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2012 BTCC and support series


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#201 jamiegc

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 16:52

Plato "I just locked up" :rotfl:

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#202 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 16:53

Plato says Gordon braked too early. Sure he did Jason :rolleyes: Gordon says he was "shovelled off". Looking at the replay that's exactly what happened.

I'm going to be cheering for Jackson and Shedden this year. Either would be a worthy champion I think.

#203 Scotracer

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 17:43

The sad thing is you just knew it was coming from Plato in to the final lap. Every corner he got more and more aggressive and then there you go.

What a prick.

(Sheddon fan btw)

#204 Fastcake

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 17:49

More Platoing there today, he might as well just introduce some Mario style turtle shells for the next race :rolleyes:

Still entertaining as usual, you need a bit of contact just to keep it fun, well for me anyway :)

#205 Crafty

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 17:53

If Sheddon braked so early surely Jason could of made the corner ? nope - he ended up in the gravel too, so they were both late on the brakes. Plato kept his foot in until Sheddon braked, once Sheddon was off he decided to turn in.

He's a complete bellend and should have some sort of penalty/disqualification/points on licence for that. It was premeditated. Sadly I doubt it will happen because BTCC is not a professional racing series and never will be with antics like that. No wonder there aren't any manufacturers in it.

#206 olliek88

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 17:54

The sad thing is you just knew it was coming from Plato in to the final lap. Every corner he got more and more aggressive and then there you go.

What a prick.

(Sheddon fan btw)


The whole way along the straight into foggies when they were nose to tail i was thinking this is either a) going to end in a crash of some sort or b) end in option a.



#207 F575 GTC

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:00

Was stood at the Esses and you could see it was coming the previous couple of laps; just basically pushed Sheddon the entire straight. Yeah we all know the BTCC has a bit of 'rubbin is racing' but that was just premeditated for him to punt Sheddon off. Chances are he'll get away with it too.

#208 fifi

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:17

platos been handed a 2 sec time penalty demoting him back to third

correct decision imo

#209 onewingedangel

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:33

Very light punishment that will do little to discourage similar in future :down:

#210 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:34

The right decision. That was a dirty move.

If Sheddon braked so early surely Jason could of made the corner ? nope - he ended up in the gravel too, so they were both late on the brakes. Plato kept his foot in until Sheddon braked, once Sheddon was off he decided to turn in.

He's a complete bellend and should have some sort of penalty/disqualification/points on licence for that. It was premeditated. Sadly I doubt it will happen because BTCC is not a professional racing series and never will be with antics like that. No wonder there aren't any manufacturers in it.


Just a couple of points. While it was clearly intentional, it was not premeditated. Premeditated means some sort of planning and previous consideration was involved. Don't make it out to be worse than it was.

BTCC has more manufacturers than most series, so I'm guessing you're talking about works teams. IMO that's a good thing, because works teams just drive costs up and then pull out when they don't win. Other than Plato's antics the series is generally quite "professional". In literal terms, the series is a mix of pros and amateurs, and it must stay like that to survive, at least for the forseable future.

#211 fifi

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:40

mat jacksons been excluded from race 3 for turbo overboost so shedden wins the race

#212 expert

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:40

While it was clearly intentional, it was not premeditated.


One wonders what Plato's plan was if it was NOT to push Sheddon off however. Sheddon took the inside and instead of taking the option on the outside and trying the cut back Plato stayed stuck to his bumper. This surely meant the only way that Plato COULD pass was for Sheddon to go off?

#213 Crafty

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:45

The right decision. That was a dirty move.



Just a couple of points. While it was clearly intentional, it was not premeditated. Premeditated means some sort of planning and previous consideration was involved. Don't make it out to be worse than it was.

BTCC has more manufacturers than most series, so I'm guessing you're talking about works teams. IMO that's a good thing, because works teams just drive costs up and then pull out when they don't win. Other than Plato's antics the series is generally quite "professional". In literal terms, the series is a mix of pros and amateurs, and it must stay like that to survive, at least for the forseable future.


