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Caterham F1 - 2012


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#2051 mechadaniel

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 21:03

It's really complicated to read your automated english, perhaps you should try to write it yourself rather than passing it through a robot?


Ah, mystery solved:)


Anyway, Petrov is in my opinion a driver who can do well if paired with an excelent driver. Put him alone and he is unimpressive. His second year at Renault was nothing special


Well, to be fair being the 2nd driver in that team has always looked like a poisoned chalice:) Remember the abuse he got from the team management, can't have helped really...


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#2052 swerved

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Posted 27 November 2012 - 21:26

I had to laugh at Petrov in the sky sports post race interview..


"You know when i go out of the car he want to kiss me"





One of the nicer moments of the day.


#2053 CatInTheBag

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 13:07



Looks like its between GvdG, Senna & Petrov.

Heikki maybe has a chance with Lotus because Lotus from what I've heard, could be sold to a new owner who is not a fan of Grosjean. And the person to head the team
will be an ex-team director, very authoritarian, whose name was witheld. Not Flavio Briatore, in case he's what you have in mind.



#2054 mechadaniel

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 13:21

Looks like its between GvdG, Senna & Petrov.

Heikki maybe has a chance with Lotus because Lotus from what I've heard, could be sold to a new owner who is not a fan of Grosjean. And the person to head the team
will be an ex-team director, very authoritarian, whose name was witheld. Not Flavio Briatore, in case he's what you have in mind.


My guess:

Heikki -> Entone
Petrov -> Marussia
Senna -> Caterham

Probably not though as Caterham surely need to have at least one driver from this year for continuity of development.
:)

#2055 CatInTheBag

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 13:44



10th place earned Caterham $26mil.

Steve Nielsem said, Caterham aerodynamics department has been completely restructured. They've identified the problems with CT-01, its their fault, not wind tunnel. The 2013 CT-02 looked very
different already.

Target 9th place in 2013. :lol:

#2056 billm99uk

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 13:45

"Bring it home or there will be no talking"


"My tyres are graining, I'm losing a second a lap. I hope they'll hold out..." :p

#2057 Red17

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Posted 30 November 2012 - 22:01

10th place earned Caterham $26mil.

Steve Nielsem said, Caterham aerodynamics department has been completely restructured. They've identified the problems with CT-01, its their fault, not wind tunnel. The 2013 CT-02 looked very
different already.

Target 9th place in 2013. :lol:

It was kinda obvious there was a serious problem in the aero department. If the calendar were as long as nascar's Caterham would be racing HRT.

#2058 hippie

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 02:37

10th place earned Caterham $26mil.

Steve Nielsem said, Caterham aerodynamics department has been completely restructured. They've identified the problems with CT-01, its their fault, not wind tunnel. The 2013 CT-02 looked very
different already.

Target 9th place in 2013. :lol:

Sounds great. But apparently they thought they had sorted out the wind tunnel problems before the Abu Dhabi updates, which didn't work. What's the source of your information?

BTW, I'm a big fan of Steve Nielsen. I think he's the most straight-talking guy in Caterham F1.

#2059 CatInTheBag

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 05:56



Sorry, can't trace back the source.

Its a recent article about the prospect of Senna and Razia by a Brazilian F1 journo. Knows Steve Nielsen well, and mentioned Caterham for a fair amount.





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#2060 Red17

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 12:52

Sorry, can't trace back the source.

Its a recent article about the prospect of Senna and Razia by a Brazilian F1 journo. Knows Steve Nielsen well, and mentioned Caterham for a fair amount.

You mean this one?
http://blogs.estadao...a-e-luiz-razia/

#2061 CatInTheBag

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 13:01

You mean this one?
http://blogs.estadao...a-e-luiz-razia/



:up: yes.

#2062 hippie

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Posted 01 December 2012 - 23:11

Thursday's Autosport magazine has Edd Straw's article on Caterham F1. It says Caterham's goal has so far been to become a top team in the long term, but lately they've analyzed that it costs too much. So now the new strategy is to stop pouring money in and, instead, establish Caterham as a mid-pack squad with the current resources. The article suggests that QPR, in contrast, continues to enjoy "spectacular investment" from Fernandes.

The article also says that John Iley has made a number of changes to the way Caterham's aerodynamic department works, which can help the team to make the next step.

#2063 packapoo

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 00:18

Target 9th place in 2013. :lol:


Where'd they finish in 2012 out of 12 teams - 10th? (i.e. third last?)

