Jump to content


Photo

From last place to P1 in F1 history


  • Please log in to reply
105 replies to this topic

#1 HAM

HAM
  • Member

  • 531 posts
  • Joined: November 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:46

How many times did that happen like we saw today? Awesome drive from Jense 99% perfect race (would been 100% without the Lewis push into wall incident).

Does some one know which drivers won a race while they were also in last postition in a F1 race?

Advertisement

#2 911

911
  • Member

  • 2,207 posts
  • Joined: April 99

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:47

Didn't John Watson do this a few times in the '80s? Long Beach and Detroit?

#3 HAM

HAM
  • Member

  • 531 posts
  • Joined: November 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:47

Didn't John Watson do this a few times in the '80s? Long Beach and Detroit?


Lets make a list, will be interesting to see how many drivers did that job, lol

#4 ensign14

ensign14
  • Member

  • 37,309 posts
  • Joined: December 01

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:48

Wattie did it from 23rd on the grid at Long Beach in 1983, but there were 26 starters. That's the furthest back anyone has started to win - I think he beat his own record (17th or so from Detroit 1982).

#5 Amador

Amador
  • New Member

  • 5 posts
  • Joined: May 11

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:49

Didn't John Watson do this a few times in the '80s? Long Beach and Detroit?


Yep John Watson, started 22th and won the 1983 Long Beach GP. His team-mate Lauda finished 2nd from 23th :)

#6 Bleu

Bleu
  • Member

  • 766 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:50

DC (Melbourne) and Fisi (Interlagos) did that in 2003.

DC started on wets but switched to dry tyres on the 2nd lap, he was last for two laps.

Fisi was running 2nd last in early parts of the race, Firman then retired behind him, which left Fisi last for a few laps. Others then pitted which brought him up.

Edited by Bleu, 12 June 2011 - 21:51.


#7 joshb

joshb
  • Member

  • 3,281 posts
  • Joined: March 11

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:51

Schumacher must've been last after the pit farce at Malaysia 2001 when there was the monsoon, but luckily they put inters on and he steamed past the lot

#8 motorhead

motorhead
  • Member

  • 919 posts
  • Joined: September 09

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:51

Kimi Suzuka from 17th to 1st

#9 Risil

Risil
  • Member

  • 13,899 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:51

Not F1, but with the safety car help and lateness of the charge (and the somewhat dodgy moves Button pulled), I was reminded of Alex Zanardi at Long Beach in 1998. Now that was a race.

#10 blackonyx4

blackonyx4
  • Member

  • 1,284 posts
  • Joined: March 09

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:57

From last to first in 30 laps?

I dont think its been ever done in F1.

#11 Mila

Mila
  • Member

  • 5,710 posts
  • Joined: December 99

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:58

if JB really wanted to seal his name in F1 lore, well, then, from last place to P1 to DQed would be un-toppable, probably. :)

I could be wrong, but I don't believe that Wattie ever ran dead-last in Detroit 1982 or Long Beach 1983.


#12 fauxhemian

fauxhemian
  • Member

  • 638 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 21:58

Jenson can't overtake.

Remember that.

#13 arknor

arknor
  • Member

  • 2,298 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:05

Jenson can't overtake.

Remember that.

he was flattered by having a wetsetup and anyone is a master overtaker when u have a ridiculously long DRS zone.

+ the added downforce from a wetsetup doesnt really give u a straightline penalty with the DRS zones.

a really good drive though but i dont think its as special as it apears

#14 ryan86

ryan86
  • Member

  • 1,100 posts
  • Joined: July 09

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:06

Winkelhock did it in 1.5 laps. (OK, didn't win the race, but still someone who was both last and first in the same race)

Edited by ryan86, 12 June 2011 - 22:10.


#15 skid solo

skid solo
  • Member

  • 2,122 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:14

he was flattered by having a wetsetup and anyone is a master overtaker when u have a ridiculously long DRS zone.

+ the added downforce from a wetsetup doesnt really give u a straightline penalty with the DRS zones.

a really good drive though but i dont think its as special as it apears


F##k me what does someone have to do to impress you? In any era of F1 it was an epic drive

#16 blackonyx4

blackonyx4
  • Member

  • 1,284 posts
  • Joined: March 09

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:17

he was flattered by having a wetsetup and anyone is a master overtaker when u have a ridiculously long DRS zone.

