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F1 2011


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#1 Mastah

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 09:11

Screens:

https://www.facebook...993.74881132059

Previews:

http://www.videogame...eview-3012.html
http://www.eurogamer...f1-2011-preview
http://www.computera...aster-stronger/

Edited by Mastah, 03 June 2011 - 09:41.


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#2 pRy

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 10:20

Sounds like they're putting in a lot of the stuff that was missing from the original such as mechanical failures, day/night change etc etc.

#3 DanardiF1

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 11:11

Looks pretty snazzy at the moment, let's hope it's the big leap from 2010 people are expecting. 2010 was a very good game for a first F1 effort, and now it's something to build on and improve...

#4 pRy

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 11:37

I don't see how it can be a big leap really. It will just be new cars, a few new tracks, a few features they wanted to put in F12010 and ran out of time and perhaps some tweaks to the graphics. But I'm expecting it to just be an expansion pack really.

#5 karlth

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 12:52

Even more impressive canned spins? :|



#6 King Six

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 19:18

I don't see how it can be a big leap really. It will just be new cars, a few new tracks, a few features they wanted to put in F12010 and ran out of time and perhaps some tweaks to the graphics. But I'm expecting it to just be an expansion pack really.

This is what I've been thinking too. It's going to retail at full price though, that's for sure.

If F1 2010 was open to the modding community, there would have been a proper 2011 total conversion out already
I guess that's why it wasn't, and why alot of games these days are so closed off for modding.

Edited by King Six, 03 June 2011 - 19:18.


#7 olliek88

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Posted 03 June 2011 - 21:35

I don't see how it can be a big leap really. It will just be new cars, a few new tracks, a few features they wanted to put in F12010 and ran out of time and perhaps some tweaks to the graphics. But I'm expecting it to just be an expansion pack really.


Ye of little faith, i think it will be a definite improvement over last years, 2010 was a good first effort for a console game, it had flaws sure but it gets more playable the more effort you put into it and tweak your FFB settings and stuff, i think 2011 will be very good, but thats just my opinion, the proof is in the pudding.

#8 Meanbeakin

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 00:30

Sounds like multiplayer is going to be a big leap. Not sure why they don't include Hockenheim and Nurburgring and if you do a championship just alternate the races from year to year.

I can only think there'll be an option for DRS to be automatic at least during practice and quali, I'm a keyboard player and I'd run out of fingers trying to use both DRS and KERS. Just with this years rules though it sounds like it'll be a pretty cool game. And thank you for mechanical failures and here's hoping the timing system isn't such a joke and you can actually hop aboard AI cars.

#9 Kvothe

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 01:27

8 minute interview about the game:

http://vgtap.com/new...ds-for-f1-2011/

#10 SRi130Brett

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 11:29

Even more impressive canned spins? :|


Thats the one thing they need to fix more than anything else. Totally ruins the game for me, some corners you cant take the correct line or you will just soin of in a bizzarre and unnatural way.

#11 Lights

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 11:39

I remember how a year ago all those previews and interviews gave such a positive feeling. How misleading was that, not gonna fall for that again.

#12 wattoroos

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 12:37

Thats the one thing they need to fix more than anything else. Totally ruins the game for me, some corners you cant take the correct line or you will just soin of in a bizzarre and unnatural way.

been playing the game a bit lately getting back into it, upto singapore but not only singapore but other tracks like catalunya, when you are on the racing line and go over a kerb trying to take the right line or just taking a line close to the line normally results in a spin which makes you less confident in taking the racing line, also they need other cars to retire imo its the worst part of the game mechanical failure, accidents, crashes other than just those spins which only happen a t particular tracks in particular areas. sorry about the rant but i was in the mood cause i had these experiences today

#13 Ise

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Posted 04 June 2011 - 13:39

If F1 2010 was open to the modding community, there would have been a proper 2011 total conversion out already
I guess that's why it wasn't, and why alot of games these days are so closed off for modding.


This has already been done on PC versions of the game, albiert recently and with some tweaking still needed to be done. Only things that are missing entirely are updated car designs and the Indian GP course, both are excuseable though.

http://www.virtualr....-2010-released/

Edited by Ise, 04 June 2011 - 13:43.


#14 karlth

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 08:48

What F1 2011 did well was the weather effects, graphics and sounds. It needs major improvements in force feedback and physics to be considered a real racing game by simulator fanatics.

Then again the game was successful without that simulator element so they could just spend their time on improving the more casual parts.

#15 A3

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 16:12

I remember how a year ago all those previews and interviews gave such a positive feeling. How misleading was that, not gonna fall for that again.


+1

#16 pRy

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 16:33

Yep I had the exact same thought. 'Oh an interview'. I didn't even bother clicking.

#17 judd

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 20:02

I hope the driving physics are improved...

#18 pRy

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 20:05

I wouldn't get your hopes up.

#19 judd

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 20:13

I know, i read about the problems with F1 2010 but i still bought it. Other games have the physics but this has the career mode I was after.

would just be nice if it had both!

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#20 chrisblades85

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Posted 07 June 2011 - 22:22

I'm going to wait what others say 1st, this year. I bought it straight away last year. And was disappointed. Only played it for a week and ended up swapping it for GT5, when that came out.