Premeditated as in "I can't get past so I'll stick him in the gravel".


#214 JRizzle86

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:53

I've heard they are working on an upgrade to assist Plato with his overtaking issues. It's called a snowplough.

#215 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 18:59

Premeditated as in "I can't get past so I'll stick him in the gravel".


Then just say intentional as that's what you clearly mean.

#216 Lopek

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 19:07

Seeing on Twitter that Flash has been promoted to 1st. He and Plato had swapped as penalty for Plato's cheating and Mat Jackson has been excluded for technical infringement. No details tho.

Very sorry for Mat, was a great drive. The most penalty I expected for Plato - and not nearly enough to stop him doing it again.

#217 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 20:54

Such a shame for Jackson.

#218 kosmic33

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 22:50

Such a shame for Jackson.

Well not if they were deliberately cheating which it sounds like they were

Edited by kosmic33, 15 April 2012 - 22:51.


#219 PayasYouRace

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 22:54

Well not if they were deliberately cheating which it sounds like they were


Then it's a shame they weren't playing fair as they're a good driver and team. Any sources that they exceeded boost pressure deliberately?

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#220 Dispenser89

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Posted 15 April 2012 - 22:57

platos been handed a 2 sec time penalty demoting him back to third

correct decision imo

Correct to penalise him but pathetic punishment though. Something like 25 or 30 seconds penalises him, this just pats him on the bum gently and says 'Don't do it again, cheeky.'

#221 Little Leaf

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 05:12

Correct to penalise him but pathetic punishment though. Something like 25 or 30 seconds penalises him, this just pats him on the bum gently and says 'Don't do it again, cheeky.'


Agreed, should have been more like 30 seconds. That would act as a deterrent for him and others not to do it in the future (well at least not as much...)

#222 Kraken

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 07:58

What Plato did was wrong but I totally understand why he did it. Shedden couldn't have driven in a more negative way if he tried. All three cars were together on the last corner before the straight. He knew Jackson was struggling massively for grip and the race win was there for the taking.

So what did he decide to do? Come off the corner take the tight line and lift off. You can see by how much Jackson took off that Sheddens only intention was to block Plato. Driving with a mindset like that is only ever going to cause "accidents" and I don't see a driver who thinks like that winning the championship.

I expect that's why the punishment was basically a swap of positions as the stewards had all the braking and throttle positions and probably decided Shedden played his part by doing something that the other driver wouldn't expect. If it had been Shedden in the lead and Plato second for one I don't think Plato would have been so blatant and if he had the punishment would have been more severe as Shedden would have been expected to protect the lead rather than throw away the potential of it as he did yesterday.

Edited by Kraken, 16 April 2012 - 08:00.


#223 blackhand2010

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 08:08

You can see by how much Jackson took off that Sheddens only intention was to block Plato. Driving with a mindset like that is only ever going to cause "accidents" and I don't see a driver who thinks like that winning the championship.


This.

Shedden had a chance to show whether he was championship material at the final rounds at Silverstone last year. He could have been more aggresive in attack and upset the Neals, but potentially have been champion. Sadly he was found wanting, and I don't see that has changed this year. Don't get me wrong, he's a fine driver (and seemingly a sound bloke) and will win many races, but there's no killer instinct to make that into a championship.

Plato and Neal may both step over the line more than is needed (and are frankly both fairly dislikable), but at least you know their always fully committed and will never say die.

#224 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 09:03

Sheddon was weaving a bit on the straights to block Jason over the last few laps, shouldn't have punted him off thought.

I'm suburnt from the day, but there was some great racing. The Ginetta Juniors received the biggest round of applause from the crowd at Hollywood at the end of their race.

Plato's charge from the back to the front was also cheered all the way by a reasonably big crowd. I've been very impressed by Dave Newsham so far this season.

It was nice to see that the pit road walkabout is now free of charge to enter, last time I went on it it cost extra.