+ the added downforce from a wetsetup doesnt really give u a straightline penalty with the DRS zones.

a really good drive though but i dont think its as special as it apears



Wet setup certainly helps a lot on dry track when Jense was the fastest guy. :lol:

#17 DanardiF1

DanardiF1
  • Member

  • 6,577 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:19

Didn't John Watson do this a few times in the '80s? Long Beach and Detroit?


Watson did from qualifying there though, and no inclement weather to mix it up...

Not taking anything away from that last 'section' by JB, that was epic.

#18 arknor

arknor
  • Member

  • 2,298 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:24

Wet setup certainly helps a lot on dry track when Jense was the fastest guy. :lol:

ofcourse it will on a cool track it helped him get heat into his slicks on a cold moist track

#19 Coops3

Coops3
  • Member

  • 1,582 posts
  • Joined: March 11

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:29

Jenson can't overtake.

Remember that.


:lol:


Advertisement

#20 Bleu

Bleu
  • Member

  • 766 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:36

Found another, however this probably should not be mentioned.

Alonso was last at the time Piquet crashed at Singapore.


#21 skid solo

skid solo
  • Member

  • 2,122 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:38

ofcourse it will on a cool track it helped him get heat into his slicks on a cold moist track


Part of a drivers job is to set the car up for the conditions. So he not only outdrove everyone he also set his car up better which helped him do it! Duh

#22 krapmeister

krapmeister
  • Member

  • 5,568 posts
  • Joined: August 08

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:39

Didn't Webber drop back to dead last after his first pitstop in China earlier this year?

#23 Lights

Lights
  • Member

  • 9,416 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:40

Just rechecked it in FIA's race history.

Button was 21st and last on lap 40, the lap the safety car went in. 30 laps later he was 1st.

#24 HAM

HAM
  • Member

  • 531 posts
  • Joined: November 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:41

Ok guys I collected all your answers so far and here is the list until now:

John Watson - Long Beach 1983
David Coultahrd - Melbourne 2003
Giancarlo Fisichella - Interlagos 2003.
Kimi Räikkönen - Suzuka ?
Fernando Alonso - Singapore 2008
Jenson Button - Montreal 2011


#25 HAM

HAM
  • Member

  • 531 posts
  • Joined: November 10

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:42

Didn't Webber drop back to dead last after his first pitstop in China earlier this year?


Think so but finished 3rd of course.

#26 blackonyx4

blackonyx4
  • Member

  • 1,284 posts
  • Joined: March 09

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:42

Didn't Webber drop back to dead last after his first pitstop in China earlier this year?


Nope. And he didnt win that race either.

#27 krapmeister

krapmeister
  • Member

  • 5,568 posts
  • Joined: August 08

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:44

Think so but finished 3rd of course.


Nope. And he didnt win that race either.


Oh yeah.

Sorry I've only had a couple of hours of sleep :blush:

#28 Lee Nicolle

Lee Nicolle
  • Member

  • 5,837 posts
  • Joined: July 08

Posted 12 June 2011 - 22:51

I did not see the race, but doing that sort of thing is not that uncommon with safety cars. It seems still a very good drive though from Jenson who is far smarter than his teammate.
A little of topic but Larry Perkins won Bathurst abut 94. At the end of the first lap he was 30 sec behind the field with a flat tyre and because of some good driving and luck with the never ending 'safety?' cars won convincingly.

#29 wepmob2000

wepmob2000
  • Member

  • 709 posts
  • Joined: October 08

Posted 13 June 2011 - 00:33

F##k me what does someone have to do to impress you? In any era of F1 it was an epic drive


Jenson's drive would probably have been ranked higher by some forum members if he was called Michael Schumacher :lol:

#30 Risil

Risil
  • Member

  • 13,899 posts
  • Joined: February 07

Posted 13 June 2011 - 00:37

he was flattered by having a wetsetup and anyone is a master overtaker when u have a ridiculously long DRS zone.

+ the added downforce from a wetsetup doesnt really give u a straightline penalty with the DRS zones.

a really good drive though but i dont think its as special as it apears


I think you're confusing 'special' with 'inexplicable'. ;)

#31 teejay

teejay
  • Member

  • 3,654 posts
  • Joined: May 09

Posted 13 June 2011 - 00:59

Not F1, but with the safety car help and lateness of the charge (and the somewhat dodgy moves Button pulled), I was reminded of Alex Zanardi at Long Beach in 1998. Now that was a race.


From a lap down. Incredible race.

