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Williams 2012 - FW34 Renault


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#1301 GSF1

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 10:54

Yes.
Posted Image


This car is looking very competitive, looks mean, and they are slowly drip feeding us and slowly adding more sponsorship, I like th build up, just like the testing time, great consistency.

I would say like Mustaf - I told you so, and all, but couldn't be bothered. hahaha to him and his expertise,

Maybe one more sponsor on next to Embratel and we have a full sponsor pack, thinking next test session at Barcelona.

As for times, it means nothing, if they are correlating all data and areo to wind tunnel and simulator, then go as slow as you like, if it helps in the development race, then we should be in for a strong year, Please do not forget we have the best facilities outside the top four and as history has shown our development rate is stronger than any of the other midfield team (except for last year). I would hate to be Lotus and as we were last year where you show strong pace in testing but have a major design error

Edited by GSF1, 22 February 2012 - 10:56.


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#1302 Little Leaf

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 11:14

Over 50 laps for Bottas so far, and only a tenth off of Senna from yesterday.

Shows how much Williams haven't been going for times so far, if any evidence was needed

#1303 GSF1

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 11:17

Bottas getting two fully days of testing is such a smart move by Williams, Gives him the chance to learn the car, and get up his experience, he is going to be some much more useful in his practice session through out the year with this experience than if he didn't have it. Another good move by a now thinking Williams GP.

Think he is also shown maturity and consistency with his times today, doing what he needs to do and what the team is asking of him,

#1304 GSF1

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 11:18

Over 50 laps for Bottas so far, and only a tenth off of Senna from yesterday.

Shows how much Williams haven't been going for times so far, if any evidence was needed


+1 :clap:

working through a very well developed programme,

#1305 gio66

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 11:35

amazing.
there are people who really thinks there may be more than 0.1s between the drivers?

I thought I was in a forum of competent ...

#1306 GSF1

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 11:46

amazing.
there are people who really thinks there may be more than 0.1s between the drivers?

I thought I was in a forum of competent ...


Please explain, we talking about testing and data acquisition or outright qualifying speed?

One is completely opposed to the other, unless you are going for outright speed which I doubt Williams are doing


#1307 tractionman

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:00

It is pretty clear they are running a different program today for Bottas. He has been doing 10 lap stints on softs showing both good speed and consistency. There's no doubting that he is a good bet for the future. The track has more rubber on it so comparing his times to Bruno's is rather meaningless.

Edited by tractionman, 22 February 2012 - 12:01.


#1308 xtremespeedjunkie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:05

Any amount of experience in preseason testing is less. The grand-daddy of them all Schumi might have been second best to Rosberg last year but i know whose Views regarding car balance would be given more weight-age at Merc . I am not one bit saying the development would be skewed towards Michael rather that experience is gold when it comes to preseason testing, especially when you live in an ear with in-season ban on testing. If Senna/Pastor were paired with Rubens , i would not have had any issues. At-least you have some reliable feedback to rely on. Now it is not about matching each others time but to listen to what the engine is saying , what the tires are saying, what the suspension is saying etc which oi am afraid will only come with experience. Now if both Senna and Pastor were so good why did Williams hire a driver-mentor like Wurz who never set the world on fire in F1.

#1309 gio66

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:10

Please explain, we talking about testing and data acquisition or outright qualifying speed?

One is completely opposed to the other, unless you are going for outright speed which I doubt Williams are doing

it's for those who "X would be half a second faster than Y"

they do not know what they're talking about.

#1310 Boing 2

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:20

Bottas getting two fully days of testing is such a smart move by Williams, Gives him the chance to learn the car, and get up his experience, he is going to be some much more useful in his practice session through out the year with this experience than if he didn't have it. Another good move by a now thinking Williams GP.

Think he is also shown maturity and consistency with his times today, doing what he needs to do and what the team is asking of him,


I think they're giving him far too much time in the car, pre season mileage plus FP1's is robbing the actual racers of too much track time.

#1311 xtremespeedjunkie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:24

I think they're giving him far too much time in the car, pre season mileage plus FP1's is robbing the actual racers of too much track time.


+1

As i have mentioned before, its the guys who will be actually racing the car, should be given maximum mileage. Trying to make your race drivers comfortable in the car and to understand the nuances of the car reacting to various set-up changes should be the main priority rather than training your third driver in a brand new car.

#1312 Anderis

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 12:45

Well, you cannot be sure what are they going to do.

Maybe they treat 2012 as an intermediate year and want to have stronger season in 2013 with Bottas as a future team leader?

#1313 GustavoB

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 14:01

+1

As i have mentioned before, its the guys who will be actually racing the car, should be given maximum mileage. Trying to make your race drivers comfortable in the car and to understand the nuances of the car reacting to various set-up changes should be the main priority rather than training your third driver in a brand new car.


