73 replies to this topic

[S A Dunbar]

I hope to see/meet some of you at Road Americe this weekend.

I will attend Friday, Saturday for certain...and possibly Sunday.

[E1pix]

I hope to see/meet some of you at Road Americe this weekend.

I will attend Friday, Saturday for certain...and possibly Sunday.

Wish I were there.... it'd be great to meet you sometime.

[arttidesco]

Look forward to seeing the photos on this side of the pond

[Wayne Fetter]

I'll be there too...looking forward to seeing the Ferrari 312T2 & T5 and Lotus 79's along withthe other HGP's, weekend weather is looking good for the most part too (just isolated t-storms on Saturday) - will be parked up on Fireman's hill under the shade tree's.....

[E1pix]

I'll be there too...looking forward to seeing the Ferrari 312T2 & T5 and Lotus 79's along withthe other HGP's, weekend weather is looking good for the most part too (just isolated t-storms on Saturday) - will be parked up on Fireman's hill under the shade tree's.....

Lotus 79s? Man, that hurts (not being there). I know those trees (not by name ), enjoy and have a double brat for us.

[Wayne Fetter]

Lotus 79s? Man, that hurts (not being there). I know those trees (not by name ), enjoy and have a double brat for us.

With Kraut of course!

[E1pix]

With Kraut of course!

Don't forget the corn drenched in butter in the coffee can!

And.... what's that stuff called again? Oh Ya, Beer.

[Wayne Fetter]

Awsome weather today...great fields for the Historic Trans-Am and Grand Prix races. Here are a couple quick pics out of the Carousel:

1978 Lotus 79:

1978 Lotus 79 by Tracer-X, on Flickr

1980 Ferrari 312 T5:

1980 Ferrari 312 T5 by Tracer-X, on Flickr

[E1pix]

Wayne:

Man, awesome!.... one of my favorite driver, the other of a favorite car. Cool.

Enjoy, do a quad-brat for us both. What's Brian French running?

[Wayne Fetter]

As and yee shall receive:

Brian French - 1997 Benetton B197:

1997 Benetton B197 by Tracer-X, on Flickr

[E1pix]

As and yee shall receive:

NICE, Thanks, Wayne!

I wonder if he misses his Ferraris? (silly question)

[RA Historian]

Benetton B-197 with a Judd V-10 in the tail.

Tom

[E1pix]

Just not the same as his red cars, particularly the V12 one.... (sound!)

Enjoy tomorrow for us, please!

Edited by E1pix, 16 July 2011 - 23:18.

[RA Historian]

Just not the same as his red cars, particularly the V12 one.... (sound!)

Of course, for all except the first year or two, his Ferrari F-93As also had Judd V-10s.

Tom

[E1pix]

Yes, when we first saw them both run in 2001 (the Berger and the Alesi cars), one had the V12 and one the Judd. In 2002, he only ran the V12 car IIRC, but I did hear from Carl that the V12 was taken out in maybe '03 or '04. Too bad, that is one fine-tone motor, maybe the best ever at 3.5 liters compared to the earlier 3.0s.

The Judd sounds nice.... but of course is missing the two cylinders that make the music.

Edited by E1pix, 17 July 2011 - 02:17.

[RA Historian]

French won the unlimited race today in his Benetton B197. But, as with the Ferraris, it is powered by a Judd V-10.

Incidentally, the small bore formula race was won by Bobby Rahal, in a Brabham. The Historic Grand Prix group race was taken by Chris Bender in a March 821, with Michael Fitzgerald second in a Williams FW-8, and Dan Marvin was third in a Brabham BT-44. The F-5000 event was won by our friend Tony A-to-Z, Tony Adamowicz, in the very same Eagle F-5000 car with which he won the 1969 SCCA F-5000 championship.
Tom

[Wayne Fetter]

The racing was excellant today...the heat...not so much...really cut down on attendance I think as Saturday seemed to have better attendance. The Historic Trans Am folks put on a great show as did the Historic Grand Prix. Count on the F5000's were lower than the past few years, as were the Can-Am's, but others were up. As RA said, Brian walked away with his race, with a Lola B07/10 ruuning up in 2nd. I'll have more pics up as Iget them loaded and processed..

[David M. Kane]

Was there a blocking incident in the HGP Race?

[E1pix]

I'll have more pics up as Iget them loaded and processed..

Looking forward to those, and Thanks for what you posted earlier!

It'll be a while before I see what your next pics, heading out for weeks in the wilderness within two days. No connectivity for awhile (at least, not by its current definition).

Glad you had another great weekend at RA, despite the heat.

