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Motorbike-powered race cars in Australia 1950 - 1980


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#251 Ray Bell

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 09:24

Or Carrathool? Or more likely, Baradine...

Not Lake Ayre.

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#252 Dale Harvey

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 21:09

I think it was also owned by the late Bill Stoddart and run in the NSW hillclimb series in the 70's.

Dale.

#253 rms

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Posted 05 June 2013 - 22:33

Phil Boot had the 501-750cc record at Silverdvale in 1960.......41.2

Seem to recall Colin Bond driving the Cooper BMW. Erol, didn't you drive it, too?


No, a bit before my time,I just drooled over it along with Merv Wards (Ralt ?)

Erol

#254 austmcreg

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 10:03

Or Carrathool? Or more likely, Baradine...
Not Lake Ayre.

The Cooper BMW was run by its first owner and builder (with outside help, I think the story of this is on TNF somewhere) Jim Madsen at Coonabarabran speed trials in 1957 (photo below). A 1956 Mark X Cooper with blown BMW engine originally 590cc but increased later. A very good, well illustrated article on the car is in SCW August 1957. This article and the Winser 1957 annual both quote the chassis number as 14, though I note Blanden has it as 16 in the 2004 book (for what that is worth...).

Ray, perhaps the Jack Forrest connection you were thinking of was that the BMW engine came from a Jack Forrest-owned R69S production racing bike.

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Madsen later sold the car tp Phil Boot.

Rob Saward

Edited by austmcreg, 15 June 2013 - 23:41.


#255 austmcreg

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Posted 06 June 2013 - 10:54

Some more details on the car that seems to have been the basis of the Warburton:-
Posted Image
This was from AMR #3 - 1953 (Thanks cooper997 !).

This article indicates that Les Taylor was the last Queensland owner of the former Lowe-Lane Special. AMS February 1948 has a report on the Queensland Championship Hill Climb at Whites Hill on January 24, 1948. One of the competitors was Clem Warburton (Lowe-Lane 500 Special). So the car was still known by that name in Queensland.

The report also says "Warburton's 500cc car, which he recently acquired in Melbourne, put up a good run of 37 seconds and surprised everyone including probably Clem".

So, if Clem Warburton was the first Queensland owner of the Lowe Lane Special, and Les Taylor the last, and if we believe the Winser annual piece then it also had several other Queensland owners bewtween these two. Ray Bell posted that Barrie Watt said it was Stan Eastwood's car; perhaps he was one of the 'in-between' owners.

I wonder, on what evidence, does the 500 club website in UK base its being called the 'Warburton'? Certainly, the AMS reporter in January 1948 called it the Lowe-Lane Special in Warburton's ownership.

Rob Saward

#256 rbm

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 07:34

I wonder, on what evidence, does the 500 club website in UK base its being called the 'Warburton'? Certainly, the AMS reporter in January 1948 called it the Lowe-Lane Special in Warburton's ownership.

Rob Saward



Rob

the 500 Owners website quotes:

"Please tell us more of Clem Warburton and Brian Chatterton's special if you can. It appears to be based on an Austin Seven chassis and may have had a Douglas engine."

which to me would suggest that not much is known about this car (in the UK by the 500 OA) and as quoted at the top of the Marques page "These pages are a living archive of the cars and the people who built and raced them" any information you would be able to supply would I am sure be welcomed by the 500 OA and would no doubt improve the quality of the information on this resource.

kind regards Richard


edit for typo

Edited by rbm, 07 June 2013 - 07:35.


#257 Ray Bell

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 08:43

I believe Barrie was telling me that Stan Eastwood had the car for a very long time...

And still has it.

#258 The Chasm

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 10:02

So the "Warburton" is not the "Lowe-Lane" Special then Ray ?.

Perhaps a copy built while the "Lowe-Lane" was in the shed ?.

#259 austmcreg

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 11:25

So the "Warburton" is not the "Lowe-Lane" Special then Ray ?.
Perhaps a copy built while the "Lowe-Lane" was in the shed ?.

I have found the AMS writeups on both the Lowe-Lane 500 (October 1947)and the Warburton 500 (November 1947). These were definitely different cars, the Lowe-Lane being Ariel Red Hunter powered and the Warburton being IoM Douglas powered. At that stage, neither car had a body.

