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The RB8 - The 2012 Red Bull Racing car (merged)


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#1001 2ms

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 08:43

Have to agree there, although I much prefer a great fight with Alonso like 2010, but seeing young Seb dominating the sport in such a nearly flawless manner last year was a joy to watch.


2010 was a fight between Vettel and the gremlins. Webber almost beat Alonso. Without the insane reliability problems on Vettel's car, it wouldn't have even been close between Vettel and Webber. 2011 was a big improvement as far as competitiveness with both McL and Ferrari having the RB8 beat at a few tracks. I'm betting on 2012 best season since 2007 -- Vettel vs Button for the championship with furious and nothing-to-lose versions of Hamilton, Alonso, and Schumacher spicing up the mix.

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#1002 jamiegc

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 08:51

2010 was a fight between Vettel and the gremlins. Webber almost beat Alonso. Without the insane reliability problems on Vettel's car, it wouldn't have even been close between Vettel and Webber.


Indeed. As i posted on the old Vettel thread, in 2010 Vettel lost 63 points through reliability issues and 40 points through driver errors. A season free of driver and reliability problems woudve seen him on 359 points in 2010, compared to 392 in 2011.

#1003 bauss

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 08:55

2010 was a fight between Vettel and the gremlins. Webber almost beat Alonso. Without the insane reliability problems on Vettel's car, it wouldn't have even been close between Vettel and Webber. 2011 was a big improvement as far as competitiveness with both McL and Ferrari having the RB8 beat at a few tracks. I'm betting on 2012 best season since 2007 -- Vettel vs Button for the championship with furious and nothing-to-lose versions of Hamilton, Alonso, and Schumacher spicing up the mix.


you hope

#1004 HoldenRT

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 09:00

Without trying to get into a big driver vs driver discussion.. in 2010 Vettel had unreliability yes, but there was also the team favouritism tihng to sort of even it out. I followed every race very closely watching live timing and following strategies so I'm not just throwing that around as an excuse. Where as in 2011, there was no excuse for Webber. He simply wasn't good enough, so there was nothing for the team to do.. the pressure was off them. There was on exception, Silverstone? But that was RARE in 2011, where as in 2010 that was a common thing..

Think about how micro managed F1 is, the setups, the strategies, what the drivers say.. everything. Redbull had alot of work to do in 2010 to keep both drivers happy. What I remember from 2010 was many times where Webber was behind, but had the pace but had to "hold station" where as you had Turkey for example where Vettel was behind but expected to attack. Look at Monza for example.. Vettel leapfrogged Webber with great strategy. The main time I can remember this happening for Webber was Hungary but that was ONLY because of Vettel's blunder/SC penalty. When you have two cars of equal pace, things like the start, qualifying and the strategy are the main things.. and this was pre DRS.

.. everyone talks about Turkey but there was quite a few times Webber got jipped on strategy.. for example being given a strategy that favours pace at the END of the race.. yet not being given the chance to attack in order to take advantage of it.

In 2011, no excuses he simply wasn't good enough to put pressure on the team in that way, and Vettel wiped the floor with he and everyone else. I payed little attention to Redbull strategies last season relative to 2010, simply because there was no point. It was the Vettel show aka Schumacher show.

And to get onto the topic of this years car, yeah it looks great. Good start so far. Who would have thought back in 2008, that we would be looking at a 4th consecutive year of Redbull being the car to beat.

Poor McLaren and Ferrari (NOT) :love:

#1005 CrucialXtreme

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:24

Flexi wing is still here on the RB8.

High Res--> http://bit.ly/A3HV9c

#1006 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:29

Flexi wing is still here on the RB8.

High Res--> http://bit.ly/A3HV9c


I don't see flexing there at all.


#1007 CrucialXtreme

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:31

I don't see flexing there at all.


You do not see that the left side(drivers left) is closer to the ground than the other side. Classic RB flexi wing

#1008 judd

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:31

Flexi wing is still here on the RB8.

High Res--> http://bit.ly/A3HV9c


Front left looks closer to the ground than front right end plate, this could just be roll in the chassis though. Id be suprised as that relatively low speed if the wing was deflecting much.

Edit: Could just be a bit of residual vibration from the curb?

Edited by judd, 09 February 2012 - 12:32.


#1009 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:34

You do not see that the left side(drivers left) is closer to the ground than the other side. Classic RB flexi wing


No. Just coming out of a corner at low speed? It never flexed that way IMHO.


#1010 Zava

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:36

Flexi wing is still here on the RB8.

High Res--> http://bit.ly/A3HV9c

look at the front tyres as well. (but I gotta say, the wing looks to be close to the ground anyway)

and look at Seb, looking angry in the direction of the photographer, sort of pissed because the photo reveals the flex! :lol:

#1011 CrucialXtreme

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 12:45

No. Just coming out of a corner at low speed? It never flexed that way IMHO.


Posted Image

Posted Image

http://scarbsf1.word...lls-front-wing/

#1012 H2H

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 14:15

look at the front tyres as well. (but I gotta say, the wing looks to be close to the ground anyway)

and look at Seb, looking angry in the direction of the photographer, sort of pissed because the photo reveals the flex! :lol:


Oh my god, this look must surely mean that this is a dog of a car! Or at least in the hands of Seb, so sorry Mark and karne the setup must get quickly changed and the whole dev. modified. :lol:

The big good news is that RBR seems to have grown as a team. If we believe Horner the speed and quality of the dev. process was better compared to last year and even if we don't know how good the RB8 is compared to the rest I think Red Bull will be hard to beat in the development race throughout the season. Ferrari and especially McLaren have shown how good they are in that regard so I think it will be a very interesting season.

The second good bit of news is that Mark seems to fresh, fit and eager and is comfortable with the car.

Edited by H2H, 09 February 2012 - 14:18.


#1013 gillesthegenius

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 14:33

Nice to see Seb complete that very solid 20 lap stint. Was getting a little worried about the lack of activity around lunch. :)

#1014 apoka

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:16

Nice to see Seb complete that very solid 20 lap stint. Was getting a little worried about the lack of activity around lunch. :)

No impressive / conclusive times from today though. I could be wrong, but I think there should be quite a few 2012 cars capable of 1:24/1:25 long runs even with high fuel. Track reports are positive though. The car seems to be more stable than on day 1. Waiting for an opinion from Vettel ...


#1015 prty

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:29

Sorry if it has been posted already:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Driver cooling? :drunk:

Edited by prty, 09 February 2012 - 17:31.


#1016 silversurf3r

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:35

Seb on first day in RB8 from Sky Sports

"It's been two months since we were in the car, so it does take a couple of laps to get back in the rhythm, but the car feels fine and as we expected," said Sebastian.

"There's quite a loss of grip due to the regulation changes, but you get used to it quickly and then start to explore how the new car feels. So far we can be happy, we had a couple of issues, but it's normal when the car is new."


Edited by silversurf3r, 09 February 2012 - 17:36.


#1017 maverick69

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:39

Sorry if it has been posted already:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Driver cooling? :drunk:


Do we have a fluidic switch ladies and gentlemen?

#1018 ClubmanGT

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:39

Sorry if it has been posted already:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Driver cooling? :drunk:


Looks like an internally contained diffuser in the floor, or it's channeling air to move faster over the keel.

#1019 gillesthegenius

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:41

Its good to hear that the car felt as expected and that he is happy about the day. But I wonder what 'the couple of issues' he is talking about were?

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#1020 gillesthegenius

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:54

No impressive / conclusive times from today though. I could be wrong, but I think there should be quite a few 2012 cars capable of 1:24/1:25 long runs even with high fuel. Track reports are positive though. The car seems to be more stable than on day 1. Waiting for an opinion from Vettel ...


When has RBR ever shown its true pace in testing. The important thing is that things went smoothly today with Seb managing get in two solid long runs as opposed to none from either of Mclaren and Ferrari.

#1021 gillesthegenius

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 17:56

Sorry if it has been posted already:

Posted Image

Posted Image

Driver cooling? :drunk:


Surely not. :eek:

#1022 apoka

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 18:04

When has RBR ever shown its true pace in testing. The important thing is that things went smoothly today with Seb managing get in two solid long runs as opposed to none from either of Mclaren and Ferrari.

In my opinion, they haven't done qualy laps very often in the past years, but they always showed good long run pace. I expect this to be the case this year as well - I'm just saying that it hasn't happened in the first testing days so far.

#1023 H2H

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 19:04


Great pics. I have a theory but I will have to make a few sketches to collect my thoughts.



#1024 Zava

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 20:57

so where goes on the air from the top inlet? the circular holes are for the nose cone, aren't they?
but then there is no slot for it, it surely can't go down there.