[E1pix]

French won the unlimited race today in his Benetton B197. But, as with the Ferraris, it is powered by a Judd V-10.

Incidentally, the small bore formula race was won by Bobby Rahal, in a Brabham. The Historic Grand Prix group race was taken by Chris Bender in a March 821, with Michael Fitzgerald second in a Williams FW-8, and Dan Marvin was third in a Brabham BT-44. The F-5000 event was won by our friend Tony A-to-Z, Tony Adamowicz, in the very same Eagle F-5000 car with which he won the 1969 SCCA F-5000 championship.
Tom

Sounds like you had another great day at RA!

I saw Tony win with the Eagle car there in '69. I recall they announced Apollo 11's moon landing that weekend, on Saturday IIRC (I was 8 or 9). For the only time in memory, I wanted to be somewhere else....

Rahal winning sounds nostalgic indeed, in a Brabham FB I assume? I also love reading that Dan Marvin is still around, he was a great Atlantic shoe (and beyond) in his day — and a cool guy.

I recognize and appreciate your interest in accuracy, Tom. What years was the V12 run in Brian French's '93 Ferraris?

[S A Dunbar]

I had a fantastic weekend at Road America... The opportunity to see and chat with so many old friends. Each year I attend this event, I run across some who I haven't seen for 20-30 years... And when we meet, it's like it was only yesterday that we last saw one another.

And the cars...so many cars I vividly recall from their earlier days - even if I don't know the current owners, the cars themselves seem like old friends...

For me, this is a truely special event.

Edited by S A Dunbar, 18 July 2011 - 12:13.

[RA Historian]

I saw Tony win with the Eagle car there in '69. I recall they announced Apollo 11's moon landing that weekend, on Saturday IIRC (I was 8 or 9). For the only time in memory, I wanted to be somewhere else....

Rahal winning sounds nostalgic indeed, in a Brabham FB I assume?

What years was the V12 run in Brian French's '93 Ferraris?

Bobby Rahal was in a Brabham BT-29 in that race.

I don't remember the exact year that French went to the Judd, but he did run the Ferrari V-12 for two or so years. Then one year I recall doing a double take at his transporter as they took the engine cover off and a Judd V-10 was ensconced therein. Carl Liebich said that it was much cheaper and easier to run.

The Eagle of Tony A-Z has the Apollo 11 stickers on it as a remembrance of that day. I was there also, and remember rushing back to our car between heats to listen to the moon landing on the radio.

The economy continues to take its toll. The entry for race cars, as opposed to the hordes of production based machines, was way down. No Listers, no Porsche racers, no Jaguars other than XK-Es, no Ferraris, no Maseratis, etc. Historic GP about half the number as in previous years, same with F-5000. One McLaren Can Am, plus a couple replicas. A number of Lola T-70 roadsters and coupes, about half of which were real. Historic Trans Am, on the other hand, was big, upwards of 30 cars. Ken Epsman won on a last lap pass with his lime green Dodge Challenger.

But as Scott Dunbar mentions, most of the fun was in the paddock, not on track. I spent all four days greatly enjoying talking to friends both old and new, reliving the past with the anciens pilotes present. Yes, it was rather hot, but it did not rain, and that was good indeed! Vintage Motorsport magazine, bless their hearts, had a large tent with tables and chairs, with water, soft drinks, and snacks available to all. Much appreciated.

Tom

[arttidesco]

Superb pix Wayne

Do you have any of the aforementioned T2 ?

[Rob Ryder]

Full results are here...

http://www.roadameri.....e Results.pdf

Question : Is Dan Marvin's Brabham a BT44 as listed or a BT44 bodied BT42? Chassis number?

Rob

Edited by Rob Ryder, 18 July 2011 - 17:07.

[E1pix]

Thanks for all your responses, Guys! Really fun to "be there" vicariously, and sorry to hear from Tom that entries are down in the higher-end classes. I wondered about that.

Thanks also to Rob for posting results. Lots of names from my lifetime in there, very cool.

[racinggeek]

Bobby Rahal was in a Brabham BT-29 in that race.

I don't remember the exact year that French went to the Judd, but he did run the Ferrari V-12 for two or so years. Then one year I recall doing a double take at his transporter as they took the engine cover off and a Judd V-10 was ensconced therein. Carl Liebich said that it was much cheaper and easier to run.

The Eagle of Tony A-Z has the Apollo 11 stickers on it as a remembrance of that day. I was there also, and remember rushing back to our car between heats to listen to the moon landing on the radio.