The report on the Warburton mentions that Clem Warburton had visited Melbourne since the previous month's report (so in late October or early November 1947), and tends to fit the premise that while in Melbourne on holidays, he purchased the Lowe-Lane. Two months later, he definitely owned the Lowe-Lane and competed in it at Whites Hill in Queensland. There is no solid evidence either way, but my suspicion is that the Lowe-Lane still did not have a body on that occasion.

The car in the Connie Jordan photo is clearly the Lowe-Lane; the Ford 10 axles, wheels etc are evident and identical to those in the AMS photo and description of the Lowe-Lane. Clem Warburton was the Lowe-Lane's first QLD owner, and may well have built the body seen in Connie Jordan's photo, and clearly the same nose panel and front end is seen in the later Les Taylor photo when the car was entered as the Taylor Special.

I think that confusion has been caused by the fact that Clem Warburton (with Brian Chatterton) built their own car, and then a mere months later was competing in his home state with a a 500cc car. The fact this was NOT the car he and Chatterton built was probably not evident unless you had all these magazine reports in front of you.

I have not yet done any searching in AMS for later evidence of the Warburton, and I dont have that many early ones in my collection (no Coopers...), though I do have photocopies of most of the AMS articles on 500cc cars.

I will post here the AMS photo of the Warburton in its original form (from a photocopy so not that good).

Now we jump to Loose Fillings magazine #2a, 1999, and Queensland correspondent John Holmes notes " Probably the first air-cooled 500cc type car in Queensland was Clem Warburton's self-built 'D-Wagon' powered by an IoM Douglas and later an ES2 Norton. The car was bought by the LPS boys -Lewis, Pitt and Swinburne- and was gracefully towed behind Charlie Swinburne's MGTC. Warburton then bought the Lowe-Lane special from Bill Lowe and Bob Lane in Melbourne, and later sold it to Connie Jordan, who fitted it with a wing. Later owners were Dud Wiles, Vic Johnson and Les Taylor, who advertised it for sale in June 1950 for 100 pounds less engine and gearbox, offering a choice of engines and gearboxes for a further 35 pounds".

This is interesting on several levels.
1. The Lowe-Lane was owned by Connie Jordan, making it perhaps likely the subject photo was taken by her whilst it was in her ownership. This car was definitley the Lowe-Lane, and not the Warburton.
2. The photo and writeup in the Winser Motor Racing Annual shows the same car and also mentions that Taylor had several different engines available for the car (of course Holmes may have obtained his information from this source so it is not necessarily confirmation).
3. Mention of the car being fitted with a wing by Connie tends to fit her Qantas engineering employement. Photo needed! She would have had access to the required aluminium panel bending equipment and expertise, so it is not impossible the body was built in the Qantas workshop.

I think there is enough in this to show that the subject photo is the Lowe-Lane Special, probably when owned by Connie Jordan, and that the photo on UK 500 club site is in fact the Lowe-Lane 500 and not the Warburton.

Next step is to find the advert mentioned by John in June 1950 (If it was in AMS I will have it). If Ray is correct and Stan Eastwood still has the car, the ownership chain for the Lowe-Lane would appear to be Bill Lowe/Bob Lane to Clem Warburton to Connie Jordan to Dud Wiles to Vic Johnson to Les Taylor to Stan Eastwood.

Rob Saward

Edited by austmcreg, 07 June 2013 - 12:26.


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#260 The Chasm

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 12:09

So can we ask Stan Eastwood, what he might remember ?.

A wing on a 500cc racing car pre-1950 - and by a woman - just amazing !.

Are there any records of Connie competing in the Lane-Lowe 500 ?.

I wonder what else John Holmes knows about Connie ?.

#261 austmcreg

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 12:41

THe Warburton Chatterton Special from AMS November 1947.
Posted Image
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The Low-Lane Special from AMS October 1947
Posted Image
Edited 25-7-13 to correct spelling of Low-Lane
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Rob Saward

Edited by austmcreg, 25 July 2013 - 07:16.


#262 David McKinney

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 16:54

Thanks for your investigations, Rob

I was getting a little concerned that people might jump to the conclusion - on the flimsiest of "evidence" - that they were the same car

#263 The Chasm

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Posted 07 June 2013 - 23:29

Can anyone refer me to photographs of the "winged 500", when Connie Jordan owned it and any reference to her competing in this car ?.

#264 austmcreg

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 01:44

Can anyone refer me to photographs of the "winged 500", when Connie Jordan owned it and any reference to her competing in this car ?.

I am currently going through my AMS from 1948 onwards, but I dont have every edition and it takes a while because I get side tracked.... I am finding very few Queensland reports - it appears AMS did not have a regular Qld correspondent at that time, so not all meetings were being reported.