#21 pRy

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Posted 08 June 2011 - 10:22

I'm going to wait what others say 1st, this year. I bought it straight away last year. And was disappointed. Only played it for a week and ended up swapping it for GT5, when that came out.


Probably best to wait a week or so. Even the first reviews by fans can be deceptive.

I did get quite a lot of hours out of F1 2010 so as a game it did it's job.. it kept me entertained. So I'm not totally against the idea of buying F12011.

#22 Matt Somers

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Posted 08 June 2011 - 15:32

In the interviews done recently they say that the physics of the game (handling) has been changed so no more stupid spins on kerbs that should be able to be took flat. Apparently the game will drive more like a real life car rather than us having to work out to handle a car in the game world. I'm personally back playing F1 2010 as I spent most of the first months of its life sat in the box in the Shadow of FIFA 11. Not being able to hold slides you could in the real world is one of my biggest frustrations.

#23 Matt Somers

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Posted 08 June 2011 - 15:34

Oh yea forgot to say, this year will have 2 player split screen mode :) and 2 player career mode :)

Also they are trying to be cagey over the whole scenario but I think safety cars may be making an outing :)

#24 Meanbeakin

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Posted 09 June 2011 - 05:09

If they're still cagey about the Safety Car I could see it potentially being buggy if they do decide to include it. I couldn't see the rest of the game being as buggy as F1 2010 was though, remember F1 2010 was CodeMasters first serious attempt at an F1 outing. Plus the fact they spent so little time on an upgrade patch for 2010 means they've been working on 2011 for a while now.

#25 wattoroos

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Posted 09 June 2011 - 08:42

Oh yea forgot to say, this year will have 2 player split screen mode :) and 2 player career mode :)

Also they are trying to be cagey over the whole scenario but I think safety cars may be making an outing :)

im really looking forward to multiplayer career i think its excellent plus i can prove to my brother that i am more superior at this game ;)
Also with the safety car, it would probaly only be out for a lap or two. but if they have no retirements like in f1 2010(another stupid thing) it will never come out. also with the safety car it should be like real f1 look at the stats at where it normally comes out like a 95% chance at monaco but at bahrain like a 10% chance i dont want the safety car to be over used which is one of my fears with it

#26 pRy

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Posted 10 June 2011 - 13:55

Heads up.. codemasters.com has been hacked and it sounds like pretty much everything taken:

On Friday 3rd June, unauthorised entry was gained to our Codemasters.com website. As soon as the intrusion was detected, we immediately took codemasters.com and associated web services offline in order to prevent any further intrusion.

During the days since the attack we have conducted a thorough investigation in order to ascertain the extent and scope of the breach and have regrettably discovered that the intruder was able to gain access to the following:

Codemasters.com website

Access to the Codemasters corporate website and sub-domains.

DiRT 3 VIP code redemption page

Access to the DiRT 3 VIP code redemption page.

The Codemasters EStore

We believe the following have been compromised: Customer names and addresses, email addresses, telephone numbers, encrypted passwords and order history. Please note that no personal payment information was stored with Codemasters as we use external payment providers, meaning your payment details were not at risk from this intrusion.

Codemasters CodeM database

Members' names, usernames, screen names, email addresses, date of birth, encrypted passwords, newsletter preferences, any biographies entered by users, details of last site activity, IP addresses and Xbox Live Gamertags are all believed to have been compromised.

Whilst we do not have confirmation that any of this data was actually downloaded onto an external device, we have to assume that, as access was gained, all of these details were compromised and/or stolen.

The Codemasters.com website will remain offline for the foreseeable future with all Codemasters.com traffic re-directed to the Codemasters Facebook page instead. A new website will launch later in the year.



#27 Mastah

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 17:36

First dev diary, starts 7:03:

http://uk.gamespot.c...s/start-select/

#28 dank

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 18:05

Loving this comment on the Eurogamer website:

F**k this. As a consumer, I don't appreciate being part of an unpaid QA team. The amount of bugs F1 2010 shipped with was pathetic, and the fact that they've moved on to the next game without bothering to fix half of them is about as shit as you could treat your customers.

If this sells well it just sends a message to developers that they can release their games in whatever state they want and people will lap them up (see what I did there). Then they'll go mental over the sequel as well. It's the end of QA as we know it.


:up:

#29 y2cragie

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 21:15

Loving this comment on the Eurogamer website:



:up:

So what they are saying is, codemasters are like most of the back of the grid teams, oh and mercedes gp... ahem lol

#30 HAM

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 22:45

They should fixed some issues with F1 2010 before thinking people would pre order F1 2011. -100

THEY SHOULD PUT A SAVE REPLAY MODE PLUS A GHOSTCAR OFF MODE.

2 important things to not f.ck up the game again. I will only buy F1 2011 if the game has these 2 options. Lol

#31 HoldenRT

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 22:45

I remember how a year ago all those previews and interviews gave such a positive feeling. How misleading was that, not gonna fall for that again.

I didn't fall for it.. I stayed away from the hype.. now I've finally started playing and it's amazing. I'm curious why some of you are guys are negative?

Has the new toys polish worn off? Are you not quick enough? Cause there will always be someone out there quicker. Bloody aliens.