Also great to see Tom Ingram get his first win in the Ginetta GTs.

#225 expert

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 12:11

Defenders of Plato make some good points.

#226 Tonka

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 15:56

If people want BTTC without the bumping and pushing, they ought to watch a couple of WTTC races. They are boring from start to finish. The reverse grid races put amateur drivers at the front and when the trio of Chevrolets appear in their mirrors, they all move over!

Sheddon deserved to be pushed off the track yesterday. He didn't attempt to pass Jackson the last lap and deliberately slowed down on the straight. A true racer would have put Jackson between himself and Plato on that last corner. Instead he didn't even try for a win.



#227 Risil

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 17:04

Indeed. The cars have bumpers for a reason!

Edited by Risil, 16 April 2012 - 17:04.


#228 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 17:32

A few of the photos I took:

Posted Image
DSC_0192 by wwodb, on Flickr

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DSC_0203 by wwodb, on Flickr

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DSC_0212 by wwodb, on Flickr

This shows how amazing Matt Jackson's start was in race two:

Posted Image
DSC_0219 by wwodb, on Flickr

Posted Image
DSC_0223 by wwodb, on Flickr

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DSC_0230 by wwodb, on Flickr



#229 billm99uk

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 17:58

JP gets more like a pantomime villain every day. I get the impression that when his driving days are over, he'll be appearing at the Hackney Empire as Captain Hook for a good few years ...

#230 wewantourdarbyback

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 18:13

Matt Neal is still the pantomime villain at the track, when he stepped onto the podium after one of the races there was a fair smattering of boos in the crowd.

#231 PayasYouRace

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 18:34

A few of the photos I took:


Nice :up:

#232 TimRTC

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 19:35

I can understand the concerns, but ultimately there is a reason that the BTCC is the most watched of the British championships and the only one shown live on free-TV and with the marketing promoting the events as "bumper to bumper racing" there is obviously an expectation for "rubbing" and I think the BTCC do need to clarify for the drivers exactly what is and isn't allowed/expected.

Got a load of shots from the races, a couple for now:

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Posted Image

#233 Crafty

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Posted 16 April 2012 - 19:44

The MSA blue book has no "weaving rule", thus Sheddon was perfectly entitled to do whatever he felt necessary to keep Plato behind.

In any case I didn't see any weaving, there was one point where the car got totally out of shape and he had to collect it back up.. might of been a little tap, might not - you can't tell from the camera angle.

If Plato was quicker why did he not just drive past down the back straight, instead of sitting behind Sheddon ?
If Sheddon braked early (as Plato claims) then how come Plato ended up in the gravel ? Because he was waay late on the brakes after ensuring he'd pushed Sheddon off.

Its clear that Plato isn't the only one with questionable driving in BTCC but I honestly cannot remember a race meeting where he didn't get involved in an incident - yet I've never seen him admit fault, ever. I'm not saying he's always at fault, but he's certainly not blameless.

Still, crashes and a bit of argument is what BTCC is about, rather than "proper" motorsport.

#234 ImDDAA

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 20:17

No-one's really complaining about a bit of contact, but blatent cheating. The rules just need to be explicit - either you let drivers punt each other off the track or you penalise it - once everyone knows you're allowed to smash other cars into the gravel then it's all fair, if that's what you want - but it'll stop the sport from being taken seriously.

#235 Scotracer

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 20:31

WWODB: How did the cars sound compared to the old S2000 units? They sounded brilliant.

#236 TimRTC

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 21:24

I've heard ITV4 will be showing Sheddon's diaper changing on the next show...

#237 sosidge

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Posted 17 April 2012 - 21:26

It's just a shame that a handful of drivers on the grid (and Plato was the major protagonist at that race meeting) seem intent on keeping the series at the bumper-cars level when the quality of the field is the best it has been for years. The regulations have finally created some parity between the cars.