A search of Qld newspapers online is also needed, but there are only 48 hours in a day. Tony, if you have the time, searches for Connie Jordan and each of the Qld race venues at
http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper
might bring reward.

I think I have 10-year old contact details for John Holmes somewhere, so will look for them too.

Rob Saward

#265 The Chasm

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 03:27

I have just been sent this from an unreferenced article found in Connie's belongings:-

"The "500" Special raced in partnership by Miss Jordan and Dud Wiles has been lightened since being raced by Clem Warburton, the body rebuilt, and the Ariel Red Hunter engine has been "hotted up"."

The clues are the article was written by Les Vowles, it was just before Chas Whatmore was to use his Studebaker for the last time at White's hillclimb as he was going to concentrate on the AGP to be held in June (1949).

There is also a confirmation that QANTAS "assisted" in the manufacture of cycle guards for the M.G.TA, so going a step further with a wing for the 500 is entirely possible.

I have done quite a lot of Trove searching on Connie, but will now have to include 500 in the key search too.

I think someone I know will have contact details for John Holmes (if we are talking about the Toowoomba JH ?).

Edited by The Chasm, 08 June 2013 - 03:30.


#266 Ray Bell

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 13:12

Toowoomba John Holmes...

That would be the one.

#267 The Chasm

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 10:36

Posted Image

Another reference to the "Lowe-Lane 500".

Source publication not know - could be "The Telegraph" perhaps ?.

Edited by The Chasm, 11 June 2013 - 10:37.


#268 cooper997

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 10:54

The above newspaper clipping is most likely from the Brisbane Telegraph in the few days prior to the Saturday, February 26, 1949 QMSC White's Hillclimb - first round for that year's Qld Hillclimb Championship.

The event report in 3/49 AMS, although not stated, will most likely have been submitted by Les Vowles. There being basic information shared in the 2 pieces.

Within the report Dud Wiles is mentioned as the only competitor in Class I and making his first appearance in motor sport. Reference is also made to him driving the ex Low(sic)-Lane - Clem Warburton 500. It had been lightened considerably and a new Ariel motor installed and Ford 10 brakes modified. It also mentions how it had briefly rained around 4pm. There isn't any mention of Connie. The report also mentions the next event would be in July.

It should probably be mentioned that Bill Lowe will most likely be the same one, who imported the Lombard's into Australia circa 1930. Then as W H Lowe & Co imported Ferraris throughout the 50's, 60's & 70's. Also Lancia's too at one stage. Bob Lane will I'm guessing be part of Melbourne's Lanes Motors family.

Stephen

#269 tsrwright

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 10:11

Loose Fillings #44 is just out and yours has bounced back Stephen. Pse advise the management of your latest addresss. Yes I know should be a PM but it is OT.

#270 cooper997

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 08:50

As Terry mentions in the previous post, issue 44 of Loose Fillings is available.

You can visit here:-

http://www.hsrca.com/

And collect it as a PDF. Back issues too.

Very nice tributes to Graham Howard from John Medley and Terry Wright in this issue. Plus, Terry gets technical and Rob Saward has been moonlighting, with part 1 of his feature on Tasmanian air-cooled Coopers.

Well done to all concerned.

Stephen

#271 HiRich

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 16:59

I have found the AMS writeups on both the Lowe-Lane 500 (October 1947)and the Warburton 500 (November 1947). These were definitely different cars, the Lowe-Lane being Ariel Red Hunter powered and the Warburton being IoM Douglas powered. At that stage, neither car had a body.

Rob Saward

I agree with the separate car piece, but that leaves the question - if the Lowe-Lane is running (repeatedly) a Red Hunter single, what's that exhaust on the RHS of the Connie Jordan photo? It also appears in the Warburton-Goodrick photo of the same car.

#272 austmcreg

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 07:42

I agree with the separate car piece, but that leaves the question - if the Lowe-Lane is running (repeatedly) a Red Hunter single, what's that exhaust on the RHS of the Connie Jordan photo? It also appears in the Warburton-Goodrick photo of the same car.