2013, target 9th out of 11 teams. If achieved, even this minor miracle will see them finish.............3rd last.

Progress?? Only on the percentages, so hardly!


#2064 Myrvold

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 01:59

Well, a 9th means beating one of the established teams...

#2065 sergeym

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 05:22

Where'd they finish in 2012 out of 12 teams - 10th? (i.e. third last?)

2013, target 9th out of 11 teams. If achieved, even this minor miracle will see them finish.............3rd last.

Progress?? Only on the percentages, so hardly!


Actually it would be quite a significant progress. While 12-10th positions are usually determined be highest place finish (so one good race can change everything), 9th place means having to earn points. For example to take 9th this year Caterham would have to earn more than 26 points.

#2066 CatInTheBag

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 06:17

The article suggests that QPR, in contrast, continues to enjoy "spectacular investment" from Fernandes.



Not anymore, if they are cut adrift at the bottom, according to their manager. No point pouring in any more money for nothing. The structure of the club is so bad in particular
with the wage, its no wonder the players are uneasy.

I've said it many times, F1 is always just a way for Tony to get into the car business. He's got it now.

Its good to hear Caterham F1 continues, but I think Tony has got his mind set at the business front from now on, in particular how to make the Caterham-Alpine project successful.

Nice reminder by sergeym. 9th is a huge task.

#2067 lambylamby

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Posted 02 December 2012 - 08:55

Nice reminder by sergeym. 9th is a huge task.


Indeed... Agreed... I would even add the most likely contender caterham and marussia have for that spot is toro rosso... Red bull aren't going to want that for their young drivers and image tarnished with that sort of 'calibre' battle, so we've got a fight on our hands next season. I expect a better than average season for TR again from red bull money... If not then I expect to see the first points for marussia and caterham. 3 years have proven they are both getting closer, I think even marussias John booth said the average qualifying has gone from 4% within to 2.5% within at the end races (whether they were shorter tracks though). With similar regs I hope for a higher calibre from both teams... What a great fight that would be.


#2068 awizul

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 10:53

It seems increasingly likely that Vitaly Petrov will be retained by Caterham as he saved the team $10 million with his efforts in Brazil and has around $12 million in support behind him. There are others with money, but the Russian seems to have more.


As wrote by joe saward here

#2069 Anja

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 11:19

I don't think there's a better option for Caterham than Petrov. He's fast AND he brings money. Plus, it's always good to have a continuity with at least one driver.

#2070 CatInTheBag

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Posted 05 December 2012 - 11:22


On the other hand, Lotus seems to want to retain Grosjean. Unlucky for Heikki.

Here's a recent video of the Brazilian GP with Caterham
http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be



#2071 TudorMiron

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Posted 07 December 2012 - 21:31

I'd be extremely happy if Petrov does retain his seat.

Edited by TudorMiron, 07 December 2012 - 21:36.


#2072 Saturnus

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 16:34

I can't see how the team could defend keeping Kovalainen over Petrov at least.
No matter who you think are best, there is not much between them and only
One of them brings money, one takes money.
Easy choice unless there's someone else in the picture.


#2073 Red17

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 22:09

Easy choice unless there's someone else in the picture.

I think at this point anyone with a large purse could be in the picture.
Caterham may well be playing some games to see what sort of offers show up.

#2074 awizul

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 13:33

I think at this point anyone with a large purse could be in the picture.
Caterham may well be playing some games to see what sort of offers show up.


...and apparently GvDG tweeted this today

Good news soon guys!! So keep on following close...



#2075 jals99

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 13:44

...and apparently GvDG tweeted this today

Its just continue of first tweet: Happy to get back in training... It's always good to give body and mind some rest, i am fully charged and ready to push!!! Hope to have Good news soon guys!! So keep on following close... šŸ‘

So he just hopes to have good news...



#2076 Rosberg

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 16:56

Looking forward to see him IF he does get the race seat. He was linked with so many teams in the past and maybe his time will come.

#2077 olliek88

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 19:19

Pic got some new clothes today...

Posted Image

http://www.autohebdo..._medium=twitter

#2078 eronrules

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 19:32

Pic got some new clothes today...

Posted Image

http://www.autohebdo..._medium=twitter


:up:

btw, why does he always look so exhausted??

#2079 Red17

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 22:21

Steve Nielsen out. I guess the restructuring is in full motion.