There's a few things that bug me, but overall this feels to me like rfactor or F1 challenge with eye candy. Reduced features (failures, simplified setups, no spectating or chatting with others unless they are on your friends list) etc but overall pretty bloody good. The lack of league races (12 people) is a bummer. Not being able to spectate others, especially if you've crashed out of the race is pretty stupid.

Overall best F1 game/sim I've ever driven for modern F1 cars (I haven't used iRacings F1 car tho). Since 2005 onwards ie the modern high downforce ridiculous effeciency cars. And I have seen just as much arcadeness in those sims when people allow "tc, abs and stability control". In other words, rFactor becomes an arcade game too.

The best sims I've ever driven are GTR and iRacing because majority of people online raced with aids off, otherwise it attracts a clumsy sort of racing where people can't run consistant times or drive unrealistic times due to aids. For league races rFactor was the best, the netcode and core engine is great.

Racing online in this one is similar to rFactor public but it's very fun. Simulated tyre wear and fuel loads for 10 or 20 laps. And there is WET RACING, haven't had that in F1's since F1 Challenge and I don't see any difficulty in terms of the hardness of that vs this. Except everything in this is better. All of the setup options react the same way as any other game/sim I've used. :confused: There's just less of them and the car is more optimised towards each track but the default setup still sucks, I guess that one is universal.

You can send others real life simulated Motec telemetry of rFactor laps but that's a bit of a moot point, no one cares about that stuff anyway.

Codemasters engine makes alot less calculations for phsyics then the other sims, I get that.. but the core feel from track to track combined with setups seems very good. :confused:

Rear brakes lock, adusting rear bias helps turn in, you can brake traction and spin if you have an edgy setup (I like anti roll bars 7 and 5) on lower fuel.. your actually trying to break traction on fast laps for best exit, but everything is the opposite in the race to prevent slip and wear. You can't just mash throttle or brake, trailbraking is rewarded..accuracy in driving lines is rewarded.. the cutting and curbs in some parts are VERY strict like there is one strict line or way to hit a curb. You have to balance the weight of the car with the pedals just like any sim. Shifting weight fowards helps fast corners, lowering ride hieght helps downforce but bottoms out. Car understeers on full tanks, the feel evolves over the course of a stint, everything feels right.

Sorry for rambling, I'm sure most of you guys know this stuff I am just excited I haven't had so much fun racing F1's online in 2 or 3 years.

Edited by HoldenRT, 23 June 2011 - 22:53.


#32 HoldenRT

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 23:40

I've noticed racing those quick races seems to attract the most idiots, it's no tyre wear, no damage so it's like 3 laps of fantasy/time trial laps.. usually only 3 or 4 people, unrealistic setups and I've noticed alot of people go out of their way to bump you into the gravel so you won't race them back or maybe it's just they want a buffer incase they make a mistake. That combined with how the gravel makes you instantly spin all the time is pretty arcade and retarded.

And then the Custom GP's you can have 10% or 20% races, with rain and tyre wear and full fulls simulated.. aids reduced or off and attracts a completely different type of racer. These are the rooms where I've seen 12 people racing as well, yesterday there was one were all 12 people had a rating over 20. I've seen some clumsy racing in this as well but it doesn't seem as deliberate and alot of the time (especially the fast guys) are very careful around other cars and are patient in their race craft. You can even play with the strategies.. starting on the harder tyre, or pitting early to avoid traffic whatever. 80% of the races I've done have been like this and even though it's not even a week yet it's pretty rewarding.. considering you can just show up randomly and not have to sign up or anything. At Turkey yesterday a 20 % race and after everyone pitted it was like everyone ended up within the same 3 second part of the track. 3 wide at times but the race was decided in a proper way, no dirtyness so that was nice to see.

So it's a bit like the internet in general, go looking for educational material you will find it, go lookig for porn or pics of cats doing funny things, you will find it. All sims bar iRacing have had this problem though. It's good in a way, sometimes you just want a quick "muckaround" but then I guess you can't complain if somoene smashes you into the gravel.

I hate how you get random cars in some rooms though, what's up with the Merc. The horns on it make it hard to see apexes or curbs.. couldn't they have lowered the head height slightly to compensate.

#33 karlth

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Posted 23 June 2011 - 23:54

I'm curious why some of you are guys are negative?


In my case it was lack of feedback from the wheel and canned(scripted) physics.






#34 mtknot

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 15:58

The dev diary seems to address some niggles that worked against F1 2010:

Main things:
-Handling, notice the one wheel lockup on schumacher's car, the car behaves more like an open wheel car now it seems, the driving shows a lot of correction needed; something which was absent from last year.We saw schumacher overdriving.

-Gear shift: sounds already sound a lot better, gearshifting sounds are immediate, also would suggest no more odd physics with gearshifting and canned physics.

Minor things:
-Custom steering wheels
-Camera behaviour seems a lot better; although i'd quickly dump it for a TV camera :D

I have a feeling they had to completely rewrite the physics for this game.



#35 DanardiF1

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 16:38

In my case it was lack of feedback from the wheel and canned(scripted) physics.


I did feel like the steering was a bit 'dead', but having really enjoyed the feedback from Codies other titles I perhaps saw it as more an F1 thing than a problem. Just their idea of what F1 handling was like based on their research etc.

It sort of creates the feeling that your car is not really planted (to me at least), and everything's a bit too light, even for an F1 car...