#32 BillBald

BillBald
  • Member

  • 3,500 posts
  • Joined: April 09

Posted 13 June 2011 - 01:09

doing that sort of thing is not that uncommon with safety cars.


Actually Jenson didn't really benefit from the safety cars. The last one closed the field up, but Jenson was catching the leaders so quickly that he would have been in the same position without it.

Actually the BBC commentators thought the last SC had worked against Jenson, by losing his momentum and tyre temperature.




#33 pingu666

pingu666
  • Member

  • 8,739 posts
  • Joined: October 07

Posted 13 June 2011 - 03:57

its rare even in nascar apart from plate tracks, and discounting those who stay out to lead a lap during pitstops.

It would of been more impressive without drs, which helped him a bunch, including sucking up to seb, and if webber hadnt screwed up at the end. and he did take out his teammate and alonso accidently. but it is what it is and he took advantage of situations and drs and won. and pushed seb into a mistake.

mcnish/dindo started petit le mans two laps down and won

#34 Menace

Menace
  • Member

  • 12,300 posts
  • Joined: November 01

Posted 13 June 2011 - 04:03

Jenson's drive would probably have been ranked higher by some forum members if he was called Michael Schumacher :lol:



...or Lewis Hamilton, or Alonso... this was an epic battle by him, he just went up a notch in my books from "almost as good as" to "as good as anyone on his day". What a drive Jenson! :up:

#35 DanardiF1

DanardiF1
  • Member

  • 6,577 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 13 June 2011 - 04:06

its rare even in nascar apart from plate tracks, and discounting those who stay out to lead a lap during pitstops.

It would of been more impressive without drs, which helped him a bunch, including sucking up to seb, and if webber hadnt screwed up at the end. and he did take out his teammate and alonso accidently. but it is what it is and he took advantage of situations and drs and won. and pushed seb into a mistake.

mcnish/dindo started petit le mans two laps down and won


DRS did help, but Canada is still a slipstreaming track, and I think Jenson was quick enough at the end to get by WEB and MSC at least without it

I still can't get over the finish though: with 30 laps to go I thought 'if you can rescue a few points Jense that'll be great'... he passes his way (without DRS) up to 11th, pits for slicks at a good time that nets him a few places (putting him about 6th IIRC), and then goes ballistic with his speed!

He's been this quick at several times this year, Monaco, Australia (after his drive-through), Malaysia... everywhere except Turkey (though that was partly strategy) he's been up there... his middle stint in Monaco was as impressive as this final one yesterday though, both magnificent drives...

Edited by DanardiF1, 13 June 2011 - 04:09.


#36 Pilla

Pilla
  • Member

  • 2,342 posts
  • Joined: February 03

Posted 13 June 2011 - 04:16

in 2001 Barichello qualified 18th and ended up winning, I think getting his first GP win. While not last it was still a good drive, he only had Minardi's and Prosts behind him which wouldn't have been a problem for his World Championship winning Ferrari.

#37 SparkPlug

SparkPlug
  • Member

  • 491 posts
  • Joined: January 10

Posted 13 June 2011 - 05:11

in 2001 Barichello qualified 18th and ended up winning, I think getting his first GP win. While not last it was still a good drive, he only had Minardi's and Prosts behind him which wouldn't have been a problem for his World Championship winning Ferrari.

That was Germany 2000. Also Schumacher was dead last in Malaysia 2001 after he had to wait behind Barrichello during the pit lane mayhem. He was up into first place in approximately 15 laps if I remember correctly.

There are more races in the 80s, I am just not able to place them now. Didnt Lauda have an incredible last to first race in 82/83 ?

#38 PLAYLIFE

PLAYLIFE
  • Member

  • 894 posts
  • Joined: May 03

Posted 13 June 2011 - 05:44

Surely the multiple Safety Cars and race suspension thwarts this ''last to first'' statistic.

Not to take anything away from a brilliant drive by Jenson, but if it wasn't for the multiple SCs and race suspension, he wouldn't have stood a chance to win.



Watson & Lauda at Long Beach '83 were brilliant 'authentic' back of the grid to win/2nd drives.

#39 BillBald

BillBald
  • Member

  • 3,500 posts
  • Joined: April 09

Posted 14 June 2011 - 23:07

Surely the multiple Safety Cars and race suspension thwarts this ''last to first'' statistic.