:up:

#1314 TURU

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 14:20

Maybe they treat 2012 as an intermediate year and want to have stronger season in 2013 with Bottas as a future team leader?


Oh look, we are two weeks into winter testing and the usual "Williams will come back stronger next year" talk has already started. Bodes well for the season ahead. :lol:

#1315 King Six

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 14:25

:up:

To be honest, at least he hasn't binned it and written the entire day off (yes I'm looking at you, Bianchi) :stoned:

#1316 Hans V

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 14:31

I'm old enough to remeber when Williams were sandbagging during pre-season tests only to take pole at the first race, while Jordan were doing underweight glory runs to attract sponsors, and then qualifying 15th. I hope it's the same we see now with Williams and Force India.  ;)

#1317 PayasYouRace

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 14:45

+1

As i have mentioned before, its the guys who will be actually racing the car, should be given maximum mileage. Trying to make your race drivers comfortable in the car and to understand the nuances of the car reacting to various set-up changes should be the main priority rather than training your third driver in a brand new car.


Yet you want them to put Barrichello in the car.

#1318 FordFan

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 16:14

Another disappointing day, though who knows what to expect from Bottas.

Looks like a super soft run in there (went from 1:25s to 1:29s in 8 laps). But with a very poor first lap, if so. Put some fuel in the car and it does Caterham worthy times in the 1:32s.

Other teams doing race sims, while Williams still focusing on basic setup with 10-lappers.

Not good. At least it's reliable.

#1319 sheogorath

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 16:25

If Senna/Pastor were paired with Rubens , i would not have had any issues.


I'm sure someone is going to send an email to Williams to let them know they need your expert opinion(and your blessing for the drivers' lineup) coming next season. Heck, maybe they can hire you as a mentor!.

:rolleyes:

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#1320 tractionman

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 16:28

Another disappointing day, though who knows what to expect from Bottas.

Looks like a super soft run in there (went from 1:25s to 1:29s in 8 laps). But with a very poor first lap, if so. Put some fuel in the car and it does Caterham worthy times in the 1:32s.

Other teams doing race sims, while Williams still focusing on basic setup with 10-lappers.

Not good. At least it's reliable.


That run was probably done on softs. Senna went from 1:25s to 1:27 on a 10 lap soft run yesterday. The team clearly need to develop the car further but they have not done any targeted time chasing so far. While I doubt if they are close to FI and STR on current form, it is clear from the team's comments that this car is a strong baseline for future development. This is very different to the fw33. That said it would be good to see some of this potential being exploited before the season starts.

#1321 xtremespeedjunkie

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 16:35

Yet you want them to put Barrichello in the car.


Yup Barrichello as No1 driver with Pastor/Senna as his team-mate.

#1322 Anderis

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 16:37

Put some fuel in the car and it does Caterham worthy times in the 1:32s.

I don't think that Williams's real pace with full tank is in the 1:32s or more.

Other teams doing race sims, while Williams still focusing on basic setup with 10-lappers.

It's a pity that nobody has realised that in Jerez, Williams was the first to do race sim, while others still focusing on bacis setup with 5-7 lappers. :drunk:


Oh look, we are two weeks into winter testing and the usual "Williams will come back stronger next year" talk has already started. Bodes well for the season ahead. :lol:

Sorry, I was thinking about that even before 2011 season ended. They might need time to recover after such a poor season and deliver the best from current technical team, which was changing while the current car was being designed, as well as build the car well around new engine.

#1323 sheogorath

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 17:05

Yup Barrichello as No1 driver with Pastor/Senna as his team-mate.



Too bad Barrichello never was No1 driver material.

#1324 Sanman59

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 17:57

The facts are the facts. Senna was over two seconds off the fastest times yeterday and Bottas over 3 seconds today.

Hardly encouraging is it for a team that has done more laps than any other since testing started in Jerez.

Looks like another long hard season. The car is slow out of the box and please lets not be waffling on about pay drivers again. Both deserve their place in F1 given their performances in GP2. That is why they attracted sponsors!

:rolleyes:

Edited by Sanman59, 22 February 2012 - 18:16.


#1325 Jambo

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 18:03

The facts are they have been lapping under the fastest race lap from last year with what looks like proper fuel loads. Wait until they try to set a time before jumping to conclusions.

They have even said that what today was was a simulation of Friday FP1 to give Bottas an idea of what he will be doing at race weekends.

#1326 Mastah

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 18:41

FP1 in Malaysia will be next time with Valtteri behind the wheel of FW34, so Bruno gets whole weekend in Australia :D.