Not a complaint, just an observation, I love the game and play it regularly still...

#36 Collective

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 16:50

I've noticed racing those quick races seems to attract the most idiots, it's no tyre wear, no damage so it's like 3 laps of fantasy/time trial laps.. usually only 3 or 4 people, unrealistic setups and I've noticed alot of people go out of their way to bump you into the gravel so you won't race them back or maybe it's just they want a buffer incase they make a mistake. That combined with how the gravel makes you instantly spin all the time is pretty arcade and retarded.


Most of the times they are idiots who have no idea of where the break points are.

#37 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 17:22

In my case it was lack of feedback from the wheel and canned(scripted) physics.

I don't understand what that means. I sort of get the force feedback, good thing about rF is the .plr file has finite adjustable parameters. I think I have wheel weight (which is like a dead consistant force) at 20 or 30%, and the feedback effects very high like 80%. It's seems to increase the feeling of the road in your hands but at times there's not enough resistance (inconsistant) and if you increase the wheel weight it sort of deadens out the feedback itself (a bit). Bit of a comprimise and not ideal.

I don't understand what canned physics means though.

All of the issues I've seen with spins or hitting the curb the wrong way I've had in every other sim. Things like hitting the inside curb at the wrong angle or whatever, being in too low a gear. Had that all the way back in GTR. Then GTR2 came out it had more grip on traction like this game does and people complained of it being dumbed down, so it's hard to win. In this you have to hit some corners at the right angle or it's a spin out of nowhere but I've seen this in all the others. Or have the car weighted a certain way (like making sure you are on throttle at certain points to compress rear suspension a bit). And in terms of correcting the spins (like tapping the brake + opposite lock) that's the same as well. I don't know if it's realstic but all sims have it.

On a seperate issue the tracks for most tracks are the best I've ever driven. Especially ones which have bad existing "sim" ones like Spain and Monaco. rF's Spain is awful. Monaco is one of my fave tracks (did a 1.13.5 in TT mode yesterday which I think is top 600 or so) and it's the most accurate I've ever seen. Worth the price of the game alone, just to be driving it by myself messing with setups. It was a good point in the other thread about Silverstone, S1 is like learning a new fantasy sort of track but on most tracks it's a very accurate representation. Especially for Abu Dahbi (which looks stunning) Valencia, Korea and Singapore. The fast chicane in Melbourne you can mow the inside curb where as in rFactor it'd be instant spin as it'd unsettle the suspenson so it goes both ways. There's a few curbs which are supposed to be low and flat so you can mow them and they are a bit higher.. but overall it's like 20 tracks so a few nit picks here or there isn't that big of a deal. Some like Monaco are near dead on IMO. rF's Monaco is EMG Monaco which is a conversion from F1 Challenge with new textures. Silverstone is probably the one where I'd rather be driving rF's version but a part of that is the new layout, S1 IS butchered though.

One of the worst things about other sims/mods is how mismatched the tracks and mods are.. they are like someone's best guess matched with someone else's best guess, where as everything in this has been optimised to work within itself. That's where IRacing is also good. Ant Davison and the teams seem to do a good job optimising it etc. IMO they have a poorer core engine (other then the eye candy) but it's much more optimised and tweaked.. if only they were using rF's engine.

One of the things I love about time trial mode is the ability to race against the people on your friends list even if they are offline. It's been the easiest way for me to catch up for lost time in terms of editting setups and just hitting esc to get back to the pits.. not having to do outlaps. I've noticed in the last 2 or 3 days most gained time is from my driving improving (especially braking right to the apex in heavy braking zones) but the setup does help but only if you know which parts of the track you are helping or hurting yourself in different areas. To be able to take advantage. The ghost times of the fast guys really help with that to see where you can gain on them or lose out. I stiffened up the setup for Sepang and went 3 tenths quicker even though I was doing the same line and braking/turn in points just because it was more responsive to fast weight changes. But I softened it up for Monaco and gained alot of pliance with the road especially over bumps and gained time in S3. Had no problem feeling the bumps or car behiavior through the wheel. I used to drive a Momo on older sims so maybe if it's inferior feedback it just seems better because it's G25.

Will probably gain more time by default in the near future because haven't enough touched the camber/toe settings yet and stil need experience. So far I've really improved my laptimes alot but it mainly just seems to be the same fundamental things that are the same in all sims. Get your car stable turning in here.. brake a bit later there.. carry more speed into here.. get a better exit there.. every corner is like a puzzle that needs figuring out and the time trials just speeds up the process. And getting to understand what changes are needed for each track etc. These cars do have ridiculous grip even with low wings but a part of that is the double diffusers and those low wing settings while great in time trials are very bad on long stints with full fuel loads and tyre wear. Seems the wings are more for fine tuning balance then overall downforce (which is predetermined by the car you drive, and the aero kit they've brough to the race weekend). Reducing rear wing should make it harder to go through fast corners but sometimes it can actually help the balance and make you carry more speed instead of understeering wide. The difference between wings and mechanical setup is bigger then other sims but it seems more accurate in this way (with the modern cars at least). More wing doesn't help you in slow corners and you can't use it as a blanket fix for bad balance like in other sims.