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#2080 David Lightman

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 22:45

Pic says they're not fussed about scoring points. Why bother then?

#2081 Anja

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 22:50

Well, I guess it's better than saying as every year "this season we want to join the midfield" and failing to do so.

Edited by Anja, 19 December 2012 - 22:50.


#2082 mechadaniel

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 22:57

Steve Nielsen out. I guess the restructuring is in full motion.


Or he got a great job offer from another team that is busy restructuring:)

Did we ever get a date for a drivers announcement?

No clues from the drivers on what's going on - Heikki is tweeting about winter training as normal, and I have no idea what is normal for Petrov but as ever he is uploading totally baffling pictures - today travelling on public transport:)


#2083 One

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 23:10

After a bad one year what would one team do? Kick out one so that the rest can stay on. Scapegoat...

#2084 Red17

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 23:13

But it falls in line with Fernandes hinting at mass decapitation in case of failure and the aero people admiting big changes were happening in the off-season.

As for who will partner Pic, it will probably be the last confirmed driver. This year Caterham waited until very late to replace the oficially non-confirmed Trulli, don't surprised if they hold it again.

2 rumours emerged in diferent threads recently:

- Petrov lost some backing
- Senna's sponsors don't want Caterham

But realistically, this is about Heiki and Vitaly. AND of course, learning to speak Ā«wind tunneleseĀ»

Edited by Red17, 19 December 2012 - 23:14.


#2085 CatInTheBag

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 05:13

Mixed messages from the team. Target 9th, but no pressure scoring a point. Does not align with Cyril's strong "must not be satisfied with 10th" words for the team.

2013 driver selection - up to now still not sure whether to treat it as transition year, or achieve something with experienced driver.

Quote from Cyril (strangely from the same "must not be satisfied with 10th" article);
"One option is someone who he can learn from and who he can use as his benchmark for what we want from both our drivers."

"Another option, more radical, is to accept the fact that 2013 is a transition year that we use to continue building the team before a period of greater stability in 2014, when a lot of other things in the package will change.


Make up your mind, team. If you are so not satisfied with 10th for 2013, why still undecided ?

Edited by CatInTheBag, 20 December 2012 - 05:21.


#2086 One

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 08:18

IMHO Caterham failed big time in 2013, nothing other than that. The team changed the technology structure too much, and gave away all continuity while rule staid stable. Everyone expected Caterham to fight for seventh on the grid this year, if not eighth.

#2087 David Lightman

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 09:32

IMHO Caterham failed big time in 2013, nothing other than that. The team changed the technology structure too much, and gave away all continuity while rule staid stable. Everyone expected Caterham to fight for seventh on the grid this year, if not eighth.

Blimey, you've posted a year early ;)

#2088 One

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 11:14

Blimey, you've posted a year early ;)

Sorry, doing it too late. But the team deserve the chance... :cry:

#2089 Red17

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 12:16

Sorry, doing it too late. But the team deserve the chance... :cry:

Ah, well. At least we will know the outcome.

So... who did Cyril pick to partner Pic? Don't tell me he choose Milka Duno!

#2090 hippie

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 12:43

In the Formula1.com interview Abiteboul doesn't yet analyze why Caterham's aero development failed in 2012, but he says his job is to divert funding into areas that give tangible value, and I think by that he must mean that all the available money will go to improve the aero development.

This might also mean that Caterham now wants two pay drivers. So if the driver options for the second seat (as one seat has already been confirmed for Pic) are Van der Garde and Petrov, I think Caterham could benefit from some stability, which Petrov can provide. Giedo did some impressive lap times towards the end of the 2012 season, especially in the young driver test at Abu Dhabi, but changing both drivers would mean that it's harder to evaluate the aero development from 2012 to 2013.

#2091 Red17

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 13:11

but changing both drivers would mean that it's harder to evaluate the aero development from 2012 to 2013.

Maybe that's one part of the issue. Maybe the aero department feels the driver feedback has not been usefull.
Remember last year when, after all the power steering issues in 2010, they overdid the power steering and blamed it on the drivers feedback? Perhaps the department would rather have someone who has not been influenced by previous cars and can offer a whole new perspective.
Theoretically, the evaluation can also be done by comparing lap charts, and to be honest, the maths are quite simple at this point: are we in the midfield yet? That is something that will only be answered in February, and it has to be a near hit, I can't see them doing a massive car overhaul like Mclaren did a few years ago.