#1327 FordFan

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 19:40

For comparison only

Day 1 Barca 2011

Driver - Team - Best Lap time - Laps
Vettel - Red Bull - 1:24.374 - 37
Alonso - Ferrari - 1:25.495 - 101
Alguersuari - Toro Rosso - 1:25.638 - 57
Kobayashi - Sauber - 1:25.641 - 78
Button - McLaren - 1:26.365 - 77
di Resta - Force India - 1:26.575 - 26
Barrichello - Williams - 1:26.912 - 52
Schumacher - Mercedes GP - 1:27.512 - 90
Karthikeyan - HRT - 1:28.393 - 116
Kovalainen - Team Lotus - 1:30.065 - 54
d'Ambrosio - Virgin - 1:30.950 - 116
Petrov - Lotus-Renault - 1:35.174 - 20
Heidfeld - Lotus-Renault - 1.44.324 - 27


Day 2 from Barcelona (19 Feb 2011)

Driver - Team - Best Lap time - Laps
Vettel - Red Bull - 1:23.315 - 104
Alguersuari - Toro Rosso - 1:23.519 - 97
Alonso - Ferrari - 1:23.978 - 90
Barrichello - Williams - 1:24.008 - 118
Heidfeld - Lotus-Renault - 1:24.242 - 41
Kobayashi - Sauber - 1:24.243 - 125
Rosberg - Mercedes GP - 1:24.730 - 131
Button - McLaren - 1:24.923 - 54
di Resta - Force India - 1:25.194 - 80
Kovalainen - Team Lotus - 1:26.421 - 58
Petrov - Lotus-Renault - 1:26.884 - 61
Liuzzi - HRT - 1:27.044 - 70
Glock - Marussia Virgin - 1:27.242 66

Day 1 Barca 2012

Vettel - Red Bull - 1:23.265 - 79
Hulkenberg - Force India - 1:23.440 - 97
Hamilton - McLaren - 1:23.590 - 114
Ricciardo - Toro Rosso - 1:23.618 - 76
Alonso - Ferrari - 1:24.100 - 75
Schumacher - Mercedes - 1:24.150 - 51
Perez - Sauber - 1:24.219 - 66
Senna - Williams - 1:25.711 - 97
Kovalainen - Caterham - 1:26.035 - 31
Grosjean - Lotus - 1:26.809 - 7
Pic Marussia - 1:28.026 - 131

Day 2 Barca 2012

Hulkenberg - Force India - 1:22.608 - 112
Perez - Sauber - 1:22.648 - 85 - 3
Vettel - Red Bull - 1:22.891 - 104
Alonso - Ferrari - 1:23.180 - 87
Ricciardo - Toro Rosso - 1:23.639 - 50
Hamilton - McLaren - 1:23.806 - 120
Rosberg - Mercedes - 1:24.555 - 82
Bottas - Williams - 1:25.738 - 117
Petrov - Caterham - 1:26.605 - 69
Pic - Marussia - 1:27.343 - 108

#1328 Sevach

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:02

Best time from a Williams at Barça last year was an 22.2 by Barrichello at the last test, the team is definitely running with a lot of fuel onboard.
On the actual race weekend the team couldn't match that and Pastor did a 22,8, beating Rubens and making Q3.

Hard to say what is the limit of a midfield car like the Force India, EBD is gone, but the tyres are suppoused to be faster (in Jerez they were, don't know if that's the case in Barça).


#1329 Francesc

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:05

Valtteri says that today they learned a bit more about the slow corners problem.
http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/97636

Edited by Francesc, 22 February 2012 - 20:05.


#1330 GustavoB

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:13

Valtteri says that today they learned a bit more about the slow corners problem.
http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/97636


They already found a clear weakness on the new car. I hope they can do something to improve that before Melbourne.
It seems that Bruno feedback isn't so bad at all.



#1331 Sevach

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:17

For years and years Williams, since the BMW days, has had good cars in terms of mechanical grip with bad aero.

Hopefully they will fix what is wrong with the FW34 quickly.

#1332 Watkins74

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:24

I don't believe Bottas has his own thread so I will ask this here.

He is so young and if he is as good as some people claim why not do GP2 and get everyone's attention? He just seems so young to be in the 3rd driver role.

JMHO

#1333 sheogorath

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 20:40

His decision apparently. The GP2 calendar conflicts with the FP calendars, so he decided to stick to the test driver role instead of racing in GP2

#1334 PayasYouRace

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Posted 22 February 2012 - 21:31

Yup Barrichello as No1 driver with Pastor/Senna as his team-mate.


As much as I like Rubens I don't see that as being any better overall than the real line up. If you want comparisons with last year, just compare Pastor's times. He was there last year too so your benchmark is there. Then Bruno seems to be quite a good test driver.