I realise I take all this a bit too seriously (and waffle on too much) but nothing hits the spot for me more then F1 cars and tracks.. the same stuff that we all love to watch/talk about on here so much. Alot more of a thrill then Meganes or V8 Supercars. In a long race with tyre wear and fuel on I can barely "attack" and keep it on the road at the same time let alone for 60 laps and yet these guys do all of that while experiences the G forces, talking to their teams on radio, making constant changes to DRS and KERS and differential and engine modes.. plus oil transfers etc. Crazy. Plus they have the pressure of being watched by millions and they can't hit restart and try again if they fail. Limited practice time and testing too! Still it's a nice way to be able to appreciate better what they do and feel a bit of it yourself.

IMO the gap between "casual games" and "sims" has closed right up in the last few years.

Edited by HoldenRT, 24 June 2011 - 17:26.


#38 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 17:25

I know I waffle on too much.. if you don't read the long message I apologise at the bottom but jsut apologising again incase you don't read that far. :lol: I just love this stuff too much. :well:

Most of the times they are idiots who have no idea of where the break points are.

You could be right. Even more fun is you can argue with them through windows live messages.

Quick races are sort of like those stupid arguements at the bottom of youtube videos.

I guess it's just a place for people to pretend it's Need for Speed?


#39 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 17:36

My windows live name is MarkWebbo (lame I know) if you want to add me.

Once people are on your friends list, you can race against their ghost times in time trial mode even if they are offline or sleeping on the other side of the world, so that's pretty cool. :) I mainly just love the TT's because it's a quick easy way to fine tune the setups for online races (like a good base before adding more wing or whatever if it's a full fuel race). But seeing where you can gain or lose time against the other times in certain corners. It's complete banzai but it's a nice "fantasy" way to find the limit of setups or tracks. The Casino Square in Monaco for example is pretty crazy when you nail it. It's really helped to learn the tracks quicker for me because some like Valencia or Singapore or Korea.. completely lost. In Korea, even with the ghosts it's still pretty bad (I spin on the turnin for that hairpin in S1 nearly every time) but it still helps a bit. It really helped with Valencia which is good because everyone seems to be racing it the last few days (wonder why :p)..



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#40 Lights

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 18:02

I know I waffle on too much.. if you don't read the long message I apologise at the bottom but jsut apologising again incase you don't read that far. :lol: I just love this stuff too much. :well:

I've noticed... I actually read most of it, and overall it's not like you're wrong or anything. Compared to other games it has it's ups and downs.

Myself, I grew up with F12002 and F1c. Since 2006 I only really race with rFactor online. I saw F12010 as a good alternative, especially to drive some offline races. The concept of live the life was nice. But when I tried it I was disappointed by the feeling in car control, the AI, and the many bugs.

I'm still believe that they will improve the game a lot for F12011. But this year I won't just take their words for granted.

#41 DanardiF1

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 18:33

My windows live name is MarkWebbo (lame I know) if you want to add me.

Once people are on your friends list, you can race against their ghost times in time trial mode even if they are offline or sleeping on the other side of the world, so that's pretty cool. :) I mainly just love the TT's because it's a quick easy way to fine tune the setups for online races (like a good base before adding more wing or whatever if it's a full fuel race). But seeing where you can gain or lose time against the other times in certain corners. It's complete banzai but it's a nice "fantasy" way to find the limit of setups or tracks. The Casino Square in Monaco for example is pretty crazy when you nail it. It's really helped to learn the tracks quicker for me because some like Valencia or Singapore or Korea.. completely lost. In Korea, even with the ghosts it's still pretty bad (I spin on the turnin for that hairpin in S1 nearly every time) but it still helps a bit. It really helped with Valencia which is good because everyone seems to be racing it the last few days (wonder why :p)..


I glad someone enjoys this game as much as I did... the tracks are achingly gorgeous, the bumps and rises are all there, and the handling model is a difficult one to master, even if it is perhaps a little off in it's feel etc.

As for setups etc., I've not really been able to get ones to work for certain tracks, whatever car I'm in. I have struggled in qualifying at Silverstone and Suzuka, only to make places up in race (Suzuka only), and I've done these races in Career in pretty much every car on the grid, from Ferrari to Hispania (who I'm driving for atm)... sometimes I make changes and they don't feel to me to have any effect, and don't impact on the laptime... but it's all motivation to learn more and get better :)

#42 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 22:53

I appreciate that everyone can have opinions I just fail to see how it's off. (I'm open to possibilities, I am not saying I'm definately right or anything just my impressions of my own experiecnes) Is it too easy or too hard?

I've driven harder sims, I've driven easier sims. 2005RH mod in F1C which was great (but not applicable to compare as v10's different aero, TC etc) and ISI BMW Sauber mod and CTDP 2006 were good. And random ones like FSOne (hate), F1C itself (the orignal cars).. this seems universal or similar to all of them. As in the same rules apply. Especailly the wet races, I really can't tell a difference between this and F1C's wet races. I just know that this one tallies best with what I've seen on onboards over the last few years. Especially since TC was banned. I always download at least 3 or 4 onboards every race from a certain website I can't name just as a reference, just as a hobby. But forgetting that, there is also YT. I even watched some 2010 pole laps on YT yesterday. Not seeing any big red flags.. like "that should be easier" "or that should be harder". Granted I have never driven the cars or "felt them", only watched from the TV cameras.