For me, all signs point at Caterham wanting to pick up another new driver, based on sponsorship purse. If all fails they can always pick up Petrov if the issue is indeed paying a salary.

#2092 hippie

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 13:45

For me, all signs point at Caterham wanting to pick up another new driver, based on sponsorship purse. If all fails they can always pick up Petrov if the issue is indeed paying a salary.

Joe Saward says Petrov can bring the team $12 million, which is more than any of the other candidates can offer.

#2093 mechadaniel

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 13:47

Perhaps the department would rather have someone who has not been influenced by previous cars and can offer a whole new perspective.


Ah, but that person surely also needs to have experience of a sorted F1 car to be able to make a comparison...

:)


#2094 tarmac

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 14:04

Joe Saward says Petrov can bring the team $12 million, which is more than any of the other candidates can offer.


But then this statement dosent make any sense if that was true. Petrov could fill both shoes unless they consider Kovalainen much better than Petrov for the first purpose. Looks like Petrov sponsors are still unconfirmed either way so GDV might be the second option

"One option is someone who he can learn from and who he can use as his benchmark for what we want from both our drivers."

"Another option, more radical, is to accept the fact that 2013 is a transition year that we use to continue building the team before a period of greater stability in 2014, when a lot of other things in the package will change.


Edited by tarmac, 20 December 2012 - 14:06.


#2095 onewingedangel

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 14:26

I think Petrov or Senna would be the best bets for the second seat at this point - as they are both fairly handy drivers and if they bring sponsorship all the better.

If Caterhams car is not there or thereabouts at the start of the year, all their efforts will go towards their 2014 car. Really they should be moving onto next years car as soon as (if) they can establish themselves as faster than Marussia.

#2096 CatInTheBag

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 17:07

If Caterhams car is not there or thereabouts at the start of the year, all their efforts will go towards their 2014 car. Really they should be moving onto next years car as soon as (if) they can establish themselves as faster than Marussia.



Can they afford to do that ?

#2097 CatInTheBag

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 17:22



hippie, what's your opinion about Steve Nielsen out ?

#2098 Red17

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 17:38

Can they afford to do that ?

No, they will soon find out that 2013 is the go or bust year. They better get that in their heads. In recent years the plugs have been pulled at really bad times. Results are essential from the start.

Caterham Cars medium term future is secured with the Alpine deal, in fact it creates a Ā«problemĀ», because maybe it will open a window to LMP racing. Too far fetched? Caterham has that Lola prototype collecting dust somewhere, there is your base for a bigger prototype, Lola spares are also back in production.
Renault may even be keen on trying an engine first at Le Mans to test the waters. Sure they could go to Williams. But it makes more sense for Alpine to spearhead a Le Mans effort, even if initially disguised as a Caterham.
That puts the Formula 1 side of things in a less favourable perspective. The man power and facilites are still minimal for one small Formula 1 operation. The car part is also now on the same site, which means there is now a single but larger bill to pay. As much as I support Caterham I can't see them undertaking 3 projects at the same time.

This may sound negative, but the team has now 1 year in delay and 1 year is huge in Formula 1. Sure, Giancarlo Minardi held on, but as soon as the big guns entered he had to sell to Stoddart and Stoddart himself was forced to sell to Red Bull.

You think Bernie was joking when he mooted another exit? He has been a team owner himself, he handles the money and knows what's going on. Caterham may indeed get another 10 th spot, but has to be spot with points and good showings.

#2099 CatInTheBag

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 17:58



I don't think its negative at all. In fact, I feel the same.

Not sure whether all these mean bad decision making, or soemone eats more than he can chew.

One thing is certain, we'll know soon.

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#2100 One

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Posted 20 December 2012 - 20:35

I think Caterham is looking at the direction which is not taking them to where they wants to.

First off, the first and the second year of Caterham manifestos were filled with persprctive that tiny teram is setting up a giant steps. in 2012 we suddernly sees that Caterham considers themselves as one of a success story.

I quit to support Caterham as I do not understand what is going on. What is the problem not taking Heikki on board? Another newbie and thinking that it scores a point or two? :rotfl:

Excuse me, but Lotus recently catched Kimi and went up.

How come that the tea, purged Gascoine out of his position and s[pred the effort in two, or three, target group? Do the board thinks unanimously that Caterham are as big as Ferrari? :rotfl: