you watch an IndyCar race constantly comparing every second to F1, you're going to be disappointed, but taken for what it is, it's a good series. If you watch it half as a serious racing series, and half as just sheer entertainment, it's a lot of fun, particularly on road courses.

#35 metz

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 16:07

I didn't know what other thread to post this in. This seems the closest. From AMuS Monaco ramblings)

Patrick Head bumped into Bernie on the weekend. He asked BE if it's true that he may be buying back F1.
He said "Surely you are not doing it with your own money?"
As Bernie laughed, he added "What would you do with it if you DID get it back?"
Bernie smiled and said "I'd give it to the teams."

:lol: Now, there is revenge for you!

#36 Ali_G

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 16:25

Not quite. There's a difference between driving etiquette of F1 pre-1990's and Indycar's stupid rule.

Example: At the 1979 Dutch GP, Alan Jones defends from Gilles Villeneuve into Tarzan by driving down the inside of the pit straight. Villeneuve still get past round the inside. A totally acceptable piece of defensive driving (no swerving or blocking), yet it would be penalised by Indycar because Jones was simply taking the inside line.


Surely you can't get done in Indycar for taking an alternative line down the straight ?

#37 PayasYouRace

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 16:33

Surely you can't get done in Indycar for taking an alternative line down the straight ?


Yes you can. They divide all the braking zones into 2 "lanes": inside and outside. If you take the inside lane, you are considered to be blocking. It's that bad.

#38 Group B

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 16:38

There are no alternatives. I like other motorsport, but nothing else has me on the edge of my seat.

Agreed, yet I'm not sure why. My point is, if we watched it without knowing it was the 'pinnacle of motorsport' would we actually enjoy it anymore than some other top formulas?

#39 pingu666

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Posted 01 June 2011 - 18:33

i cant enjoy indycar with that stupid rule, because all i want todo is smash brian barnhearts head against a wall while shouting "how can you be so ****ing stupid"

F1 has some magic too it, but its also because we know quite abit about the teams and drivers.