I've never driven an F1 mod where you can mash the throttle on low fuel without insta spinning the car gets so light and twitchy. On this one you can floor the throttle in a straight line and the car will spin the wheels but stay reasonably straight. All other F1 mods, you mash the throttle in a straight line but it still wants to spin. They do this under the SC all the time in real life with aggressive steering and spinning the wheels without spinning, and even now with TC banned, they deliberately try to get some slip to help the exits. Did you see Webber at the last race? How much he spun his wheels in the traction zones but the car wasn't spinning. In other F1 mods I've driven you try to do that and it aquaplanes off like Massa did. I'm not talking about making "wheel corrections" I am talking is just spins straight on into the wall or grass unless the wheel is dead straight and your on 20% throttle. Then you watch TV and they are just so planted with low temps under SC. This was one of the talking points of GTR2 vs GTR. The traction was more like in this one. Some said it was dumbed down, some said it was more realistic. Some people have different expectations regardless if they've never driven the real thing. :well: I hadn't watched GT's on TV so I had no idea, I just liked that it was a sim that had online races with big grids, tyre wear, fuel strategies, 30 or 60 min races etc. You can still spin the car in this, and you can still spin the car in GTR2 but there is a wider window to work with and you can "play with it" a bit.. and correct slides easier. Unless the tyres are worn or it's wet.

#43 pRy

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 22:57

Nice to see they've thrown in some celebration graphics.

#44 HoldenRT

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Posted 24 June 2011 - 23:22

I'm sure everyone doesn't want to hear stories of every race I've ever had (like a racing diary :lol: ) but it's only been a week so I am still very excited.

Today I've had 2 great races.. 17 laps (30% I think) at Valencia with tyre wear, fuel loads and qualifying etc. Full 12 people in the room both times although a couple were new so let's say 8. Medium skill level, not aliens.

Protip - On the slow right hand corner after you go over the bridge.. I couldn't drive that corner a few days ago without spinning 5/10 or running wide the other 4/10. Similar to the corners in between the Loews hairpin and the tunnel at Monaco and also the first hairpin at Korea I'd lift off throttle and spin. You can't change diff settings in the game either. By memory I think you'd be trying to incrase the coast % or the preload? Anyway.. If you keep 10 or 20% throttle through the entry of the corner it will keep more wiehgt on the rear axle and it won't go light and spin. Staying in the higher gear like 2nd helps as well. I don't know if it's realistic but it seems to work. For the corner at Valencia.. I found in time trials that staying to the left and then turning hard and sharp for a late apex is really needed and also to not get onto the power too early as it leads onto the long straight. I hated that corner but it seems fine now.

So for these two races.. a few days ago I couldn't do 3 laps at Valencia in a row without spinning. I got pole position both times (wtf). 1:40ish. In the second race's quali, I went P1 with 5 mins to go and then it started raining... WTF how cool is that? :eek: The second race was a bit Vettelish and I had the experience of the first race to help with tyre wear and not overdriving but the first one was a cracker.

Got a bad start as always and was 3rd or 4th after the first corner chaos. If your not going to be at the front your always better off hanging back and waiting for everyone to crash IMO. :lol:

Had the soft tyres in the first stint but the Ferrari had the hards on. There was 3 of us within 2 or 3 seconds for the first stint. We both pitted were badly worn tyres (I overdrove on them and spun the tyres way too much) on lap 6 or 7 leaving 10 or so laps on the harder tyre. I coulnd't even drive a lap on this tyre a few days ago, but fortunately my setup and understand of this track is better now. The Ferrari stayed out and ended up pitting with 6 or 7 laps left to go. Sort of like Webber's strategy in China.

So there was 6 or 7 laps to go.. I was on the yellow worn harder tyre and he had fresher soft tyres although he'd done maybe 2 or 3 laps and maybe they'd gone yellow. It was a great test and experience, it may as well had been raining.. had to be accel gradually and smooth etc. With two laps to go the tyres were orange wear and I made a mistake in the 3rd sector and he ended up winning by 2 secs. But it was a great race to be chased down, trying to hold on with those worn slippery tyres. The polar opposite of a qualifying lap, had to be so smooth and on rails but the car kept getting lighter of fuel and the tyres kept getting worse and worse. I also learned about how the fast engine mode can wear tyres more as well (I used to have same problem in RF).

In the second race alot of people seemed to leave and my tyres only went into yellow wear with 2 or 3 laps left, so the overdriving really does crush them.. Or maybe it was the dirty air that hurt them? There is an art in this game to being fast and smooth. Much more important in 2010 compared to 2006 rules for example.. I loved 2006 and "sprint" F1. Anyway it was the first time I've experienced the wear properly without making errors or spinning etc. A time trial lap is very different to consistant "in the groove" pace so yeah, very rewarding and fun. So these were like little mini league races and I haven't had so much fun in a long time.

#45 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 00:07

Forgot to mention that it was crucial to be able to feel the slip on the rear tyres when I was in the first race during the last 6 or so laps.. with the harder tyre, once it went into orange wear it was like ice and I could feel in the wheel when it started to break traction. And any slide or spin just made it worse. Especially with Valencia some of those corners your in a traction zone and turning at the same time, like the slow right left in S2. Very tricky. Maybe it's my settings or maybe it's the Logitech profiler settings that's helping to compensate. I think just turning down the wheel weight and the others up helps alot though. The FF felt pretty good.