#1025 fieraku

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 21:01

so where goes on the air from the top inlet? the circular holes are for the nose cone, aren't they?
but then there is no slot for it, it surely can't go down there.

Look at the bottom there is a thin slot with dividers it seems.

#1026 glorius&victorius

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 21:07

maybe the entire car is an fduct... mclaren pioneered it for the rear wing.... mercedes made it for the front wing... red bull does it for the entire under tray of the car... who knows...

this looks a bit scary.


or maybe is just cooling for the kers.

Edited by glorius&victorius, 09 February 2012 - 21:09.


#1027 Szoelloe

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 21:12

Why wouldn't that be driver cooling? If it is not, then there's no driver cooling at all, which cannot be the case. That gap is just what Newey says it is.

#1028 Zava

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 21:15

Look at the bottom there is a thin slot with dividers it seems.

the "surely it can't go down there" part was about the downside slot. look to the top, the blade in the middle is the blade in the upper inlet - so the air would have to drop the whole depth of the nose in about 0 cm longitudinally, with no visible channel for it.

#1029 Raifosa

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 21:25

Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1
RT @K_Parrott: @ScarbsF1 “@Khan_F1: pic.twitter.com/jKuyESKR” More of that RBR second nose hole
Posted Image

Alejandro Canalejo @Khan_F1
@ScarbsF1 @K_Parrott Any ideas, anyone? Air flow under nose is critical, so surely must be there for some important reason?


Craig Scarborough @ScarbsF1
@Khan_F1 I can only think to cool the SECU which tends to mounted in the "V" of the cockpit above the splitter



#1030 Nonesuch

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Posted 09 February 2012 - 22:32

I'm not sure how, but I completely missed the launch of this car. It looks pretty good (save for the nose, obviously) - and it's always fun to see cars where people are left guessing as to "what does that piece do?" :up:

For the sake of the championship though, I do hope this car isn't as dominating as the previous two Red Bulls were!  ;)

#1031 wingwalker

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 09:35

You do not see that the left side(drivers left) is closer to the ground than the other side. Classic RB flexi wing



or a classic F1 car in a turn shot.

#1032 gillesthegenius

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 09:36

Anyone knows why Seb hasnt set a time yet?

#1033 sosidge

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:27

Without trying to get into a big driver vs driver discussion.. in 2010 Vettel had unreliability yes, but there was also the team favouritism tihng to sort of even it out.


Not this one again...

If you had actually been watching the season as closely as you claim, you would have noticed that at every race where there was an allegation of team favouritism, Webber actually ended up scoring MORE points than Vettel.

Impossible to argue that the team favouritism evened out that battle - if anything it ended up bringing Webber closer.

Unless you are going to use the general "they are so mean to Mark" whinge - well, they can't have been that mean because Mark has re-signed for the team TWICE since Turkey 2010.

#1034 puxanando

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 10:35

Anyone knows why Seb hasnt set a time yet?


I read something about electronical problems


#1035 plumtree

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:03

10:31 @StrangAutosport reports that Red Bull is warming the car up now, and Vettel is heading across from the hospitality

10:45 Red Bull has informed @StrangAutosport about the problems with Vettel's car:
"Normal testing niggles, some of which are not easy to get. It was not in the plan to lose three hours but we are quite unconcerned. Expect to do long runs later."


News from Ted Kravitz: “The first sign of unreliability for Red Bull. An electrical problem has brought progress to a halt. The car went out and did two installation laps earlier in the day before the team suffered the failure. I’ve been down to the pits and mechanics are busily scurrying from truck to garage working to fix the problem. But it means that Sebastian Vettel has missed a couple of hours of testing, and when each of these drivers only has six or seven days of pre-season testing, that’s not insignificant.

“The usual caveat applies though: this is just testing and it’s better to have these failures now than at the second and third tests, which will be when we only get a true read of where everyone stands.”

#1036 gillesthegenius

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:33

This is turning out to be a frustrating day for me. three and a half hours of action and still no sign of Seb. :mad:

Hopefully he can, god willing, put together some strong long runs in the evening.

#1037 KirilVarbanov

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:40

Those fluid containers from the second picture have always been there, check this picture from 2009 -
http://www.team-bhp....ai-p1000721.jpg

#1038 gillesthegenius

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:45

Those fluid containers from the second picture have always been there, check this picture from 2009 -
http://www.team-bhp....ai-p1000721.jpg


So thats nothing new. For a while I feared that the RB8's secrets were exposed so early in the year.