I am confused by this because to my eyes both the Connie Jordan photo and the Warburton-Goodrick photo on the 500 website show an exhaust pipe on the LHS. The AMS October 1947 photo of the Low-Lane however does show an exhaust on the RHS of the Ariel motor. I suspect the answer is fairly simple - the engine is a c1933-36 Red Hunter (open valve with the large plated support plate on timing side, whereas c1937 and later engines had enclosed valves), and unless my previous life has misled me, most (all?) of these had two port heads, and so it is very simple to have the single exhaust pipe on whatever side you want, with a blanking plate on the other. Tuners lore says they went better with one pipe anyway, to do with exhaust gas velocity. Most sporting singles of the early to mid 30s had twin ports but it was a styling thing only and the serious racing makes never did it with two-valve heads, only with four valve heads like Rudge.

An important point now (I avoided saying it before, but just so it is clear) the photo labelled as Warburton on the 500 website is not that at all and is in fact the Low-Lane, which is not represented on the website.

When you look at the Warburton-Chatterton photo from AMS it is easy to see why Clem Warbuton would have purchased the Low-Lane when he saw it in Melbourne; it has a stronger chassis, much lower C of G and a much easier to work on engine than his own car. The Warburton-Chatterton would have flexed badly and handled poorly due to its inherent design problems. Perhaps design is not the right word here - many of these specials were not designed, they were just built!

Rob Saward
Edited 25-7-13 for spelling Low-Lane

Edited by austmcreg, 25 July 2013 - 07:25.


#273 HiRich

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 11:46

Sorry, I meant the LHS exhaust, which is the 'wrong' side for a Red Hunter, or indeed pretty much any single.
Having said that, a deeper search has, as you suggested, confirmed that some early models ran twin port, with double exhausts. Furthermore, the downpipes are angles apart rather than parallel, which matches the downpipe we see in the image. I would presume then that there is a matching pipe on the far side of the car.

#274 austmcreg

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 15:52

I have just located the AMS report on Queensland Hill Climb Championship, Whites Hill, 26 February 1949.

"Only competitor in class 'I', Dud Wiles, drove the ex-Low-Lane-Clem Warburton 500 with great dash, taking each corner nicely and producing changes from the Norton gearbox which made it sound like a preselector. His last run of 51.4 took the class 'I' record, a most creditable performance on Dud's first appearance in motor sport. The car has been lightened considerably, a new RH Ariel motor installed and the Ford 10 braking modified to give better compensation."

The results list shows:
D.Wiles (Jordan Wiles 500) 51.4

A few things arise:
1. Confirms what John Holmes said in the Loose Fillings notes regarding Connie Jordan and Dud Wiles having joint ownership of the car.
2. Confirms Jordan and Wiles as next owners of the car after Clem Warburton.
3. Indicates that considerable work had been done on the car since Warburton's ownership. The Warburton-Goodrick photo on the 500 web site shows the fuel tank as a motorcycle tank above the engine, but the Jordan photo shows a purpose-built tank (very much in the Cooper style), likely built as part of that work done.
4. Confirms what we have already worked out, that this was the Low-Lane Special and tends to indicate that it was known by that name in Queensland, though the fact that it was (apparently) entered as the Jordan Wiles 500 shows how easily name changes occurred. Can we rule out that this car was known as the Warburton 500 during his ownership of it? Probably not! Remember it was also later called the Taylor.

So it is the Low-Lane 500 (aka Jordan Wiles 500 and Taylor 500, and possibly Warburton 500), not to be confused with the Warburton-Chatterton Special.

Rob Saward
Edited 25-7-13 for spelling Low-Lane. The AMS report was correct!

Edited by austmcreg, 25 July 2013 - 07:28.


#275 austmcreg

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 23:48

I have just located the AMS report on Queensland Hill Climb Championship, Whites Hill, 26 February 1949.

My apology Stephen, I just realised that you had already referred to this AMS report in an earlier post referring to the newspaper clipping, which I agree has to be this meeting. The report does however mention Connie Jordan's name in the results list in the name of the car.

Rob Saward

#276 cooper997

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 00:22

I didn't look hard enough at the results to spot that Rob.

Stephen

#277 The Chasm

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Posted 28 June 2013 - 12:09

A bit more on the "Warburtom" from the Official Programme of the Queensland Motor Racing Carnival held on 20th June 1948 at Lowood.

"CLEM WARBURTON, the king of the "500" enthusiasts in Queensland, has managed to produce some more "horses" from the Red Hunter Ariel motor that powers his special, and has lightened the car by 40lb., bringing the weight to approximately 500lb., the minimum allowed for 500 c.c. cars. Warburton handled this special most expertly at practice, and his lap times for the circuit were equal to those of many of the big cars. He clocked 82 m.p.h. in the Lowood straight."

The above piece was written by Brian Chatterton.

