14 replies to this topic

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

I'm working on a model of a 1970 Ferrari 512S (at Sebring) and I'm not sure if these cars had the "submarine" belts which went between the drivers legs to keep the driver from moving forward, and possible underneath the steering wheel. This must have been a significant safety improvement. The few interior shots or these cars I've found so far seem to show them not being used at this time (not clearly shown). Anyone one if the 1970 512S factory Ferrari race cars used them, or when they were starting to be commonly used?

Thanks.

[Lee Nicolle]

I doubt that crotch straps were used that early, by the 80s in open wheelers and the late 90s in most tintops

[Ray Bell]

You're not reading enough of this forum, Lee!

We had a thread about Michael Henderson's work with belts. Though he previously had kitted out some cars with these, and I mean the crotch straps, it was when he fitted Niel Allen's in May, 1968 that the real advance was to come.

Niel's huge crash at Lakeside a month or two later showed the world that belts work in openwheelers. The crotch strap was an integral part of the installation in those lay-down driving position cars. Within a few months they were mandatory world-wide.

I have no hesitation in saying that a works or works-supported 1970 Ferrari at Sebring would have had these in 1970.

[Peter Leversedge]

I used them before 1973

[Ray Bell]

I used them in 1973 myself...

The car I bought had been fitted with the Henderson-style harness two or three years beforehand.

[D-Type]

I'm sure I've read that Rindt had refused to wear crotch straps which was considered a contributary factor in his fatal accident. This suggests that they were the norm in F1 in 1970.

Edited by D-Type, 13 July 2011 - 12:58.

[lanciaman]

SCCA made them mandatory in 1973.

[Frank S]

I added a reinforcing bar across the front underside of my MGB driver seat as an alternative to chopping it up to add the sub strap, 1968; by the time I faced the same dilemma with the Vega Kammback in 1971, someone had for sale a harness with sub straps integrated to the lap belt mounts. SCCA tech inspectors seemed to like - or at least tolerate - both solutions.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by D-Type
I'm sure I've read that Rindt had refused to wear crotch straps which was considered a contributary factor in his fatal accident. This suggests that they were the norm in F1 in 1970.

Yes, you would have, that's common information...

What I posted above encapsulates the facts. Michael Henderson did the groundwork, he had some samples out there (Jackie Stewart cars?) prior to early 1968, Niel Allen's fitment came in April or May of '68 and then he crashed in July to prove to the world they worked.

It was only a matter of months from that time that harnesses were mandated and anyone with any sense or knowledge fitted the crotch straps. They were literally everywhere by early 1969 because they had to be.

Check these earlier threads:

http://forums.autosp...showtopic=14755

http://forums.autosp...howtopic=105868

http://forums.autosp...showtopic=93673

That the push started by Michael Henderson included the crotch straps is evident in all of that.

[Tim Murray]

There's also this one:

Seat belts

which includes this first-hand testimony:

1968 was my first year in F1. At that time, about half the drivers wore belts.

Although quite badly injured, if I hadn't been wearing one when the right front wishbone broke, at Spa, I would note be wrting this note!

Brian Redman

[JacnGille]

I used them in 1973 myself...

1977 for me.

[Cam2InfoNeeded]

Thanks everyone. It helps me know how to equip my model.

[Tim Murray]

We discussed this a little in the 'Full-face helmets' thread - see this post and the responses to it. The consensus was that as the risk of fire had reduced so much, the air bottles had become an unnecessary extra weight and complication.

[Cargo]

Thanks Tim. That thread just about covers it all... Understand now.

[ianrand]

FWIW: Several 1967 Ford MKIIB and MKIV race cars were factory equipped w/ anti-submarine belts.