#1039 gillesthegenius

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:46

Btw something positive for the RBR fans in this rather frustrating morning...

Red Bull test driver Sebastian Buemi on Twitter:

2nd day in the simulator. Driving Barcelona this time!



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#1040 Lazy

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:48

Those fluid containers from the second picture have always been there, check this picture from 2009 -
http://www.team-bhp....ai-p1000721.jpg


They've all got them, thats brake fuid.

#1041 maverick69

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:49

Those fluid containers from the second picture have always been there, check this picture from 2009 -
http://www.team-bhp....ai-p1000721.jpg


That looks like a 2006 Toro Rosso

#1042 ClubmanGT

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:53

I presume they are the master cylinders for the pedals.

#1043 HoldenRT

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 11:58

In previous winter testing.. when people said RBR looked strong. It wasn't laptimes.. long run pace OR quick times. It was how the car looked when viewing it on track.

Nick Heidfeld for example talked about how well balanced it looked etc, braking late, speed in fast corners, traction etc (I can't remember the exact details) and at the time his prediction seemed bold.. and then after the first race or two everyone talked about how well Heidfeld had picked it.

The last few winters I remember Ferrari seeming strong in laptimes (especially race sims) and then they get to the first race and they are behind where everyone thought they were. That pattern has happened a few times in the last few seasons. And then Ferrari have to "catch up". For example.. last winter everyone thought McLaren were struggling and Ferrari were strong and it turned out Ferrari were actually BEHIND McLaren.

Ferrari seem to have a lot of pressure on them from Italy and the Tifosi so it's hard to ever take their test times too seriously. Where as Redbull have a less passionate following and just get on with business. Redbull have never looked dominant in the winter like Brawn did in that final Barcelona test in 2009.

#1044 gillesthegenius

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 12:09

In previous winter testing.. when people said RBR looked strong. It wasn't laptimes.. long run pace OR quick times. It was how the car looked when viewing it on track.

Nick Heidfeld for example talked about how well balanced it looked etc, braking late, speed in fast corners, traction etc (I can't remember the exact details) and at the time his prediction seemed bold.. and then after the first race or two everyone talked about how well Heidfeld had picked it.

The last few winters I remember Ferrari seeming strong in laptimes (especially race sims) and then they get to the first race and they are behind where everyone thought they were. That pattern has happened a few times in the last few seasons. And then Ferrari have to "catch up". For example.. last winter everyone thought McLaren were struggling and Ferrari were strong and it turned out Ferrari were actually BEHIND McLaren.

Ferrari seem to have a lot of pressure on them from Italy and the Tifosi so it's hard to ever take their test times too seriously. Where as Redbull have a less passionate following and just get on with business. Redbull have never looked dominant in the winter like Brawn did in that final Barcelona test in 2009.


That is so true.

#1045 puxanando

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 12:14

Red Bull in troble? They have to change the engine?

#1046 mgs315

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 12:21

Problem with that statement is that McLaren actually were in trouble last year.

If we're going by look then it's another Red Bull season with a close (maybe closer) McLaren?

#1047 cilurnum

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 12:57

Losing several hours is not great. The only consolation is that he did 96 laps yesterday.

The exhaust system is still extremely basic on that Red Bull. I have a hard time believing they don't have something else they can put on there. Maybe they're waiting to let other teams test what is legal and what is not?

#1048 puxanando

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 13:04

Maybe they're waiting to let other teams test what is legal and what is not?


:rotfl:


#1049 KirilVarbanov

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 13:26

That looks like a 2006 Toro Rosso

No, that's RB5 from 2009. And yes, these are brake fluid containers / master cylinders, so nothing revolutionary here.
The reason why they are there, packed between the suspension is simple: space reduction (front and rear brakes are there). However, I don't see how the RB8 nose duct would be used for driver cooling - rather KERS or electronics.

#1050 Clatter

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Posted 10 February 2012 - 13:29

No, that's RB5 from 2009. And yes, these are brake fluid containers / master cylinders, so nothing revolutionary here.
The reason why they are there, packed between the suspension is simple: space reduction (front and rear brakes are there). However, I don't see how the RB8 nose duct would be used for driver cooling - rather KERS or electronics.


Can't see how they would get enough air through there to the back of the car to give any real KERS cooling benefit.