#278 DanTra2858

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 09:14

Should this link be combined with "The First Australian Cooper" site. Comments gentlemen, I fell it would add a better way of searching for cars of this type.

#279 austmcreg

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Posted 02 July 2013 - 12:57

Should this link be combined with "The First Australian Cooper" site. Comments gentlemen, I fell it would add a better way of searching for cars of this type.

Dan, I understand where you are coming from in asking the question, but as the originator of the Cooper thread I would prefer to keep that seperate - Coopers really are a big subject of their own, as indeed are the Australian specials.


Rob Saward

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#280 DanTra2858

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Posted 03 July 2013 - 00:05

Dan, I understand where you are coming from in asking the question, but as the originator of the Cooper thread I would prefer to keep that seperate - Coopers really are a big subject of their own, as indeed are the Australian specials.


Rob Saward


Rob as the originator of this thread my thoughts were to include all Motorbike Powered cars into one thread, if this requires a name change that is OK with.

Is it the aim of your thread to only cover 500/1000 cc Motor Bike type cars or also to include Coopers powered by Car motors as well.

Cheers, Daniel

#281 austmcreg

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Posted 06 July 2013 - 05:31

I have available to me me if I want them, several engines which would be suitable for a 500cc car, if a suitable chassis was available. Does anyone know the wherabouts of a chassis , remains of a car, whatever, that would be eligible to run either of the following engines:
Norton International SOHC 500 late 1930 or 1940s
Rudge 500 4-valve late 1930s enclosed valve gear type
Rudge 500 4- valve radial or semi-radial early 1930s

I would appreciate any leads to a chassis that may be suitable. I know there were a few Rudge-engined cars, and apart from the Sydney Rudge which is accounted for, are any about?

Rob Saward

#282 cooper997

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 06:19

A bit of addition and clarification on the Low-Lane 500 from the November 2nd, 1947 Rob Roy Hillclimb #14 programme.

As published it was the only entry in the 'Class up to 500cc'
1 W G Low-R M Lane
500 cc Special

With Low also entered in 'Class up to 1500cc Sports'
12 W G Low MG TC

Thus, this info nullifies my previous reference to W H Lowe involvement in this Special.
In fact in the 'Class up to 1500 cc Racing' Bill Lowe is entered.
25 W H Lowe Lombard S/C

Stephen

#283 austmcreg

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 07:31

A bit of addition and clarification on the Low-Lane 500 from the November 2nd, 1947 Rob Roy Hillclimb #14 programme.

As published it was the only entry in the 'Class up to 500cc'
1 W G Low-R M Lane
500 cc Special

With Low also entered in 'Class up to 1500cc Sports'
12 W G Low MG TC

Thus, this info nullifies my previous reference to W H Lowe involvement in this Special.
In fact in the 'Class up to 1500 cc Racing' Bill Lowe is entered.
25 W H Lowe Lombard S/C

Stephen

Thanks Stephen for clearing this up - I have been through and edited my posts to correct the spelling to Low-Lane. Shows how careful we have to be about making assumptions!

Rob Saward

#284 DanTra2858

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 00:31

Ron Palmer who purchased the Robertson Special from Victoria is sitting in the car, photo from Illawarra Mercury 1960 at a local Car Show, the next owner of the car was Niel Podmore not sure of dates or year

 

mdfl.jpg


Edited by DanTra2858, 17 October 2013 - 00:37.


#285 cooper997

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 07:19

Just back from this year's Motorclassica at Melbourne's historic Exhibition Building. Great selection of cars to suit most tastes, but of interest to this thread is the Hunt 500 with Vincent HRD fitted. going to auction tomorrow at the event. Guiding price is pretty serious for a motor bike engined special - $62500 to $70000.

Some more details should be available at www.theodorebruce.com.au - lot 122

Stephen

#286 275 GTB-4

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Posted 28 October 2013 - 11:08

Just back from this year's Motorclassica at Melbourne's historic Exhibition Building. Great selection of cars to suit most tastes, but of interest to this thread is the Hunt 500 with Vincent HRD fitted. going to auction tomorrow at the event. Guiding price is pretty serious for a motor bike engined special - $62500 to $70000.