Not to take anything away from a brilliant drive by Jenson, but if it wasn't for the multiple SCs and race suspension, he wouldn't have stood a chance to win.


With 30 laps to go, Jenson was dead last.

There was only one SC after this point, and Jenson only gained a few seconds. Before the SC he was so much faster than the leaders, he was on track to catch them anyway.



Advertisement

#40 Dunder

Dunder
  • Member

  • 6,784 posts
  • Joined: April 01

Posted 14 June 2011 - 23:21

That was Germany 2000. Also Schumacher was dead last in Malaysia 2001 after he had to wait behind Barrichello during the pit lane mayhem. He was up into first place in approximately 15 laps if I remember correctly.

There are more races in the 80s, I am just not able to place them now. Didnt Lauda have an incredible last to first race in 82/83 ?


Indeed he was. That race serves to prove that safety car farces have been around for more than a decade!


#41 zold

zold
  • Member

  • 277 posts
  • Joined: August 10

Posted 14 June 2011 - 23:41

germany 2000, rubens p18 of 22 on saturday to p1 on sunday. first f1 race i ever watched, unfortunately made me a rubens fan

#42 LB

LB
  • Member

  • 12,540 posts
  • Joined: February 01

Posted 15 June 2011 - 00:20

Indeed he was. That race serves to prove that safety car farces have been around for more than a decade!

There was a safety car in the Canadian GP 1973

Edited by LB, 15 June 2011 - 00:22.


#43 Dunder

Dunder
  • Member

  • 6,784 posts
  • Joined: April 01

Posted 15 June 2011 - 00:28

There was a safety car in the Canadian GP 197something (1)?


Sure. The key word in my sentence however, was "farce".

In the 2001 Malaysian race, the Ferraris were the only cars to switch to intermediates. When the safety car was deployed, cars were aquaplaning left, right and centre even on the full wet but the SC duly stayed on track for enough laps for the intermediate to be 4 or 5 seconds per lap faster than the full wet one the race got going.

Edited by Dunder, 15 June 2011 - 00:29.


#44 CSquared

CSquared
  • Member

  • 621 posts
  • Joined: December 09

Posted 15 June 2011 - 01:24

As we all know, Clark was over a lap down halfway through the 1967 Italian GP, but I don't know if he was actually last. Anyone?

(Thread title says "to P1," which Clark did, though he didn't stay there till the win.)

#45 ensign14

ensign14
  • Member

  • 37,309 posts
  • Joined: December 01

Posted 15 June 2011 - 06:20

There was a safety car in the Canadian GP 1973

And it was such a balls-up they dropped them for 20 years. To this day nobody knows who REALLY won.

#46 scheivlak

scheivlak
  • Member

  • 11,479 posts
  • Joined: August 01

Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:06

As we all know, Clark was over a lap down halfway through the 1967 Italian GP, but I don't know if he was actually last. Anyone?

(Thread title says "to P1," which Clark did, though he didn't stay there till the win.)

I think he had only Stewart behind him, who had pitted before.

#47 GSiebert

GSiebert
  • Member

  • 1,884 posts
  • Joined: November 07

Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:24

From a lap down. Incredible race.


I still feel sorry for the poor Herta. :lol:

#48 Wlleiotl

Wlleiotl
  • Member

  • 906 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:33

Awesome drive from Jense 99% perfect race (would been 100% without the Lewis push into wall incident).


is speeding under the safety car a condition of driving a perfect race then?

last 30 laps might have been perfect, the first 40 were obviously pretty poor or he wouldnt have been last

#49 ivand911

ivand911
  • Member

  • 8,152 posts
  • Joined: February 10

Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:39

With last SC he gain 10 sec to Vettel. Who think that with 10 sec more to Vettel, he would have won? Without DRS, he didn't have chance to overtake MS. Webber made so many mistakes, he was easy even without DRS. DRS and SC and fast car made this possible. Not JB. Some better drivers with this car could lead the race from lap 30(or earlier). Because they will not go back and forward all race like headless chicken.

Edited by ivand911, 15 June 2011 - 07:44.


#50 trogggy

trogggy
  • Member

  • 7,247 posts
  • Joined: March 10

Posted 15 June 2011 - 07:40

With last SC he gain 10 sec to Vettel. Who think that with 10 sec more to Vettel, he would have won? Without DRS, he didn't have chance to overtake MS. Webber made so many mistakes, he was easy even without DRS. DRS and SC and fast car made this possible. Not JB.

Bitter much?