Let's wait and see. The most important issue this year is getting the new technical team used to working together, finding out where the strengths and weaknesses are. The team needs a foundation for the future. Right now I'd rather Williams are quiet in testing and then surprise us during the season rather than go for glory now and then disappoint us for another 12 months.

#1335 packapoo

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:20

Shaping up as another lost year isn't it?

I'm not daft enough to believe that just because they're not turning up now they'll change their spots when the racing starts.
We read every year how good their car performs pre-season.....then no-where. :confused:

#1336 Petroltorque

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:35

I don't know what everyone is worried about. It doesn't look like Williams have gone out chasing times as I suspect FI, STR and Sauber have done. Gillan has taken a systematic approach to testing. I'm willing to put a small wager that they get on top the slow corner stability issue by the end of this test. If you want to feel real despair I suggest visiting the Ferrari thread.

#1337 GSF1

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 08:57

Shaping up as another lost year isn't it?

I'm not daft enough to believe that just because they're not turning up now they'll change their spots when the racing starts.
We read every year how good their car performs pre-season.....then no-where. :confused:


where have we heard from anyone say this car is so good..... no where, they are been understated and even pointing out the deficiency in testing, not one person has come out and said how good this car is.

I have been getting sick of the last 7 years of the same thing, but such a different outfit this year, and a completely different approach.

And yes, Rubens is and was overrated as a driver. Bruno is quicker IMO

#1338 GSF1

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 08:59

I don't know what everyone is worried about. It doesn't look like Williams have gone out chasing times as I suspect FI, STR and Sauber have done. Gillan has taken a systematic approach to testing. I'm willing to put a small wager that they get on top the slow corner stability issue by the end of this test. If you want to feel real despair I suggest visiting the Ferrari thread.



Also the question would be, what development/s are they working on right now with all this data acquisitions, the next test in Barca is when I will be looking, I'm sure they will have a melb spec/definative spec upgrade on the car,

#1339 GSF1

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:05

Fastest lap by Williams this week, only lap 13, The money man, may get to open her up today

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#1340 Little Leaf

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:37

Fastest lap by Williams this week, only lap 13, The money man, may get to open her up today


Sub 1:25 lap from Pastor

Let's hope they can carry that on, nothing wrong in seeing the car further up the timesheets!

#1341 tractionman

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:40

Sub 1:25 lap from Pastor

Let's hope they can carry that on, nothing wrong in seeing the car further up the timesheets!


They are doing short 5 lap runs- hopefully they clock something in the 1:23 range by the end of the day.

#1342 GSF1

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 10:19

Sub 1:25 lap from Pastor

Let's hope they can carry that on, nothing wrong in seeing the car further up the timesheets!


Would be great a 22 today, but doubt they would do that here at this time, but some better times today. also senna and bottas say car not good in slow corners, may have something to do with fuel load being so heavy,

#1343 A.Fant

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 10:57

Would be great a 22 today, but doubt they would do that here at this time, but some better times today. also senna and bottas say car not good in slow corners, may have something to do with fuel load being so heavy,


Well the drivers are hopefully able to account for the fuel effect in their evaluation and not mistake a heavily fueled car for a badly handling one. Then I'd be REALLY worried.

Hopefully they are able to rectify this problem and the car is probably more competetive than last years abomination, but after last years debacle I've decided not to get any hopes up before the first race.

Edited by A.Fant, 23 February 2012 - 10:57.


#1344 roadie

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 10:57

Well, there's a mid 1.23...

On mediums apparently, so must be fairly light.

Edited by roadie, 23 February 2012 - 11:02.


#1345 A.Fant

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:02

Well, there's a mid 1.23...


On mediums no less. Hülk and Perez were on SS's yesterday posting 22.6's, what is the estimated difference between SS and medium per lap?

Edited by A.Fant, 23 February 2012 - 11:03.


#1346 Jambo

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:12

Not a bad lap on meduim tyres, a 23.3 then a slow lap and then another 23.3 before pitting. Dialling it in I would say.

And now a 22.6 on the soft tyres.

Edited by Jambo, 23 February 2012 - 11:17.


#1347 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:14

Glad I've not panicked about the times. *smugface*

#1348 rayburn

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:18

Would be great a 22 today, but doubt they would do that here at this time, but some better times today. also senna and bottas say car not good in slow corners, may have something to do with fuel load being so heavy,


They have just done a 22.6!

#1349 A.Fant

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:18

1:22.6 on softs, FI/Sauber was on SS's yesterday. The sky might not be falling after all...

#1350 GSF1

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Posted 23 February 2012 - 11:19

I gotta a feeling, this year could be a good good year. Who said pay drivers were no good?

Mustaf where are you?