Some more details should be available at www.theodorebruce.com.au - lot 122

Stephen

 

VinP1010629_zps9a19f08e.jpg

 

VinP1010628_zpsdb66f538.jpg

 

:yawnface:



#287 cooper997

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 07:00

It would appear that the Hunt (shown in Mick's photos) was passed in, going by the auction results.

http://theodorebruce...2013&offset=100

Stephen

#288 cooper997

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 06:16

Recently found a 3 page feature simply titled 'Australian Motor Racing' in the 25/3/53 issue of The Motor.There's a number of photos of MG's, Bugattis at el running at Parramatta Park and King Edward Park, Newcastle. These might be of iinterest here.

 

25_3_53_The_Motor_1.jpg
image post

 

25_3_53_The_Motor_2.jpg
image url upload

 

Stephen



#289 lyntonh

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Posted 05 August 2014 - 06:40

Recently found a 3 page feature simply titled 'Australian Motor Racing' in the 25/3/53 issue of The Motor.There's a number of photos of MG's, Bugattis at el running at Parramatta Park and King Edward Park, Newcastle. These might be of iinterest here.

 

25_3_53_The_Motor_1.jpg
image post

 

25_3_53_The_Motor_2.jpg
image url upload

 

Stephen

Is that the Ash Marshall of first 200 mph quarter mile drag fame?



#290 cooper997

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Posted 06 August 2014 - 10:08

I think you could be right Lynton, but I've never been one for following drag racing.

 

A bit of digging and I think the 2 photos shown above from the 25/3/53 issue of The Motor feature, were possibly taken at the 15/11/52 Parramatta Park and 25/10/52 King Edward Park, Newcastle meetings. The Marwyn driver is probably Noel Barnes.

 

Stephen


Edited by cooper997, 06 August 2014 - 12:45.


#291 DanTra2858

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Posted 06 August 2014 - 22:05

What is known about the Marwyn Special, very destintive wheels on the car.

#292 275 GTB-4

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 00:39

What is known about the Marwyn Special, very destintive wheels on the car.


Looks like Tamworth on the rear cowling...and a B in wrought iron on the nose...

#293 DanTra2858

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 07:52

Found out that the Marwyn was built in the UK & was. Also sold in kit form, so it is an Imported car.

Info is available on the The 500 Owners Association site, wonder if the "B" stands for BARNES, where did Noel Barnes come from.

#294 Ray Bell

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 21:28

Tamworth...

He was very much tied to MGs, but you never know. I should check through those old pics I have.

#295 DanTra2858

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Posted 08 August 2014 - 23:13

More info on the Marshall Special again from the 500 Owners

Marshall
The Marshall was Bob Joass' second 500, inspired by Ron Tauranac's RALT, with transverse leaf and wishbone suspension at the front and a swing axle to the rear. Engine and gearbox came from a Triumph Tiger. Bob ran out of money before completing the project which was taken over by Ashton Marshall.

#296 HiRich

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 14:11

The Marwyn is a 1948 body type, so I doubt it was new to Barnes (who it has to be). I understand the car is still in the family.



#297 rbm

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Posted 12 August 2014 - 20:06

Rich, you would have to suggest the possibility of it being the ex-Evelyn Kindersley Pullibank Marwyn - based on the very small number of Marwyns and the wheels?



#298 DanTra2858

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 10:04

Rich, you would have to suggest the possibility of it being the ex-Evelyn Kindersley Pullibank Marwyn - based on the very small number of Marwyns and the wheels?


Richard who is Evelyn Kindersley Pullbank, the body style & wheels suggest that it is a 1949 model?????

#299 HiRich

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 12:52

I spent far too long convincing myself that they were the same wheels, then that they weren't. Pip Pullibank's, on the 1948 car he drove, seem to have a "Yorkshire Rose" 5-hole pattern, and I can't convince myself that the Noel Barnes car has the same pattern. Having said that, the Pullibank car is the only one I've seen that isn't running wires, multispokes or Topolino-like disks. There's nothing remotely close in my files. I asked Duncan Rabagliati for comment, but his "cool" didn't really advance the discussion. The Marwyn story has just too many holes with some cars never delivered, and at least two not making it past their first run (Don Truman rebuilt his, but the other chap... well, couldn't), and I'm not aware of anyone suitably expert.

 

Daniel

Pip Pullibank had a few runs in a Marwyn in 1948, in the UK, one image is  http://www.500race.o...ques/Marwyn.htm - note the wheels, but the rear bodywork is missing from this car.. The 1949 car (all of them, at least ex-factory) had a pointier nose, and large vents in the high engine cover. It also has rounded panniers compared with the flat sides of the 1948 car (and the Barnes car)



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#300 rbm

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 13:22

rooster.jpg

 

the Pullibank Marwyn in the early 50's