The economy continues to take its toll. The entry for race cars, as opposed to the hordes of production based machines, was way down. No Listers, no Porsche racers, no Jaguars other than XK-Es, no Ferraris, no Maseratis, etc. Historic GP about half the number as in previous years, same with F-5000. One McLaren Can Am, plus a couple replicas. A number of Lola T-70 roadsters and coupes, about half of which were real. Historic Trans Am, on the other hand, was big, upwards of 30 cars. Ken Epsman won on a last lap pass with his lime green Dodge Challenger.

But as Scott Dunbar mentions, most of the fun was in the paddock, not on track. I spent all four days greatly enjoying talking to friends both old and new, reliving the past with the anciens pilotes present. Yes, it was rather hot, but it did not rain, and that was good indeed! Vintage Motorsport magazine, bless their hearts, had a large tent with tables and chairs, with water, soft drinks, and snacks available to all. Much appreciated.

Tom

Maybe you can add to this, Tom, but I've been at this event for at least one day every year but one since 1994, and, well, it just seemed the usual buzz wasn't in the air. I agree with you that Historic T-A was quite good, and that I was surprised by the lack of Can-Am cars and other bigger-class sports cars and prototypes. (One small correx: there was a Jag race car, the XJR-5 in Gp. 44 colors, on track at least in Saturday's qualifying race.)

Maybe it was the featured group(s)? Seemed like the Carl Haas Porsche 356 Challenge and the E-Type races were pushed as the big races, and while Historic T-A lived up to its billing, RA always pulls a good number of big-bore sedans, GTs and production cars for its vintage races. Tough to follow last year's act, with the Donohue reunion, but it just seemed we didn't have that star group/special event to focus on. Now, if there'd been a reunion of the cars and crew members Haas was involved with, instead of the 356s ...

That said, had a great time Saturday, as always and expected.

[RA Historian]

Sorry about the Jaguar; I was thinking C and D types and forgot about the XJR-5.

You may be right about the one big thing around which the weekend can be built. In the past there has been such things as the Can Am Reunions, the McKee reunion, the Scarab reunion, the Jim Hall Chaparral display, the big and very successful Ford GT-40 weekend and so on. This year did not have one central event around which the weekend revolved. Perhaps that could have been the Carl Haas Porsche 356 Challenge. If Carl was not ill and unable to attend, that event could have been built up into a reunion of sorts for the well over 40 year history of Carl Haas Racing. Could have had a number of his cars, team cars, some of the many drivers who drove for him. But, as I said, Carl's illness prevented that from happening. Too bad.
Tom

[red stick]

Tom:

Your answer raises a question I've wondered about over the years: What is the lead time for planning this event? Is someone already plotting out that 2015 is the 30th, 40th, or 50th anniversary of some event or marque, or is it more a case of "who will be available to do what next year"? Just curious.

[RA Historian]

A little bit of both, I suspect. While the track management has a general idea of the direction it would like to go, a lot of stuff does happen to just pop up.

Examples. The track's year long 50th Anniversary was long in planning. On the other hand, Bob Sirna approached them a year or so before the Scarab reunion event. A combination of planning, timing, availability, serendipity, and luck.

Tom

[WDH74]

In the spirit of sharing. Taken during Saturday's qualli race.

Challenger by William 74, on Flickr

-WDH

[E1pix]

In the spirit of sharing. Taken during Saturday's qualli race.
-WDH

Awesome, I saw that car run there 41 years ago.

Nice Job, WDH!

[raceannouncer2003]

Question : Is Dan Marvin's Brabham a BT44 as listed or a BT44 bodied BT42? Chassis number?

Rob

Apparently BT42/2.

Vince H.

[arttidesco]

In the spirit of sharing. Taken during Saturday's qualli race.

-WDH

have you got any more to share ?

[bill p]

have you got any more to share ?

Yes, photos please!!

[Aero426]

A few taken with my meager camera from the T/A group on Thursday.

[Aero426]

More...

[E1pix]

Man, awesome TA turnout, and Thanks for sharing!

[WDH74]

Good stuff Aero! I've never shot down there, I may have to next time I'm there.

have you got any more to share ?

A ton of photos, but I'm still sorting through them. Here's another from Saturday's T/A race.

Best Damn Garage In Town by William 74, on Flickr

[WDH74]

For fans of U-2. No, not that one!

Nine-One-One by William 74, on Flickr

[bill p]

Aero426 and WDH74, I like your photos - thank you

Edited by bill p, 20 July 2011 - 07:39.