#238 Crafty

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Posted 18 April 2012 - 18:17

It's just a shame that a handful of drivers on the grid (and Plato was the major protagonist at that race meeting) seem intent on keeping the series at the bumper-cars level when the quality of the field is the best it has been for years. The regulations have finally created some parity between the cars.


Really ?

I hear that the MG team got allowed a high boost limit. ES Team with the vectras complained, so they've got the high boost limit too but the likes of the toyota doesn't.
Matt Neal tweeted at the weekend that in a straight line the Hondas were slower than Platos Chevy last year that caused all the tantrums.

I don't think there is anything like parity..

#239 DS27

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Posted 22 April 2012 - 10:16

Really ?

I hear that the MG team got allowed a high boost limit. ES Team with the vectras complained, so they've got the high boost limit too but the likes of the toyota doesn't.
Matt Neal tweeted at the weekend that in a straight line the Hondas were slower than Platos Chevy last year that caused all the tantrums.

I don't think there is anything like parity..


There's parity if you are looking at lap times - that's why the racing is so close. Parity is hardly fair in the conventional sense as it can be said to penalise the teams that do the best job, but if you want to watch close racing then it's the price you pay.

The Honda's have been restricted on power, and are slower on the straignts. However, even running with more or less full ballast, they have race winning / podium pace. Without restrictions they would walk away with it and no one other than Honda / Neal fans would be interested. I do however think that the MG team may need to be trimmed slightly at some stage to keep it fair.

As to Plato, there's no defense for moves like that. However, the organisers allow so much contact / poor driving standards that the line is incredily 'fuzzy' so there will always be controversy.



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#240 RC127

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Posted 28 April 2012 - 23:42

No one bumped this thread after today's qualifying for tomorrow's races at Thruxton?

After this? :eek:


http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99220


http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2635908

Very good chance for a wet race 1 and 2 tomorrow - with a drying track possible for race 3. Should be awesome.

#241 TimRTC

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 00:17

The cameras are pretty good at missing the big shunts this year.

#242 Crafty

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 06:39

No one bumped this thread after today's qualifying for tomorrow's races at Thruxton?

After this? :eek:


http://www.autosport...rt.php/id/99220


http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2635908

Very good chance for a wet race 1 and 2 tomorrow - with a drying track possible for race 3. Should be awesome.


A call went out on twitter to pull out the chassis leg and straighten the rear quarter on the Audi last night. Since the last round they had two engines blow on the dyno and they lost one yesterday and were waiting for a new one to turn up. Some speculation that he may call it a day due to lack of sponsors.

There was also a picture of Andy neates car with the offside disassembled and being welded up. I think the 888 boys have had a busy weekend.

#243 GX390

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:08

http://www.accuweath...forecast/708635

:up:

#244 PayasYouRace

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:24

Dramatic qualifying. Can't wait for the races. (Might miss last race if it clashes with the Indycar :cry: )

#245 HuddersfieldTerrier1986

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:27

Dramatic qualifying. Can't wait for the races. (Might miss last race if it clashes with the Indycar :cry: )


It'll definitely clash with the Indycar. The Indycar race itself starts at either 4.45 or 5pm UK time, the final BTCC race starts at about 5.15pm.

#246 froggy22

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:33

yeah, i was watching qualifying yesterday. bit of an amateur hour when the lorry got stuck trying to recover Plato's car :rotfl:

#247 PayasYouRace

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:44

It'll definitely clash with the Indycar. The Indycar race itself starts at either 4.45 or 5pm UK time, the final BTCC race starts at about 5.15pm.


Keith Huewen has just tweeted that the Indycar might start at 4pm now (they're trying to avoid the weather). Of course I could deal with missing a bit of that race for some touring car madness. I'll play it by ear.

#248 phil1993

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 08:50

Should be a good day today. Heavy rain this morning will be clearing, always makes for a fun day.

#249 froggy22

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 10:00

i dont know if i want rain. i think its always cool to see the cars going round Thruxton in the dry, going pretty much flatout or 3/4 of the track

#250 jrg19

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Posted 29 April 2012 - 10:05

looks very wet!