For more on topic discussion.. I'm a bit worried about the Pirelli's in the game for 2011 because already in 2010 juggling the tyre wear seems tricky. And this was the season where the tyres "lasted too long" and like Vettel in Monza could have done the whole race on one tyre. Webber in Hungary was similar with that stint where he pulled out the gap vs Alonso. Those were the super durable tyres but already they don't feel so durable when your race is condensed down to 20 or 30%.

It's hard to image how they could simulate that in the game.. you'd be pitting every 2nd lap. Already in 2010 it seems pretty good. It's hard but the main thing that makes it hard IMO is the huge difference in feel going from a full races worth of fuel down to empty. In 2006 or 2007 in rF mods.. I remember one stopping in a 50% league race.. that was around 140 or 150L for a stint, it felt like an understeering pig in the early laps. And that's only half the fuel they run these days. You have to try an optimise it for all phases of the race which is practically impossible. Hence how Ferrari can qualify far back yet seem really quick in the race.

It's tough enough as it is though with these fuel loads and parc ferme, the Pirelli's are great for us as viewers but for the computer we don't need it to be so realistic.

#46 Mary Popsins

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 06:44

I expect the next livery to come with some legend racing because I can't be bothered with half of the current tracks, and I won't even mention the cars. This said, I feel pretty relaxed when I compare my G25 to Webber's wheel..

#47 Sevach

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 15:36

I appreciate that everyone can have opinions I just fail to see how it's off. (I'm open to possibilities, I am not saying I'm definately right or anything just my impressions of my own experiecnes) Is it too easy or too hard?

I've driven harder sims, I've driven easier sims. 2005RH mod in F1C which was great (but not applicable to compare as v10's different aero, TC etc) and ISI BMW Sauber mod and CTDP 2006 were good. And random ones like FSOne (hate), F1C itself (the orignal cars).. this seems universal or similar to all of them. As in the same rules apply. Especailly the wet races, I really can't tell a difference between this and F1C's wet races. I just know that this one tallies best with what I've seen on onboards over the last few years. Especially since TC was banned. I always download at least 3 or 4 onboards every race from a certain website I can't name just as a reference, just as a hobby. But forgetting that, there is also YT. I even watched some 2010 pole laps on YT yesterday. Not seeing any big red flags.. like "that should be easier" "or that should be harder". Granted I have never driven the cars or "felt them", only watched from the TV cameras.

I've never driven an F1 mod where you can mash the throttle on low fuel without insta spinning the car gets so light and twitchy. On this one you can floor the throttle in a straight line and the car will spin the wheels but stay reasonably straight. All other F1 mods, you mash the throttle in a straight line but it still wants to spin. They do this under the SC all the time in real life with aggressive steering and spinning the wheels without spinning, and even now with TC banned, they deliberately try to get some slip to help the exits. Did you see Webber at the last race? How much he spun his wheels in the traction zones but the car wasn't spinning. In other F1 mods I've driven you try to do that and it aquaplanes off like Massa did. I'm not talking about making "wheel corrections" I am talking is just spins straight on into the wall or grass unless the wheel is dead straight and your on 20% throttle. Then you watch TV and they are just so planted with low temps under SC. This was one of the talking points of GTR2 vs GTR. The traction was more like in this one. Some said it was dumbed down, some said it was more realistic. Some people have different expectations regardless if they've never driven the real thing. :well: I hadn't watched GT's on TV so I had no idea, I just liked that it was a sim that had online races with big grids, tyre wear, fuel strategies, 30 or 60 min races etc. You can still spin the car in this, and you can still spin the car in GTR2 but there is a wider window to work with and you can "play with it" a bit.. and correct slides easier. Unless the tyres are worn or it's wet.


Well, it has to do with expectations, i have tried Ferrari virtual academy and it's more in line of what i expect of a beast that has 750+ hp and weights 620 (???) kilos.
The car is a lot more "violent" in it's reactions in that game, specially the brakes, i don't think F1 2010 is terrible like some people make it to be, but i don't think you can make the case for it as one of the top sims in the world.

And... no, you can't simply floor it and hope for the best in FVA :cool:

With that said, i like what i'm seeing from F1 2011 (very superficial info so far, i know), the Schumacher lock up followed by opposite lock was just beautiful, something that was very absent on 2010.

Edited by Sevach, 25 June 2011 - 15:42.


#48 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 20:15

I just haven't be able to find any specific data or info on it tho, just like vague or blanket comments. I guess I should have a look on rscnet and the like and try to find out more. I've been out of the sim loop for 12 or 18 months or so, first I've heard of that Ferrari academy will have to have a look.

I am very anal about this stuff though. My first proper sim (I don't consider F1C a proper sim as it was very dated and simplistic even though telemetry and setup wise it was great) was GTR and I spent 1000 laps at Spa offline in practice mode just to learn every aspect of the car setup. Reading the definitions, and changing it back and forth to learn the feel of both. To be able to FEEL the differences, rather then words on a page. Even once I hit the tracks online there was a steep learning curve and the biggest improvements came from driving against fast people, sharing setups with them and just immersing myself with them in general. Those first offline laps helped learn certain habits though rather then jumping straight in and ruining everyone's races. A setup you made for yourself will always work better then one that somebody else made for you (and for their style).

Then I loved GTR so much I craved for F1's (the reason I like sims at all) within the same engine so I convered a Williams F1 car over from F1C.. F1C, GTR and rFactor all run on basically the same engine. The same file formats for tyres, physics, engine etc. I even made a F1 2006 mod at one point for F1C because I wanted to drive the cars I was seeing on TV but there was no official 2006 mods. 2005RH was a base with a V8 engine file that somebody made, etc etc. Once BMW ISI Sauber was released for rFactor it was a dream come true because rFactor was just a modern much improved version of F1C and being an official mod, was alot easier to take seriously accuracy wise.

Our league had to find a new mod to use for the new season, and FSONE had just came out and that was a frikken nightmare. It had 110C front temps and only 80C rear temps or something like that and tyre pressures made no difference. It was just completely retarded. You want to complain about physics? So I took the BMW Sauber physics and converted it into FSONE so that all the cars had equal performance, and also optimised the textures because alot of them were oversized (losing FPS).. tweaked some of the textures and it was our new league mod which gave a great season. Obviously we didn't want to have a season where there was 22 BMW Saubers driving around.

My point is I'm not a noob at comparing onboards or apex speeds or speed trap figures with the ones in sims trying to get accuracy, my personality seems to be suited to having the patience for that stuff. In testing back and forth while editting the files with the F1C/GTR/RF engine. Repititive, trial and error etc. Other ones like Codemasters F1 2010 I'm lost and a noob but overall I still don't see any problems with the driving itself. *shrug*

The lack of spectating others is stupid, the lack of the ability to type "good luck" before a race is stupid.. but there are other positives like moving hands, animated pit crews.. a penalty for gravel on the tyres and STRICT corner cutting rules.

I am about all "typed out" for this stuff now. Too much typing not enough driving. I hope that somebody here still races in 2010 and can see this.

Once again my Windows Live tag is "MarkWebbo" and I hope that one day I can race some people from here, in this or F1 2011 or RF2 or whatever. As there is a big gap between hardcore F1 fans that post here, and the guys you'll see on RSCnet or wherever that don't care alot for real life racing and I hope that can change. Sharing setups, comparing PB's on certain tracks, casual races, trash talk, an autosport racing night.. whatever.

#49 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 20:31

A quick word on setups.. I remember in the marketting for the game this time last year they tried to say that setup would only improve .5 sec or something and that the basic core setup would be good. Seems like marketting BS to me.. to lure in the casual fans and make them feel more confident or safer.

Yesterday in a time trial I stiffened up the car for Hockenheim and gained .5, just on the stiffness of the car alone and some small camber and toe in increases. I was driving the same lines, the same braking points. I went really stiff.. and I couldn't brake as late into turn 2 or 3 (the S that leads onto the long straight) and the car would skate wide on 4 wheel slide.. so I softened it back until I could make that corner like before.. and then with that I gained a tenth (turn 1 flat in 6th at 270km without triggering the corner cutting thing) after a few laps of getting used to it.. combined with MUCH better response in the fast third sector. Felt like I had all this extra wing, but the wings were on 2 and 1. The only thing that was doing the trick was weight on the front axle (60, 70 or 80%) and stiff suspension. These things are more important for fast corners then wing level. You do the same driving inputs and suddently the car is just responding so much better. Softer suspension is so lazy in comparison but works great on traction or bumpy tracks.

The first races I did at Hockenheim online I had 30 secs to "make" a setup on the fly, I hadn't done time trials yet, I jumped straight in. I had 290 or so top speed was losing so much time. Wasn't gaining it back in the third sector either.. understeer understeer. From then to now it must be a 2 or 3 second difference combined with learning the track better. But it seems IMPOSSIBLE to seperate driving/track knowledge and setup. It all has to be in harmony together.

All games/sims give you these understeery stable default setups. You gain stability but loose overall speed. So you reduce the wings, make the mechanical grip more twitchy and less margin for error but faster.. better turn in, better exit etc. Then you have these alien type guys who are good enough to drive those edgy setups as if they are stable.. and it's alot easier to be brave doing that when it's a computer game.. you have these guys that will be anywhere from 1-3 seconds faster. The top 100 time trial times are simply ridiculous. But it's just the way it is. For Codemasters to try and change that would to be to create an artifical racing experience IMO.

#50 HoldenRT

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Posted 25 June 2011 - 21:26



Here's a vid I did of the 2002 BMW Williams I converted over to GTR. (That I mentioned above.) I know it seems like nothing now, just searching for that vid, I found all these fancy F1 mods for GTR2. At the time, to be able to race online with friends, there was F1C and that was it (or GTR). GP4 had no online and I never got into LFS. I was the first to do mod an F1 car in GTR. Which was a big improvment until RF came along. Only thing that was screwed up was a lack of adjustable 7th gear but at the time, the physics, the graphics, the force feedback was all a huge improvement. BTW those 2002 cars handled like crap compared to todays or even 2005 or 2006's.

I don't have to mod anything anymore there is F1 2010. :love: :p It's pretty bad though that it took from F1C in 2002 or whenever until 2010 until there was another official release. And I do know that I care too much about this stuff, but it's a fun hobby.

Edited by HoldenRT, 25 June 2011 - 21:28.