[Aero426]

Look at all the high water marks in past Road America July events. The GT40 event in 1994 had apx 40 cars with enough depth that a book was written on the car using many event pics. The Can-Am event in 1996 (apx 77 cars!) was off the charts. Same with the Chaparrals and the Donohue event last year. To a lesser degree, McKee, Scarab, F5000 and F1 feature groups were all very well executed and crowd pleasers for their years at RA. My point is that there are only so many blockbuster events that you can have - and it sure cannot happen every year. Some are going to be better than others. Some might not be repeatable. I have often wondered after a the real siginificant KIC events what they will do for an encore. There are only so many choices, and Trans-Am was one of those few groups that has not been there before. What is left? GTP, or maybe those dreadful NASCAR stock cars?

Edited by Aero426, 20 July 2011 - 19:07.

[WDH74]

I would love to see a proper, historic NASCAR display and event at the KIC, with cars from the 40's through the 70's. I think it would be more popular than many believe.

Here's another photo, too. Why didn't this car run with the Trans-Am pack? Was it not an authentic T/A car?

XR-7 by William 74, on Flickr

-WDH

Edited by WDH74, 20 July 2011 - 22:39.

[RA Historian]

I would love to see a proper, historic NASCAR display and event at the KIC, with cars from the 40's through the 70's. I think it would be more popular than many believe.

The Fall Vintage weekend two years ago featured historic nascar. One car, a 1956 Mercury, showed up. One car. One. It was a big flop. Not very encouraging for another go around.

[Aero426]

I would love to see a proper, historic NASCAR display and event at the KIC, with cars from the 40's through the 70's. I think it would be more popular than many believe.

Here's another photo, too. Why didn't this car run with the Trans-Am pack? Was it not an authentic T/A car?

XR-7 by William 74, on Flickr

-WDH

The Historic Trans-Am Group functions as its own entity. As part of the deal to come to Road America, they mandated their own race group separate from the normal big bore class known as Group 6. They are selective of who runs with them and who does not. They do not want to run with "fake" T/A cars without documented history. They do not want to run with drivers with history of aggressive driving. They do not post lap times. The cars are said to be era correct. It is my impression that the group sees value in its own marketing and keeping as much control as possible.

It has been whispered in the past years that the Historic T/A group had no interest in running with the midwest Group 6 guys who had the big stack-em up on the main straight in 2006. Group 6 has some excellent drivers and well driven cars, but there is probably some truth that there is way too much real racing going on at the front of the pack, and probably too much aggresiveness for the real deal T/A cars to risk. The fastest T/A lap Sunday was a 2:37 and the fastest Group 6 lap was a 2:26 in a Camaro. It is easy to tell which car is more period correct, and easy to understand why the Trans-Am group would not want to be embarassed by the more evolved (and period illegal) Group 6 cars.

Edited by Aero426, 21 July 2011 - 01:43.

[SCHKEE T332]

Well stated.

[WDH74]

The Fall Vintage weekend two years ago featured historic nascar. One car, a 1956 Mercury, showed up. One car. One. It was a big flop. Not very encouraging for another go around.

I remember that car-it was an ex-Russ Truelove Mercury. I didn't know that was an attempt at an historic NASCAR display. That's sad, really. I wonder why whomever organized it couldn't get a bigger turnout.

The Historic Trans-Am Group functions as its own entity.

I know that-I was led to believe by someone else that the Mercury was an actual T/A car, not a replica or Group 6 monster. I didn't see it in the paddock, only on the track, which is why I asked about it.

[E1pix]

The Fall Vintage weekend two years ago featured historic nascar. One car, a 1956 Mercury, showed up. One car. One. It was a big flop. Not very encouraging for another go around.

Not to mention that NASCAR has enough market share already....

[Wayne Fetter]

I think something around the Endurance/LeMans/IMSA cars would be awsome...it's been quite a few years since we have seen Porsche 917K's at the track, and it would great to see some cars from the 70's/80's too (it's always nice to see cars like the 962, Nissan GTP), just loved hearing the turbo chirp again on the Nissan this year.

[Wayne Fetter]

I've been working on my class reunion which is this weekend, so the updates will really kick in next week...got some good shots to share. In the mean time, here are a couple more to enjoy:

Bobby Rahal:

1969 Brabham BT-29 by Tracer-X, on Flickr

Tony Adamowicz:

1969 Gurney Eagle F5000 by Tracer-X, on Flickr

[Wayne Fetter]

Jimmy Hague in the AMC Javlin dirt tracking in corner 5, it was fun to watch him drive the wheels off that car....EVERY lap:

1972 AMC Javlin by Tracer-X, on Flickr